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2013 NHL Entry Draft Talk 3.0

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Old
12-29-2012, 03:23 PM
  #351
paddy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EveryDay View Post
Who would you guys take first OV MacKinnon or Jones?
Elias Lindholm.

My prediction is that in 5 years, Lindholm will be the best overall player from this draft. He might struggle with injuries, just like Drouin and Mackinnon. Drouin will probably be the biggest point producer, and Jones will struggle.with consistency. I see Jones as a guy who plays like one of the best on a stretch of games, but never able to put it together for a lon period. Mac will top out as a 30-40 goal scorer who's hard to play against, -la Jarome Iginla.

As for Barkov, I think he'll be a very good and durable player, who may have a Sundin-like career.

I'll go against the grain and rank them as so:

1- Lindholm
2- Barkov
3- Mackinnon
4- Drouin
5- Jones

Personally, I don't like to pick a defenseman high.

Anyways, it's just personnal opinions and projections. We'll revisit this in 5 years.

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12-29-2012, 03:26 PM
  #352
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paddy View Post
Elias Lindholm.

My prediction is that in 5 years, Lindholm will be the best overall player from this draft. He might struggle with injuries, just like Drouin and Mackinnon. Drouin will probably be the biggest point producer, and Jones will struggle.with consistency. I see Jones as a guy who plays like one of the best on a stretch of games, but never able to put it together for a lon period. Mac will top out as a 30-40 goal scorer who's hard to play against, -la Jarome Iginla.

As for Barkov, I think he'll be a very good and durable player, who may have a Sundin-like career.

I'll go against the grain and rank them as so:

1- Lindholm
2- Barkov
3- Mackinnon
4- Drouin
5- Jones

Personally, I don't like to pick a defenseman high.

Anyways, it's just personnal opinions and projections. We'll revisit this in 5 years.
Can you elaborate on your choice of Lindholm and what you think he can bring in terms of production and future to the franchise? You gave out a description for all the others except him lol

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12-29-2012, 03:30 PM
  #353
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jabba11 View Post
Can you elaborate on your choice of Lindholm and what you think he can bring in terms of production and future to the franchise? You gave out a description for all the others except him lol
TBH, I see him as a Nick Backstrom type of player. Solid for years and constant 75+ pts producer.

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12-29-2012, 03:34 PM
  #354
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TBH, I see him as a Nick Backstrom type of player. Solid for years and constant 75+ pts producer.
I see more grit in his game than Backstrom's. People tend to say he's the best Swedish prospect since Backstrom, but Landeskog is pretty hard to beat. So, Landeskog or Lindholm?

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12-29-2012, 03:38 PM
  #355
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Getting to play an abbreviated season should be beneficial to the Habs future,a Top Five Draft pick being their likely finish to the season.Given the lottery being weighted in favor of order of finish and only the non-playoff teams involved,the Habs could get fortunate and draft 1st,2nd or 3rd again.Calgary is quite likely to be in the bottom five teams to finish as well,which would make the Habs first two picks in the 2nd round between 30-35,giving them three picks in the Top 35.Depending upon their 1st round pick,the players I would like to see them draft are Alex Wennberg Center from Sweden, A.Mantha RW or V.Zykov RW with the first two picks in the 2nd round and either W.Carrier C/LW or A.Burakowsky C/LW from Sweden.Any combination of three from these five players along with a lottery choice in the 1st round would be a great draft.So let's all hope the NHL & NHLPA agree upon a new CBA,giving the Habs two really successful drafts in a row.This would be very similar to the work done by Dale Tallon in Florida,whose team rejoined the playoffs in his 3rd year as GM and has a plethora of top prospects in their system that will make them "Elite" for years.

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12-29-2012, 03:39 PM
  #356
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Originally Posted by Jabba11 View Post
Can you elaborate on your choice of Lindholm and what you think he can bring in terms of production and future to the franchise? You gave out a description for all the others except him lol
Lindholm can bring everything. Speed, smarts, hands, playmaking, grit. People compare him to Foppa, but that's way too much to ask of any player as Foppa was probably the most complete player ever and one of the strongest and balanced player I've ever seen. That being said, Lindholm does has certain Forsberg flashes, but he can never be as physically dominant as Foppa. But when I watch him, I see not only a great point-producer -la Backstrom, but a guy who will successful in the playoffs, which is the ultimate goal. He won't be the best of the draft right away, but I predict he'll keep improving dramatically once in the NHL to be the best from the class of 2013 in 5 years.

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12-29-2012, 04:04 PM
  #357
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We're not in the '70s anymore and they now have rules in place to promote parity with the salary floor & cap. No need to reward the inaptitude of GMs with high draft picks.
When teams are continually in danger of losing their franchises,besides being out of the playoffs their fans need some form of promise for the future.The ineptitude of the picks chosen or of their development system is a whole other matter each team has to overcome.Salary Caps favor the wealthy teams,parity has been transparent due to the change of awarding points,which gives the illusion that most teams are on a par with each other.

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12-29-2012, 04:07 PM
  #358
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paddy View Post
Elias Lindholm.

My prediction is that in 5 years, Lindholm will be the best overall player from this draft. He might struggle with injuries, just like Drouin and Mackinnon. Drouin will probably be the biggest point producer, and Jones will struggle.with consistency. I see Jones as a guy who plays like one of the best on a stretch of games, but never able to put it together for a lon period. Mac will top out as a 30-40 goal scorer who's hard to play against, -la Jarome Iginla.

As for Barkov, I think he'll be a very good and durable player, who may have a Sundin-like career.

I'll go against the grain and rank them as so:

1- Lindholm
2- Barkov
3- Mackinnon
4- Drouin
5- Jones

Personally, I don't like to pick a defenseman high.

Anyways, it's just personnal opinions and projections. We'll revisit this in 5 years.
I like your descriptions.

For the Habs, I would rank them and where they should be picked:

1. MacKinnon(1-2)
2. Lindholm(4-6)
3. Barkov(3-5)
4. Drouin(1-4)
5. Jones(1-2)

-Mac is a scoring center/winger than plays a tough game and should be a consistent 30 goal scorer. Montreal hasnt had someone like him in a long time. He has speed, grit, hands and a good shot.

-Lindholm is complete. He can do anything. PP, PK, play gritty, make plays and has good hands. A perfect 2nd line center behind Galchenyuk. I dont see him as an elite 1st line player but he can play there and excel in every situation. Maybe 75 points per season in his prime.

-Barkov is the most NHL ready of all of them. He is big, tough and skilled. I see a bit of Lindros in him. He would be a perfect center for te Habs but I dont see the highest offemsive upside in him. Maybe a 60 point player, 70 in his prime if he plays with other skilled player. He will probably be the one with the longest career but wont get the attention the others will since he is not flashy.

-Drouin. Hardcore Habs fans better listen to me. Drouin is a small, skilled winger. He wont solve all our problems. He is small. He will probably be the most successfull offensively but will be more of the same. More small weak players. I would take Mac, Barkov and Lindholm over him.

-Jones is a defenseman. I dont want to waste a high pick on him.

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12-29-2012, 04:32 PM
  #359
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs4TheCup View Post
I like your descriptions.

For the Habs, I would rank them and where they should be picked:

1. MacKinnon(1-2)
2. Lindholm(4-6)
3. Barkov(3-5)
4. Drouin(1-4)
5. Jones(1-2)

-Mac is a scoring center/winger than plays a tough game and should be a consistent 30 goal scorer. Montreal hasnt had someone like him in a long time. He has speed, grit, hands and a good shot.

-Lindholm is complete. He can do anything. PP, PK, play gritty, make plays and has good hands. A perfect 2nd line center behind Galchenyuk. I dont see him as an elite 1st line player but he can play there and excel in every situation. Maybe 75 points per season in his prime.

-Barkov is the most NHL ready of all of them. He is big, tough and skilled. I see a bit of Lindros in him. He would be a perfect center for te Habs but I dont see the highest offemsive upside in him. Maybe a 60 point player, 70 in his prime if he plays with other skilled player. He will probably be the one with the longest career but wont get the attention the others will since he is not flashy.

-Drouin. Hardcore Habs fans better listen to me. Drouin is a small, skilled winger. He wont solve all our problems. He is small. He will probably be the most successfull offensively but will be more of the same. More small weak players. I would take Mac, Barkov and Lindholm over him.

-Jones is a defenseman. I dont want to waste a high pick on him.
Agreed on Barkov. Most NHL-ready and longest injury-free career.

I chose Lindholm as the best player of the bunch, but Barkov is a safer pick. I'm afraid that with his size and playstyle, Lindholm will get injured often.

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12-29-2012, 05:04 PM
  #360
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No love for Sean Monahan? Guy is an absolute beast. I would take him over Drouin and Lindholm.

For me:
MAC
Jones
Barkov
Monahan
Lindholm
Drouin

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12-29-2012, 05:24 PM
  #361
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs4TheCup View Post
I like your descriptions.

For the Habs, I would rank them and where they should be picked:

1. MacKinnon(1-2)
2. Lindholm(4-6)
3. Barkov(3-5)
4. Drouin(1-4)
5. Jones(1-2)

-Mac is a scoring center/winger than plays a tough game and should be a consistent 30 goal scorer. Montreal hasnt had someone like him in a long time. He has speed, grit, hands and a good shot.

-Lindholm is complete. He can do anything. PP, PK, play gritty, make plays and has good hands. A perfect 2nd line center behind Galchenyuk. I dont see him as an elite 1st line player but he can play there and excel in every situation. Maybe 75 points per season in his prime.

-Barkov is the most NHL ready of all of them. He is big, tough and skilled. I see a bit of Lindros in him. He would be a perfect center for te Habs but I dont see the highest offemsive upside in him. Maybe a 60 point player, 70 in his prime if he plays with other skilled player. He will probably be the one with the longest career but wont get the attention the others will since he is not flashy.

-Drouin. Hardcore Habs fans better listen to me. Drouin is a small, skilled winger. He wont solve all our problems. He is small. He will probably be the most successfull offensively but will be more of the same. More small weak players. I would take Mac, Barkov and Lindholm over him.

-Jones is a defenseman. I dont want to waste a high pick on him.

Im sorry, but that is just false
Ive trained with Drouin over the summer, kids a tank and has a great work ethic. Yes, he may be small, but hes still growing and you cant teach work ethic which he already has. I have no doubt if Montreal drafts him strength and conditioning will be the least of the worries for Drouin, btw this is the same gym and trainer that trains Letang

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12-29-2012, 05:34 PM
  #362
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Originally Posted by ReppingMTL View Post
No love for Sean Monahan? Guy is an absolute beast. I would take him over Drouin and Lindholm.

For me:
MAC
Jones
Barkov
Monahan
Lindholm
Drouin
Monahan is the only forward that is late 94(i think) in this group. He fell a bit for me and I wouldnt take him in the top 5. The top 5 is really strong this year but for the habs , my choice would be:
1. Lindholm
2. Barkov
3. Jones
4. Drouin
5. Mackinnon

As you can see , I am not the biggest Mackinnon fan. What worries me the most about Mackinnon is that is offense won't translate to the NHL since he doesn't have the best puck control. In WJC and SSS, Mackinnon showed everyone he couldnt play on the wing and his style of play reflects more the style of a winger. On the other hand, Ive been impressed by Lindholm, Barkov and Jones in the WJC. Lindholm has great chemistry with Collberg(Galchenyuk-Linholm-Collberg?) . Jones has been used in all situations and is one of the most trusted defenseman by Housley. Barkov played well but could be better since I have big expectations for him. And finally for Drouin, he is one of my favorite player from this draft but his size and his speed worries me.

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12-29-2012, 05:49 PM
  #363
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In my humble opinion the Top two players are still Nathan MacKinnon and Seth Jones,certainly there could be someone else chosen before either of them it just depends upon which teams are choosing 1-6.The teams choosing won't be reading much into the size of players and the chances of them getting injured.Johnathan Drouin and Sasha Barkov will probably go 3rd & 4th,leaving Elias Lindholm 5th and Sean Monahan at 6th.After that it's pretty much anybody's guess,a lot will depend upon team needs other than a gamble on Valeri Nicushkin the LW/RW that signed a three year deal in the KHL.If the NHL has a season which looks promising,then I believe the Habs are in tough and will most certainly be at the bottom of their division once more.That being the case the only teams I see at or near their standing will be Columbus and Calgary.First,second or third would give the Habs a very good chance of choosing a franchise type of player and another superb draft.Somebody should run a poll on which player the Habs fans here would choose between the Top Six if the Habs chose #1 overall.

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12-29-2012, 06:17 PM
  #364
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Not bad, but in order to prevent the 'Lemieux and Crosby both end up in Pittsburgh syndrome', in which a HUGE generational player is a temptation for massive tanking, I would propose a preliminary 1 ball each lottery for all non PO teams for 1st pick only, followed by your system for the remaining 13 non PO teams.
I think that overall it's better for worst teams to get better players, statistically speaking.

The NHL could always impose corrections, such that a team that drafts top-3 one year cannot draft top-3 the next year, and thus if they are picked their balls are dropped back in the lottery pool.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bsl View Post
What utter bollocks.

We don't need more 'depth' players. Every team has depth players. We need stars. The chances of a second round pick becoming a star in the NHL are extremely low.

And our chance of a top 5 pick if we play this year are damn good. Here's two of the big reasons why:

1. There will not be huge win streaks by bad teams in a 48 game season. The good teams will be gunning from the start.

2. Markov will not have time to adjust.

In conclusion, I would say a short season increases the Habs chances of finishing badly.
Sometimes, good players are picked in the 2nd round.

PK Subban
Shea Weber
Milan Lucic

were all 2nd rounders.

3 2nd rounders in a deep draft... three high second rounders in all likelihood as both Calgary and Montreal are lottery candidates and Nashville will have a hard time. Don't trivialize it imo, we have a decent shot at acquiring a major piece to add to our 2015-2020 stanley cup contention window.


Last edited by DAChampion: 12-29-2012 at 06:23 PM.
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Old
12-29-2012, 07:12 PM
  #365
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At 1:04 ... hopefully we will see this in the future at the Bell Centre!

http://video.tsn.ca/?dl=main/latest/1/0/834658/clip/404

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12-29-2012, 09:04 PM
  #366
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
I think that overall it's better for worst teams to get better players, statistically speaking.

The NHL could always impose corrections, such that a team that drafts top-3 one year cannot draft top-3 the next year, and thus if they are picked their balls are dropped back in the lottery pool.



Sometimes, good players are picked in the 2nd round.

PK Subban
Shea Weber
Milan Lucic

were all 2nd rounders.

3 2nd rounders in a deep draft... three high second rounders in all likelihood as both Calgary and Montreal are lottery candidates and Nashville will have a hard time. Don't trivialize it imo, we have a decent shot at acquiring a major piece to add to our 2015-2020 stanley cup contention window.
Exactly what I think. People forget that sometime players are forget in the 1st round and teams can land them at the beginning of the second round. Since we will probably have 2 picks in the first 10 picks of the second round (Calgary and MTL). Players like Mantha, Duclair, Gauthier, Domi and Sorensen could fall in the 2nd round because of the depth of this draft or needs of other team. Those players could fill perfectly our second line and maybe first line.

And their is a lot of intriguing players that are overlook for many reasons. Nic Petan is a good exemple. The guy is 5ft9, yes, but he is 2nd in WHL scoring, 17 pts above a certain Hunter Shinkaruk. This kid got heart and hockey sense, which are hard to teach. Mirco Muller is a excellent defenseman with size (6ft4, 185lbs) that would probably get more attention if he was not Swiss. Michael Downing is another D-Men with size I like. He can throw hits and play on the powerplay.

Let's never forget that a lot of players have great career in the NHL and are found in round beyond the first round. Hockey is a TEAM game. You cannot win with one or two great players. You need good players too. I'm not saying that we don't need another star in MTL, but with four picks in the top60, in a deep draft, we can fill a lot of holes in our line-up/prospect pool. And sometime, you get lucky and you find a Subban. Don't always happen, but it might.

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12-29-2012, 09:41 PM
  #367
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Besides Edmonton and Pittsburgh how many teams have been that bad for more than a year or two? Maybe it would be better to penalize a team like Edmonton with a five drafting place penalty after picking 1st twice in a row.

I don't mind teams moving up or down a couple of places but I don't like the sound of this one bit.

The only thing worse then letting idiots own and run sports franchises is letting idiots who don't own sport franchises run sport franchises.
Chicago.

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12-29-2012, 09:51 PM
  #368
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Chicago.
LA as well

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Old
12-29-2012, 09:57 PM
  #369
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Washington too. Got Ovechkin, Backstrom and Alzner out of it.

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12-29-2012, 09:58 PM
  #370
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Washington too. Got Ovechkin, Backstrom and Alzner out of it.
We're 'only' up to 5, of those, 3 are cup winners.

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12-29-2012, 10:18 PM
  #371
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I'm referring to teams that drafted 1st overall a couple of times. Chicago never drafted 1st overall (lottery win - finished 5th overall) and Toews and Barker were 3rd overall.

Washington took Alzner 5th overall and Backstrom 6th.

Edmonton drafted 1st overall 3 times - moved up 1 spot.

Pittsburgh drafted 1st overall twice, 2nd and 3rd overall.

I think there is a difference between trying to win and not be a bottom celler dweller and just rotting at the bottom of the pile.

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12-30-2012, 01:54 AM
  #372
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This is the order I would draft:

1. Nathan MacKinnon - I believe he's the best player in the draft. He wants to do everything comparable to Alex Ovechkin.

2. Jonathan Drouin - Drouin is the second best player in the draft, he's got some sick hands comparable to Claude Giroux.

3. Aleksander Barkov - This guy I believe is a sure #1 center. He lacks that top speed and flash but he will put up points. I think of Anze Kopitar.

4. Seth Jones - He may take some time to fulfill his potential but he will be a #2 defenceman. I say a better Dustin Byfuglien.

5. Elias Lindholm - Hockey IQ off the charts, plays two-way game, and always give 100% every shift. Think a better Jason Spezza.

6. Rasmus Ristolainen - I really like this player, he's big and plays a positional game. May not put up major offensive numbers but very solid on defense, comparable to Brent Seabrook.

7. Sean Monahan - He's a very good positional player but I think he lacks that great offensive game. Probably a future #2 center. I say a better David Legwand.

8. Ryan Pulock - comparable to Zach Bogosian.

9. Hunter Shinkaruk - He's got some good speed and creativity, reminds me a lot of Matt Duchene.

10. Jacob de-la-Rose - Comparable to Patrice Bergeron

11. Kerby Rychel - May not have the size and #1 center but can be an effective two way player.

12. Valeri Nichushkin - He might stay with KHL but this guy is 6'4" 200lbs and can skate like the wind. Some of us witnessed the greatness rush against Germany. This guy lacks consistancy. He could be Evgeni Malkin or Danius Zubrus. I would stay away from drafting him.

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12-30-2012, 02:02 AM
  #373
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I would love to get these players at the draft:

1st round: LW - Jonathan Drouin
2nd round: LW - Anthony Duclair
2nd round: C/LW - Ryan Kujawinski
2nd round: D - Robert Hagg


Imagine Alex Galchenyuk-Jonathan Drouin

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12-30-2012, 05:52 AM
  #374
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Im sorry, but that is just false
Ive trained with Drouin over the summer, kids a tank and has a great work ethic. Yes, he may be small, but hes still growing and you cant teach work ethic which he already has. I have no doubt if Montreal drafts him strength and conditioning will be the least of the worries for Drouin, btw this is the same gym and trainer that trains Letang
My cousin trains there too. He mentionned seeing Letang, Drouin and someone from the Flyers. Giroux, Briere?

Anyway, it is very close between these guys. Drouin, Barkov and Lindholm all bring something different to the table. I just see Drouin as something Montreal doesnt need. Dont get me wong, I wouldnt be upset if Montreal selected him but I just think Barkov or Lindholm would be better for Montreal.

Collberg, Kristo and Gallagher are already all under 6" and skilled. Maybe not as skilled but still.

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12-30-2012, 06:55 AM
  #375
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I've watched every Sweden game since the pre-tournament games and Lindholm has been, by far, their best player. He has everything you look for in a #1 C.

I understand the staying power of Mackinnon/Jones, but it would be hard for me to see him being ranked behind Monahan or Barkov. He can essentially do everything that these two can and has more offensive upside IMO as well as a clearly superior skating ability.

He and Galchenyuk would compliment each other very well, from what I've seen.

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