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WJC U20 Championship Game

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Old
12-28-2012, 11:15 AM
  #201
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Gibson bailing out Jones big time right there. Dude was in no mans land.

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12-28-2012, 11:20 AM
  #202
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Brutal, brutal game by Seth Jones. End of the game tries to skate through the entire Russian D by himself on a 6 on 4. Come on kid.

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12-28-2012, 11:21 AM
  #203
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This is exactly why it was stupid to cut Skjei. Too many offensive minded defensemen. Gibson is the only reason this game isn't out of hand.

Naming McCabe captain.

Not inviting another forward after Noeson suspension.

Mismanaged.

They're going to get slaughtered by Canada.

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12-28-2012, 12:06 PM
  #204
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I take it this is the first series of viewings for a lot of people when it comes to Seth Jones. Kid is trying to do too much, as do most kids in this tourney who are draft eligible and highly touted. Reminds me of another big righty who people "never understood the hype about" as an 18 year old but would now kill to pluck him out of St. Louis.

All Jones needs is time and experience. Franchise D-man in the making.

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12-28-2012, 12:12 PM
  #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I take it this is the first series of viewings for a lot of people when it comes to Seth Jones. Kid is trying to do too much, as do most kids in this tourney who are draft eligible and highly touted. Reminds me of another big righty who people "never understood the hype about" as an 18 year old but would now kill to pluck him out of St. Louis.

All Jones needs is time and experience. Franchise D-man in the making.
Guilty. But color me unimpressed. I see the tools are there, he just seems very raw to me and the way Hradek is talking about him is like he's a bonafide NHL star; which you seem to agree with. Just seems like a poor man's PK Subban right now.

(not a racist comment, just the best comparison I could come up with)

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12-28-2012, 12:12 PM
  #206
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
This is exactly why it was stupid to cut Skjei. Too many offensive minded defensemen. Gibson is the only reason this game isn't out of hand.

Naming McCabe captain.

Not inviting another forward after Noeson suspension.

Mismanaged.

They're going to get slaughtered by Canada.
More upset that they cut Matteau and didn't even invite Samuelsson.

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12-28-2012, 12:44 PM
  #207
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I thought the little dangler Grimaldi (aka Bible Boy) looked pretty good out there today. Was close to breaking out a couple times. Jones is still very raw still imo. See the talent - but needs time to put it together.
Miller had his good points today, though he needs to work on his skating and first stride especially. A good bottom 4 guy for sure. Did I hear "Barbara Underhill"?

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12-28-2012, 12:48 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
Guilty. But color me unimpressed. I see the tools are there, he just seems very raw to me and the way Hradek is talking about him is like he's a bonafide NHL star; which you seem to agree with. Just seems like a poor man's PK Subban right now.

(not a racist comment, just the best comparison I could come up with)
An 18 year old kid is raw? Ya dont say.

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12-28-2012, 12:50 PM
  #209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
This is exactly why it was stupid to cut Skjei. Too many offensive minded defensemen. Gibson is the only reason this game isn't out of hand.

Naming McCabe captain.

Not inviting another forward after Noeson suspension.

Mismanaged.

They're going to get slaughtered by Canada.
I can't stand watching Gostisbehere out there. He's horrendous in the D-zone and gives the puck up like crazy in the O-zone trying to skate through people.

Danny Kristo on D.

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12-28-2012, 12:54 PM
  #210
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
Guilty. But color me unimpressed. I see the tools are there, he just seems very raw to me and the way Hradek is talking about him is like he's a bonafide NHL star; which you seem to agree with. Just seems like a poor man's PK Subban right now.

(not a racist comment, just the best comparison I could come up with)
Believe me, I can see why people who are getting their first look at him might be skeptical. He's made some boneheaded plays, and his coverage has been close to abysmal at times. However, he's never played at this kind of level before. Sure, the dub is a quality junior league, but these are the best players in the world in his age group -- a group in which he's one of the youngest. A lot of these kids have professional experience. That kind of thing goes a long way.

Is he a star right now? Of course not, but he has the total package in terms of skating, size and skill. If he can learn the intricacies of the professional game and adapt to the higher levels of play, the sky is the limit for him, IMO. The team that drafts him and eases him into the pro's is going to get a huge reward for their patience.

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12-28-2012, 12:59 PM
  #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
Believe me, I can see why people who are getting their first look at him might be skeptical. He's made some boneheaded plays, and his coverage has been close to abysmal at times. However, he's never played at this kind of level before. Sure, the dub is a quality junior league, but these are the best players in the world in his age group -- a group in which he's one of the youngest. A lot of these kids have professional experience. That kind of thing goes a long way.

Is he a star right now? Of course not, but he has the total package in terms of skating, size and skill. If he can learn the intricacies of the professional game and adapt to the higher levels of play, the sky is the limit for him, IMO. The team that drafts him and eases him into the pro's is going to get a huge reward for their patience.
He also is a notoriously slow starter.

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12-28-2012, 01:21 PM
  #212
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He also is a notoriously slow starter.
To me being a "slow starter" means a player needs to improve their preparation and conditioning, etc, and is as much a black mark as it is an excuse

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12-28-2012, 01:26 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
To me being a "slow starter" means a player needs to improve their preparation and conditioning, etc, and is as much a black mark as it is an excuse
I don't think it's a good thing myself. Just how he's been as long as I can remember.

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12-28-2012, 02:43 PM
  #214
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I can't stand watching Gostisbehere out there. He's horrendous in the D-zone and gives the puck up like crazy in the O-zone trying to skate through people.

Danny Kristo on D.
Pretty much.

Pinches at the absolute worst times too. How many odd man rushes does your goaltender need to bail you out of.

Skjei would have offered a more calming influence on the back end.

Like I said before the real tourny started. USA management stupidly decided they'd try to get into a shootout with Russia and Canada.

They're going to get slaughtered by Canada and it makes me mad.

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12-28-2012, 02:44 PM
  #215
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Gostisbehere is a really ****** version of Phil Housley without any of the (already bad) defense, the smarts, or the real offensive game.

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12-28-2012, 02:47 PM
  #216
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Gostisbehere is a really ****** version of Phil Housley without any of the (already bad) defense, the smarts, or the real offensive game.
The kid blows Matt Gilroy out of the water in every respect. If the scouts we had in the NCAA actually did a decent job and watched the games, like the Leafs scouts do, we'd pick up on more of the talent available. The Leafs and Stars have scouts at just about every game I've been to so far. What are we scouting?

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12-28-2012, 02:50 PM
  #217
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I'll tell you, avoiding that upcoming disaster is a good thing for Skjei. Instead of getting embarrassed by Canada on New Years, he has a chance to log big minutes against BC minus Gaudreau.

Feel bad for Miller and Grimaldi who are very competitive. Not there going through the motions. They genuinely want to win.

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12-28-2012, 03:00 PM
  #218
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The kid blows Matt Gilroy out of the water in every respect. If the scouts we had in the NCAA actually did a decent job and watched the games, like the Leafs scouts do, we'd pick up on more of the talent available. The Leafs and Stars have scouts at just about every game I've been to so far. What are we scouting?
Rangers scouts have done a great job.

Gostisbehere has talent. But he's all over the place. The point of the WJC is to win, not develop players. USA management took too many offensive minded defensemen. Not enough guys who can stymie an offensive team like Russia and Canada.

Going into this tourny, everyone knew Canada and Russia would be all offense. USA doesn't have the offensive weapons to match. They should have focused on shutting those teams down and capitalizing on their mistakes defensively.

Now not only does USA not have the offense to match but they have too many defensmen thinking they're Leetch in his prime. Get caught pinching. Left Gibson out to dry. They're lucky he kept the goals against to a minimum.

Canada is going to beat us like a drum.

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12-28-2012, 03:04 PM
  #219
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The kid blows Matt Gilroy out of the water in every respect. If the scouts we had in the NCAA actually did a decent job and watched the games, like the Leafs scouts do, we'd pick up on more of the talent available. The Leafs and Stars have scouts at just about every game I've been to so far. What are we scouting?
I'm a little confused. Gostisbehere was drafted, so are you talking about the Leafs success in terms of drafting from the NCAA? Because they've drafted like two kids out of the college ranks in the last 10 years. They've had a few go the NCAA route after their draft year, but I can't think of any who are setting the world on fire. Frattin is decent, but there's a whole lot of "meh" in that pool. Not many college FA's either.

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12-28-2012, 03:52 PM
  #220
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All I'm going to say is that the second goal is the exact scenario I was dreading when I saw that Reilly wasn't cut. Just all around lost.

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12-28-2012, 04:22 PM
  #221
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going to be interesting to see how you guy do against us (canada)... we have not looked very good and subban is very shaky in goal.. Was hoping you guys could pull it out.

How did JT Miller look

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12-28-2012, 04:39 PM
  #222
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I'm a little confused. Gostisbehere was drafted, so are you talking about the Leafs success in terms of drafting from the NCAA? Because they've drafted like two kids out of the college ranks in the last 10 years. They've had a few go the NCAA route after their draft year, but I can't think of any who are setting the world on fire. Frattin is decent, but there's a whole lot of "meh" in that pool. Not many college FA's either.
Pretty much what I was gonna post.

And Matt Frattin was a leaf pick from 2007, not a college free agent IIRC.

The Leafs have Tyler Bozak and Ben Scrivens to show for their supposedly splendid NCAA free agent track record. Some cornerstone franchise pieces for sure!

If you want to find a team that has a great track record with college FAs, check out Florida. They got Boyle and Garrison. Or New Jersey with Rafalski.

The chances of finding impact players via college free agents is very slim and more likely than not, the majority of them barely even play a full NHL season.


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12-28-2012, 04:58 PM
  #223
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He was drafted after his first year in the NCAA. I knew about him, the leafs knew about him, and evidently so did Philly.

I wanted him when we took Nieves, as a kid out of Baldwinsville I knew about him as well.

I can't remember NYR using a draft pick on a kid that has already proven himself with a year in the NCAA. High school kids recently, headed to the NCAA or (In Miller's case) the OHL.

Carolina got a kid in the ECAC by the name of Danny Biega who is going to be a great player in this league. The Canucks got Ben Hutton whose stock is rising.

Greater point is, we've got guys following high schoolers, but not the correct NCAA teams. The guys we have picked up from the NCAA have been from Alaska, Nebraska, completely random. Union has a great program. They play solid defense, quick counterattacks, and they clear the crease. Made the frozen four last year.

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12-28-2012, 05:23 PM
  #224
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Miller and Skjei weren't playing HS. They were in the USHL playing with USNTDP. Some of their games are against NCAA teams.

Miller was committed to North Dakota. The only reason he chose to go play with Plymouth of the OHL is because he and the Rangers mutually wanted his path to the NHL to be quicker and wanted him signed to a pro contract ASAP.

The Rangers have a great track record with the NCAA in recent years.

Kreider, Stepan, Hagelin, McDonagh.

Their top two picks last June (Skjei and Nieves) were NCAA bound players. The year prior they selected Miller (again who at the time was NCAA bound) and Fogarty.

They love the USNTDP kids. Bourque, Miller, Skjei.

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12-28-2012, 05:24 PM
  #225
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Isn't Hutton in his first year at Maine? Unless I'm confusing him with someone else..

Look, I'm all for putting additional emphasis on NCAA scouting, but it's not as if we're crapping the bed there either. Jean looks like a solid pickup, and Gilroy was one of the most sought-after UFA's that year. We were also pretty heavy after Jeremy Welsh but we just couldn't offer him what Carolina could. Unfortunately the fact that we have (or had) a deep prospect pool and a lot of competition for roster spots really works against us when it comes to signing these kids out of college.

Now, in terms of drafting, I'd much rather have Nieves over Ghost. I'm just not that high on the kid. Will he be better than Gilroy? I don't know. Both are guys who might as well be playing forward because they're always looking up the ice instead of paying attention to their own end.

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