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Old
12-16-2012, 07:17 AM
  #26
DJOpus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prairie Habs View Post
Like as in confirmed never to play again and Toronto is trading for his rights for advertising and charity purposes?

I agree with the general consensus of ~20 overall plus a B prospect. I also agree that he wouldn't have a big jump in value at the deadline. Pretty much every team that will be in a playoff position will already have 2 top 6 centers (except Chicago) and Grabovski isn't on an expiring contract so they won't be able to afford him the following years at 5.5M on the third line.
Just wondering, what's Plekanec's value comparatively?

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12-16-2012, 10:02 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
Just wondering, what's Plekanec's value comparatively?
Slightly higher. He is better defensively, more proven offensively and is on a better contract though Grabo is a little bit younger I believe. I would want a first at ~15-20 overall plus a good prospect, hopefully a former first rounder. So pretty much I think both would return a mid first but the prospect/other piece should be a little better for Plek.

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12-16-2012, 10:40 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Prairie Habs View Post
Slightly higher. He is better defensively, more proven offensively and is on a better contract though Grabo is a little bit younger I believe. I would want a first at ~15-20 overall plus a good prospect, hopefully a former first rounder. So pretty much I think both would return a mid first but the prospect/other piece should be a little better for Plek.
Would you trade Plekanec for:

Gaunce/Schroeder + VAN 1st + 2nd/Raymond?

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Old
12-16-2012, 11:44 AM
  #29
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I can safely assure you that your opinion is wrong.
Well, I'd be looking to build a team, not play NHL 13.

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Old
12-16-2012, 11:54 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
Would you trade Plekanec for:

Gaunce/Schroeder + VAN 1st + 2nd/Raymond?
Why would Vancouver need another center...unless you are putting him on your 3rd line. But why waste him there?

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Old
12-16-2012, 12:01 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
Would you trade Plekanec for:

Gaunce/Schroeder + VAN 1st + 2nd/Raymond?
maybe

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Old
12-16-2012, 12:02 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
Would you trade Plekanec for:

Gaunce/Schroeder + VAN 1st + 2nd/Raymond?
I'd rather we save our futures and only go after a legit first line RW if we do decide to make a move like that before going on a cup run. Plekanec doesn't really fit need for us.

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Old
12-16-2012, 12:17 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hlaverty06 View Post
Why would Vancouver need another center...unless you are putting him on your 3rd line. But why waste him there?
Poll recently... "Is Grabovski a #1 or #2 on a contender... results were basically he would be a #2/3 on a contender.

Hey, if Grabovski is your 7th forward, you're in damn good shape. Injuries and such occur in playoffs, if Vancouver is "going for it" which they certainly would be.. it's not a bad trade for them at all.

If Kesler get's injured in 3rd round again, you have a center like Grabovski to pick up some of that slack?... you're laughing.

It's like Bruins with Peverly/Kelly... those guys would be 2nd liners on a lot of teams, but 3rd for Bruins, and that's the difference between contenders/playoff teams... depth.

Not a bad trade, but doubt Toronto does it, they are done toiling in the bottom of standings and want to get competitive/good... but it does make sense for Vancouver imo.

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Old
12-16-2012, 12:26 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Howie View Post
Poll recently... "Is Grabovski a #1 or #2 on a contender... results were basically he would be a #2/3 on a contender.

Hey, if Grabovski is your 7th forward, you're in damn good shape. Injuries and such occur in playoffs, if Vancouver is "going for it" which they certainly would be.. it's not a bad trade for them at all.

If Kesler get's injured in 3rd round again, you have a center like Grabovski to pick up some of that slack?... you're laughing.

It's like Bruins with Peverly/Kelly... those guys would be 2nd liners on a lot of teams, but 3rd for Bruins, and that's the difference between contenders/playoff teams... depth.

Not a bad trade, but doubt Toronto does it, they are done toiling in the bottom of standings and want to get competitive/good... but it does make sense for Vancouver imo.
This is about plekanec, and one... It's an expensive "replacement" and your giving up futures.

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Old
12-16-2012, 06:56 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by hlaverty06 View Post
This is about plekanec, and one... It's an expensive "replacement" and your giving up futures.
I'd take either as a Canucks fan and rate then similarly.

I feel there is more than one way to address secondary scoring.

Sedin - Sedin - Burrows
Higgins - Kesler - Hansen/Kassian
Booth - Plekanec - Raymond/Hansen

Looks solid to me and any one player could go down and we would still be okay.

I have no problem giving up our 1st, 2nd, and Gaunce since we will likely get similar back for Luongo... Basically its Luongo for Plekanec.

I think Pleks would be better for Van than Grabo because he's more of a setup man for Booth.

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Old
12-16-2012, 07:04 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
I'd take either as a Canucks fan and rate then similarly.

I feel there is more than one way to address secondary scoring.

Sedin - Sedin - Burrows
Higgins - Kesler - Hansen/Kassian
Booth - Plekanec - Raymond/Hansen

Looks solid to me and any one player could go down and we would still be okay.

I have no problem giving up our 1st, 2nd, and Gaunce since we will likely get similar back for Luongo... Basically its Luongo for Plekanec.

I think Pleks would be better for Van than Grabo because he's more of a setup man for Booth.
I'd still prefer going after someone like Perry than a top-6 centre. I think we'd be a better team with, say, Perry and Schroeder than Plekanec/Grabovski and Kassian filling holes.

Especially as it would be easier to find a rental 3C than a rental top-6 RW at the deadline.

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Old
12-16-2012, 07:21 PM
  #37
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I'd rather try Kadri out as the second line centre. He's playing great in the AHL right now.

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Old
12-16-2012, 07:51 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Howie View Post
It's like Bruins with Peverly/Kelly... those guys would be 2nd liners on a lot of teams
Lol no

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Old
12-16-2012, 08:22 PM
  #39
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Plekanec is a more attractive player if The nucks wanted a center behind Kesler and Sedin, better on the draws than Grabovski which is a big asset IMO, and a slightly better cap hit at 5M. He also has hit a season high of 70 pts in his career.

I floated the idea of a Luongo for Grabovski deal before the lock out on the Leafs board, the majority of Leafs fans were against it, but I can certainly see there being some smoke in a move like this one.

Pleks may be more attractive but Montreal do not need a Goalie with Price.

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Old
12-16-2012, 09:07 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
better on the draws than Grabovski which is a big asset IMO,
Last year.

Pleks - 49.5%
Grabs - 51.5%

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Old
12-16-2012, 09:21 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
I'd still prefer going after someone like Perry than a top-6 centre. I think we'd be a better team with, say, Perry and Schroeder than Plekanec/Grabovski and Kassian filling holes.

Especially as it would be easier to find a rental 3C than a rental top-6 RW at the deadline.
The difference is, cover for injury if Kesler or H. Sedin get injured again.

We could lose any winger and still be okay as long as its not compounded by other injuries. If we lose either of our top 2 centres in your scenario, we're completely screwed which is exactly what happened in our last two playoff series'.

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12-16-2012, 09:23 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmlhockeyfan View Post
I'd rather try Kadri out as the second line centre. He's playing great in the AHL right now.
Kadri is not better than Grabovski.

At all.

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Old
12-16-2012, 09:26 PM
  #43
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The Leafs would be interested in prospects or picks in exchange for Grabovski, since trading your number two center is an indication that your team is not willing to compete which the Leafs are not anywhere close to doing so Grabovski isn't really all that useful to us right now.

Most playoff teams who can afford his price-tag would really like him for a third center (with PP time) or for teams with lighter depth a second center.

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Old
12-16-2012, 09:27 PM
  #44
Vankiller Whale
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
The difference is, cover for injury if Kesler or H. Sedin get injured again.

We could lose any winger and still be okay as long as its not compounded by other injuries. If we lose either of our top 2 centres in your scenario, we're completely screwed which is exactly what happened in our last two playoff series'.
We were completely screwed because Kesler was trying to carry a line by himself. Centres aren't the only players who can score. A big reason why our scoring took a hit is also because Daniel was out. Perry >> Plekanec/Grabovski, and if we're going to address our scoring problems, we may as well address the biggest hole.

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Old
12-16-2012, 10:00 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
We were completely screwed because Kesler was trying to carry a line by himself. Centres aren't the only players who can score. A big reason why our scoring took a hit is also because Daniel was out. Perry >> Plekanec/Grabovski, and if we're going to address our scoring problems, we may as well address the biggest hole.
IMO our scoring was screwed as soon as Kesler was hurt. He was so injured that he still isn't healed.

Getting Perry would fix our 2nd line which already works when Kesler isn't hurt and likely still wouldn't be that great if Kesler is hurt.

Getting Pleks or Grabo fixes our third line when Kesler is healthy and our 2nd line if Kesler is hurt.

I don't think we're going to agree on this... But I was pushing hard for us to go after Carter and Hemsky last season so I clearly acknowledge 2nd line rw could use an upgrade.

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Old
12-16-2012, 10:34 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fogelhund View Post
Last year.

Pleks - 49.5%
Grabs - 51.5%
Really I thought the last poll had it as:

85% Plekanec
15% Grabovski

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Old
12-16-2012, 10:39 PM
  #47
Vankiller Whale
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Really I thought the last poll had it as:

85% Plekanec
15% Grabovski
Those were the faceoff percentages last year.

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Old
12-17-2012, 07:38 AM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Those were the faceoff percentages last year.
The difference is primarily Plekanec is matched up against the other team's best faceoff men, Grabovski is rarely relied on to win key faceoffs. Steckel(58%) and Bozak(52.7%) are ahead of him on the Leafs, plus Plekanec usually is in the top 3 in amount of draws taken in the NHL, he is clearly the choice on the Habs.

Here are Grabovski's numbers past 4 seasons. Not very good.

44.5, 49.8, 48.4, 51.5

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Old
12-18-2012, 06:23 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
Kadri is not better than Grabovski.

At all.
Kadri has a much higher ceiling. He has better playmaking skills, hands and vision too. He just needs to be given a full season. I can see JVR-Kadri-Kulemin line working well.

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Old
12-18-2012, 06:44 PM
  #50
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IMO, Plekanec is one of the most underrated players in the NHL. Grabovski is clearly levels below Plekanec.

If I was matching Plekanec against a Leaf it would be Kessel...and if that was the case I honestly don't know who I'd pick. I guess the kicker would be whether or not I was convinced that Kessel will continue to be a consistent PPG player. Right now I'm unconvinced that he will.

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