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NFL in Toronto - Terrible idea

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Old
12-22-2012, 03:44 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by EpochLink View Post
Put some good teams playing in Toronto and fan interest will show up. The Bills haven't been relevant since the 1990's..if you put New England, New York Giants, Pittsburgh or even San Francisco..people would be loud and proud at Rogers Centre.
They have been putting good teams in Toronto.

Pittsburgh and Colts came for preseason.

2008 Dolphins - Historic Franchise and Division Champions that year
2009 Jets - Memorable first season of Rex Ryan, got to the AFC championship that year
2010 Bears - Historic Franchise, Division Champions and made the NFC championship that year
2011 Redskins - Historic Franchise but had a pretty bum year
2012 Seahawks - Exciting up and coming team, ROTY candidate, playoffs???

This argument that they haven't been putting good teams in for the series doesn't hold any weight.

Not every game in the NFL is against teams like New England or the Packers, their are 31 other possible teams you can face. You can't depend on just facing the top of the league to be successful.

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12-22-2012, 04:54 PM
  #77
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Blueandgoldguy just demolished any argument for a team in Toronto

What concerns me most is where they will play

There are just so many factors that don't fit for Toronto, that it'd be a failure at this time to move a team there.

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12-22-2012, 05:14 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by ixcuincle View Post
Blueandgoldguy just demolished any argument for a team in Toronto

What concerns me most is where they will play

There are just so many factors that don't fit for Toronto, that it'd be a failure at this time to move a team there.
Yet it feels like a much more logical solution than the London angle pushed by the league..

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12-23-2012, 02:26 AM
  #79
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The vast majority of Torontonians don't care for the Bills, hence why the games they play here in TO (especially against other weaker teams) have bad attendance.

The VAST majority of Torontonians follow the NFL over the CFL. Don't judge the Argo's attendance on how an NFL franchise would do here.

An NFL team here in Toronto would do fine. Much better than some other current cities that's for sure.

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12-23-2012, 07:08 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by MovesLikeJagr68 View Post
The vast majority of Torontonians don't care for the Bills, hence why the games they play here in TO (especially against other weaker teams) have bad attendance.

The VAST majority of Torontonians follow the NFL over the CFL. Don't judge the Argo's attendance on how an NFL franchise would do here.

An NFL team here in Toronto would do fine. Much better than some other current cities that's for sure.
Where would they play?

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12-23-2012, 12:39 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by ixcuincle View Post
Where would they play?
That would really be one of the only issues with a team here. The SkyDome would obviously have to do; it doesn't have the same capacity as the rest of the league's fields, but 50,000-60,000 is still doable.

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12-23-2012, 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by MovesLikeJagr68 View Post
That would really be one of the only issues with a team here. The SkyDome would obviously have to do; it doesn't have the same capacity as the rest of the league's fields, but 50,000-60,000 is still doable.
The NFL is not relocating a team or awarding an expansion franchise to a city where the team will play in a 54,000 seat baseball stadium.

Edit: did I just read 4 pages with no mention of the Canadian Football Act? Maybe it doesn't pass but somebody is tabling that bill in Parliament if an NFL team seriously considers moving to Toronto.


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12-23-2012, 07:28 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by MovesLikeJagr68 View Post
That would really be one of the only issues with a team here. The SkyDome would obviously have to do; it doesn't have the same capacity as the rest of the league's fields, but 50,000-60,000 is still doable.
It is certainly not doable. Rogers Centre would be the worst stadium in the league. Arguably worse than Oakland's stadium seeing as it only seats 54,000 and has thousands of obstructed seats.

Then there is the small issue of who will own the team.

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12-24-2012, 11:54 AM
  #84
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If I believe in what nonsense exactly?? I presented facts to support my claim that some football players are more successful in adapting to different styles of play/rules. Obviously, the NFL in general, consists of more talented athletes (Calvin Johnson would tear the league to shreds no doubt) but it doesn't change the fact that a few of these CFLers have as much talent as some of the top-end guys in the NFL.

You can't really compare the AHL to the CFL because it actually follows the same rules as the NHL (as opposed to the CFL in relation to the NFL). CFLers are smaller than NFLers, whereas AHLers are pretty much the same size as NHLers. CFLers are generally fairly old, so they are not as likely to get a shot with an NFL team as much as young AHLers are likely to get a shot in the NHL.
Anyway, no matter which way you cut it, the CFL is the second highest level of grid-iron football in the world.

You might not be a Torontonian but you are every bit as ignorant and as much of an American wannabe as all of them.
Since you've resorted to name calling, all I'll say is that if you believe what you just posted then you know nothing about the game of football. CFLer's are generally old? Yeah, because they all spent a couple years trying to make the NFL and then went north when they realized they weren't good enough. You act like it's two different sports because they rules are a little different. There's no CFLer's that have as much talent as top-end NFLer's and it's utterly absurd to think that way.

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Originally Posted by ixcuincle View Post
Everyone says they don't want to see the Bills play, but if you got a team, you damn well know it is going to be the Bills. Do you really think Goodell is going to open a brand new expansion team for you all? Please
And it wouldn't be the Buffalo Bills, it would the Toronto whatever. Why is that so hard to get thru your head?

I'll say it again, It wouldn't be the Buffalo Bills, it would be the Toronto Bills or whatever. Huge difference. I hope I don't have to explain that to you again.

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Originally Posted by WinterEmpire View Post
Vancouver does not struggle to support minor league baseball from a fan perspective. They've been breaking franchise attendance records in recent years and been far and away the tops of their league. Regardless no I would not categorize Vancouver as a baseball city, because the number of people who consider it their most favorite sport is small.

And this is clearly the same with what has happened with the Bills series in Toronto. You can make excuses all you want but guess what, people in many other parts of Canada who support the CFL think the NFL is better too, but they actually enjoy the sport and will watch it and pay money for it regardless.

The point I was making was that Toronto has not shown a willingness to do that at any level of football. CFL is a failure, Bills series is a failure, why should anyone believe that Toronto could legitimately support an NFL franchise when they haven't proven they can do it at any other level of the sport.
If the bolded is your criteria, then every city in Canada is a hockey city and every other sport is a distant 2nd.

Your 2nd paragraph is something that I've been saying it fine for a long time. I think I already said it in this thread in fact. I have no problem with people enjoying the CFL more than the NFL. I actually watch the Argos a bit myself. Just don't claim the talent's better.

Your 3rd paragraph is just more of the same. CFL isn't the NFL, Bills aren't a Toronto team. We're going in circles now.
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Originally Posted by Ryan34222 View Post
The post you originally quoted said other than the Leafs.. It's actually the very first sentence..

If your numbers are correct, which I'll have to look. But lets use 11th. Sothe Raptors are 4 spots away from bottom half of league. Does that make you feel better?
Again, please post these lists of attendence. I'd love to see what other cities are in the dreaded bottom half. Your whole argument is just non-sensical. Should every team in the bottom half just fold. Miami Marlins have low attendence, should the Dolphins fold now?

LOL, at your 4 spots away from the bottom half comment. Their also 6 spots away from being top 5.
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Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
This Bills series has been a miserable failure and a serious miscalculation for Rogers.

By paying $78 million for 8 games (including 3 meaningless exhibition games) Rogers had to charge astronomical prices in order to break even. Turns out Torontonians weren't willing to pay any price to satisfy their thirst for the NFL. As a result, Rogers is bathing in red ink from this debacle.

I wouldn't be surprised if there is no extension of this series in 2013. Rogers might chalk it up to "unforseen circumstances" or some such nonsense in order to try and save face.

And boy, is it hard to save face when you can only sell 40000 seats in a 54000 seat facility at an average price of $99 (nearly half the $180 average from 4 years ago)...with reportedly thousands of those given away as freebies.

To those of you here who claim to use "logic" in your arguments in support of a Toronto NFL team, tell me, what reasons has the city provided to intrigue Roger Goodell and the owners. And no, silly comments like, "Oh, there are 5.5 million people in Toronto and 9 million in southern Ontario which will make it a surefire hit," don't cut the mustard.

The burden of proof lies with Toronto, but what have they proven? There has been tepid support for their own CFL team for the better part of 25 years with a few (years) exceptions. There has been the recent Bills-Toronto series plagued by embarrassing turnouts despite huge discounts and apparent widepread dispersal of free tickets.

This does not even cover the issue of an inadequate stadium..Rogers Centre has poor sightlines as several thousand seats are tarped off due to being too low to the ground..not to mention the fact the capacity of the stadium is found wanting...something an expansion of seating into the former hotel will not solve. Good luck finding someone to build you a stadium too as the feds have made it abundantly clear they are not in the business of funding pro sports stadiums. Considering the financial state of the province and the city don't look for any answers there either.

Then there is the issue of ownership. Who will own the team Toronto? The NFL has a policy against corporations owning teams so that eliminates Rogers as a potential suiter. Who else is there? I haven't heard any rumors about an individual interested in becoming an owner. Toronto's poor response to the Bills series might have scared off potential investors...

Back to the stadium and fan support, suppose a stadium could be built with the majority of it being funded privately. Do you think there are 50,000 Torontonians who will pay on average $15,000 - $20,000 for PSLs plus the ongoing yearly costs of $1000 per season ticket (on average) and $3000 - $4000 per club season ticket in the new stadium especially if the team is a perrenial non-playoff contender? Are there 150 corporations and/or wealthy individuals willing to pay $100,000 - $250000 PSL for a suite and the ongoing yearly costs of $100000+ for the privelege of watching the Toronto NFLers?

This are questions that need to be answered in a positive manner or at least there needs to be some positive momentum to resolve these issues if Toronto has any hope of getting an NFL team. Right now, arguably, London is seens as a more intriguing option to the commissioner and the owners. They have a suitable stadium, sellouts/near sellouts in a 85,000 seat facility and a population that dwarfs Toronto (10 million in London and 30 million or so within the southern area of the United Kingdom).

So Toronto, why should the league invest in your city? Do you have something substantive other than the population argument?
For all your typing here, you really brought nothing new to the argument. We know a stadium and ownership are issues but that's not what we're arguing about. We're talking about fan support which there'll be plenty of imo. Hard to prove, yes but those "silly numbers" you talk about aren't silly at all and are very relevant. Do you really think the 5th most populated city in Toronto can't support an NFL team?

Yeah, the stadium and ownership are wrinkles that need to be ironed out but they could come together rather easily. Plenty of examples of this in the past with other cities.

As for your bolded paragraph, if other cities can do it, what makes you think Toronto can't?

Don't use the Bils/CFL arguments either, they're pointless and irrelevant.
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Originally Posted by ixcuincle View Post
Blueandgoldguy just demolished any argument for a teaare just so many factors that don't fit for Toronto, that it'd be a failure at this time to move a team there.
No, he really didn't.

Right now it would be failure, but when a stadium is built and ownership stable it would do just fine.

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12-24-2012, 12:49 PM
  #85
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So much silliness in this thread.

First of all, if you're the owner of a Toronto NFL team, do you market to the football fans, or will they show up regardless?

Do you market to the people who have large disposable income who want to spend their money on big city, world-class, sex-appeal, it-factor, whatever has the large buzz, product?

How much disposable income is there amongst the population in Toronto and area?

Are there corporations in Toronto and area that would want their brand associated with this new exciting world class product?

Would these same corporations wish to have their brand associated with another city, like Buffalo?

How hard would it be to sell out 8 or 9 home games? That's one game every 2 weeks. Would you need to advertise? Or are there 3 national sports stations in Canada that would do the advertising for you simply because they would talk about this new exciting team every day?

Also, would this be Toronto's NFL team, or Canada's NFL team? Recall back in the day when the Jays were marketed properly that there were bus trips from as far away as Vancouver. You didn't need to be a knowledgable baseball fan to jump on that bandwagon, everyone was welcome.

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12-24-2012, 02:53 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by DaaaaB's View Post
Since you've resorted to name calling, all I'll say is that if you believe what you just posted then you know nothing about the game of football. CFLer's are generally old? Yeah, because they all spent a couple years trying to make the NFL and then went north when they realized they weren't good enough. You act like it's two different sports because they rules are a little different. There's no CFLer's that have as much talent as top-end NFLer's and it's utterly absurd to think that way.


And it wouldn't be the Buffalo Bills, it would the Toronto whatever. Why is that so hard to get thru your head?

I'll say it again, It wouldn't be the Buffalo Bills, it would be the Toronto Bills or whatever. Huge difference. I hope I don't have to explain that to you again.


If the bolded is your criteria, then every city in Canada is a hockey city and every other sport is a distant 2nd.

Your 2nd paragraph is something that I've been saying it fine for a long time. I think I already said it in this thread in fact. I have no problem with people enjoying the CFL more than the NFL. I actually watch the Argos a bit myself. Just don't claim the talent's better.

Your 3rd paragraph is just more of the same. CFL isn't the NFL, Bills aren't a Toronto team. We're going in circles now.

Again, please post these lists of attendence. I'd love to see what other cities are in the dreaded bottom half. Your whole argument is just non-sensical. Should every team in the bottom half just fold. Miami Marlins have low attendence, should the Dolphins fold now?

LOL, at your 4 spots away from the bottom half comment. Their also 6 spots away from being top 5.

For all your typing here, you really brought nothing new to the argument. We know a stadium and ownership are issues but that's not what we're arguing about. We're talking about fan support which there'll be plenty of imo. Hard to prove, yes but those "silly numbers" you talk about aren't silly at all and are very relevant. Do you really think the 5th most populated city in Toronto can't support an NFL team?

Yeah, the stadium and ownership are wrinkles that need to be ironed out but they could come together rather easily. Plenty of examples of this in the past with other cities.

As for your bolded paragraph, if other cities can do it, what makes you think Toronto can't?

Don't use the Bils/CFL arguments either, they're pointless and irrelevant.

No, he really didn't.

Right now it would be failure, but when a stadium is built and ownership stable it would do just fine.
Explain the stadium issue. It's not easy to come by. They're not going to play at Skydome...are they?

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12-24-2012, 03:03 PM
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A NFL team in Toronto would likely get a new stadium. SkyDome would be of benefit as a temporary solution, if relocation is in play. Problem with that is not many teams are looking into new stadiums.


And if you do that right, a lot of other things happen. Look at Seattle.


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12-24-2012, 03:36 PM
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Since you've resorted to name calling, all I'll say is that if you believe what you just posted then you know nothing about the game of football. CFLer's are generally old? Yeah, because they all spent a couple years trying to make the NFL and then went north when they realized they weren't good enough. You act like it's two different sports because they rules are a little different. There's no CFLer's that have as much talent as top-end NFLer's and it's utterly absurd to think that way.
Well if you refuse to believe that some players adapt to different styles of play differently, then I don't know what to tell you. All you have to do is look at the concrete evidence I presented previously to support my claim. Some players just don't get an opportunity right away in the NFL, so they come North, excel, and then get noticed enough by NFL scouts to get a second chance. Sometimes, earning a spot has to do with politics more so than actual talent. Anyway, I already stated that it's pretty obvious the NFL is the superior league, but the CFL is pretty good in its own right.

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12-24-2012, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by DaaaaB's View Post

For all your typing here, you really brought nothing new to the argument. We know a stadium and ownership are issues but that's not what we're arguing about. We're talking about fan support which there'll be plenty of imo. Hard to prove, yes but those "silly numbers" you talk about aren't silly at all and are very relevant. Do you really think the 5th most populated city in Toronto can't support an NFL team?
lol. You're basing this on nothing more than a hope and a prayer. Until it's proven that Toronto is willing to financial support pro football on a yearly basis, whether that be the Argos or the Bills in Toronto series, the Roger Goodell and the owners will continue to look at Toronto with a skeptical eye.

And so far they have proven to have lukewarm interest in both products. Argos have averaged around 20,000 per game every season (with the exception of a few seasons) over the past few decades. The Bills in Toronto series has not sold out and has progressively worse attendance and cheaper ticket prices each year. To the NFL, that is not the mark of a future NFL market.

You also bring up the population which of course should be one of the primary factors when deciding to bring a professional sports franchise to a city. Do you know which two cities in the U.S. have a similar population to the Toronto DaaaaaaB's? Atlanta and Miami.

Similar populations, strong corporate base in Atlanta (not sure about Miami) and lots of wealthy individuals. And how has hockey worked out there DaaaaaaB's? Atlanta moved in 2011 after reportedly losing tens of millions of dollars over its last 5 - 7 years. Atlanta apparently averaged something like $400,000 per game in gate revenue - an unstainable number in a league that probably requires a million plus per game in order for a franchise to have any hope of profitability. TV numbers were pathetic as well.

IT's not much better in Miami. Several years of poor attendance although that appears to have turned around recently. However, they gate revenue per game is still only $500,000 per game and their TV ratings are still atrocious. What's assisting them right now is a lease agreement they have in place and one of the busiest venues in North America (for non-sporting events).

The NHL made a mistake going into these markets in a haphazard fashion with the belief that hockey would be a profitable venture for the forseeable future, counting primarily on corporate strength and population numbers of these markets to support their stance.

Fortunately, the NFL will not be so reckless. They will look carefully at all the numbers before even considering Toronto as an expansion/relocation market. And right now, those numbers, other than population, are not very flattering to Toronto. The attendance numbers in particular show true apathy from the Toronto population.


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Originally Posted by DaaaaB's View Post
Yeah, the stadium and ownership are wrinkles that need to be ironed out but they could come together rather easily. Plenty of examples of this in the past with other cities.

You make this seem like it's a small formality. It most assuredly is not. The feds won't fund it. The city and the province won't fund it, at least not in any significant way, since they are both drowning in red ink. The optics of funding a pro sports team with the ONtario still struggling with unemployment would be horrible.

Also, what examples of cities that have never had an NFL team before and have had to rely primarily on private funding are you referring to?[/QUOTE]

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As for your bolded paragraph, if other cities can do it, what makes you think Toronto can't?

Don't use the Bils/CFL arguments either, they're pointless and irrelevant.
BUt what else can the league base their decision on? Sorry, the population factor is not a compelling reason all on its own. NHL cities with large populations and poor support are proof of that.

The NFL will look at these other factors like the city's support for football as it stands right now and the signs aren't very encouraging. If that's your argument, Los Angeles, Mexico City and London are better options anyways.

Two other things, Toronto will have no positive effect on TV ratings in the U.S. and the Toronto is considered part of Bills' territory. These are yet two other factors working against the city.

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12-24-2012, 06:34 PM
  #90
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A NFL team in Toronto would likely get a new stadium. SkyDome would be of benefit as a temporary solution, if relocation is in play. Problem with that is not many teams are looking into new stadiums.


And if you do that right, a lot of other things happen. Look at Seattle.
If you're suggesting an NFL team would come to Toronto, and play at Rogers Centre before any official agreements for the construction and funding of a new stadium are in place, then that is incorrect. The league wouldn't move to a new market without the guarantee of a new NFL stadium.

Even if they did allow it, it's not like the owners are going to be able to pressure the various levels of goverment to fork over $500 - $750 million for stadium funding once the team is in Toronto. People remember Skydome selling for pennys on the dollar a few short years ago. Also, in general, the various levels of government in Canada do not fund sports facilities to the same level as those in the U.S.

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12-27-2012, 02:31 PM
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The NFL will never work in TO. Toronto doesnt care about football, they care about gambling and goofy looking caps. Everywhere i look i see jays caps, but go to a non yanks/sox Blue Jays game at the skydome and you will see 11 thousand fans at the game.
I was at the Bills/Skins game last year (free tixof course). TO's so called football fans did not even know when to cheer. It was quite pathetic actually that there is so little football culture in TO, especially coming from a town that is home to North Americas oldest football team .

If it was any team other than the bills, attendance wouldve been even worse. Who the hell cares about dallas , green bay or any other team half way across the continent.

Claiming a team because thats the team you play on madden football does not make said team popular in Toronto. lol

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12-27-2012, 04:33 PM
  #92
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Yeah, no one has given a convincing argument yet why a team should be placed there. There are too many logistical nightmares to have it work successfully.

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12-27-2012, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
If you're suggesting an NFL team would come to Toronto, and play at Rogers Centre before any official agreements for the construction and funding of a new stadium are in place, then that is incorrect. The league wouldn't move to a new market without the guarantee of a new NFL stadium.

Even if they did allow it, it's not like the owners are going to be able to pressure the various levels of goverment to fork over $500 - $750 million for stadium funding once the team is in Toronto. People remember Skydome selling for pennys on the dollar a few short years ago. Also, in general, the various levels of government in Canada do not fund sports facilities to the same level as those in the U.S.
Of course a new stadium would be guaranteed.


That's really at the heart of the argument here. If there is an owner, who is then willing to get a stadium (regardless of means), with PSL's and superboxes, and in turn corporate sponsorship, the rest will line up. Tampa Bay can't sell out games, with a fairly new stadium and owners willing to deal with blackouts, and I don't see people trying to move them. In fact they went on a spending spree in free agency.

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12-27-2012, 06:28 PM
  #94
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Yeah, no one has given a convincing argument yet why a team should be placed there. There are too many logistical nightmares to have it work successfully.
Very true, logistical and financial roadblocks will prevent a team from ever coming to TO. Even Bell and Rogers had to get in bed together just to own only 75 percent of MLSE. The only Financial Juggernaut who could pony up $$$ for NFL expansion as if it was chump change is the Federal Govt. and you know that ain't happening. They handed out 12 million for the 100th Grey Cup for its cultural significance. The NFL has no significance in Canada and the Feds would never get on board if it even remotely meant a negative impact for the rest of the country which would be the case.

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12-27-2012, 06:38 PM
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Toronto can't support it.

1. They'd need a new Stadium.. I don't think Toronto is going to pay a billion or so to build a new one.

2. According to NFL rules a corporation cannot own a team it has to be a single person.. so that means no Rogers or Bell.

I feel if they did get a team it would do ok for the first couple honeymoon years but after that if they continued to suck they would do bad at the Gate like the Blue Jays and Argos.

Raptors are funny.. they still do decent but their ticket sales are tied to the Leafs so they get a big boost there

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12-28-2012, 10:42 AM
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lol. You're basing this on nothing more than a hope and a prayer. Until it's proven that Toronto is willing to financial support pro football on a yearly basis, whether that be the Argos or the Bills in Toronto series, the Roger Goodell and the owners will continue to look at Toronto with a skeptical eye.

And so far they have proven to have lukewarm interest in both products. Argos have averaged around 20,000 per game every season (with the exception of a few seasons) over the past few decades. The Bills in Toronto series has not sold out and has progressively worse attendance and cheaper ticket prices each year. To the NFL, that is not the mark of a future NFL market.

You also bring up the population which of course should be one of the primary factors when deciding to bring a professional sports franchise to a city. Do you know which two cities in the U.S. have a similar population to the Toronto DaaaaaaB's? Atlanta and Miami.

Similar populations, strong corporate base in Atlanta (not sure about Miami) and lots of wealthy individuals. And how has hockey worked out there DaaaaaaB's? Atlanta moved in 2011 after reportedly losing tens of millions of dollars over its last 5 - 7 years. Atlanta apparently averaged something like $400,000 per game in gate revenue - an unstainable number in a league that probably requires a million plus per game in order for a franchise to have any hope of profitability. TV numbers were pathetic as well.

IT's not much better in Miami. Several years of poor attendance although that appears to have turned around recently. However, they gate revenue per game is still only $500,000 per game and their TV ratings are still atrocious. What's assisting them right now is a lease agreement they have in place and one of the busiest venues in North America (for non-sporting events).

The NHL made a mistake going into these markets in a haphazard fashion with the belief that hockey would be a profitable venture for the forseeable future, counting primarily on corporate strength and population numbers of these markets to support their stance.

Fortunately, the NFL will not be so reckless. They will look carefully at all the numbers before even considering Toronto as an expansion/relocation market. And right now, those numbers, other than population, are not very flattering to Toronto. The attendance numbers in particular show true apathy from the Toronto population.





You make this seem like it's a small formality. It most assuredly is not. The feds won't fund it. The city and the province won't fund it, at least not in any significant way, since they are both drowning in red ink. The optics of funding a pro sports team with the ONtario still struggling with unemployment would be horrible.

Also, what examples of cities that have never had an NFL team before and have had to rely primarily on private funding are you referring to?



BUt what else can the league base their decision on? Sorry, the population factor is not a compelling reason all on its own. NHL cities with large populations and poor support are proof of that.

The NFL will look at these other factors like the city's support for football as it stands right now and the signs aren't very encouraging. If that's your argument, Los Angeles, Mexico City and London are better options anyways.

Two other things, Toronto will have no positive effect on TV ratings in the U.S. and the Toronto is considered part of Bills' territory. These are yet two other factors working against the city.[/QUOTE]
1. Comparing NHL teams in southern USA to having an NFL team in Toronto makes no sense whatsovever. Hockey is nowhere near as popular down there as Football is up here.

2. I'm not saying (and never have said) the NFL will give them a team. I'm saying if the NFL gave them a team (with stadiium, ownership issues solved) it would do fine in Toronto and there's no reason to believe otherwise.

3. How do you know the city and province won't help with funding? Things can change a lot over the course of a few years.

4. I'm done talking with people from western Canada who have an agenda against Toronto. It's pathetic, how many of these types are around here.

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12-28-2012, 10:44 AM
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Well if you refuse to believe that some players adapt to different styles of play differently, then I don't know what to tell you. All you have to do is look at the concrete evidence I presented previously to support my claim. Some players just don't get an opportunity right away in the NFL, so they come North, excel, and then get noticed enough by NFL scouts to get a second chance. Sometimes, earning a spot has to do with politics more so than actual talent. Anyway, I already stated that it's pretty obvious the NFL is the superior league, but the CFL is pretty good in its own right.
All the top players in the NFL, would have no trouble adapting to the rules and would dominate the CFL. Simple as that.

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12-28-2012, 11:19 PM
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3. How do you know the city and province won't help with funding? Things can change a lot over the course of a few years. .
eastern Canadian here , the city and the province are pizz broke. do you ever pick up a newspaper?

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12-28-2012, 11:21 PM
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All the top players in the NFL, would have no trouble adapting to the rules and would dominate the CFL. Simple as that.
They would be fish out of water. It takes a certain type of player to excel in the CFL and the prototypical NFL star ain't it. And vice versa

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12-29-2012, 06:36 PM
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You all know the Bills will likely go to Toronto as "their team" if the move happens, right? So show them some love.

Unlikely that Goodell will just form an expansion team out of nowhere

You're getting the Bills
WRONG. Bills just signed a 10 year lease so good luck. Btw we already got a billionaire (Tom Golisano) from the area who already said he would buy the team before he ever let them leave. Bills aren't going anywhere. Toronto doesn't deserve a NFL team.

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