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Fowler-Subban-Mcdonagh-J.Schultz-Hamonic

View Poll Results: You're named GM, select one defenceman.
Cam Fowler 10 9.71%
P.K. Subban 35 33.98%
Ryan Mcdonagh 39 37.86%
Justin Schultz 8 7.77%
Travis Hamonic 11 10.68%
Voters: 103. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
12-29-2012, 01:56 AM
  #26
Kershaw
 
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Okay you can try to defend that and I'll make it easy and only include NHL players...lol

we are talking about Jack Johnson here, pretty decent Dman and a great recording artist to boot.
Look at his garbage +/- numbers. And before someone tells me that it's an illegitimate stat, I agree with you. However he bleeds GA at an abnormal rate in his career thus far.

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Old
12-29-2012, 02:08 AM
  #27
Hardyvan123
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Originally Posted by Tortorella View Post
Look at his garbage +/- numbers. And before someone tells me that it's an illegitimate stat, I agree with you. However he bleeds GA at an abnormal rate in his career thus far.
Plus/minus?

That's really weak man, if he is that bad he doesn't play over 22MPG in his entire post lockout career.

Seriously you point explains a ton of your posts now.

Just to show how use full plus/minus can be JJ went to a worse team and played over 27 MPG and was a plus 5 in 21 GP for the Blue Jackets.

Did he suddenly get better playing more MPG for a worse team?


Last edited by Hardyvan123: 12-29-2012 at 02:15 AM.
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Old
12-29-2012, 02:11 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Plus/minus?

That's really weak man, if he is that bad he doesn't play over 22MPG in his entire post lockout career.

Seriously you point explains a ton of your posts now.
Look at his GA/60 mins on behindthenet season by season. Plays soft minutes too.

07-08: 2nd worst GA on Kings facing, 3rd best competition.
09-10: Led team in this category, faced fairly weak competition.
10-11: Once again led Kings in this category, playing weak competition again. Brutal Corsi relative rankings too.


Last edited by Kershaw: 12-29-2012 at 02:20 AM.
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Old
12-29-2012, 05:32 AM
  #29
PhillyBluesFan
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1.Mcdonagh





2. PK/Fowler



3.Schultz/Harmonic

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Old
12-29-2012, 05:50 AM
  #30
Hardyvan123
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Originally Posted by Tortorella View Post
Look at his GA/60 mins on behindthenet season by season. Plays soft minutes too.

07-08: 2nd worst GA on Kings facing, 3rd best competition.
09-10: Led team in this category, faced fairly weak competition.
10-11: Once again led Kings in this category, playing weak competition again. Brutal Corsi relative rankings too.
So you are going to pull out 08 when he was 21 (a rookie) playing the 3rd most minutes on the Kings which would have included major time with a
31 year old Vishnosky (22:60 -19)
38 year old Rob Blake (22:44 -19)
21 year old Jack Johnson (21:42 -19)

10 he plays the 2nd most GPM on the Kings again.

Doughty 24:59
Jack Johnson 22:37
Rob Scuderi 19:16
Sean O'Donnell 18:44
Randy Jones 18:10
28 year old Brad Stuart (21:13 -16)

11 once again 2nd to Doughty 25:39 (who plays alot with willie Mitchell)

Jack Johnson 23:12

I'm not going to argue that he is the best defensive dman in the world but he is hardly as you would say

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tortorella View Post
Johnson is the worst defensive player in hockey post lockout.
I'm sorry but the worst defensive player in hockey does not get the MPG that Jack Johnson gets.

He does not get invited to play for the US at the WC 5 times in the last 7 years or the Olympics either.

As Mark Twain has said and you so well have supported this, there are lies damn lies and statistics.

But then again maybe you and 3 select years of stats over the last 7 years know much more about his defensive play than any of his NHL coaches of those of US Hockey right?

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Old
12-29-2012, 11:21 AM
  #31
Le Magnifique 66
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PK Subban

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12-29-2012, 05:00 PM
  #32
Drydenwasthebest
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Fowler is also 3 years younger than the 2 front runners and I'm projecting him to be better than McDonagah overall in 3 years and maybe Subban too who is a bit of a free spirit.

When guys are that far apart there has to be projection and I think many are missing that point. 20,21,22,23 huge gap just look back at any set of prospects with those age swings.
Yes, Fowler is younger. That does not mean he projects to become better. Right now Fowler is mostly an offensive defenceman who needs to develop better defensive abilities. He is not in the same category as Subban and McDonagh. If you are picking a defenceman to build a team around, you go with one who already has proven he can be good offensively and defensively. Fowler is ONLY younger, nothing else. That does not mean he is a bust or horrible. He is still a very good offensive defenceman. However, he is NOT in the same discussion as Subban and McDonagh. By the way, you make it sound like Fowler will develop while Subban and McDonagh will remain where they already are. You might want to consider that Subban and McDonagh took great strides this past season and look to only get better, as well.

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Old
12-29-2012, 05:38 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
So you are going to pull out 08 when he was 21 (a rookie) playing the 3rd most minutes on the Kings which would have included major time with a
31 year old Vishnosky (22:60 -19)
38 year old Rob Blake (22:44 -19)
21 year old Jack Johnson (21:42 -19)

10 he plays the 2nd most GPM on the Kings again.

Doughty 24:59
Jack Johnson 22:37
Rob Scuderi 19:16
Sean O'Donnell 18:44
Randy Jones 18:10
28 year old Brad Stuart (21:13 -16)

11 once again 2nd to Doughty 25:39 (who plays alot with willie Mitchell)

Jack Johnson 23:12

I'm not going to argue that he is the best defensive dman in the world but he is hardly as you would say



I'm sorry but the worst defensive player in hockey does not get the MPG that Jack Johnson gets.

He does not get invited to play for the US at the WC 5 times in the last 7 years or the Olympics either.

As Mark Twain has said and you so well have supported this, there are lies damn lies and statistics.

But then again maybe you and 3 select years of stats over the last 7 years know much more about his defensive play than any of his NHL coaches of those of US Hockey right?
He got those minutes because he's still a physical and offensive threat.

And with the personal shots, I have no reason to continue this bickering.

Take 5 mins to read this

http://www.coppernblue.com/2012/2/24...on-is-not-good

Quote:
"Jack was a thoroughbred out there. But he was all over the place. He was awful as a hockey player. As an athlete, you’re going, wow! Look at the way he skates, shoots, he can pass. But he had no idea where he was going. At times, he was playing forward at Michigan. You had no idea what position he was playing. But he had always been the star and he always got his numbers. Then he turns pro and for the first time, we’re telling him ‘whoa, just make the first pass and learn to play in your own end.’ How about making a read in your own end about the right guy to pick up? He was awful."
~Dean Lombardi.


Last edited by Kershaw: 12-29-2012 at 05:51 PM.
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Old
12-29-2012, 05:39 PM
  #34
TieClark
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McDonagh
Fowler
Hamonic
Subban
Schultz

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Old
12-29-2012, 05:45 PM
  #35
the
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Mcdonagh>Subban

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Old
12-29-2012, 06:15 PM
  #36
tony d
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Fowler
Mcdonagh
Subban
Schultz
Hamonic

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