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Anyone Getting Utterly Dis-interested With This Lockout?

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Old
12-12-2012, 10:54 AM
  #51
Indy on the Road
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Someone send me a postcard when it's over.

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Old
12-12-2012, 11:05 AM
  #52
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I definitely have no interest in watching a 40-odd game season or whatever amount it's going to end up being. What a f#$$% travesty.

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12-12-2012, 11:32 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by jbeck5 View Post
WHAT!? then you blame fehr?
Don't blame Fehr in the least, he was hired to represent the player's interest, not the owners.

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Old
12-12-2012, 11:53 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
Don't blame Fehr in the least, he was hired to represent the player's interest, not the owners.
Then he failed miserably. The players lost more then they could ever make up with a better CBA about a month into the season. He failed miserably.

If we can all agree the basics:

-We get a career/job to make money(money to support ourselves and our family)
-If we can have fun doing our job/career then that is a plus

So Fehr's job is to make sure his employees are well paid, and are having a good time while working.

The NHL's offer's have ensure the above. Fehr has tried to rally the troops in a "**** the authority mentality" and we see it in the dumb,immature, unprofessional tweets the players post.

Fehr is not doing his job...unless his job was to make a "**** you" point to their bosses at all cost...in which case how can any of you agree with this? I might have thought this way...then i turned 18.

If fehr's job is to get his players the most amount of money possible, then he's failed at his job, and keeps failing more and more every day. Remember the players are losing much more then the owners. The players lose 1.8(or is it 1.6, i forget) billion on the season in profits. The owners lose maybe 50-100 million in profit with a missed season.

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Old
12-12-2012, 11:58 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by jbeck5 View Post
Then he failed miserably. The players lost more then they could ever make up with a better CBA about a month into the season. He failed miserably.

If we can all agree the basics:

-We get a career/job to make money(money to support ourselves and our family)
-If we can have fun doing our job/career then that is a plus

So Fehr's job is to make sure his employees are well paid, and are having a good time while working.

The NHL's offer's have ensure the above. Fehr has tried to rally the troops in a "**** the authority mentality" and we see it in the dumb,immature, unprofessional tweets the players post.

Fehr is not doing his job...unless his job was to make a "**** you" point to their bosses at all cost...in which case how can any of you agree with this? I might have thought this way...then i turned 18.

If fehr's job is to get his players the most amount of money possible, then he's failed at his job, and keeps failing more and more every day. Remember the players are losing much more then the owners. The players lose 1.8(or is it 1.6, i forget) billion on the season in profits. The owners lose maybe 50-100 million in profit with a missed season.
No clue why the NHLPA did not impose a similar gag order to the one the NHL stuck the owners with. If they thought letting the player's voice their opinions was going to win the fans over to their side then boy did that not work out. Props to the majority of the players that have just kept to themselves or answered questions legitimately for reporters instead of the idiocy we see on Twitter.

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Old
12-12-2012, 12:03 PM
  #56
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Still awaiting the day when they come out of their collective arseholes and decide to drop the puck. I miss my Sens.

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Old
12-12-2012, 12:24 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by WantEggRoll View Post
No clue why the NHLPA did not impose a similar gag order to the one the NHL stuck the owners with. If they thought letting the player's voice their opinions was going to win the fans over to their side then boy did that not work out. Props to the majority of the players that have just kept to themselves or answered questions legitimately for reporters instead of the idiocy we see on Twitter.
http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey...ers-smarten-up

Here's a piece by none other then don cherry on the matter. Funny thing is, he makes a lot of sense here and is pretty much bang on on everything.

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Old
12-12-2012, 01:04 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbeck5 View Post
http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey...ers-smarten-up

Here's a piece by none other then don cherry on the matter. Funny thing is, he makes a lot of sense here and is pretty much bang on on everything.
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Bettman is a cancer. . . . First, you unfeeliní jerks. How do you think the people with cancer feel?
Really Don? We're not allowed to use this expression anymore? Get real.

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Old
12-12-2012, 01:08 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Buck Aki Berg View Post
Really Don? We're not allowed to use this expression anymore? Get real.
Haha, i laughed at that part too. But aside from that, he's completely right.

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Old
12-12-2012, 01:36 PM
  #60
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How do you think cancer feels for being associated with Bettman?

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Old
12-12-2012, 01:44 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by jbeck5 View Post
Nah, i'm pretty sure you've been watching a different lockout.

-The NHL tried to reach the NHLPA 4 times. Count em, 4 times!!!! last year. The NHLPA kept saying no. POINT IN FAVOUR OF NHL.
Sorry, I don't believe for one second a lockout was going to be avoided regardless of when negotiations started. When one side only wants to take, no settlement can be reached until breaking points occur.

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Bettman has been professional about this while fehr has been withholding information to the players.
Link that substantiates your claim about Fehr?

Bettman professional? Well if rejecting proposals out of hand in 5 - 10 minutes, halting negotiations and stomping out, claims of concessions when none have been made, melting down on national TV, attempts to assassinate Fehr's character and divide the union are acts of professionalism, then I guess you're right.

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The players have been more unproffesional then i could imagine. 2 POINT IN FAVOUR OF NHL. in fact, looking at how immature the players have been in the media, 3 points in favour of nhl. The players have been disgraceful.
Of the 750 players in the NHLPA, a handful have posted tweets or made comments to the media that were less than appropriate. However, I can understand player frustration when I hear the absolute BS flowing from Bettman and Daly.

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The NHL's offers kept getting closer and closer to the middle, while the NHLPAs first 4 offers were basically the same recycled trash. POINT IN FAVOUR OF NHL.
So you believe if someone offered you 50% of the value for you house, then moved up to 60% its a good deal?

The initial offers from the NHL were laughable, the NHLPA's proposals were at least an attempt to address the fundamental problem with the economics. The players want to end this cycle of lockouts and realize the only way to achieve this is through a viable revenue sharing plan.

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The nhl is fighting to keep the league viable. The long term health of the league is their main priority. The NHLPA is fighting to keep average salaries at 2.6 million instead of 2.2 million. The money the players make is their main priority. 1 POINT IN FAVOUR OF THE NHL.
You are drinking the NHL koolaid, in gulps!!!!

Average salary is nothing more than a function of revenue, when one rises so does the other. The players have agreed to 50/50, what they want is the owners to honour the signed contracts.

The 'make whole' was the concept Bettman claimed would do this, but it is now obvious that was a fairy tale.

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the NHL has all the leverage...they're only losing about 50-100 million in profit. The NHLPA is losing 1.8 billion in profit. 1 POINT IN FAVOUR OF NHL.
What does leverage have to do with favouring/supporting one side or another?

I respectfully suggest you do a little research yourself, the Maple Leafs alone make $100M profit.

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How can you know all the above(assuming your staying knowledgable through the whole process) then go on siding with the players and fehr? Doesn't make any sense.
Might not make sense to you, but when I consider all the factors I don't believe the NHL/owners are acting in good faith.

Since 02-03 as league revenue grew from $1.996B to $3.4B, the players' share +13.8%, the owners' share +238.6%. During that time the owners raised ticket prices by 39%, I suppose you blame the players for this as well.

The facts are clear, owners make the business decisions yet don't want accountability when the economics don't work. Their answer, turn to the fans, sponsors, taxpayers and players to pay the bill.

IMO its time one of these entities stood up to the NHL, and so the players have my full support.

Quote:
It does make sense if you informed yourself.

Inform yourself!!
Maybe you should take your own advice, base your points on fact, not anecdotal evidence and emotion.


Last edited by Holdurbreathe: 12-12-2012 at 03:43 PM.
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Old
12-12-2012, 04:18 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
Sorry, I don't believe for one second a lockout was going to be avoided regardless of when negotiations started. When one side only wants to take, no settlement can be reached until breaking points occur.



Link that substantiates your claim about Fehr?

Bettman professional? Well if rejecting proposals out of hand in 5 - 10 minutes, halting negotiations and stomping out, claims of concessions when none have been made, melting down on national TV, attempts to assassinate Fehr's character and divide the union are acts of professionalism, then I guess you're right.



Of the 750 players in the NHLPA, a handful have posted tweets or made comments to the media that were less than appropriate. However, I can understand player frustration when I hear the absolute BS flowing from Bettman and Daly.



So you believe if someone offered you 50% of the value for you house, then moved up to 60% its a good deal?

The initial offers from the NHL were laughable, the NHLPA's proposals were at least an attempt to address the fundamental problem with the economics. The players want to end this cycle of lockouts and realize the only way to achieve this is through a viable revenue sharing plan.



You are drinking the NHL koolaid, in gulps!!!!

Average salary is nothing more than a function of revenue, when one rises so does the other. The players have agreed to 50/50, what they want is the owners to honour the signed contracts.

The 'make whole' was the concept Bettman claimed would do this, but it is now obvious that was a fairy tale.



What does leverage have to do with favouring/supporting one side or another?

I respectfully suggest you do a little research yourself, the Maple Leafs alone make $100M profit.



Might not make sense to you, but when I consider all the factors I don't believe the NHL/owners are acting in good faith.

Since 02-03 as league revenue grew from $1.996B to $3.4B, the players' share +13.8%, the owners' share +238.6%. During that time the owners raised ticket prices by 39%, I suppose you blame the players for this as well.

The facts are clear, owners make the business decisions yet don't want accountability when the economics don't work. Their answer, turn to the fans, sponsors, taxpayers and players to pay the bill.

IMO its time one of these entities stood up to the NHL, and so the players have my full support.



Maybe you should take your own advice, base your points on fact, not anecdotal evidence and emotion.
I fully support the players as well and this basically sums it up for me. My opinion is that owners were handing out huge contracts like crying towels at a leafs game; they were going to implement a new CBA that would restructure everything back into there favour. This is pure speculation. The week prior to the lockout contracts that were longer than 5 years were being handed out even though the media was reporting that the ownership was wanting to limit term to 5 years. To me, the NHL haven't been bargaining in good faith or signing players to contracts in good faith. I am not a lawyer but i believe that is grounds for voiding a contract, if it can be proven.

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Old
12-12-2012, 04:37 PM
  #63
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Player CBA = no parity, even harder on small market teams, increased ticket prices, more "Kovalchuck" contracts and more garbage.

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Old
12-12-2012, 04:46 PM
  #64
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Am I the only one who was surprised to see Don Cherry write an Op-Ed for the pinko commie Toronto Star?

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Old
12-12-2012, 04:55 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
So you believe if someone offered you 50% of the value for you house, then moved up to 60% its a good deal?
Depends. If no one else in the world is going to offer you that 50% of your houses "value" then yeah, 60% is a good offer.

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12-12-2012, 05:05 PM
  #66
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I would be surprised if this happened in Canada where fans are less concerned with how they are treated. Im pretty confident Gary could come out and say he dislikes Canada and that he hopes nobody from Canada ever watches a hockey game again and people would come back in droves. Sad because like many have said the only way this stops is if fans show their displeasure but similar to the owners some fans cannot help themselves!
Yeah, I cant see it happening in Canada either, but I'll be amazed if smaller market teams can retain even the minimal attendance they had before this lockout.

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12-12-2012, 05:31 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbeck5 View Post
You would just be hurting melnyk. Bad idea. Actually, terrible idea.

The players get paid everything.

Melnyk gets stuck paying the players without getting revenue...lockout time again.

Seriously though, think about it. Melnyk would be the only one hurting from that scenario. The only one. If you blame melnyk for this lockout, then go ahead...but i don't blame melnyk, therefore won't hurt melnyk. He's saved our team. I'd rather the players on the team( who will be out the door in the ever changing rotation of players) suffer then melnyk who's priority is not losing money while offering the fine people of ottawa hockey to watch.

I'd much rather boo the players then hurt melnyk financially after all hes done for the city. but hey, that's just me.
I love Melnyk too, he saved our team, and have no desire to see him hurt financially. But player salaries are based on league revenues (hence all the talk about lowering their share from 57% to 50% of hockey related revenue). If revenues go down, so do the real salaries that the players pocket.

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Old
12-12-2012, 06:34 PM
  #68
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Depends. If no one else in the world is going to offer you that 50% of your houses "value" then yeah, 60% is a good offer.
However the only buyer has been raising the offer, so the question is how much more will they give.

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Old
12-12-2012, 06:40 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Suiteness View Post
I definitely have no interest in watching a 40-odd game season or whatever amount it's going to end up being. What a f#$$% travesty.
What?

40 game schedule >>>>>>>>>>>> 82 gamer.

Think about it. As soon as the season starts, it's basically playoffs the whole way, with an extra injury or two.

Going to be awesome.

Every year should be a max 60 game schedule. Would be so good. Goes for NBA as well.

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Old
12-12-2012, 06:58 PM
  #70
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What?

40 game schedule >>>>>>>>>>>> 82 gamer.

Think about it. As soon as the season starts, it's basically playoffs the whole way, with an extra injury or two.

Going to be awesome.

Every year should be a max 60 game schedule. Would be so good. Goes for NBA as well.
Teams would lose millions from this.

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Old
12-12-2012, 07:11 PM
  #71
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If you guys want to argue owners vs players then I suggest you take it to the general NHL board.
We're all Sens fans and I don't want to have to block some of you like I did that Veni Vidi Vici dude

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Old
12-13-2012, 08:25 AM
  #72
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If you guys want to argue owners vs players then I suggest you take it to the general NHL board.
We're all Sens fans and I don't want to have to block some of you like I did that Veni Vidi Vici dude
Why can't we talk about the lockout in the sens board as well? It's interesting to get different perspectives.

As for the response to...i forget...i will do it after my exam.

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Old
12-13-2012, 12:23 PM
  #73
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Why can't we talk about the lockout in the sens board as well? It's interesting to get different perspectives.

As for the response to...i forget...i will do it after my exam.
I can tell you that if I allow myself to get into the specifics I will be at odds with holdurbreath who is someone I have no qualms with.

This player vs owners thing gets way out of hand very easily especially considering how complicated collective bargaining is and how uninformed a lot of people are; I'm not saying I know everything but I have spent a huge chunk of time learning the specifics and I get very, very angry with people who act like they understand but don't (and I don't mean to imply that everyone who isn't in agreement with me is wrong)

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Old
12-13-2012, 12:35 PM
  #74
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Honestly I havent' followed this lockout at all, outside of wishing there was a way that both Bettman and Fehr could both lose and the fans win (hey I can dream). Gotten back into watching the Belleville Bulls and the Kingston Frontenacs after moving back to Ontario and havent' (and wont' be) looking back.

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Old
12-13-2012, 01:03 PM
  #75
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Yeah, I cant see it happening in Canada either, but I'll be amazed if smaller market teams can retain even the minimal attendance they had before this lockout.
Agreed, id love to have an unbiased stats guy that goes into the "bargaining sessions" prior to each one begining and give a quick summary/estimation to both sides on how much $$$$ has been lost to date, how many estimated fans will not come back etc...like a running tally so they could see the daily damage being done via a NHL "town cryer" type person!

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