Hated by players. Read Dryden's book... And he was being kind.
Don't remember Watson.
The thing is --- Bowman became a players coach somewhere between Buffalo and Pittsburgh. So, while his presence might make sense if one only consider his stint as a Habs, it doesn't if looking at his career as a whole.
Watson coached well before I was born, but there are quite a few references to the fact that he was a major ***.
The thing is --- Bowman became a players coach somewhere between Buffalo and Pittsburgh. So, while his presence might make sense if one only consider his stint as a Habs, it doesn't if looking at his career as a whole.
Watson coached well before I was born, but there are quite a few references to the fact that he was a major ***.
I agree that the topic is vague. Hated by his players? Hated by other teams? Hated by fans? But I'll throw out three names that haven't been mentioned yet:
Joe Crozier: In the WHA, he ordered one of his goons to attack Marc Tardif (this was far more violent than the Clarke-Kharlamov incident). Don Cherry said that instructing his players to intentionally injure an opponent's star player was something Crozier did a few other times in the AHL.
Bill Laforge: He was absolutely hated by the players in Vancouver during his brief tenure there. Had a lot of odd ideas when it came to practices.
Graham James: His vileness puts him in a category all by himself.
I agree that the topic is vague. Hated by his players? Hated by other teams? Hated by fans? But I'll throw out three names that haven't been mentioned yet:
Joe Crozier: In the WHA, he ordered one of his goons to attack Marc Tardif (this was far more violent than the Clarke-Kharlamov incident). Don Cherry said that instructing his players to intentionally injure an opponent's star player was something Crozier did a few other times in the AHL.
.
I caught something on TV a few years ago.
Rick Jodzio tried everything to meet up with Marc Tardif (I think it was during Quebec's International Pee-Wee tournament) in order to somehow apologize (and actually did meet him).
Tardif just couldn't have cared less.
But yeah, James is obviously in a class of his own.
The thing is --- Bowman became a players coach somewhere between Buffalo and Pittsburgh. So, while his presence might make sense if one only consider his stint as a Habs, it doesn't if looking at his career as a whole.
Watson coached well before I was born, but there are quite a few references to the fact that he was a major ***.
A lot of players hated Bowman in Detroit as well. Early in his tenure mind you.
In Ray Sheppard's biography, he wrote of how excited they were when Bryan Murray hired a coach to replace himself, Ilitch letting him pick, proving management wanted a winner. The wings were a bit leaderless and divided on the ice, and Bryan wanted a coach who could take 16 different egos and gel them into a winner.
The author who wrote the biography Ray went on to say he was shocked after having lunch with the team at how most of the red wing players, especially the leaders, hated Bowman and his style of coaching. One of the problems they had with Murray(Although they loved him) was his being both a coach and GM splitting his attention. Then, Bowman started bypassing Murray and going straight to Ilitch and it was said the players lost any respect they had for Bowman.
It went on about their loss to the Sharks. how Steve Y was rushed back to play before physically ready, and how despite the pounding they gave the sharks 2 games before with their run and gun style(Which they still played), Bowman decreed they were changing up for game 7 with a defense first, no risk taking game and that he would bench anyone not following his plan. Larionov was credited for his ability to defensively take Hart winning Fedorov out of games.
After they lost, Bowman trashed the team in the media about how the whole team "can't or won't play defense. We are not a good team at checking. The forwards are thinking goals and chicago".
I don't personally remember that because it was a Detroit paper, but at the time, I remember Bowman trashing just about everyone defensively except Fedorov and Konstantinov for their lackluster defensive play And Declared he was going to end this run and gun style the team plays and show them how to be winners. If they don't like it, they will be traded.
Obviously, Bowman did what he said and converted the team and gained their respect(Well, not some of them) over the years. But boy did a lot of players hate him.
A lot of players hated Bowman in Detroit as well. Early in his tenure mind you.
In Ray Sheppard's biography, he wrote of how excited they were when Bryan Murray hired a coach to replace himself, Ilitch letting him pick, proving management wanted a winner. The wings were a bit leaderless and divided on the ice, and Bryan wanted a coach who could take 16 different egos and gel them into a winner.
The author who wrote the biography Ray went on to say he was shocked after having lunch with the team at how most of the red wing players, especially the leaders, hated Bowman and his style of coaching. One of the problems they had with Murray(Although they loved him) was his being both a coach and GM splitting his attention. Then, Bowman started bypassing Murray and going straight to Ilitch and it was said the players lost any respect they had for Bowman.
It went on about their loss to the Sharks. how Steve Y was rushed back to play before physically ready, and how despite the pounding they gave the sharks 2 games before with their run and gun style(Which they still played), Bowman decreed they were changing up for game 7 with a defense first, no risk taking game and that he would bench anyone not following his plan. Larionov was credited for his ability to defensively take Hart winning Fedorov out of games.
After they lost, Bowman trashed the team in the media about how the whole team "can't or won't play defense. We are not a good team at checking. The forwards are thinking goals and chicago".
I don't personally remember that because it was a Detroit paper, but at the time, I remember Bowman trashing just about everyone defensively except Fedorov and Konstantinov for their lackluster defensive play And Declared he was going to end this run and gun style the team plays and show them how to be winners. If they don't like it, they will be traded.
Obviously, Bowman did what he said and converted the team and gained their respect(Well, not some of them) over the years. But boy did a lot of players hate him.
He was also criticized by Dino who said that "Bowman distance himself too much from his team and it becomes a problem in the locker room". I don't think I ever saw anyone criticizing his startegies or coaching ability. Except those who were discarded or didnt get enough ice-time (Burr, Primeau, Fedorov)
Scotty Bowman has had image changed due to the media and his age and through his record winning no one wants to say bad things.The truth is he was one of the most disliked individuals in hockey and at times hated.There are tons of articles written over the decades that would make front page news.But the one thing Bowman had was respect from players like Lafleur and Yzerman and that takes you a long way
He was also criticized by Dino who said that "Bowman distance himself too much from his team and it becomes a problem in the locker room". I don't think I ever saw anyone criticizing his startegies or coaching ability. Except those who were discarded or didnt get enough ice-time (Burr, Primeau, Fedorov)
There were quite a few times in the biography where they criticized Bowman's coaching and strategies. Mostly about how he should be allowing the team to run and gun like they had the previous score of years before he got there. He of course proved them wrong in the end.
Dino, Yzerman, Coffey and Sheppard were vocal in their distaste for Bowman's defense first style. But Ilitch signed Bowman for 3 more years and they knew from the rumblings that he was going to make examples of those who criticized his regime of defense. We know how that turned out
Edit: I am only reading it for the second time as Ray Sheppard's biography didn't interest me overmuch, but it is actually a good read.
heh. Apparently at ilitch's end of the year party after being swept by the devils, when Bowman arrived, every player sitting in the main living room rose and left because they were so mad at his decisions and coaching during that series. During the first 10 games of the season, he played the Sheppard/Yzerman/Dino line as the 4th line haha.
I sure don't remember that.
Last edited by Dark Shadows: 12-26-2012 at 11:35 AM.
Bowman had feuds in Montreal with Jacques Laperriere and Pete Mahovlich that were well-known. And in Buffalo there were problems with some of the players. Rick Martin always insisted that his career was ruined by Bowman forcing him back into the lineup too soon after a knee injury, and Gil Perreault was critical of Bowman's tactics in running the team.
But the majority seem to respect him more than hate him.
Thanks DarkShadows. I didnt know they (the players you mentioned) were so vocal about it. Intresting indeed. Ill see if I can get a hold of his biography. Although, complaints from Ray Sheppard should be taken with a frain of salt. He was a primadonna and wanted to be treated as a star. Perhaps thats why they sent him away.
Didnt Pat Quinn manage to alienate the whole Maple Leaf fan base? Not that its an accomplishment out of context but I seem to remember reading that he became disliked by the players too for beign both GMand coach and not able to focus on his duties to the team.
True. Players led a mutiny to get rid of him. He would make the players clean up the arena after games b/c he was too cheap to hire a cleanup crew, ha!
