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Old
12-14-2012, 03:16 PM
  #551
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Perhaps Edler at 4.6m gets it done? It really depends on what kind of depth is retained, but I think they can keep Booth if they go cheap on the rest of the roster.


You also have to go for cheaper options instead of allowing prospects space on the roster, as you are looking at 200k to 300k differences.
I don't see Edler accepting $4.6 mil. If that's all we offered, I think he would test free agency and get more from another playoff team.
The lowest I could see him accepting is $5-5.25 mil per.

Hopefully players will realize that they wont be making what players got last off-season, as the cap is going down.

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Old
12-14-2012, 03:23 PM
  #552
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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Perhaps Edler at 4.6m gets it done? It really depends on what kind of depth is retained, but I think they can keep Booth if they go cheap on the rest of the roster.


You also have to go for cheaper options instead of allowing prospects space on the roster, as you are looking at 200k to 300k differences.
That would be quite the coup.

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12-14-2012, 04:41 PM
  #553
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I think Edler re-signs for Kesler money, around 5 million, maybe a bit more.

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12-14-2012, 04:45 PM
  #554
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Originally Posted by ZenMaster View Post
Booth is not going to be traded, and quite frankly he brings fair value for his contract. He has qualities that are attractive in today's NHL. He's built like an ox, a powerful skater, and plays a power-forward game while chipping in 25-30 goals a season.
I would dump David Booth in a heartbeat. Behind Ballard, he's the next to go if the Canucks need to clear cap space to get under $60mil.

Just not a very good player IMO. Not durable either. Don't see this guy a Canuck for too much longer.

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12-14-2012, 04:51 PM
  #555
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenMaster View Post
Booth is not going to be traded, and quite frankly he brings fair value for his contract. He has qualities that are attractive in today's NHL. He's built like an ox, a powerful skater, and plays a power-forward game while chipping in 25-30 goals a season.
I disagree. He's worth $3M at best for what he brings. All of these attributes matter little if opponents know he'll probably fumble the pass or be in the wrong place in the ice. He needs some coach lovin'

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12-14-2012, 04:55 PM
  #556
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Originally Posted by VinnyC View Post
I disagree. He's worth $3M at best for what he brings. All of these attributes matter little if opponents know he'll probably fumble the pass or be in the wrong place in the ice. He needs some coach lovin'
Who else on the current roster, consistently takes the puck to the crease?

23 goal scorers (his pace last season) are worth substantially more than $3 million.....I don't know how many times people need to be shown the statistics that clearly outline David Booth as a top 6 NHL forward.

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12-14-2012, 05:28 PM
  #557
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
Who else on the current roster, consistently takes the puck to the crease?

23 goal scorers (his pace last season) are worth substantially more than $3 million.....I don't know how many times people need to be shown the statistics that clearly outline David Booth as a top 6 NHL forward.
I don't disagree that he is worth his contract, but then what do we do? Ballard, although I feel he would be worth his contract if he were used properly, is gone for similar money, and who do we jettison? Malhotra has an NTC until seasons end, Alberts and Raymond can be AHL'd or traded, Luongo is likely gone, but who else?

4.2+1.225+2.275+5.33 in capspace is shipped off, and depending on the return, we have holes to fill through UFA or internally. Rookies aren't free, grinders aren't free, even plugs aren't free. Lack fills one free agency hole at 0.875M/season, but we still have 2 top six forwards we need to replace Raymond (or, having Kassian fill in, a bottom line winger at best). Volpatti and Ebbett can fill in the bottom six, but we NEED a top six winger as is, even with out jettisoning Raymond. We also have a top four defender that's been bounced, as well as several "spare" slots vacant. That loss 12 million or so (really 5 million, less our internal additions) in cap space we dump isn't looking so great any more if we look to improve, and is just enough to stay as is, minus some role players, Lu and Ballard.


Last edited by Cogburn: 12-14-2012 at 05:31 PM. Reason: Spelling mistakes (Sorry, I'm sick and at work on my belated lunch break)
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Old
12-14-2012, 05:50 PM
  #558
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Let's face it, when he's at his best, Edler is one of the best two-way defensemen in the league, he'll want upwards of $5M and he'll get it.

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Old
12-14-2012, 09:47 PM
  #559
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CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Daniel Sedin ($6.100m) / Henrik Sedin ($6.100m) / Alexandre Burrows ($2.000m)
David Booth ($4.250m) / Ryan Kesler ($5.000m) / Zack Kassian ($0.870m)
Chris Higgins ($1.900m) / Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Jannik Hansen ($1.350m)
Aaron Volpatti ($0.600m) / Manny Malhotra ($2.500m) / Dale Weise ($0.615m)
Andrew Ebbett ($0.600m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Hamhuis ($4.500m) / Kevin Bieksa ($4.600m)
Alexander Edler ($3.250m) / Jason Garrison ($4.600m)
Keith Ballard ($4.200m) / Chris Tanev ($0.900m)
Derek Joslin ($0.700m) /
GOALTENDERS
Cory Schneider ($4.000m)
Eddie Lack ($0.750m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,200,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,385,000; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $9,815,000

For this year, this is the closest I can get without moving Tanev/Kassian down for cheaper players (which given the nature of their respective performances on the Wolves, we may wish to do) like Gordon or Mullen, who would together save us something like 600 K. This is assuming we don't get a huge number of roster players back, then we don't have to desperately waive/drop contributing players (although I have Raymond being moved, mostly because I see him being moved, and I don't see Alberts sticking if we have cuts needed).

Long story short, there is one move we're expecting, but otherwise we don't have to move Booth/Ballard, which is contrary to my earlier post, but we wouldn't be dressing our best roster.

Next year gets trickier with Burrows' raise, Edler's raise, and trying to keep Higgins and Lapierre. Booth and Ballard, in addition to Malhotra's salary coming off the books would be needed to keep everyone happy.

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Old
12-16-2012, 01:35 PM
  #560
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post

Next year gets trickier with Burrows' raise, Edler's raise, and trying to keep Higgins and Lapierre. Booth and Ballard, in addition to Malhotra's salary coming off the books would be needed to keep everyone happy.

If the cap drops to 60mil i think higgins and lapierre would re-sign the same contract they have now.


13-14 canucks with 60mil cap
FORWARDS
Daniel Sedin ($6.100m) / Henrik Sedin ($6.100m) / Alex Burrows ($4.500m)
David Booth ($4.250m) / Ryan Kesler ($5.000m) / Zack Kassian ($0.870m)
Chris Higgins ($1.900m) / Jordan Schroeder ($1.025m) / Jannik Hansen ($1.350m)
Aaron Volpatti ($0.600m) / Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Dale Weise ($0.615m)
Andrew Ebbett ($0.600m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Hamhuis ($4.500m) / Kevin Bieksa ($4.600m)
Alex Edler ($5.200m) / Jason Garrison ($4.600m)
Jim Vandermeer ($0.900m) / Chris Tanev ($0.900m)
Derek Joslin ($0.700m) /
GOALTENDERS
Cory Schneider ($4.000m)
Eddie Lack ($0.750m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $60,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,060,000; BONUSES: $125,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $65,000

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Old
12-16-2012, 01:38 PM
  #561
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Royal Canuck View Post
Let's face it, when he's at his best, Edler is one of the best two-way defensemen in the league, he'll want upwards of $5M and he'll get it.
I disagree. I like Edler, but we overrate him way too much on here.

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Old
12-16-2012, 01:41 PM
  #562
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
I disagree. I like Edler, but we overrate him way too much on here.
I agree, he's too consistently inconsistent to garner that kind of praise. He's a very good defenseman when he's on his game, but that doesn't happen often enough.

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Old
12-16-2012, 01:49 PM
  #563
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Originally Posted by Canucker View Post
I agree, he's too consistently inconsistent to garner that kind of praise. He's a very good defenseman when he's on his game, but that doesn't happen often enough.
Which is why the team held off resigning him imo. It's not that they won't pay him >4.6m... he just needs to take his game up a notch to get that kind of deal. A missed season really throws a wrench into making him earn a big contract... I still think we have a 100% chance of hockey this season though.

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Old
12-16-2012, 01:51 PM
  #564
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Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
Which is why the team held off resigning him imo. It's not that they won't pay him >4.6m... he just needs to take his game up a notch to get that kind of deal. A missed season really throws a wrench into making him earn a big contract... I still think we have a 100% chance of hockey this season though.
Agreed. I think he's fully capable of doing it, just needs to prove it.

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Old
12-16-2012, 04:41 PM
  #565
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I think Edler can get five somewhere. I think he is going to attempt it, too.

In the event of a season, I might explore a package with Edler and Luongo.

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Old
12-16-2012, 04:46 PM
  #566
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JuniorNelson View Post
I think Edler can get five somewhere. I think he is going to attempt it, too.

In the event of a season, I might explore a package with Edler and Luongo.
I don't see why we don't give him 5. If he wants more than 6, I'd get weary.

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Old
12-16-2012, 09:30 PM
  #567
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamskull View Post
If the cap drops to 60mil i think higgins and lapierre would re-sign the same contract they have now.


13-14 canucks with 60mil cap
FORWARDS
Daniel Sedin ($6.100m) / Henrik Sedin ($6.100m) / Alex Burrows ($4.500m)
David Booth ($4.250m) / Ryan Kesler ($5.000m) / Zack Kassian ($0.870m)
Chris Higgins ($1.900m) / Jordan Schroeder ($1.025m) / Jannik Hansen ($1.350m)
Aaron Volpatti ($0.600m) / Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Dale Weise ($0.615m)
Andrew Ebbett ($0.600m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Hamhuis ($4.500m) / Kevin Bieksa ($4.600m)
Alex Edler ($5.200m) / Jason Garrison ($4.600m)
Jim Vandermeer ($0.900m) / Chris Tanev ($0.900m)
Derek Joslin ($0.700m) /
GOALTENDERS
Cory Schneider ($4.000m)
Eddie Lack ($0.750m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $60,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,060,000; BONUSES: $125,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $65,000
I'd hope so, but I honestly can't say it with any certainty. Lapierre would be a small raise at best, given his role, but I think Higgins will get more then 2 easily, and 2.5 as a "home town discount" if it's a shorter, as in under three year, term.

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12-16-2012, 10:10 PM
  #568
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
I disagree. I like Edler, but we overrate him way too much on here.
Hey we all have a player we tend to overrate on here....

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Old
12-17-2012, 12:55 AM
  #569
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I've got another ridiculous set of proposals.

Booth, Higgins and a 2nd for Clowe and Murray.

Luongo for Lupul, Gunnarsson and what ever futures you wish to fill in.

Edler for Franzen and Filppula.

Tanev and Kassian staying with the Wolves this season.

FORWARDS
Daniel Sedin ($6.100m) / Henrik Sedin ($6.100m) / Alexandre Burrows ($2.000m)
Ryane Clowe ($3.625m) / Ryan Kesler ($5.000m) / Joffrey Lupul ($4.250m)
Jannik Hansen ($1.350m) / Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / Johan Franzen ($3.955m)
Manny Malhotra ($2.500m) / Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Mason Raymond ($2.275m)
Andrew Ebbett ($0.600m) / Dale Weise ($0.615m)
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Hamhuis ($4.500m) / Kevin Bieksa ($4.600m)
Jason Garrison ($4.600m) / Douglas Murray ($2.500m)
Keith Ballard ($4.200m) / Carl Gunnarsson ($1.325m)
Andrew Alberts ($1.225m) /
GOALTENDERS
Cory Schneider ($4.000m)
Eddie Lack ($0.750m)
SALARY CAP: $70,200,000; CAP PAYROLL: $70,069,545; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $130,455

I should get to sleep, it's Monday tomorrow.

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Old
12-17-2012, 01:07 AM
  #570
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^ After his last season, Doug Murray would be lucky to be a #6 earning minimum. Someone will probably give it to him, but that's how bad Sharks fans on here agree(d) he was last year.

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Old
12-17-2012, 01:13 AM
  #571
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^ After his last season, Doug Murray would be lucky to be a #6 earning minimum. Someone will probably give it to him, but that's how bad Sharks fans on here agree(d) he was last year.
Yeah, actually looking at his stats declining last year...drop our 2nd and Murray, get Tanev back in the line up with Ballard.

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12-17-2012, 09:00 AM
  #572
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One approach for a $60MM cap world would be as follows:

- move Luongo, Ballard and Booth. Easier said than done.

- go with a 20man roster - the 4th line are the spare parts already (6-7 minutes on avg. the last 4 playoffs, 5 goals scored in 52 games), one of them can be a dman which would be an improvement as many games LY were finished with only 5 D.

- total budget for 4th line and back up goalie of $2.8MM.

- as a methodology for the cap, a capgeek roster was generated where everybody was removed but the "core" players (YMMV) - Henrik, Daniel, Burr, Kes, Schneider, Hamhuis, Bieksa, and Garrison.

- used Volpatti, Weise and Ebbett as proxy for the 4th line, Conklin as proxy for the backup, and left Malhotra in to reflect Burrows' 2013-14 cap hit.

- Leaves ~$18MM of cap space for 3 dmen and 5 forwards... Some flexibility to alter the team's look going forward.

- Of note, 6 of the players (Edler, Raymond, Hansen, Higgins, Lapierre, Tanev) occupying these 8 spots re on short term contracts (RFA or UFA) and IMO, their value as players exceeds their cap hit.

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
FORWARDS
Daniel Sedin ($6.100m) / Henrik Sedin ($6.100m) / Alexandre Burrows ($2.000m)
Aaron Volpatti ($0.600m) / Ryan Kesler ($5.000m) / Dale Weise ($0.615m)
Manny Malhotra ($2.500m) / Andrew Ebbett ($0.600m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kevin Bieksa ($4.600m) / Jason Garrison ($4.600m)
Dan Hamhuis ($4.500m) /
GOALTENDERS
Cory Schneider ($4.000m)
Ty Conklin ($0.985m)
------
SALARY CAP: $60,200,000; CAP PAYROLL: $42,200,000; CAP SPACE (13-man roster): $18,000,000


Last edited by Outside99*: 12-17-2012 at 09:12 AM. Reason: clarify
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Old
12-17-2012, 03:57 PM
  #573
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More Edler: "After surgery (2011) I don't think the back can get back to 100 per cent. That doesn't mean you can't play at 100 per cent ...
... It's sore and stiff, but it was sore and stiff last year and I played 82 games."



Thought this may be important when it comes to Edler & resigning him.

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Old
12-17-2012, 05:14 PM
  #574
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Quote:
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@benkuzma
More Edler: "After surgery (2011) I don't think the back can get back to 100 per cent. That doesn't mean you can't play at 100 per cent ...
... It's sore and stiff, but it was sore and stiff last year and I played 82 games."

Thought this may be important when it comes to Edler & resigning him.

Edler should be traded in a package with Luongo. This would ensure the Luongo trade returns a player(s) who will help current Canuck's roster.

If these two were a package deal, what could the return be? Toronto? Florida? Edmonton?

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12-17-2012, 05:19 PM
  #575
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I disagree. I like Edler, but we overrate him way too much on here.
You may disagree that he's one of the best in the NHL, but there is absolutely no doubt he could get 5+ million a season somewhere.

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