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James Shields and Wade Davis to KC for Wil Myers, Odorizzi, Montgomery & Leonard

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Old
12-10-2012, 12:41 PM
  #76
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http://www.baseballamerica.com/today...2/2614446.html

Scouts feel it's a fair trade.

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12-10-2012, 12:44 PM
  #77
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KC got robbed

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12-10-2012, 12:45 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by imayagainknowanson View Post
Well, they just get top 15 pitcher and good #4-5 guy in Davis for unproven prospects. It's not end of the world. Montgomery screams mediocrity. Shields in division with White Sox, Indians and Twins... could be a Cy Young candidate.

Win-win here.
Agreed.

The Rays got their man, but its the Royals who benefit immediately from this deal.
They get an established top of the line starter along with a solid bullpen/long man/starter in Davis.

The Rays got prospects. And until they are accomplished, they are just propects.
You gotta figure the Rays generally know what they're doing, but its a big risk for them.

One immediate benefit for the Rays is the deal frees up about $14M, allowing them to buy a free agent DH.

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12-10-2012, 12:48 PM
  #79
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This is funny, considering how many bleated on about the proven talent the Jays recieved in their mega deal over unproven, yet here, the Rays, with a bevy of unproven talent, won this trade over the Royals, who recieved a proven top 20 pitcher in baseball.


Royals arent hurting with prospects while the Rays could trade another starter if they so desire. Both teams traded from depth.

Rays right now have made the most of their off season in the east and are my prediction of front runner with all the moves they made followed by the Yankess, while the Royals will still dominate the White Sox but still have a hard time finishing above .500.

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12-10-2012, 12:50 PM
  #80
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Severe contrast of the two Florida teams. One is the best run organization in baseball (Rays), and the other one is the worst run organization in baseball (Marlins).

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12-10-2012, 01:44 PM
  #81
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scouts > hfboards

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12-10-2012, 02:57 PM
  #82
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The main reason I hate this trade is for the Royals it doesn't make sense on multiple levels.

Firstly on a value level. If we assume Myers and Shields are worth each other, a #1-2 pitcher and a top-5 prospect in baseball, then you equate Odorizzi + Montogmery + Leonard to Davis. Yeah wtf?

Secondly, from a competitive perspective. Yes the Royals rotation did get better. Anytime you add a top-of-the rotation starter, it gets better. Any rotation. The problem is the pieces surrounding Shields. Guthrie and Santana are his 2nd and 3rd starting pitchers in that lineup. If we assume Davis, then he slots in at 4. Shields-Guthrie-Santana-Davis. With Santana your hoping he can find his 2011 and the decrease in velocity on his FB is not concrete. And Guthrie isn't that good. Yes he had a decent 91 IP after moving to KC, but his time with the O's indicate he won't be that good. Davis has a risk of losing some of his velocity like he did when he was a starter.

With regards to their offense, they are hoping Hosmer and Moose take a step forward.

What I'm saying is their roster has too many question marks. And even if it all works out, I don't think anyone will be comfortable with putting them finishing above the tigers. I mean, could they have a Baltimore esque season? Absolutely, but they could have also just traded important pieces of their future for a shot at being mediocre. If Shields was under team control longer (he has 2 cost controlled option years I believe), I would've said this makes sense. With how crazy FA pitching is these days salary wise, I think it's almost certain Shields atleast tests the market. Maybe the Royals can re-sign him, who knows, but I don't like this for them.

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12-10-2012, 03:14 PM
  #83
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On the flipside this sets up the Rays nicely to add a good DH. If they can sign a guy like Adam Laroche (11M/yr for 2 years?), it would give them something like:

CF Jennings
SS Escobar
3B Longoria
DH Laroche
RF Zobrist
LF Joyce
1B Loney
2B Roberts/Rodruiguez
C Molina

That's assuming Myers spends a couple of months in AAA fixing any holes in his swing.

That line up with Price-Hellickson-Moore-Niemann-Cobb and a good bullpen is a pretty well rounded team. While starting pitching is lighter, Moore's continued development along with Hellickson's potential development(he's been wayyyy too lucky) might reduce the pain of losing Shields somewhat. That lineup still competes for the AL East crown though.

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12-10-2012, 03:18 PM
  #84
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there's no way premier pitcher in shields mold to worth just a prospect. what if wil myers is next matt laporta? odorizzi if fine, he's lock to have mlb career. but montgomery is not that big loss. they still have chris dwyer and lamb. leonard is blocked by colon and cuthbert.

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12-10-2012, 03:25 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
The main reason I hate this trade is for the Royals it doesn't make sense on multiple levels.

Firstly on a value level. If we assume Myers and Shields are worth each other, a #1-2 pitcher and a top-5 prospect in baseball, then you equate Odorizzi + Montogmery + Leonard to Davis. Yeah wtf?

Secondly, from a competitive perspective. Yes the Royals rotation did get better. Anytime you add a top-of-the rotation starter, it gets better. Any rotation. The problem is the pieces surrounding Shields. Guthrie and Santana are his 2nd and 3rd starting pitchers in that lineup. If we assume Davis, then he slots in at 4. Shields-Guthrie-Santana-Davis. With Santana your hoping he can find his 2011 and the decrease in velocity on his FB is not concrete. And Guthrie isn't that good. Yes he had a decent 91 IP after moving to KC, but his time with the O's indicate he won't be that good. Davis has a risk of losing some of his velocity like he did when he was a starter.

With regards to their offense, they are hoping Hosmer and Moose take a step forward.

What I'm saying is their roster has too many question marks. And even if it all works out, I don't think anyone will be comfortable with putting them finishing above the tigers. I mean, could they have a Baltimore esque season? Absolutely, but they could have also just traded important pieces of their future for a shot at being mediocre. If Shields was under team control longer (he has 2 cost controlled option years I believe), I would've said this makes sense. With how crazy FA pitching is these days salary wise, I think it's almost certain Shields atleast tests the market. Maybe the Royals can re-sign him, who knows, but I don't like this for them.
Word had it that the Rays were not going to trade Shields for Myers straight up.
So KC did not trade Odorizzi + Montogmery + Leonard for Davis.

These other side issues regarding the Royals have nothing to do with the trade.

Shields will have to perform very well these next two seasons to command serious money as a free agent. The jury is certainly out on that.
If that's the case, they'll get 2 quality years from Shields before deciding whether to pay for him to stay.
And in Davis, it looks like KC got a bargain from a salary standpoint.

This is a now trade for KC. They may compete in an otherwise weak division.

It's great to see an old fashion trade happen in this era of ridiculous free agent spending.

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Old
12-10-2012, 03:28 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
On the flipside this sets up the Rays nicely to add a good DH. If they can sign a guy like Adam Laroche (11M/yr for 2 years?), it would give them something like:

CF Jennings
SS Escobar
3B Longoria
DH Laroche
RF Zobrist
LF Joyce
1B Loney
2B Roberts/Rodruiguez
C Molina

That's assuming Myers spends a couple of months in AAA fixing any holes in his swing.

That line up with Price-Hellickson-Moore-Niemann-Cobb and a good bullpen is a pretty well rounded team. While starting pitching is lighter, Moore's continued development along with Hellickson's potential development(he's been wayyyy too lucky) might reduce the pain of losing Shields somewhat. That lineup still competes for the AL East crown though.
Doubt the Rays will go after a Laroche now that they have Loney.

And the way the Rays do things, Myers will not be on the main squad when they break camp next spring.

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12-10-2012, 04:25 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Woodman19 View Post
And lets not forget that as unlikely as it is Myers could still not become what he projects to become. We have all seen it time and time again.
I would take six years of Wil Myers, unspectacular league average player, over two years of Shields either way.

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12-10-2012, 04:38 PM
  #88
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James Shields just told us he would be open right now to talk about an extension with the Royals if they are interested "no doubt about it"
good for royals.

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12-10-2012, 04:45 PM
  #89
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good for royals.
I hope for the Royals they can lock him up until 2018.

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12-10-2012, 05:13 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Reality Check View Post
Kansas City needed pitching badly...but this is a massive risk

And one, if it doesn't pan out, should get their GM fired
I feel like he would of gotten fired if he didn't pull off some kind of trade to improve their rotation for the immediate future. This trade had to be done to keep his job safe for now IMO.

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12-10-2012, 05:30 PM
  #91
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I would take six years of Wil Myers, unspectacular league average player, over two years of Shields either way.
Yeah, no...Shields at 15 million over the next two years is highly valuable. Plus, the Royals get the first chance to offer Shields financial security. If Shields wants to risk not getting injured the next two years, he could take a chance at the market, but two years is a long time.

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12-10-2012, 05:55 PM
  #92
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Wade Davis is a dark horse in this deal. I really think he can turn into a very respectable middle of the rotation starter.

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12-10-2012, 06:02 PM
  #93
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Wade Davis is a dark horse in this deal. I really think he can turn into a very respectable middle of the rotation starter.
even if he doesn't turn the corner, he could be dominant late inning reliever. i like him pretty much.

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12-10-2012, 06:25 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by imayagainknowanson View Post
there's no way premier pitcher in shields mold to worth just a prospect. what if wil myers is next matt laporta? odorizzi if fine, he's lock to have mlb career. but montgomery is not that big loss. they still have chris dwyer and lamb. leonard is blocked by colon and cuthbert.

And Shields probably walks in 2 years and all Royals get in return is a lone supplementary draft pick. It's not like we are talking about a borderline playoff team where a guy like Shields can put you over the top. This is a bigger risk for Royals than it is for Rays.

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12-10-2012, 06:25 PM
  #95
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Braves should have been all over this

Not sure we could have offered a pitcher as good as Shields is right now though

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12-10-2012, 06:41 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by visor wearing goon View Post
Braves should have been all over this

Not sure we could have offered a pitcher as good as Shields is right now though
... Teheran?

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12-10-2012, 06:56 PM
  #97
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And Shields probably walks in 2 years and all Royals get in return is a lone supplementary draft pick. It's not like we are talking about a borderline playoff team where a guy like Shields can put you over the top. This is a bigger risk for Royals than it is for Rays.
Actually, it's a pretty big risk for the Rays. Myers isn't guaranteed to be productive next season, so all they've essentially done is send their #2 starting pitcher and a dominant reliever for possibly no immediate help, in a very competitive AL East. And their hitting, which wasn't very good last season, lost two of their best hitters in Keppinger and Upton, and merely added an enigmatic SS.

The Rays have arguably taken two steps back in trying to make the playoffs for next season. It's good for the future, but you know what they say, if you keep looking towards the future, the present will never arrive. The Royals still may not contend for a playoff spot, but at least they tried. If they dont try now, it may be too late for their current crop of young hitters. Who knows how long it would have taken for the team to develop young pitchers. They can't keep on waiting.

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Old
12-10-2012, 07:10 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by kanuck87 View Post
Yeah, no...Shields at 15 million over the next two years is highly valuable.
It's 22.5 M actually.

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12-10-2012, 07:26 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by MurrayBannerman View Post
... Teheran?
He's still just a prospect, plus he struggled at times last year so I doubt he was enticing enough for the Royals

Braves have pretty decent pitching depth but no one like Shields. Not to mention the Rays still have one of the best rotations in the league with this trade, couldn't say the same for the Braves if we gave up a top rotation starter.

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12-10-2012, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by visor wearing goon View Post
He's still just a prospect, plus he struggled at times last year so I doubt he was enticing enough for the Royals

Braves have pretty decent pitching depth but no one like Shields. Not to mention the Rays still have one of the best rotations in the league with this trade, couldn't say the same for the Braves if we gave up a top rotation starter.
Oh, sorry, I read that wrong. I thought you were going after Shields

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