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StL - PIT

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Old
12-18-2012, 11:44 AM
  #1
PensBandwagonerNo272
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StL - PIT

To Pittsburgh:

Chris Stewart


To St. Louis:

Brooks Orpik
Tom Kuhnhackl

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12-18-2012, 12:27 PM
  #2
bleedblue1223
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Orpik isn't the type of player that we'd be targeting IMO, and we don't have a need for any prospects on the wing.

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Old
12-18-2012, 12:32 PM
  #3
PensBandwagonerNo272
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I feel like you guys are set with forward depth, with offensive dmen, and could use another top-4 left-handed physical/shutdown guy.

What would you say the need is?

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Old
12-18-2012, 12:36 PM
  #4
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Need more from Pittsburgh here.

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Old
12-18-2012, 12:47 PM
  #5
bleedblue1223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PensBandwagonerNo272 View Post
I feel like you guys are set with forward depth, with offensive dmen, and could use another top-4 left-handed physical/shutdown guy.

What would you say the need is?
We need a better skater for our system and someone who is more well-rounded with the loss of Colaiacovo. We need someone who can play some PP minutes. It is very likely that, that guy could be Cole and he is having a pretty good year with Peoria.

We don't need a straight shutdown guy because whoever we get will be paired with Pietrangelo, and there are very few players that can be a better shutdown guy than Pietrangelo. Orpik is older and beginning to decline, and really wouldn't improve us that much. Our need has been blown out of proportion on HF. Pietrangelo finished 4th in the Norris and his pairing shut opponents down and he played with Colaiacovo, Huskins, and Cole. As long as Pietrangelo is healthy, we are fine. If Pietrangelo gets hurt, it doesn't matter who his partner is, we would be screwed.

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Old
12-18-2012, 01:04 PM
  #6
Vladys Gumption
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PensBandwagonerNo272 View Post
I feel like you guys are set with forward depth, with offensive dmen, and could use another top-4 left-handed physical/shutdown guy.

What would you say the need is?
The primary need is actually a center that can bump Backes down to the second line and Berglund to the third. And before anyone jumps on me, I realize those guys don't grow on trees and it's darn near impossible. But The need for a guy to play with Petro is overblown. I can't see how Ian Cole could possibly be any worse than Coalaiacovo was last year. And we did just fine with him on the first pairing.

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Old
12-18-2012, 01:29 PM
  #7
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This trade proposal has been brought up so many times.

Blues fans are firm with their belief they don't need Orpik, but Pens fans shouldn't even be thinking about trading Orpik right now.

Scoring isn't the Penguins problem, defense is, or the system is. There aren't many prospects that could replace Orpik. Bortuzzo? Maybe. Ruopp? Sure, in 3-4 years. Dumoulin? No, not really.

It's like people don't understand that playing the style of play Orpik does eventually slows him down OR that he just had a bad season while struggling through injuries. This lockout will benefit Orpik and he'll be fine. Just like Martin, people are starting to write off Orpik. These are still very capable defenders in the NHL.

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Old
12-18-2012, 01:58 PM
  #8
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Orpik is too much Regehr/Jackman and not enough Yandle/Kulikov/Whitney...For the Blues anyway.

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Old
12-18-2012, 02:47 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PensBandwagonerNo272 View Post
I feel like you guys are set with forward depth, with offensive dmen, and could use another top-4 left-handed physical/shutdown guy.

What would you say the need is?
Jason Garrison.
Perhaps Pre-Free-Agency Paul Martin.

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Old
12-18-2012, 05:36 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
We need a better skater for our system and someone who is more well-rounded with the loss of Colaiacovo. We need someone who can play some PP minutes. It is very likely that, that guy could be Cole and he is having a pretty good year with Peoria.

We don't need a straight shutdown guy because whoever we get will be paired with Pietrangelo, and there are very few players that can be a better shutdown guy than Pietrangelo. Orpik is older and beginning to decline, and really wouldn't improve us that much. Our need has been blown out of proportion on HF. Pietrangelo finished 4th in the Norris and his pairing shut opponents down and he played with Colaiacovo, Huskins, and Cole. As long as Pietrangelo is healthy, we are fine. If Pietrangelo gets hurt, it doesn't matter who his partner is, we would be screwed.
I can see the logic in wanting more of a two-way guy in losing C.C., but to me a guy like Orpik is the perfect guy to be paired with Pietrangelo. Of course Pietrangelo is a great shut down guy, he is one of the best dmen in the league and has elite IQ and positioning. But he is also a guy that should be free to roam the ice and move the puck forward, and control the puck from the point in the o-zone, so a staple like Orpik would be perfect. Just like how Orpik - Letang works.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangles78 View Post
This trade proposal has been brought up so many times.

Blues fans are firm with their belief they don't need Orpik, but Pens fans shouldn't even be thinking about trading Orpik right now.

Scoring isn't the Penguins problem, defense is, or the system is. There aren't many prospects that could replace Orpik. Bortuzzo? Maybe. Ruopp? Sure, in 3-4 years. Dumoulin? No, not really.

It's like people don't understand that playing the style of play Orpik does eventually slows him down OR that he just had a bad season while struggling through injuries. This lockout will benefit Orpik and he'll be fine. Just like Martin, people are starting to write off Orpik. These are still very capable defenders in the NHL.
Simon Despres. Bylsma has already been quoted that he likes Despres and Letang together and want to try them as a full-time pair, and that would obviously be pairing number one.

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Old
12-18-2012, 06:44 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangles78 View Post
This trade proposal has been brought up so many times.

Blues fans are firm with their belief they don't need Orpik, but Pens fans shouldn't even be thinking about trading Orpik right now.

Scoring isn't the Penguins problem, defense is, or the system is. There aren't many prospects that could replace Orpik. Bortuzzo? Maybe. Ruopp? Sure, in 3-4 years. Dumoulin? No, not really.


It's like people don't understand that playing the style of play Orpik does eventually slows him down OR that he just had a bad season while struggling through injuries. This lockout will benefit Orpik and he'll be fine. Just like Martin, people are starting to write off Orpik. These are still very capable defenders in the NHL.
Last year's Orpik? Any number of them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
We need a better skater for our system and someone who is more well-rounded with the loss of Colaiacovo. We need someone who can play some PP minutes. It is very likely that, that guy could be Cole and he is having a pretty good year with Peoria.

We don't need a straight shutdown guy because whoever we get will be paired with Pietrangelo, and there are very few players that can be a better shutdown guy than Pietrangelo. Orpik is older and beginning to decline, and really wouldn't improve us that much. Our need has been blown out of proportion on HF. Pietrangelo finished 4th in the Norris and his pairing shut opponents down and he played with Colaiacovo, Huskins, and Cole. As long as Pietrangelo is healthy, we are fine. If Pietrangelo gets hurt, it doesn't matter who his partner is, we would be screwed.
Fair justification. But whatever Orpik's faults, he is still a great skater, so scratch that knock against him.

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Old
12-18-2012, 06:57 PM
  #12
bleedblue1223
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
Fair justification. But whatever Orpik's faults, he is still a great skater, so scratch that knock against him.
Fair enough. I don't want it to sound like I think he is a bad player, he just doesn't fit our need perfectly, and if we don't get a perfect fit, then we'll just go with Cole.

You guys have a similar issue. Crosby really doesn't need a top winger to succeed, but it's one of those few needs that you do have.

Even though our needs and strengths match up, I don't really see a move being made because our NHL players don't fit with each other perfectly, and I think both sides would rather hang on to the prospects that we have.

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Old
12-18-2012, 07:40 PM
  #13
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Once the Stl-LA series was over, i felt an Orpik type player was what the Blues were missing from the line up. Cole nor Jackman were good enough to be those defensive rocks.

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Old
12-18-2012, 07:48 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Fair enough. I don't want it to sound like I think he is a bad player, he just doesn't fit our need perfectly, and if we don't get a perfect fit, then we'll just go with Cole.

You guys have a similar issue. Crosby really doesn't need a top winger to succeed, but it's one of those few needs that you do have.

Even though our needs and strengths match up, I don't really see a move being made because our NHL players don't fit with each other perfectly, and I think both sides would rather hang on to the prospects that we have.
Yep, that's cool. I've been as hard on Orpik as anyone over his last season, and his age is a concern considering the style of game he plays.

I just see the skating thing mentioned pretty frequently around here regarding Orpik, which must be a by-product of the punishing defensive defenseman stereotype. His skating's one of his best attributes, even though he was crap in most other areas in '11-'12.

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Old
12-18-2012, 08:19 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsofLA View Post
Once the Stl-LA series was over, i felt an Orpik type player was what the Blues were missing from the line up. Cole nor Jackman were good enough to be those defensive rocks.
Cole wasn't used, Pietrangelo had a sprained MCL, and Jackman was exposed because Shattenkirk was overwhelmed.

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Old
12-18-2012, 08:43 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PensBandwagonerNo272 View Post



Simon Despres. Bylsma has already been quoted that he likes Despres and Letang together and want to try them as a full-time pair, and that would obviously be pairing number one.
Ok? That's great and all, but Despres doesn't replace what Orpik brings with his play. My point was that the Pens don't have a D-prospect ready that can bring what Orpik brings.

[QUOTE=Rowdy Roddy Peeper;56656785]Last year's Orpik? Any number of them.
/QUOTE]

Apparently players aren't allowed to have down years or you just read my comment out of context, but really you should have gotten the point by the latter part of the post.

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Old
12-18-2012, 10:48 PM
  #17
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Originally Posted by Dangles78 View Post
Apparently players aren't allowed to have down years or you just read my comment out of context, but really you should have gotten the point by the latter part of the post.
Given Orpik's age, number of injuries the past few years, style of play, and crap last season (not to mention diminishing effectiveness since the Cup run), I'd be willing to bet it was more than an aberration.

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12-18-2012, 11:26 PM
  #18
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[QUOTE=Dangles78;56659637]Ok? That's great and all, but Despres doesn't replace what Orpik brings with his play. My point was that the Pens don't have a D-prospect ready that can bring what Orpik brings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
Last year's Orpik? Any number of them.
/QUOTE]

Apparently players aren't allowed to have down years or you just read my comment out of context, but really you should have gotten the point by the latter part of the post.
Not sure what Penguins games you're watching, but Orpik has been horribly regressing since we won the cup. He was putrid in 2010 and has been regressing since game 1 of that season.

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Old
12-19-2012, 10:54 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PensBandwagonerNo272 View Post
Simon Despres. Bylsma has already been quoted that he likes Despres and Letang together and want to try them as a full-time pair, and that would obviously be pairing number one.
Despres would be the guy we'd want. Not Orpik. We need someone who can skate and keep up with Pietrangelo, but still has that big frame and physical edge. We don't need a ton of offense from this player either, but a guy like Despres who still has a little offensive touch would be perfect. The Blues have plenty of wingers that I think Pittsburgh would be interested in. If the Pens were willing to deal Despres then I think both of these teams would make really good trade partners.

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Old
12-19-2012, 11:02 PM
  #20
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As a Pens fan, I have absolutely no interest in acquiring Chris Stewart whether Orpik is removed from the proposal entirely. He's just not a player that the Penguins should be interested in. Not that we couldn't use a big, scoring winger...but we can't use Chris Stewart. More than a few teams are going to find that out over the course of his career.

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Old
12-20-2012, 09:09 AM
  #21
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I guess Im one of the few Blues fans who would love to get Orpik, not at the cost of Stewart though

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Old
12-20-2012, 12:35 PM
  #22
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I guess Im one of the few Blues fans who would love to get Orpik, not at the cost of Stewart though
I'd trade Stewart for Orpik and Kuhkhackl, as the OP said.

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Old
12-20-2012, 01:00 PM
  #23
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I was shocked it was the Pens that were adding. Stewart's value has really tumbled in my eyes.

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Old
12-20-2012, 01:03 PM
  #24
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I was shocked it was the Pens that were adding. Stewart's value has really tumbled in my eyes.
Orpik and Stewart both had down years last year.

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Old
12-20-2012, 05:23 PM
  #25
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I'm still trying for Morrow, but hey, that's just me

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