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Old
12-20-2012, 12:53 AM
  #351
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Originally Posted by CanadienShark View Post
All the bolded ones are either untrue, or very debatable in my opinion.

Quick, Lundqvist, Price, Rinne and Thomas, I believe, are better than Luongo in roughly that order.
But none of Lundqvist, Price, or Rinne have done anything important when it matters.

Funny though, Lundqvist and Rinne do look great in front of very defensive minded teams. Then they become the 2nd best goalies in a series and lose.

Quick has been great for 1 year.

Thomas is done.

However, none are available.

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12-20-2012, 12:55 AM
  #352
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as to the rest :

Also why would Luongo want to go from a stanley cup contender to a play off team , Does he not want win a cup?
Pretty clear it's time for him to move on.

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12-20-2012, 01:10 AM
  #353
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Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
He's on everyones all-time list.

He shouldn't be on anybody's now list.
Why not? He played more games than Luongo, same GAA, Stanley Cup finals last season. How about Mike Smith?

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12-20-2012, 01:21 AM
  #354
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Brodeur deserves a spot on that list.
And Patrick Roy!!

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12-20-2012, 01:26 AM
  #355
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Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
I still think FLA is the best option by far, playoff team with an amazing future + location.
Sometimes fans forget that the Panthers were one goal away from knocking the Devils out of the 2012 playoffs. Weiss beat Brodeur in OT of Game 6 of their Round 1 series, but hit the post. They fall in double OT in Game 7.

At this rate, Florida will have only one goalie under contract when we see NHL ation again, and that's career back-up Scott Clemmensen, who's only inked through '13-'14. Markstrom is an RFA at the end of the current AHL season. If Jacob isn't promised the Panthers' No. 1 job for the '13-'14 season, or at least allowed to challenge for it, I could see him returning to Sweden or demanding a trade. Can't see him putting in a 4th year in the AHL, and platonning with Clemmensen in '13-'14 is not getting the Panthers back to the playoffs.

Florida, like Toronto, could only face Vancouver in the Stanley Cup finals. I'm sure that's far more appealing than sending Luongo to Chicago or Edmonton, only to have Roberto possible haunt the Canucks in the near future.

Personally, anyone not named Kulikov, Huberdeau or Campbell is on the table, especially since y'all will be on the hook for his caphit when he retires early. Tallon has far more quality assets to choose from, that are available, than Burke does.


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12-20-2012, 01:31 AM
  #356
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Even Bjugstad?

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12-20-2012, 01:38 AM
  #357
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Originally Posted by StringerBell View Post
Even Bjugstad?
Clearly most Panthers fans wouldn't agree with me on that, but, yes, I'd make Bjugstad available.

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Old
12-20-2012, 01:40 AM
  #358
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What would you consider the difference in value between him and Shore? I've watched a couple SA games this year and have been really impressed with Drew's game.

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12-20-2012, 02:17 AM
  #359
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Originally Posted by StringerBell View Post
What would you consider the difference in value between him and Shore? I've watched a couple SA games this year and have been really impressed with Drew's game.
I am a big fan of Drew's. I believe he'll be every bit as good as Jugs at the NHL level. Nevertheless, when talking about Roberto Luongo, a Top-5 starter who still has plenty of quality years remaining, I'd make Shore available as well.

I'm not one to get excited about Panthers prospects. Florida has a rich history of prospects who never matched their hype.

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12-20-2012, 07:10 AM
  #360
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Originally Posted by Hockey 4 Life View Post
Because toronto was one of the teams that was said to be on his list. Also there has been talks between gillis and burke over Luongo. Now if there was no way lou would waive to Toronto why would gillis waste his time. So theres your asnwer.
There's a list? what list? who? what? where? when?

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12-20-2012, 07:44 AM
  #361
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Originally Posted by BayStBullies View Post
I would prefer Markstrom to Luongo; as the Vancouver fans are stating Florida would sign another starter to a decade long contract; over him. What would Florida want for Markstrom? I imagine less than Luongo; as apparently Luongo is more valuable.
LMAO.

Thank you friend. I needed a laugh. Really brightened up my day.

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12-20-2012, 08:32 AM
  #362
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Originally Posted by CanuckLuck View Post
Wow..Luongo hater...

Lundqvist, Quick and Thomas are better
Halak and Howard aren't on the same planet.
the rest are debatable.

There is NO WAY that there are 10 goaltenders better than Luo. Keep the hate going.
in my opinion miller and ward are pretty darn close as is kipprusoff. also considering that vancouver seems to prefer schneider i dont see how you can not include schneider on that list? if luongo was clearly better then you would be keeping him and looking to move schneider no?

ill agree that luongo is consistently a top 10 goalie in the league but at his age and contract i think a lot of goalies who might be a notch below become more appealing. i think if given a choice i would take halak at have the price and half the term and younger to booth.

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12-20-2012, 09:07 AM
  #363
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Originally Posted by gabeliscious View Post
in my opinion miller and ward are pretty darn close as is kipprusoff. also considering that vancouver seems to prefer schneider i dont see how you can not include schneider on that list? if luongo was clearly better then you would be keeping him and looking to move schneider no?

ill agree that luongo is consistently a top 10 goalie in the league but at his age and contract i think a lot of goalies who might be a notch below become more appealing. i think if given a choice i would take halak at have the price and half the term and younger to booth.
Umm Miller and Ward aren't even close to Luongo. Call me when they go a season having better stats than Luongo again, which is something they've done only once. Last year neither goalie could stop a beach ball directed to them by a toddler before the all star break.

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12-20-2012, 09:42 AM
  #364
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Originally Posted by Ag925 View Post
I am a big fan of Drew's. I believe he'll be every bit as good as Jugs at the NHL level. Nevertheless, when talking about Roberto Luongo, a Top-5 starter who still has plenty of quality years remaining, I'd make Shore available as well.

I'm not one to get excited about Panthers prospects. Florida has a rich history of prospects who never matched their hype.
Of all Panthers' prospects I think the one that makes the most sense for both sides is Petrovic. Florida has loads of young D coming up, and Vancouver could use a good RHD with size. Obviously not enough on his own, but if Florida were the final destintion, I would really like him to be involved.

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12-20-2012, 09:44 AM
  #365
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Sometimes fans forget that the Panthers were one goal away from knocking the Devils out of the 2012 playoffs. Weiss beat Brodeur in OT of Game 6 of their Round 1 series, but hit the post. They fall in double OT in Game 7.

At this rate, Florida will have only one goalie under contract when we see NHL ation again, and that's career back-up Scott Clemmensen, who's only inked through '13-'14. Markstrom is an RFA at the end of the current AHL season. If Jacob isn't promised the Panthers' No. 1 job for the '13-'14 season, or at least allowed to challenge for it, I could see him returning to Sweden or demanding a trade. Can't see him putting in a 4th year in the AHL, and platonning with Clemmensen in '13-'14 is not getting the Panthers back to the playoffs.

Florida, like Toronto, could only face Vancouver in the Stanley Cup finals. I'm sure that's far more appealing than sending Luongo to Chicago or Edmonton, only to have Roberto possible haunt the Canucks in the near future.

Personally, anyone not named Kulikov, Huberdeau or Campbell is on the table, especially since y'all will be on the hook for his caphit when he retires early. Tallon has far more quality assets to choose from, that are available, than Burke does.
I dont think Markstrom will be as uncooperative as you make it out. Plus, the org has gone out of its way to be accommodating to him. They know he's their #1 of the future and want him to get plenty of starts in the AHL now so he's ready to handle the NHL. And I dont think it would be bad for him to platoon with Clemmensen or would really cause the Panthers to be worst off than now. People seem to forget that Clemmensen was able to put up impressive numbers when Brodeur went down with a long term injury. Him and Markstrom could very easily get us back in the playoffs IMO. And really, there's zero guarantees that Luongo leads another team to the playoffs...remember we've been down that road before with him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by StringerBell View Post
Even Bjugstad?
I think he's wrong there...and thats basically been backed up by the fact that Tallon balked at the idea. It doesnt matter my opinion, your opinion or Ag925's opinion on Bjugstad. Only one that matters is Tallon and he isnt interested in dealing Bjugstad for Luongo.
Quote:
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Clearly most Panthers fans wouldn't agree with me on that, but, yes, I'd make Bjugstad available.
Yes I would disagree with it. From the simple facts that sure Bjugstad is a prospect and you dont know what you have there in an NHLer yet. But Luongo isnt getting younger and is paid a hefty salary (screw cap hit which doesnt matter to the Panthers). This is a team that is building for the future, not the right now when Luongo would really help a team. This team isnt about most of the players are the roster now, its about those guys like Huberdeau, Gudbranson, Bjugstad, Howden, Shore, etc that are coming down the pipe.

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12-20-2012, 09:53 AM
  #366
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Umm Miller and Ward aren't even close to Luongo. Call me when they go a season having better stats than Luongo again, which is something they've done only once. Last year neither goalie could stop a beach ball directed to them by a toddler before the all star break.

i disagree but i guess it depends on what you consider close. luongo might have "slightly" better stats but he also plays for a better team, is older, has a ridiculous contract, and never won a major award. miller won a vezina and ward has a cup ring and a con smyth. in contrast what has luongo done in the playoffs?

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12-20-2012, 09:56 AM
  #367
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Originally Posted by gabeliscious View Post
i disagree but i guess it depends on what you consider close. luongo might have "slightly" better stats but he also plays for a better team, is older, has a ridiculous contract, and never won a major award. miller won a vezina and ward has a cup ring and a con smyth. in contrast what has luongo done in the playoffs?
More than Lundqvist, Rinne, or Price.

Also, age or contract is not an argument for how good a player he is.

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Old
12-20-2012, 09:57 AM
  #368
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Originally Posted by gabeliscious View Post
i disagree but i guess it depends on what you consider close. luongo might have "slightly" better stats but he also plays for a better team, is older, has a ridiculous contract, and never won a major award. miller won a vezina and ward has a cup ring and a con smyth. in contrast what has luongo done in the playoffs?
I agree there is a pretty lengthy list you'd take before Luongo.
His contract makes him available for a song though while the others the cost would be very high.

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12-20-2012, 09:58 AM
  #369
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Of all Panthers' prospects I think the one that makes the most sense for both sides is Petrovic. Florida has loads of young D coming up, and Vancouver could use a good RHD with size. Obviously not enough on his own, but if Florida were the final destintion, I would really like him to be involved.
You keep saying that but its not completely true. The only 2 guys that are close to NHL-ready is Robak & Petrovic. The only other guy in the system that is probable for making the NHL is Matheson and he's at least 3-4 yrs away. Florida isnt as deep as you think with top 4 d-men. Given that Guds is coming off a shoulder injury, Kulikov is currently unsigned as a RFA and the only other young player is Ellerby, who hasnt put it together yet as an NHLer, we're not exactly as strong as perceived even with the younger NHL d-men.

Then keep in mind that we have Jovo at 36 yrs old, Weaver is 34 yrs old, Kuba is 35 yrs old and both Weaver & Kuba are only signed for 2 yrs. That would be the right time to insert both of Robak & Petrovic. By the time Matheson is ready also, Campbell will be around 36-37 when you know he's gonna start being less effective. We need every top 4 prospect in our system to develop exactly as planned or we'll be in trouble and be forced to try and sign free agents which requires overspending and thats not gonna be sustainable for FL.

We have enough forward prospects that it makes more sense to move one of them. I like Shore as much as the next guy but he probably holds a lot of value in trade right now. We have the most depth up the middle with guys that can play center and he is developing well enough but still figures to be more of a 3rd line center with some 2nd line upside.

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12-20-2012, 10:06 AM
  #370
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You keep saying that but its not completely true. The only 2 guys that are close to NHL-ready is Robak & Petrovic. The only other guy in the system that is probable for making the NHL is Matheson and he's at least 3-4 yrs away. Florida isnt as deep as you think with top 4 d-men. Given that Guds is coming off a shoulder injury, Kulikov is currently unsigned as a RFA and the only other young player is Ellerby, who hasnt put it together yet as an NHLer, we're not exactly as strong as perceived even with the younger NHL d-men.

Then keep in mind that we have Jovo at 36 yrs old, Weaver is 34 yrs old, Kuba is 35 yrs old and both Weaver & Kuba are only signed for 2 yrs. That would be the right time to insert both of Robak & Petrovic. By the time Matheson is ready also, Campbell will be around 36-37 when you know he's gonna start being less effective. We need every top 4 prospect in our system to develop exactly as planned or we'll be in trouble and be forced to try and sign free agents which requires overspending and thats not gonna be sustainable for FL.

We have enough forward prospects that it makes more sense to move one of them. I like Shore as much as the next guy but he probably holds a lot of value in trade right now. We have the most depth up the middle with guys that can play center and he is developing well enough but still figures to be more of a 3rd line center with some 2nd line upside.
Fair enough. Shore is also pretty intriguing, although obviously I'd prefer Howden, although neither fits a need as much a Petrovic, from our POV. I had always thought Florida's biggest problem was scoring, which is why I thought a defenseman prospect would be more preferable. Although if you have problems getting Kulikov signed...

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12-20-2012, 10:35 AM
  #371
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Of all Panthers' prospects I think the one that makes the most sense for both sides is Petrovic. Florida has loads of young D coming up, and Vancouver could use a good RHD with size. Obviously not enough on his own, but if Florida were the final destintion, I would really like him to be involved.
Yeah, I'm going to disagree with you here. If we don't re-sign Edler then I can definitely get on board with this, but assuming he re-signs we'll have a solid top 4 locked up for the foreseeable future. I think a good bottom six center is much, much more valuable than a strong bottom pairing defenseman, and this is only intensified when you look at the hole we currently have at center.

Also, and more importantly, from watching them both play a couple times this season I've been considerably more impressed with Shore. Just curious, but how much have you watched the two play?

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12-20-2012, 10:43 AM
  #372
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Yeah, I'm going to disagree with you here. If we don't re-sign Edler then I can definitely get on board with this, but assuming he re-signs we'll have a solid top 4 locked up for the foreseeable future.
Well it's not as if a player such as Petrovic is ready to step into a top 4 spot in the forseeable future anyway. He's likely got at least another year of AHL seasoning in front of him before earning an NHL roster spot then likely another 2+ seasons in a bottom pairing role. Bieksa is signed for another 3 seasons so the timelines would actually match up quite well.

I understand your point about a solid 3rd line center being a bigger hole currently, but it's not likely that any prospect is going to step into that spot right now and be a solid fit anyway.

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12-20-2012, 10:43 AM
  #373
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Yeah, I'm going to disagree with you here. If we don't re-sign Edler then I can definitely get on board with this, but assuming he re-signs we'll have a solid top 4 locked up for the foreseeable future. I think a good bottom six center is much, much more valuable than a strong bottom pairing defenseman, and this is only intensified when you look at the hole we currently have at center.

Also, and more importantly, from watching them both play a couple times this season I've been considerably more impressed with Shore. Just curious, but how much have you watched the two play?
I've probably seen Petrovic play in about 5 games with the Rampage, and I really liked what I swa, although I didn't focus that much on Shore. We just lost Salo, Rome, and Sulzer and only added Garrison. We need more defensive depth, especially if we need to shed Ballard for salary. I think Petrovic's ability to contribute now and his potential in the future would make him good to target, as we have no one who projects like him in our system. I have no problem with Shore, but I am reluctant as bringing in any centre likely means Schroeder will be written off of getting a shot at the NHL.

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12-20-2012, 10:52 AM
  #374
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I've probably seen Petrovic play in about 5 games with the Rampage, and I really liked what I swa, although I didn't focus that much on Shore. We just lost Salo, Rome, and Sulzer and only added Garrison. We need more defensive depth, especially if we need to shed Ballard for salary. I think Petrovic's ability to contribute now and his potential in the future would make him good to target, as we have no one who projects like him in our system. I have no problem with Shore, but I am reluctant as bringing in any centre likely means Schroeder will be written off of getting a shot at the NHL.
Uhh what? I really don't think he's NHL ready at this point, but maybe it's just me.

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12-20-2012, 11:01 AM
  #375
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This is a team that is building for the future, not the right now when Luongo would really help a team. This team isnt about most of the players are the roster now, its about those guys like Huberdeau, Gudbranson, Bjugstad, Howden, Shore, etc that are coming down the pipe.
Gee, when have I heard this from Panthers fans before? Oh yeah, every year for the past 12 years. According to Panthers fans, Florida is perpetually in re-build mode. "Sucking today to win tomorrow." Funny thing is, the winning part seems to never come. I call BS. You're kidding yourself if you think Tallon wants to move backwards from a playoff berth, especially one in which his club came within one goal of knocking out the eventual Eastern Conference champs.


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