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IIHF reffing is a joke MOD WARNING: Post 144

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Old
12-29-2012, 02:14 PM
  #526
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Originally Posted by stish View Post
Reading some of the responses in this thread makes me agree with Don Cherry more; and that is frightening. Just have an all European non-contact tournament with 500 people in the stands and a T.V. contract worth 6,000 Euro and everything will be fine.
Well, this is more than the current NHL TV contract, isn't it?

And if you agree with Don Cherry on anything, at any point in your life, you are a laughing stock for the rest of the world. Which is fine, if it is your choice to make, just be aware of it.

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12-29-2012, 02:15 PM
  #527
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Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
Deliberately injuring people is bad sportsmanship, sorry. This is not "war" (no matter what sports commentators make you believe), you are not protecting your country or your family. It's a s-p-o-r-t. If you can't beat your opponent with your skill, reserving to violence and injure them constitutes a definition of "bad sportsmanship" in my book.
That's nice. You're wrong, but that's nice.

If you can't play a sport within the rules (like apparently some teams can't, as evidenced by their whining about the contact aspect of it) then that country needs to adapt or continue losing. I don't consider a clean body check as a deliberate attempt to injure. If the Slovakian player had have kept his head up, he likely isn't injured. That's the breaks...I feel bad for the kid, but he should have kept his head up and likely will not make that same mistake again.

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12-29-2012, 02:18 PM
  #528
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Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
Well, this is more than the current NHL TV contract, isn't it?

And if you agree with Don Cherry on anything, at any point in your life, you are a laughing stock for the rest of the world. Which is fine, if it is your choice to make, just be aware of it.
Don Cherry dislikes touch icing. Nice use of absolutes.

The NHL gets $200M this season no matter what happens, so maybe you shouldn't talk about things you are ignorant about?

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12-29-2012, 02:18 PM
  #529
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
Well, this is more than the current NHL TV contract, isn't it?

And if you agree with Don Cherry on anything, at any point in your life, you are a laughing stock for the rest of the world. Which is fine, if it is your choice to make, just be aware of it.
Don Cherry is a sports icon in Canada, and is actually correct on a lot of what he says. The fact that some kid sitting at home posting on the internet thinks he knows more than a former NHL coach, former NHL Coach of the Year, former AHL Coach of the Year, and current hockey analyst who has been on TV spanning across 3 decades is embarrassing.

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12-29-2012, 02:18 PM
  #530
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I am not sure there was intent to injure at either of these episodes. Hard to tell. The Slovak certainly did not try to avoid collision, that's for sure...

y2K: stop saying "you feel bad for the kid." You most certainly don't.

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12-29-2012, 02:19 PM
  #531
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Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
Well, this is more than the current NHL TV contract, isn't it?

And if you agree with Don Cherry on anything, at any point in your life, you are a laughing stock for the rest of the world. Which is fine, if it is your choice to make, just be aware of it.
Reading comprehension helps when you are in the habit of throwing insults.

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12-29-2012, 02:19 PM
  #532
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Maybe Canada should withold the 60% of IIHF funding that it provides until there is 1 set of international rules...not IIHF and NA?

End the debate by actually making the International Ice Hockey Federation, you know, international.

As for the poster that stated that the rules should be based on the majority and that would mean IIHF rules, you would be wrong. 66% of all registered hockey players, globally, play in North America, so it would mean NA rules would rule the day.

That being said, is it really too much to ask for the NHL, KHL, IIHF, any other major leagues, to sit down and make one set of rules?

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12-29-2012, 02:20 PM
  #533
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Originally Posted by Hynh View Post
The NHL gets $200M this season no matter what happens, so maybe you shouldn't talk about things you are ignorant about?
Seriously? TV pays them even though there are no games to televise? Talk about money well spent

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12-29-2012, 02:21 PM
  #534
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
I am not sure there was intent to injure at either of these episodes. Hard to tell. The Slovak certainly did not try to avoid collision, that's for sure...

y2K: stop saying "you feel bad for the kid." You most certainly don't.
Actually I do feel bad for the kid. He was living a dream playing in this tournament and now his tournament is over. Tough break, but he should have kept his head up.

You can feel bad for an injured player without jeopardizing the integrity of the game by issuing a penalty to a player who committed a CLEAN hit.

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12-29-2012, 02:22 PM
  #535
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Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
Well, this is more than the current NHL TV contract, isn't it?

And if you agree with Don Cherry on anything, at any point in your life, you are a laughing stock for the rest of the world. Which is fine, if it is your choice to make, just be aware of it.
You just made yourself a laughingstock with that comment. Perhaps next time you shouldn't talk in absolutes.

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12-29-2012, 02:23 PM
  #536
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Don Cherry is a sports icon in Canada, and is actually correct on a lot of what he says. The fact that some kid sitting at home posting on the internet thinks he knows more than a former NHL coach, former NHL Coach of the Year, former AHL Coach of the Year, and current hockey analyst who has been on TV spanning across 3 decades is embarrassing.
The fact that he is a "sports icon" speaks more about Canadian hockey fans. Although every Canadian I spoke to about him used the word "embarrassment" and "clown" at some point.

What he "knows more" is also debatable. His Stone Age views undoubtedly entertain a certain fraction of people, just like Rush Limbaugh's views inspire a certain fraction of population South of the Border.

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12-29-2012, 02:25 PM
  #537
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Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
I am not sure there was intent to injure at either of these episodes.
I'd say about the same that Camara had.

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12-29-2012, 02:25 PM
  #538
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Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
Deliberately injuring people is bad sportsmanship, sorry. This is not "war" (no matter what sports commentators make you believe), you are not protecting your country or your family. It's a s-p-o-r-t. If you can't beat your opponent with your skill, reserving to violence and injure them constitutes a definition of "bad sportsmanship" in my book.
Have you ever played hockey at any level? In a contact sport you are expected to make c-o-n-t-a-c-t!
The higher the level the higher the degree of contact. At this level these players are making split second decisions with adrenaline levels that would kill most horses! None of these kids are the knuckle dragging Cro-magnons who's sole purpose is to injure opposing players you are making them out to be from behind your keyboard.

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12-29-2012, 02:27 PM
  #539
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
The fact that he is a "sports icon" speaks more about Canadian hockey fans. Although every Canadian I spoke to about him used the word "embarrassment" and "clown" at some point.

What he "knows more" is also debatable. His Stone Age views undoubtedly entertain a certain fraction of people, just like Rush Limbaugh's views inspire a certain fraction of population South of the Border.
Wouldn't call his views stone age. Just because you don't like physical hockey doesn't mean it's wrong. What makes your views where a player can make a clean, legal hit yet still be penalized more correct than Don Cherry who believes in physical hockey and players keeping their heads up so they don't get demolished like the Slovakian player?

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12-29-2012, 02:27 PM
  #540
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Actually I do feel bad for the kid. He was living a dream playing in this tournament and now his tournament is over. Tough break, but he should have kept his head up.

You can feel bad for an injured player without jeopardizing the integrity of the game by issuing a penalty to a player who committed a CLEAN hit.
Again, I don't really make a distinction between "clean" and "dirty" hits. They both intend to hurt, injure, and whatever. "If you can't beat them in skill, beat them up." Again, I realize my view is an outlier, hardly ever to be accepted, especially by Canadian hockey fans. Still this is how I feel. Before you go on: I don't like golf, women's hockey, or whatever. I like hockey. More specifically, the hockey of Gretzky, Sakic, Fedorov, and Lidstrom. Not of Clarke, Stevens, and Lemieux.

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12-29-2012, 02:27 PM
  #541
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Originally Posted by Zybalto View Post

Your continued silence on the Rapac knee on Scheifele also speaks volumes. You must be outraged that the officals only gave Rapac 2 min and the IIHF didn't even look at it for a suspension. Every bit as dirty as Lipon's hit no?
Yeah, 2 minutes was too much for that. The canadian player tried to avoid the hit by sidestepping and had a little contact with his leg because of that.

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12-29-2012, 02:28 PM
  #542
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Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
I didn't see either incident, so I can't comment on them. Does that also "speak volumes"? If both players were injured, the offenders should be suspended.

I fully recognize the fact that my position is an outlier. Oh well, it's not the only one :
Heh, the media usually does a piss poor job of covering hockey so thats not your fault.

Heres what happened to poor Altonen:



The knee on Scheifele:



What's most infuriating to me is that if Scheifele gave the oscar calibre performance Mikus gave after the Lipon hit(which the refs were originally signalling was going to be a standard 2 and 10 for a headshot) we would probably be talking about Rapac being suspended a game as well....and if Mikus had not intentionally stayed down, Lipon never would have been suspended. It's a little maddening.

I'll say it again, the best solution is for the officials on the ice to let the IIHF look at injuries after the game and hand down supplementary suspensions instead of huddling up and changing their calls because some is (or is faking) to be hurt.

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12-29-2012, 02:31 PM
  #543
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
Again, I don't really make a distinction between "clean" and "dirty" hits. They both intend to hurt, injure, and whatever. "If you can't beat them in skill, beat them up." Again, I realize my view is an outlier, hardly ever to be accepted, especially by Canadian hockey fans. Still this is how I feel. Before you go on: I don't like golf, women's hockey, or whatever. I like hockey. More specifically, the hockey of Gretzky, Sakic, Fedorov, and Lidstrom. Not of Clarke, Stevens, and Lemieux.
Well quit complaining then. I respect that you like skilled, soft players. But that doesn't change the fact that hockey is a physical, contact sport where there will be players like Clarke, Stevens, Lemieux, etc. I take it you must not be a huge fan of the Ovechkin's or Kasparitis's of the world either? Regardless, contact is permitted within the rules, and nothing Camara did was against the rules. The only reason there was a call made was because a stretcher came out. There was no call made initially on the play because the referees knew it was a legal play. But as soon as someone brought out a stretcher they felt they had to come up with some BS call. It was a disgrace to the game and jeopardized the integrity of the game.

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12-29-2012, 02:31 PM
  #544
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Yeah, 2 minutes was too much for that. The canadian player tried to avoid the hit by sidestepping and had a little contact with his leg because of that.
He followed through with his leg. It's like a more extreme version of Getzlafs hit on Mikus (theres a familiar name) in the WC, which Getzlaf was thrown out of the game for.

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12-29-2012, 02:31 PM
  #545
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Yeah, 2 minutes was too much for that. The canadian player tried to avoid the hit by sidestepping and had a little contact with his leg because of that.
I'm assuming you feel the same about the Camara hit?

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12-29-2012, 02:32 PM
  #546
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Wouldn't call his views stone age. Just because you don't like physical hockey doesn't mean it's wrong. What makes your views where a player can make a clean, legal hit yet still be penalized more correct than Don Cherry who believes in physical hockey and players keeping their heads up so they don't get demolished like the Slovakian player?
Well, if I hold the opposite view, it automatically makes him wrong from my perspective (logic, you know?). What makes my views more correct? At this point, the refs' decisions that this tournament goes by (especially if they keep it consistent).

Let's just agree to disagree. You can keep cut'n'pasting "the reffing in this tournament is joke," which I have seen used in every tournament. I'll just applaud every ref's decision to send goons to their dressing rooms with subsequent disqualifications.

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12-29-2012, 02:33 PM
  #547
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Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
Again, I don't really make a distinction between "clean" and "dirty" hits. They both intend to hurt, injure, and whatever. "If you can't beat them in skill, beat them up." Again, I realize my view is an outlier, hardly ever to be accepted, especially by Canadian hockey fans. Still this is how I feel. Before you go on: I don't like golf, women's hockey, or whatever. I like hockey. More specifically, the hockey of Gretzky, Sakic, Fedorov, and Lidstrom. Not of Clarke, Stevens, and Lemieux.
Well if you do not like hitting than go watch womens hockey.

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12-29-2012, 02:34 PM
  #548
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Originally Posted by Zybalto View Post
Heh, the media usually does a piss poor job of covering hockey so thats not your fault.

Heres what happened to poor Altonen:



The knee on Scheifele:



What's most infuriating to me is that if Scheifele gave the oscar calibre performance Mikus gave after the Lipon hit(which the refs were originally signalling was going to be a standard 2 and 10 for a headshot) we would probably be talking about Rapac being suspended a game as well....and if Mikus had not intentionally stayed down, Lipon never would have been suspended. It's a little maddening.

I'll say it again, the best solution is for the officials on the ice to let the IIHF look at injuries after the game and hand down supplementary suspensions instead of huddling up and changing their calls because some is (or is faking) to be hurt.
lipon's suspended because of his own stupidity. he's lucky he only got a game. blaming lipon's suspension on the refs or mikus is ridiculous. hits like that are dangerous and unnecessary, whether the player on the receiving end is seriously injured or not.

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12-29-2012, 02:35 PM
  #549
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
Well, if I hold the opposite view, it automatically makes him wrong from my perspective (logic, you know?). What makes my views more correct? At this point, the refs' decisions that this tournament goes by (especially if they keep it consistent).

Let's just agree to disagree. You can keep cut'n'pasting "the reffing in this tournament is joke," which I have seen used in every tournament. I'll just applaud every ref's decision to send goons to their dressing rooms with subsequent disqualifications.
Not going to applaud a referee's decision to disqualify a player for doing something that is clean and permitted by the rules. The referee made a very blatant bad call, and that should be met with punishment, not applause. You can choose to applaud bad calls all you want, but that doesn't make it correct. I hope team Canada continues to impose a physical punishment on their opponents. It's the way we play our game and we aren't going to change it just because a few players from other countries don't want to keep their head up, or can't handle the physicality of a contact sport. Don't like it? Go play tennis.

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12-29-2012, 02:35 PM
  #550
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Well quit complaining then. I respect that you like skilled, soft players. But that doesn't change the fact that hockey is a physical, contact sport where there will be players like Clarke, Stevens, Lemieux, etc. I take it you must not be a huge fan of the Ovechkin's or Kasparitis's of the world either? Regardless, contact is permitted within the rules, and nothing Camara did was against the rules. The only reason there was a call made was because a stretcher came out. There was no call made initially on the play because the referees knew it was a legal play. But as soon as someone brought out a stretcher they felt they had to come up with some BS call. It was a disgrace to the game and jeopardized the integrity of the game.
I think it's YOU who is doing the complaining. I, for one, feel it's perfectly OK to give game misconduct if the player leaves the game because of the injury. Clean or not.
And yes, I don't like Ovy or Kasper. I think I've said it many, many times.

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