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Old
12-20-2012, 10:40 AM
  #826
Jarick
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Mikko's hockey IQ and skills aren't at Granlund's level.

Look at their stats:

18 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 0.15 ppg
Granlund: 1.0 ppg

19 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 0.54 ppg
Granlund: 0.92 ppg

20 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 067 ppg
Granlund: 1.13 ppg

21 years in AHL
Koivu: 0.72 ppg
Granlund: 1.0 ppg

Granlund is able to adapt quickly to higher levels of play at a young age. That's a sign of TREMENDOUS hockey IQ and of course his very high end offensive skills. Koivu was able to adapt but it took longer as he had to learn to adapt to stronger competition.

Look at Koivu's NHL stats:
22 years: 0.33 ppg
23 years: 0.66 ppg
24 years: 0.74 ppg
25 years: 0.85 ppg
26 years: 0.89 ppg
27 years: 0.87 ppg
28 years: 0.80 ppg

It took Mikko four years to hit his peak numbers in the NHL. I'd expect Granlund to him them by year two or three.

I am not worried whatsoever about Granlund. He was at or near the top offensively in the AHL until he got injured.

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Old
12-22-2012, 06:36 AM
  #827
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I'm kinda mad that we didn't get Trouba.

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Old
12-22-2012, 07:16 AM
  #828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharppi View Post
I'm kinda mad that we didn't get Trouba.
I've felt that Trouba would've been a bit more Wild kind of a pick, whereas Dumba was the "sexier" choice. I'm still happy with the Dumba pick, though.

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Old
12-22-2012, 10:07 AM
  #829
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharppi View Post
I'm kinda mad that we didn't get Trouba.
2nd this one

3rd it too


4th it while at it


Dumba is such a bad pick, i don't think he'll overcome his deficiency in IQ to be what we want him to be. plus while people have said his skating is explosive forward few times now people have commented on his BACKWARDS skating, and how he gets beaten to the side easy...... not a trait you want in a Dman.

the only knock on Trouba is he plays for Michigan....

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Old
12-22-2012, 10:11 AM
  #830
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
Mikko's hockey IQ and skills aren't at Granlund's level.

Look at their stats:

18 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 0.15 ppg
Granlund: 1.0 ppg

19 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 0.54 ppg
Granlund: 0.92 ppg

20 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 067 ppg
Granlund: 1.13 ppg

21 years in AHL
Koivu: 0.72 ppg
Granlund: 1.0 ppg

Granlund is able to adapt quickly to higher levels of play at a young age. That's a sign of TREMENDOUS hockey IQ and of course his very high end offensive skills. Koivu was able to adapt but it took longer as he had to learn to adapt to stronger competition.

Look at Koivu's NHL stats:
22 years: 0.33 ppg
23 years: 0.66 ppg
24 years: 0.74 ppg
25 years: 0.85 ppg
26 years: 0.89 ppg
27 years: 0.87 ppg
28 years: 0.80 ppg

It took Mikko four years to hit his peak numbers in the NHL. I'd expect Granlund to him them by year two or three.

I am not worried whatsoever about Granlund. He was at or near the top offensively in the AHL until he got injured.
Mikko hasn't hit his peak yet, some of those teams he was on were ******* bad, we have relied on him on the PK as well so that ate up some of his energy every game.

Also while Granlund might have better skill then Koivu, i think Koivu has a way better NHL game then Granlund, his size along with his strength allows him to be a better player. in short i think Granlund will have less impact then Koivu.


Last edited by forthewild: 12-22-2012 at 10:18 AM.
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Old
12-22-2012, 04:42 PM
  #831
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Dumba is 18 years old...give me a break. Still tons of time left until we can call it a bad pick.

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Old
12-22-2012, 05:33 PM
  #832
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dee Oh Cee View Post
Dumba is 18 years old...give me a break. Still tons of time left until we can call it a bad pick.
Thank you!

Same goes for the other prospects in the AHL.

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Old
12-23-2012, 01:54 PM
  #833
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forthewild View Post
2nd this one

3rd it too


4th it while at it


Dumba is such a bad pick, i don't think he'll overcome his deficiency in IQ to be what we want him to be. plus while people have said his skating is explosive forward few times now people have commented on his BACKWARDS skating, and how he gets beaten to the side easy...... not a trait you want in a Dman.

the only knock on Trouba is he plays for Michigan....
Bust.

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Old
12-23-2012, 02:12 PM
  #834
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I must say, I was watching Trouba live yesterday and disappointed that we didn't pick him.

That being said, it's still way too early to call Dumba a bust. He was a project pick all along, and if he pans out, look out.

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Old
12-23-2012, 06:01 PM
  #835
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
Mikko's hockey IQ and skills aren't at Granlund's level.

Look at their stats:

18 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 0.15 ppg
Granlund: 1.0 ppg

19 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 0.54 ppg
Granlund: 0.92 ppg

20 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 067 ppg
Granlund: 1.13 ppg

21 years in AHL
Koivu: 0.72 ppg
Granlund: 1.0 ppg

Granlund is able to adapt quickly to higher levels of play at a young age. That's a sign of TREMENDOUS hockey IQ and of course his very high end offensive skills. Koivu was able to adapt but it took longer as he had to learn to adapt to stronger competition.

Look at Koivu's NHL stats:
22 years: 0.33 ppg
23 years: 0.66 ppg
24 years: 0.74 ppg
25 years: 0.85 ppg
26 years: 0.89 ppg
27 years: 0.87 ppg
28 years: 0.80 ppg

It took Mikko four years to hit his peak numbers in the NHL. I'd expect Granlund to him them by year two or three.

I am not worried whatsoever about Granlund. He was at or near the top offensively in the AHL until he got injured.

I agree with all of this...the only question i have remaining isn't skill. Its size and durability Granlund has all the skill in the world. Don't forget however Mikko is 6'2 200. As long as Granlund's size/injury woes doesn't become an issue I believe we have a future all star on our hands.

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Old
12-23-2012, 06:03 PM
  #836
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dee Oh Cee View Post
Dumba is 18 years old...give me a break. Still tons of time left until we can call it a bad pick.
You would at least like to see some progression from him this year. Not making the WJC is concerning as well.

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Old
12-23-2012, 06:03 PM
  #837
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keppel146 View Post

I think either way you do it, it may work. Just no seto-heater-koivu, they didnt seem to have any chemistry
I think that was due to Seto..he really didn't perform with those 2 like we all thought he would.

I thought Koivu and Heatley wasn't a bad duo.

Hell, Heatley with anyone was our only offense. Then teams keyed on him and we put up 2goals< a game. Parise and Granlund should help make up for that

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Old
12-23-2012, 06:08 PM
  #838
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post



One comparison that has always stuck in my head: David Kreijci.
On what grounds??

find me some statistical comparison on that one..

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Old
12-23-2012, 06:13 PM
  #839
Surly Furious
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
Mikko's hockey IQ and skills aren't at Granlund's level.

Look at their stats:

18 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 0.15 ppg
Granlund: 1.0 ppg

19 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 0.54 ppg
Granlund: 0.92 ppg

20 years in SM-Liiga
Koivu: 067 ppg
Granlund: 1.13 ppg

21 years in AHL
Koivu: 0.72 ppg
Granlund: 1.0 ppg

Granlund is able to adapt quickly to higher levels of play at a young age. That's a sign of TREMENDOUS hockey IQ and of course his very high end offensive skills. Koivu was able to adapt but it took longer as he had to learn to adapt to stronger competition.

Look at Koivu's NHL stats:
22 years: 0.33 ppg
23 years: 0.66 ppg
24 years: 0.74 ppg
25 years: 0.85 ppg
26 years: 0.89 ppg
27 years: 0.87 ppg
28 years: 0.80 ppg

It took Mikko four years to hit his peak numbers in the NHL. I'd expect Granlund to him them by year two or three.

I am not worried whatsoever about Granlund. He was at or near the top offensively in the AHL until he got injured.
Well said

However, Koivu is a very good 2 way guy with size. MG will never have Koivu's complete game.

And we all know how MK is under-rated, and never played on a true 1st line.

MG played with Ville fricken Peltonen!!!

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Old
12-24-2012, 12:58 AM
  #840
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Calling Dumba a bad pick allready is just silly..

He would have atleast 2-3 more years to prove himself..

Just think AJ Thelen, and even Sheppard is a superstar.

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Old
12-24-2012, 01:29 AM
  #841
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Saying I'm not concerned at all about Dumba's progression would be a lie, but as others have stated already, the kid still has plenty of time to work out the kinks in his game. I won't be overly concerned until he starts looking like a fool at the AHL level.

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Old
12-24-2012, 02:29 AM
  #842
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WILDhockeyfan View Post
I won't be overly concerned until he starts looking like a fool at the AHL level.

This

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Old
12-25-2012, 05:42 PM
  #843
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beegoalie View Post
On what grounds??

find me some statistical comparison on that one..
It's not based on statistics, as they haven't yet played in comparable leagues at the same age, but more of skill set/playing style. Both are undersized, playmaking centers. Might not be 100% legit #1 centers, but you can win with them in that position as long as the team is well-rounded.

It's not a knock on Granlund, as Krejci is a consistent 50-60 point, occasional 70+ point, top-2 center.

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Old
12-26-2012, 10:56 AM
  #844
Jarick
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THREE STARS
1. Endras: 3w in 3gp
2. Palmieri: 1-2=3 +2
3. n/a

COLD
Zucker, Granlund, Coyle a combined -16 in two games
Dumba failing to make the Canadian WJC with ~ -1,000
AHL'ers ability to stay/get healthy
European pro leagues ability to play hockey in the month of December

2012 WJC-U20
PosNameHtWtAgeLeagueTeamGPGAPtsPIM+/-GPWGAASave
CChristoph Bertschy5'1017018.7 Switzerland          
FMario Lucia6'218719.4 USA          

AHL/ECHL
PosNameHtWtAgeLeagueTeamGPGAPtsPIM+/-GPWGAASave
LJason Zucker5'1117421AHLHouston Aeros2413102321-8    
RJustin Fontaine5'1017025.2AHLHouston Aeros268132122    
RNick Palmieri6'222523.5AHLHouston Aeros288917318    
DBrian Connelly5'1117026.6AHLHouston Aeros272151742    
LJohan Larsson5'1020020.4AHLHouston Aeros286101616-1    
CCharlie Coyle6'220520.8AHLHouston Aeros281061614-5    
CDavid McIntyre6'019025.9AHLHouston Aeros2778151813    
CMikael Granlund5'1018020.8AHLHouston Aeros1659146-5    
DMarco Scandella6'221622.9AHLHouston Aeros2311011131    
LKris Foucault6'120222.1AHLHouston Aeros2046102-3    
DChay Genoway5'917726AHLHouston Aeros263710216    
CZack Phillips6'017520.2AHLHouston Aeros2619102-5    
CChad Rau5'1117526AHLHouston Aeros1342643    
DSteven Kampfer5'1119724.3AHLHouston Aeros1406610-10    
CCarson McMillan6'120024.3AHLHouston Aeros1714543    
DJonas Brodin6'116619.5AHLHouston Aeros822442    
CJoel Broda6'019623.1AHLHouston Aeros2622420-5    
DTyler Cuma6'218023AHLHouston Aeros201238-5    
LBrett Bulmer6'318520.7AHLHouston Aeros1711219-8    
DKyle Medvec6'519124.5AHLHouston Aeros500000    
DJosh Caron6'221521.9AHLHouston Aeros100007-1    
GMatt Hackett6'217022.8AHLHouston Aeros      23112.640.902
GDarcy Kuemper6'419522.7AHLHouston Aeros      632.470.908
DSean Lorenz6'119122.8ECHLOrlando Solar Bears221894-1    
DKyle Medvec6'519124.5ECHLOrlando Solar Bears12347162    
DJosh Caron   ECHLOrlando Solar Bears1411228-2    

Europe
PosNameHtWtAgeLeagueTeamGPGAPtsPIM+/-GPWGAASave
CCody Almond6'219923.4Swiss-AGeneve Servette2661319404    
DDaniel Gunnarsson6'520120.7SELLulea HF315510125    
RMikko Lehtonen6'319625.8KHLCherepovets Severstal2336980    
DBjorn Krupp6'218921.8DELCologne Sharks1814583    
CChristoph Bertschy5'1017018.7Swiss-ABern27224141    
GDennis Endras6'016727.5DELMannheim Eagles      25152.320.925
GJohan Gustafsson6'220220.8SELLulea HF      20121.630.932

College
PosNameHtWtAgeLeagueTeamGPGAPtsPIM+/-GPWGAASave
LErik Haula5'1018421.8WCHAU. of Minnesota17814226     
FMario Lucia6'218719.4CCHANotre Dame955104     
DNick Seeler6'017019.6WCHAU. of Nebraska-Omaha1625716     
DJohn Draeger6'218619.1CCHAMichigan State University171456     
CAnthony Hamburg6'118521.3R.I.T.AHA111348     

Junior
PosNameHtWtAgeLeagueTeamGPGAPtsPIM+/-GPWGAASave
LRaphael Bussieres6'119519.2QMJHLBaie-Comeau Drakkar361826442221    
CTyler Graovac6'317919.7OHLOttawa 67's261812306-14    
LLouis Nanne5'1117118.5BCHLPenticton Vees2713122512     
CAdam Gilmour6'219318.9USHLMuskegon Lumberjacks2810122249    
DMathew Dumba6'018418.4WHLRed Deer Rebels347101743-3    
DColton Jobke6'017520.7WHLRegina Pats151121342-1    
GStephen Michalek6'219619.4USHLCedar Rapids RoughRiders      733.120.885

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Old
12-26-2012, 11:00 AM
  #845
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I'm worried about Dumba's regression. I'd like to have a future game changer on the Wild's D, not a broken project whose head is spinning.

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12-26-2012, 11:57 AM
  #846
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
I'm worried about Dumba's regression. I'd like to have a future game changer on the Wild's D, not a broken project whose head is spinning.
I honestly don't think Dumba as "regressed". It was known that he had to work on his defensive game. He was drafted for his ability to read the offensive zone play and get pucks to the net (something Wild Dmen have a hard time doing), plus his big hits.

I think that when you straight up compare him to Trouba, who continues to improve with Michigan (Go Blue!!!), that's where it looks like a gap is forming (since Dumba is appears to be plateauing).

However, my assessment of Dumba hasn't change since draft day. He's never going to be a shut-down or a big strong Dman. He projects as a 2nd pairing Dman who brings the offensive and makes the other team keep their heads up. Kronwall with less defense, more offense.

We passed up swinging for the home run in favor of a double by picking Dumba over Trouba.

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Old
12-26-2012, 12:44 PM
  #847
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Offensively he has regressed and defensively he was awful at the WJC camp.

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Old
12-26-2012, 01:33 PM
  #848
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Watching the Spengler Cup. (Canada and Maxim Noreau vs. Dennis Endras' team)

Endras doesn't look bad against some NHLers so far. First time I have the chance watching him.

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Old
12-26-2012, 01:37 PM
  #849
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1-0 Team Endras.

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Old
12-26-2012, 01:57 PM
  #850
thestonedkoala
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Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
I'm worried about Dumba's regression. I'd like to have a future game changer on the Wild's D, not a broken project whose head is spinning.
I am too. I don't know what they are going to do but he needs to get his head on straight. Maybe a trade?

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