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The 2012-2013 NHL Lockout Discussion Thread

View Poll Results: Will there be any NHL games before 8/15/13?
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Old
12-14-2012, 11:33 PM
  #501
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Since we are going full nuclear, I fully believe not one player should he paid more than four million bucks. Call two hundred Kay the minimum and twenty times that the max. Not a penny over four million for any player. Twenty year CBA with those terms. No contract greater than six years, ZERO annual variance and a max of four million per year.

Do it NHL. Do it.

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12-15-2012, 01:25 AM
  #502
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Looking forward to what the NHLPA can get out of this, most likely the owners will do like their NBA counterparts and cave rather soon because you do not want an antitrust lawsuit in pro sports.

Serves 'em right.

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12-15-2012, 03:38 AM
  #503
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Originally Posted by letbob View Post
The Coyotes might win the "most screwed" award given the excitement that could have been generated this season from the playoff run last year and the fact that the Suns and Cardinals are nothing short of pathetic this winter.
Par for the course, when it comes to the "most screwed" award, the Coyotes are a freaking dynasty.

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12-15-2012, 04:10 AM
  #504
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I wish athletes played for the sport, and not the money.

That's what i love about NASCAR. The drivers just want to drive. How do they get their money? Sponsors. How do they earn their sponsors? Driving well. How do they earn bonuses? Winning. They have to EARN what they get. There are drivers like Kurt Busch, a former champion, who was just recently driving the hell out of an unsponsored car because he wasn't performing well. Started finishing in the top 10 in multiple races and gained a sponsor. Now he is at least guaranteed a paycheck at the end of the week for being a sponsored driver, but if he wants big money, he's got to win. One of the few sports where you start with nothing and WORK your way to the top. That's why most of these drivers and their respective put crews are such classy, and humble people. With hockey, basketball, and football, you see 17-18 year old kids fresh out of high school making damn near 1 million dollars a year for signing a contract with a team before they even play a game at the professional level. You know, a 3rd line winger with one good season under his belt could sign a 6 million dollar contract with a team just based on that season. You know how much the check was that CHAMPION of NASCAR worked ALLL year to earn? The ultimate grand prize to the sport, the prize that is the equivalent to the Stanley Cup, the prize that drivers year after year dedicate their lives to achieve? 5 million dollars.

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12-15-2012, 10:41 AM
  #505
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
Since we are going full nuclear, I fully believe not one player should he paid more than four million bucks. Call two hundred Kay the minimum and twenty times that the max. Not a penny over four million for any player. Twenty year CBA with those terms. No contract greater than six years, ZERO annual variance and a max of four million per year.

Do it NHL. Do it.
B-b-b-b-b-b-b-but what about 'make whole' provisions...?!

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12-15-2012, 11:25 AM
  #506
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Do it NHL. Do it.
There won't be any rules like that at all if they successfully decertify. But they won't get that far, and the league would probably rather tie it up in the courts for another year or two rather than face running a league with no CBA.
I don't think the PA has a chance of winning in court, but if they did, there'd be no minimum pay (and no maximum).
If they don't win, then they're out the salaries (and contract years) of however long it takes to resolve in court. And the union is pretty much broken anyway. I don't see the players getting a better offer than what's on the table now.
I think the league is probably worried that a version of "the takeaway" is going to leave them vulnerable to claims they haven't negotiated in good faith. Which is absurd, b/c they're the only ones who have up to this point, but it's a reasonable approach to avoid the spin or having to defend itself in court or in front of the NLRB from the spinmeisters in the PA.
But I'd definitely stop negotiating against myself which is what the league has been doing to this point. The players haven't really offered up anything and the league is moving every couple of weeks. It gives Fehr no reason to move and encourages him to wait b/c the offers keep getting better.

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12-15-2012, 08:58 PM
  #507
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
Since we are going full nuclear, I fully believe not one player should he paid more than four million bucks. Call two hundred Kay the minimum and twenty times that the max. Not a penny over four million for any player. Twenty year CBA with those terms. No contract greater than six years, ZERO annual variance and a max of four million per year.

Do it NHL. Do it.
As long as there was a provision in there to guarantee lower ticket prices I'd go for that.

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12-16-2012, 03:54 AM
  #508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
Since we are going full nuclear, I fully believe not one player should he paid more than four million bucks. Call two hundred Kay the minimum and twenty times that the max. Not a penny over four million for any player. Twenty year CBA with those terms. No contract greater than six years, ZERO annual variance and a max of four million per year.

Do it NHL. Do it.
Why limit yourself to having a minimum salary. Players like Biznasty come to mind. Pay him $1,000/minute of ice time. He'll make about $40K.

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12-16-2012, 04:08 AM
  #509
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Why limit yourself to having a minimum salary. Players like Biznasty come to mind. Pay him $1,000/minute of ice time. He'll make about $40K.
I'd rather we don't pay BizWussy anymore. Since we are going full nuclear here, I wish there was a way for players like Turris and Mueller to have to pay back what they made here in Phoenix as a result of spitting on the organization and the fans.


Last edited by Colt45Blast: 12-16-2012 at 04:45 AM.
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12-16-2012, 09:10 AM
  #510
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Originally Posted by rabbit3119 View Post
I wish athletes played for the sport, and not the money.

That's what i love about NASCAR. The drivers just want to drive. How do they get their money? Sponsors. How do they earn their sponsors? Driving well. How do they earn bonuses? Winning. They have to EARN what they get. There are drivers like Kurt Busch, a former champion, who was just recently driving the hell out of an unsponsored car because he wasn't performing well. Started finishing in the top 10 in multiple races and gained a sponsor. Now he is at least guaranteed a paycheck at the end of the week for being a sponsored driver, but if he wants big money, he's got to win. One of the few sports where you start with nothing and WORK your way to the top. That's why most of these drivers and their respective put crews are such classy, and humble people. With hockey, basketball, and football, you see 17-18 year old kids fresh out of high school making damn near 1 million dollars a year for signing a contract with a team before they even play a game at the professional level. You know, a 3rd line winger with one good season under his belt could sign a 6 million dollar contract with a team just based on that season. You know how much the check was that CHAMPION of NASCAR worked ALLL year to earn? The ultimate grand prize to the sport, the prize that is the equivalent to the Stanley Cup, the prize that drivers year after year dedicate their lives to achieve? 5 million dollars.
While NASCAR drivers' big payday is from sponsors and race earnings are significant the drivers do still enjoy salaries in the millions.

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12-16-2012, 09:55 AM
  #511
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"NHL’s class action complaint almost identical to NBA’s, but the differences are illuminating"

http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/201...-illuminating/

Quote:
The class action complaint for declaratory relief was, like the NBA’s, filed in the southern district court of New York. Like the NBA’s, lawyers from the firms of Proskauer Rose and Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom were listed at the bottom. But the similarities went much further.
In fact, huge stretches of the two documents were nearly identical. Five of the NHL’s seven claims for relief were lifted directly from the NBA’s complaint. The same arguments were made, the same language was used; some paragraphs could have been word-for-word quotations. Every single non-NBA specific argument made in that league’s complaint was duplicated in the NHL’s version.
Quote:
In both filings, a central argument was that whether the union opted for decertification or a disclaimer of interest, they didn’t really mean it – in other words, it was a trick to negotiate a better deal and as such should be ignored. Unfortunately for the NHL, while the NBPA has a pretty long track record of signing deals after talking about decertification, there is no similar track record with the NHLPA.

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12-17-2012, 10:42 AM
  #512
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Phoenix misses the NHL, even during an Arizona Cardinals blowout (PHOTO)

http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl...0916--nhl.html

Kinda funny

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12-17-2012, 02:25 PM
  #513
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Originally Posted by naurutger View Post
Phoenix misses the NHL, even during an Arizona Cardinals blowout (PHOTO)

http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl...0916--nhl.html

Kinda funny
Not sure who the guy is to the left of the guy (his right) holding the sign, but I'm pretty sure he's been a coyote season Ticket holder since day one. Good for them....the number of diehard coyote fans may be small in numbers, but I'll put them up against any other teams' fans, especially after the last 3 seasons of uncertainty.

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12-17-2012, 02:34 PM
  #514
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Originally Posted by Devils Advocate View Post
Not sure who the guy is to the left of the guy (his right) holding the sign, but I'm pretty sure he's been a coyote season Ticket holder since day one. Good for them....the number of diehard coyote fans may be small in numbers, but I'll put them up against any other teams' fans, especially after the last 3 seasons of uncertainty.
I went to my first Cardinal game since 2008 yesterday. I almost wore my jersey but opted for a Coyotes t-shirt instead. So I was representin'!

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12-18-2012, 09:16 AM
  #515
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Consulting group finds NHL has suffered major damage as far as fan loyalty

http://www.660news.com/sports/articl...as-fan-loyalty

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12-18-2012, 09:40 AM
  #516
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Adrian Aucoin uprooted to Columbus, yet might never play there

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“I’m not naive,” he said at the time. “I think we all saw what happened [with the last lockout], and there’s really no reason to think it would be different.”

What’s more, Aucoin didn’t just move to Columbus — he brought the whole family along with him. His wife and five children relocated to the Midwest, a decision based largely on Aucoin’s research.
http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2...er-play-there/

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12-18-2012, 09:51 AM
  #517
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No winning this lame blame game

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Somehow, a deal that isn't that far away at all -- on paper, at least -- is threatening to get worse with the legal battle now under way between the NHL and NHL Players' Association.
http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/87...o-lockout-mess

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12-18-2012, 09:54 AM
  #518
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^ the same thing happened to Steve Sullivan and his family. In a late summer interview with Tyson Nash he stated that he had enrolled his kids in school here and found a house.

Now, the greater Phoenix area is a known retirement destination and may have been on Sullivan's radar for that purpose, all along. Still, that uncertainty is pretty heavy.

You know who I blame for this lock out? The players' wives. There is no way I'd get away with this stubborn stupidity. Why aren't these women doing their jobs? Isn't a wife's duty to keep her husband from doing stupid **** for ridiculous reasons?

Falling on your sword and sacrificing an enormous chunk of your lifetime earnings so that the top five percent of your richest colleagues can have a tiny bit more flexibility in the way the are paid, flexibility that you and ninety five percent of your brothers will never enjoy is stupid. And to do so in the name of "winning" is a foolish and prideful motivation.

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12-18-2012, 11:00 AM
  #519
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Falling on your sword and sacrificing an enormous chunk of your lifetime earnings so that the top five percent of your richest colleagues can have a tiny bit more flexibility in the way the are paid, flexibility that you and ninety five percent of your brothers will never enjoy is stupid. And to do so in the name of "winning" is a foolish and prideful motivation.
You have hit this head on the nail with great force and stout hammer. The "blue collar" guys, the players who have the shortest careers, earn the least per contract, and are, in fine, both the largest and the most vulnerable segment of the union's membership, are getting ****ed. Paul Bissonnette should be furious with Fehr and the rest, not cheering them on.

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12-18-2012, 11:27 AM
  #520
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Consulting group finds NHL has suffered major damage as far as fan loyalty

http://www.660news.com/sports/articl...as-fan-loyalty
Not alot of solid infomation from that aritcle. I remember when I kept hearing that the NHL was gone for good after the last lockout and they came back stronger than ever. Then again, there was no social media at that time or no previous cancelations to the season due to CBA talks at that time for that matter.

I have no doubt seeing that the Coyotes Fans will be back seeing that the team is the only professional one in the state that the citizens have faith in the team winning a title. Also, we are finally witnessing the 1st ever team banner to be raised.



Last edited by Colt45Blast: 12-18-2012 at 11:39 AM.
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12-18-2012, 04:25 PM
  #521
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This is fairly off topic, but as a result of the lock out I've been watching a lot of hockey from the early and mid nineties on the NHL Network. I find it hilarious that Raffi Torres is so vilified by HFboards, and some of the most respected legends from our own time were ten times as violent, predatory, and dirty. In 1994, not a person in the world would consider a guy like Torres a dirty or dangerous player. Not even in '99. Not even close. Just funny how things change right before our eyes and we still manage to romanticize what was and marginalize what is.

Raffi Torres is classless and dangerous but Wendel Clark was the epitome of everything you'd want in a hockey player.

It's funny, I've watched Clark throw three hits in one game that are easily worse than the worst three of Raffi's career.

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12-18-2012, 06:17 PM
  #522
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^ the same thing happened to Steve Sullivan and his family. In a late summer interview with Tyson Nash he stated that he had enrolled his kids in school here and found a house.

Now, the greater Phoenix area is a known retirement destination and may have been on Sullivan's radar for that purpose, all along. Still, that uncertainty is pretty heavy.

You know who I blame for this lock out? The players' wives. There is no way I'd get away with this stubborn stupidity. Why aren't these women doing their jobs? Isn't a wife's duty to keep her husband from doing stupid **** for ridiculous reasons?

Falling on your sword and sacrificing an enormous chunk of your lifetime earnings so that the top five percent of your richest colleagues can have a tiny bit more flexibility in the way the are paid, flexibility that you and ninety five percent of your brothers will never enjoy is stupid. And to do so in the name of "winning" is a foolish and prideful motivation.
Unfortunately that misguided mentality seems to be plaguing a lot of us these days.

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12-18-2012, 06:47 PM
  #523
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I think the major difference in the hitting results are the size, speed, and strength of the players. Today's player is probably 25 or more lbs bigger on average and significantly faster and stronger than they were even 10 years ago. When you combine that with the assault equipment that they wear it is easy to see how hits are causing more injuries. Wendel Clark worked the farm in the summer while drinking beer and playing softball. Today's player has a workout routine start 4 weeks after season ends and treats his body like a shrine.

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12-18-2012, 06:57 PM
  #524
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naurutger View Post
Consulting group finds NHL has suffered major damage as far as fan loyalty

http://www.660news.com/sports/articl...as-fan-loyalty
404 - Page not found

(is it just me?!)

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12-18-2012, 07:27 PM
  #525
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404 - Page not found

(is it just me?!)
Probably a phone thing? I dont know, must have been lost...did not go to deep into anything.


Last edited by Naurutger: 12-18-2012 at 07:46 PM.
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