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Fleury to Chicago

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Old
12-23-2012, 08:00 PM
  #26
Hawkaholic
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Crawford isn't even close to Fleury. Crawford is AHL quality, Fleury is middle of the pack NHL quality.

That said, I dont even think about doing this trade.

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Old
12-23-2012, 08:03 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Mike Farkas View Post
Team gives up 400 goals in a playoff series, acquires Corey Crawford...? I'll take my chances on Fleury, at least we've seen flashes of him being able to carry the bag...Crawford hasn't exactly been the pinnacle of goaltending even going back to his days in junior...
Another homerish remark. Crawford has been the better goal-tender as of late.

This entire deal is so ridiculously slanted one way that only a few die-ard Pitt fans could turn it down.

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Old
12-23-2012, 08:25 PM
  #28
Mike Farkas
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Another homerish remark. Crawford has been the better goal-tender as of late.

This entire deal is so ridiculously slanted one way that only a few die-ard Pitt fans could turn it down.
The deal could have been Sharp and three first round picks for Fleury, I wouldn't do it. That's not being a homer, I just don't want to trade Fleury. Especially for a goaltender of Corey Crawford's caliber...heaven forbid...

Value-wise the deal can be one-sided, slanted, two-sided, diagonal, the hypotenuse of an isosceles triangle any size or shape you want to call it...I don't want it, personally.

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Old
12-23-2012, 09:01 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Mike Farkas View Post
The deal could have been Sharp and three first round picks for Fleury, I wouldn't do it. That's not being a homer, I just don't want to trade Fleury. Especially for a goaltender of Corey Crawford's caliber...heaven forbid...

Value-wise the deal can be one-sided, slanted, two-sided, diagonal, the hypotenuse of an isosceles triangle any size or shape you want to call it...I don't want it, personally.
Isn't that really the exact definition of a Homer? Thinking only from the angle where your teams players are the best and no objective reasoning, be it value or team needs, plays a role in your decision?

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Old
12-23-2012, 09:19 PM
  #30
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Isn't that really the exact definition of a Homer? Thinking only from the angle where your teams players are the best and no objective reasoning, be it value or team needs, plays a role in your decision?
I thought homer, in the context of the trade thread, finds their players more valuable and superior to all and goes around trying to hypothetically rob teams with inane proposals?

I'm saying, "your players are probably better and/or more valuable, but I don't want them because they don't help my team win" That goes for being a homer these days? Instead, I should accept the rather lopsided deal that over-values my team's players (and under-values Chicago's) to avoid being a homer?

Boy, I'll tell ya, I am just flabbergasted...

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Old
12-23-2012, 10:28 PM
  #31
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Last year MAF played great. The Pens Dee hung him out to dry in the playoffs. I'm not saying that MAF didn't let a bad goal or two. But, the dee was the problem, not MAF.

They should hire Dave Burrows as a coach, to teach them how it's done right.

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Old
12-23-2012, 10:37 PM
  #32
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Boys.... Even Roy and Brodeur who are considered to be among the best that've played the game have had bad playoffs. Fluery played damn near every game last year because Johnson couldn't stop a beach ball. Ill admitt maf playoff wasn't very good but he is a big time goalie that can steal games. Pit doesn't take down Washington in game 7 if fluery doesn't stand on his head. Stops #8 on a break away with an incredible glove save that sets the tone of the game. Crawford had a good rookie season and a not so great sophomore season. He may rebound whenever they start again but maybe not

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Old
12-23-2012, 11:07 PM
  #33
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Terrible proposal but Fleury is getting horrendously underrated because of the playoffs. He's no Quick but he is definitely an improvement on Crawford. Unquestionably. He would make Chicago better, just not at the expense of Sharp. Something like Fleury + Kennedy + (???) for Crawford + Hjalmarsson (or something like this, maybe Stalberg, etc.) could probably work.

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Old
12-23-2012, 11:30 PM
  #34
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James Van Reimsdyk + Ben Scrivens + 2nd round pick in 2013

for

Marc-Andre Fleury

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Old
12-23-2012, 11:44 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by vinnybaby View Post
James Van Reimsdyk + Ben Scrivens + 2nd round pick in 2013

for

Marc-Andre Fleury
jaysus Murphy. What in the hell would Pittsburgh want scrivens for? If they trade fluery it won't be to a team with that coming back.

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Old
12-23-2012, 11:53 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by jayball75 View Post
jaysus Murphy. What in the hell would Pittsburgh want scrivens for? If they trade fluery it won't be to a team with that coming back.


He'd fit in as a cheap, young back-up for Vokoun.

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Old
12-23-2012, 11:55 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by jayball75 View Post
Boys.... Even Roy and Brodeur who are considered to be among the best that've played the game have had bad playoffs. Fluery played damn near every game last year because Johnson couldn't stop a beach ball. Ill admitt maf playoff wasn't very good but he is a big time goalie that can steal games. Pit doesn't take down Washington in game 7 if fluery doesn't stand on his head. Stops #8 on a break away with an incredible glove save that sets the tone of the game. Crawford had a good rookie season and a not so great sophomore season. He may rebound whenever they start again but maybe not
I have conflicting opinions on Fleury with myself. Not a big fan, BUT he isn't anywhere near as bad as he was last year in the playoffs. He was ridiculously bad, and the defense was bad as well. He will probably see better days in the future I'd bet.

And yes Brodeur had an awful 2001 SCF. I try to reason with the fellow Devils fans who feel the need to rip him over every goal he let in these playoffs. I said he's seen better days for sure, but he's also seen much worse. Had a worse save percentage in the 01 SCF than Luongo did in 11 somehow. Let in bad goals unscreened, undeflected from the blue line to Bourque, Blake, and Foote almost every game that SCF. Game 6 of the 01 SCF was the worst game I've ever seen him play. We were shutout by Roy so can't fault him. He was coming off a SCF win, and long season the year before to be fair.

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Old
12-24-2012, 03:54 AM
  #38
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I dont think either team will want to put fleury in a deal untill they find out how well he rebounded from his playoff apearance

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Old
12-24-2012, 04:00 AM
  #39
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I've had a fairly strong dislike of the MA FLeury Overhype Extravaganza even before this past playoff debacle, so it's a horrible deal for Chicago, IMO.

Fleury is probably just about the most average goalie you can find. He is special in absolutely zero ways.

He's Chris Osgood 2.0

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Old
12-24-2012, 05:40 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
I've had a fairly strong dislike of the MA FLeury Overhype Extravaganza even before this past playoff debacle, so it's a horrible deal for Chicago, IMO.

Fleury is probably just about the most average goalie you can find. He is special in absolutely zero ways.

He's Chris Osgood 2.0
You made me laugh. Chris was the most averarge ever. He had great team in front of him. All of the shots againts him were from the Blue Line. I'll take MAF over him any day.

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Old
12-24-2012, 05:57 AM
  #41
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How exactly is Fleury a choker when he led a team that relied on their loaded offense to 2 SCFs? Ask yourself, could Pittsburgh have won a Cup with someone like Brent Johnson as their starter? MAF is their franchise goalie, this is what Shero would ask for. Kunitz would make the value more even though.
Both of those teams had defense and Fleury didn't lead anyone anywhere. Fleury is a mediocre goaltender. Average, middle of the pack, better than most but not as good as 15-20 goaltenders in the league. I have never understood why he gets such undeserved credit for playing so mediocre.

If I was to just throw out stats of what a middle of the pack NHL #1 goaltender should be, it is almost exactly Fleury's stats.

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Old
12-24-2012, 07:16 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Hawkaholic View Post
Crawford isn't even close to Fleury. Crawford is AHL quality, Fleury is middle of the pack NHL quality.

That said, I dont even think about doing this trade.
Fluery is a bottom third/quarter starter in the league, as is Crawford. Crawford had a bad season, much like Pens fans are talking about Fluery being hung out to dry, the same applies to Crawford. The Hawks are amongst the worst teams in the league when it comes to breakouts and system play.. and they have the worst PK system in the league, by far.

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Old
12-24-2012, 09:08 AM
  #43
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He'd fit in as a cheap, young back-up for Vokoun.
That's true but Vokoun had a bad year last year. He was brought in as a backup to maf not to carry a starter load of games. Scrivens does have potential but if and when they start a season scrivens/Vokoun isn't a better option than fluery.

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Old
12-24-2012, 09:21 AM
  #44
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You made me laugh. Chris was the most averarge ever. He had great team in front of him. All of the shots againts him were from the Blue Line. I'll take MAF over him any day.
Eh, I'm glad you got a chuckle. Doesn't change my view on MAF though.

Everything you just said about Osgood applies to MAF, IMO.

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12-24-2012, 09:39 AM
  #45
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Eh, I'm glad you got a chuckle. Doesn't change my view on MAF though.

Everything you just said about Osgood applies to MAF, IMO.
You must not watch many Red Wings or Penguins games then. No one would confuse the styles they play.

Chris Osgood was an average goalie with nothing special to his game. Fleury has amazing natural abilities as a goalie that Osgood could only have dreamed of, it's his inability to consistently play at the level he should with all that talent that's the problem.

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Old
12-24-2012, 10:50 AM
  #46
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Pens need to add something significant... Harrington maybe? At least.

Obviously the Pens take this deal if the money is right. Crawford is a downgrade from Fleury but he's good enough and cheaper. Sharp would be great with Crosby.

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Old
12-24-2012, 11:05 AM
  #47
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I must say I find it hard to believe the Blackhawks wouldn't take him for free.

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Old
12-24-2012, 11:12 AM
  #48
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Fleury gets a hard time here. I guess its because people can't rationally rag on Crosby or Malkin and someone from the Pens needs it, ha ha.

But seriously, he's a much better goalie than Crawford, but Sharp is too steep of a price for Chicago to pay for a goalie improvement (yes, improvement).

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Old
12-24-2012, 01:10 PM
  #49
Jax Teller
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Originally Posted by jayball75 View Post
That's true but Vokoun had a bad year last year. He was brought in as a backup to maf not to carry a starter load of games. Scrivens does have potential but if and when they start a season scrivens/Vokoun isn't a better option than fluery.
Vokoun was poor last season, apparently. Yet even in a "bad" season he had a better save percentage than Fleury. Outside of the 07/08 season, Vokoun has produced better #'s than Fleury every season since Fleury entered the league.

No, obviously Vokoun/Scrivens isn't a comparable tandem. But, it's much cheaper and the statistically better goalie is still with the Penguins. The penguins downgrade in net to find Sid a long-term winger in my proposal.


Last edited by Jax Teller: 12-24-2012 at 01:17 PM.
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Old
12-24-2012, 01:31 PM
  #50
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I must say I find it hard to believe the Blackhawks wouldn't take him for free.
Folks who say this are being massive homers, and are seriously misjudging the difference between Crawford and MAF, who are both capable of much better than they dismayed last season, IMO.

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