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NHL Lockout XXVI: 57 Hockey Channels (And Nothin' On)

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Old
12-11-2012, 06:29 PM
  #826
KingsFan7824
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Originally Posted by crapeze11 View Post
Not to jump ahead, but does anyone else think that this will be the last lockout for the next couple of CBA negotiations? Since the 1994-1995 lockout, the owners have pushed slowly but surely to take what they want, and I do not see what else they could want after this (hopefully) agreement that would be worth losing time over. The only thing that the owners could do that could conceivably get in the way of labor peace would be to try and implement NFL style non-guaranteed contracts imo.
It would be going in the right direction if they get a deal done. A short strike. Followed by a lockout resulting in a 48 game season. Then a full year lockout. Followed by, maybe, a lockout resulting in a 48 game season.

It would certainly break a trend.

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Old
12-11-2012, 06:31 PM
  #827
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Originally Posted by bp13 View Post
I'm going to respectfully disagree.

Despite the fact Bettman was shaking more than his usual shaking self last week when the took his proverbial ball and went home, I think these guys realize they're too close to let a season go. Moreover, taking their make whole offer off the table could obviously been conditional upon what they asked for in return for THAT package. In other words, I think make whole will be right back on the table so long as the players give up more.

I'm coming around to the owners in this, at least to the extent that the players need to make the next move. The owners have made clear what they must have, numerous times. I say the players give it, every little bit, then take their pound of flesh back elsewhere, either in the make whole, the cap total, %HRR, whatever.
And you think Fehr is going to give something up? Without adding in another new version of delinkage to gum up the works (Escrow Cap, Mid Level Cap Exemptions).

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12-11-2012, 06:32 PM
  #828
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Bettman and Daly should just start agreeing with everything Fehr says... Don't give him a chance to move the goalposts again.

Oh and it would probably weird him out.

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Old
12-11-2012, 06:35 PM
  #829
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Would love to hear that Fehr and Bettman got involved in a physical altercation during this meeting. The press conference afterwards would be priceless! Bettman with a black eye, "no progress was made..."

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Old
12-11-2012, 06:44 PM
  #830
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I can't believe how the two sides were so close at the previous meetings and the NHL just walks away.

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12-11-2012, 06:59 PM
  #831
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Originally Posted by Ranger de FLA View Post
I can't believe how the two sides were so close at the previous meetings and the NHL just walks away.
that's an interesting way of looking at it..

seems to me that the NHL was the only party looking to strike a deal and they were insulted so badly that even the moderate "willing to stay until it's done" owners flew home the next day.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:02 PM
  #832
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The NBA has a cap on escrow of 10%. Any overage comes out of a post career benefits fund. 1% of BRI from the players share is set aside for the fund. The owners aren't funding it.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:06 PM
  #833
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Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
Apply it to your own life. If the choice was work 6 months for 50k or sit on the couch for 30k, which do you chose?
Ignoring the contract rights (which are a bigger deal than people realize) that 300m in make whole was worth the fight.
You do realize the logical conclusion of this line of thinking is that it is better to be laid-off and collect income assistanse or welfare than to work for a living? While you won't have as much money at least you won't have to work for a living.

I highly doubt this applies to even one player who has dedicated his life to playing hockey. Each and everyone would have put in 10's of thousands of hours of free labour just for the chance to play in the NHL.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:07 PM
  #834
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoobs View Post
https://twitter.com/aaronward_nhl/st...13322738311168

@Aaronward_NHL NHLPA expected to be in attendance: D. Fehr,S. Fehr,PA Labour Lawyers and players. At this time, names/number of players still TBD. #TSN

PA labour lawyers? Why?
So PA has requested to bring in mediators and labor lawyers? No way this week ends well. It will make 'traction' for a few days and then blow up? Aren't both Fehr brothers lawyers?

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12-11-2012, 07:10 PM
  #835
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Originally Posted by MacOfNiagara View Post
So PA has requested to bring in mediators and labor lawyers? No way this week ends well. It will make 'traction' for a few days and then blow up? Aren't both Fehr brothers lawyers?
Maybe the labor lawyers are there to make the needed revisions to the CBA they agree on.

Hey, it could happen.*

(*Angels in the Outfield reference, for those who are too young to remember even the newer version of it.)

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:11 PM
  #836
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Originally Posted by SerenityRick View Post
that's an interesting way of looking at it..

seems to me that the NHL was the only party looking to strike a deal and they were insulted so badly that even the moderate "willing to stay until it's done" owners flew home the next day.
Boy, you think that those billionaire experienced businessmen would have been in a few tough negotiations before and had grown thicker skins. I hope that they get over their hurt feelings soon.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:11 PM
  #837
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingskring View Post
Nick Cotsonika ‏@cotsonika
Just filed. Key line: Sides now so close, if deal isn't done, not because of principle, economics. Because "leadership (bleeped) it up."

Nick Cotsonika ‏@cotsonika
Players aren't fighting cap, aren't asking for guaranteed share, are at 50-50, will accept contract max, etc. This is about details now.
https://twitter.com/cotsonika
No they are not.

- Make whole / soft landing
- Escrow limit
- Mid Level Cap Exemption

are all things that make it 50/50 in name only.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:14 PM
  #838
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Originally Posted by SerenityRick View Post
that's an interesting way of looking at it..

seems to me that the NHL was the only party looking to strike a deal and they were insulted so badly that even the moderate "willing to stay until it's done" owners flew home the next day.
Ron Burkle was so "offended" that he has spent days trying to bring the two parties back to the table.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:17 PM
  #839
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Originally Posted by Chelios View Post
Exactly. The fact that Scott Gomez is an overpaid piece of crap has nothing to do with Scott Gomez and everything to do with Glen Sather signing him to that contract. Why should the players bear any responsibility for their play on the ice?

This actually touches on an important point when it comes to the 5 year term limit. Having a cap on the term, theoretically, limits the amount of players who are undeservedly overpaid. This, again theoretically, would mean more money available to those players deserving of it.
hahaha...speaking of gomez i will have the pleasure to watch him tomorrow night and if the 1st game i saw him this year is any indication....dude, is BRUTAL...

i dont understand the mediation with where things were just last week...i guess the NHL either feels they have to start over and "make whole" is really off the table, or the NHL still has some to give?

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:17 PM
  #840
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I love how a lot of people are pessimistic, even me, I'd laugh so hard if they sign a deal when we are all so doubtful for the first time. When we were all hopeful and optimistic, it went to shize. Lol i would just laugh after all the negativity they sign it lol.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:20 PM
  #841
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Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
I love how a lot of people are pessimistic, even me, I'd laugh so hard if they sign a deal when we are all so doubtful for the first time. When we were all hopeful and optimistic, it went to shize. Lol i would just laugh after all the negativity they sign it lol.
We're a Burton type leak away from optimism.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:22 PM
  #842
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Originally Posted by LickTheEnvelope View Post
Which is odd because players don't seem to realize their own offer.

All the one's interviewed about this said that it was "25% total variance over the life of the contract..." but that's not how it was written in their proposals...
It is intended to be confusing, at least in the sense that it appears to be one thing when it is really something quite different. See for reference 'hybrid linking'

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:22 PM
  #843
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Ron Burkle was so "offended" that he has spent days trying to bring the two parties back to the table.
mmhmm and that was after he said "I'm not leaving this city until we get this done"

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:27 PM
  #844
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheesesteak Invictus View Post
At this point they should replace the solid paint lines in all the circles and lines with repeated "We're sorry"s
Would have a lot more respect for that than the condescending 'Thank you fans'

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:29 PM
  #845
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Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
Apply it to your own life. If the choice was work 6 months for 50k or sit on the couch for 30k, which do you chose?

Ignoring the contract rights (which are a bigger deal than people realize) that 300m in make whole was worth the fight.
Where did the 30k come from?

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:32 PM
  #846
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I hear you. My point was mainly that some GM will still hand out another dumb Gomez, Redden or Finger type contract. At least they will probably be limited to a 5 to 7 year term though.
Thats exactly what I am saying. Shorter contract terms means players will, over the life of their careers, be paid closer to what they are worth/deserve. Players under performing will have their salaries adjusted on their new contracts sooner than they would in the old system. Conversely, players who are outperforming their contract will also be able to negotiate a new, richer contract sooner. The end result is players being paid closer to what they deserve overall. It won't be perfect, there will still be players overpaid and some underpaid, but their salaries will be adjusted quicker than they would under the old system.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:33 PM
  #847
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Originally Posted by LickTheEnvelope View Post
Where did the 30k come from?
Hypothetical situation for someone who normally makes $50K

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:33 PM
  #848
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Originally Posted by SerenityRick View Post
mmhmm and that was after he said "I'm not leaving this city until we get this done"
You're thinking of Tanenbaum and that's not what he said.

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:33 PM
  #849
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Originally Posted by NYRFAN218 View Post
Aaron Portzline ‏@Aportzline
Funny what a few days can do: Sense among many around the league is that deal gets done in next 7-10 days, season starts early January.

https://twitter.com/Aportzline/statu...30780874412032
Swear I've heard that somewhere before

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Old
12-11-2012, 07:37 PM
  #850
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Originally Posted by HarryHabs View Post
The PA made 5 de-linked offers before their first real offer of November and even then they had a clause not to get less than year 2. Their first real linked proposal was last week, 3 months after the lockout started. Idiots.
No it wasnt delinked. Both escrow limit and (potentially) mid level cap exception are delinks.

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