Jon Gruden jumping from the Raiders to the Bucs is the only one I'm thinking of offhand that's "recent".
Gruden was definitely unique in the fact he was effectively traded, and the NFL put rules in that it can't be done again.
Also, in a similar vein, there was the Bill Belichick situation where he was the Jets coach for one day and then abruptly resigned and went to the Patriots. The Jets demanded, and received, compensation from the Patriots for the situation.
In a way not entirely surprising (the NFL's case seemed to erode as time progressed) but in another way shocking as it is a huge embarrassment to Goodell and the whole pretense of being seriously concerned about player safety.
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
Tagliabue affirms factual findings of Commissioner Goodell...concludes Hargrove, Smith, Vilma "engaged in conduct detrimental" and...
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
vacates all player discipline. "Unlike Saints' broad organizational misconduct, player appeals involve sharply focused issues of alleged...
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"...individual player misconduct in several different aspects...My affirmation of Commissioner Goodell's findings could certainly justify...
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"the issuance of fines. However, this entire case has been contaminated by the coaches and others in the Saints' organization."
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"Having reviewed the testimony very carefully, including documentary evidence that is at the center of the conflict, and having assessed...
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"...the credibility of the four central witnesses on these matters, I find there is more than enough evidence to support...
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"...Commissioner Goodell's findings that Mr. Vilma offered such a bounty (on Brett Favre)."
So, basically it happened but again, Goodell didn't have the authority to suspend them? I think that's what the last appeal basically ruled. Regardless, Vilma and co. escape on a technicality, but it's bad news for his defamation lawsuit.
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
Our statement on PT's ruling: "We respect Mr. Tagliabue’s decision, which underscores the due process afforded players in NFL disciplinary..
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"...matters. This matter has now been reviewed by Commissioner Goodell, two CBA grievance arbitrators, the CBA Appeals Panel, and Mr. Tag.."
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"...as Commissioner Goodell’s designated appeals officer. The decisions have made clear that the Saints operated a bounty program..."
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"...in violation of league rules for three years, that the program endangered player safety, and that the commissioner has the authority.."
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"...under the CBA to impose discipline for those actions as conduct detrimental to the league. Strong action was taken in this matter..."
Greg Aiello @gregaiello
"...to protect player safety and ensure that bounties would be eliminated from football." End of NFL statement.
I still don't understand why this isn't suspendable.
So the NFL continues to say that everything happened the way it did, they've just chosen to not hold the players involved responsible.
One wonders if that might not be related to the fact that all the players involved are not going to be in any way prominent this season, so the league's embarrassment is considerably reduced anyway.
Meanwhile, Goodell if he is lucky has but a shred of credibility remaining. Now he's going to have players coming after him seeking damages, namely Hardgrove.
Meanwhile, Goodell if he is lucky has but a shred of credibility remaining.
Uh, what? Tags basically re-affirmed Goddell's findings but didn't uphold the suspensions. It also means that if Goddell wanted too, he could still go after others in the organization.
There is nothing to celebrate for this.
BTW; NFL fans who are fans of the NHL are ridiculous in their stance with the commishes. Bettman gets unfairly blamed, blah blah blah. Goddell is the devil, he's evil blah blah blah. Hypocrites much?
They both have positives and negatives about them. The way Goodell handled this was clearly a mess, but he was going after a guilty party. However I think he and the league were completely stupid with their stance on the refs.
So, basically it happened but again, Goodell didn't have the authority to suspend them? I think that's what the last appeal basically ruled. Regardless, Vilma and co. escape on a technicality, but it's bad news for his defamation lawsuit.
Quote:
When asked about this, Vilma said in a text that Tagliabue "ignores the totality of the situation. Goodell publicly stated I helped create the program and I waved $10k for Kurt Warner. It's not about just Favre."
His case is still just as strong, who knows maybe the evidence about Kurt Warner is in the other 49,998 pages Goodell claims to have on the Saints.
Uh, what? Tags basically re-affirmed Goddell's findings but didn't uphold the suspensions. It also means that if Goddell wanted too, he could still go after others in the organization.
There is nothing to celebrate for this.
BTW; NFL fans who are fans of the NHL are ridiculous in their stance with the commishes. Bettman gets unfairly blamed, blah blah blah. Goddell is the devil, he's evil blah blah blah. Hypocrites much?
Who else is he going to go after within the organization? He's already suspended 2 coaches and the GM and took away 2 high draft picks. Is the offensive coordinator next?
Between this mess, the unfair penalties on the Cowboys and Redskins, and locking out everyone in sight, and ignorance to head injuries (he's only this year getting around to suspending people), he loses credibility by the day.
The reason Goodell recused himself was because he knew he blew it. He won't reveal where the evidence came from, and blackmailed Gregg Williams into an affidavit almost 6 months after indefinitely suspending him.
Care to explain the comparison to Bettman further?
Who else is he going to go after within the organization? He's already suspended 2 coaches and the GM and took away 2 high draft picks. Is the offensive coordinator next?
Between this mess, the unfair penalties on the Cowboys and Redskins, and locking out everyone in sight, and ignorance to head injuries (he's only this year getting around to suspending people), he loses credibility by the day.
The reason Goodell recused himself was because he knew he blew it. He won't reveal where the evidence came from, and blackmailed Gregg Williams into an affidavit almost 6 months after indefinitely suspending him.
Care to explain the comparison to Bettman further?
First off, I can't take much of what you say seriously because you're a Saints fan.
Secondly, I think there are others in the organization (more business personal) they could look at.
This was only a mess because of the Saints players and coaches. It wouldn't have been a mess if they had fixed it in the first place. As for the Cowboys and Redskins, they were told not to defer that money. Do you think the Redskins would have cut Haynsworth in a cap year? They shifted a lot of money. Furthermore, Goddell wouldn't have gone after them IF none of the other owners hadn't said anything. Blame the Giants for that one because they were the ones that were making a stink about that. As such, Goddell had to go after those two.
Ignorance to head injuries? Is that why Jerome Harrison hates him so much? Why football fans think the game is becoming flag football? Yep! He's just ignoring those head injuries.
So the word of two CBA grievance arbitrators, the CBA Appeals Panel, and Mr. Tag..along with a former defense attorney who all REVIEWED the data that Goddell had collected isn't enough to say that what the Saints did was in violation? What more do you need?
Both Goddell and Bettman are accountable to the owners. Both of them. Goddell is more known because he is more vocal and runs a more popular sport.
Can we blame Bettman for moving Atlanta? Not moving Phoenix? Can we blame him for the lockout? Can we blame him for Quebec moving? And Minnesota moving? And not moving Nashville? Or not selling Nashville?
Whenever anyone says Bettman is to blame for the lockout (along with Fehr) everyone responds, but Bettman is accountable to the owners. It's the owners fault.
So is Goddell. Both of them are the spokesmen for their respective leagues owners.
You want to blame anyone for these messes, blame the owners.
First off, I can't take much of what you say seriously because you're a Saints fan.
Secondly, I think there are others in the organization (more business personal) they could look at.
That's fine if I'm a Saints fan, but I long since accepted the penalties. I didn't really complain about them when they were handed down, nor did I ever deny that it happened. What I did complain about was the process in how this was conducted, and how Goodell can justify nailing the Saints to the cross without having investigated the rest of the league, since it's been made known that other teams and players were paying bounties. Even if Sean Payton didn't know about it, he's still responsible for those underneath him.
Feel free to name more names though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo
This was only a mess because of the Saints players and coaches. It wouldn't have been a mess if they had fixed it in the first place. As for the Cowboys and Redskins, they were told not to defer that money. Do you think the Redskins would have cut Haynsworth in a cap year? They shifted a lot of money. Furthermore, Goddell wouldn't have gone after them IF none of the other owners hadn't said anything. Blame the Giants for that one because they were the ones that were making a stink about that. As such, Goddell had to go after those two.
It was an uncapped year. There shouldn't have been anything wrong with deferring the money, considering there was no collective bargaining agreement. This is like if the NHL starts penalizing teams for circumventing the new salary cap rules for contracts signed this past summer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo
Ignorance to head injuries? Is that why Jerome Harrison hates him so much? Why football fans think the game is becoming flag football? Yep! He's just ignoring those head injuries.
He doesn't do anything to Dunta Robinson who routinely headhunts receivers, and he isn't the only one. There's been little to no protocol established in efforts to reduce head injuries, only ones that have already occurred.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo
So the word of two CBA grievance arbitrators, the CBA Appeals Panel, and Mr. Tag..along with a former defense attorney who all REVIEWED the data that Goddell had collected isn't enough to say that what the Saints did was in violation? What more do you need?
Still hasn't revealed where he got the evidence from, that's why Goodell was trying to make this go away. If this got to court, Goodell was going to have to reveal how he got the information, and how he got it. And he didn't want to do that, he just wanted to do what people do on internet message boards: talk a bunch of crap, and disappear when the next person on the internet message board calls you on it.
He originally suspended the players without presenting them with any evidence to defend themselves against. He just started playing he-said-she-said. That doesn't even work arguing in your house, how is it supposed to work when you're doing that without providing evidence you say you have? Vilma was defending himself against a ghost. Goodell tried to treat Vilma like a child, and get him to admit to something unable to prove it, and hoped that it worked. It didn't.
Once Gregg Williams started admitting that this was going on, and then got an audio recording, Goodell lost leverage in doing anything to players. A player is supposed to listen to his coach. How am I supposed to prove that I didn't try to injure Brett Favre, and didn't want to injure Brett Favre, while everyone knows my coach is yelling at me to do it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo
Both Goddell and Bettman are accountable to the owners. Both of them. Goddell is more known because he is more vocal and runs a more popular sport.
Can we blame Bettman for moving Atlanta? Not moving Phoenix? Can we blame him for the lockout? Can we blame him for Quebec moving? And Minnesota moving? And not moving Nashville? Or not selling Nashville?
Whenever anyone says Bettman is to blame for the lockout (along with Fehr) everyone responds, but Bettman is accountable to the owners. It's the owners fault.
So is Goddell. Both of them are the spokesmen for their respective leagues owners.
You want to blame anyone for these messes, blame the owners.
I do blame the owners, if your point is that fans of sports hate them equally that's fine. Their issues aren't completely the same (the NHL proved how much of a circus they are with discipline last season).
Once Gregg Williams started admitting that this was going on, and then got an audio recording, Goodell lost leverage in doing anything to players. A player is supposed to listen to his coach. How am I supposed to prove that I didn't try to injure Brett Favre, and didn't want to injure Brett Favre, while everyone knows my coach is yelling at me to do it?
I don't buy this at all. This isn't the military and these players aren't children. You don't get excused for "just following orders".
I don't buy this at all. This isn't the military and these players aren't children. You don't get excused for "just following orders".
Prove that you weren't trying and didn't want to injure the player despite it being the coach's instructions. And by the same token, not admit you weren't giving 100%, even if you were
