IIHF World ChampionshipDiscuss International Tournaments like the WJC, Olympics, and World Cup, as they take place, or discuss past tournaments. performances.
Intent to hurt is different from intent to injure. In Canada, we know the difference and expect the games to be called with that in mind, and internationally they rarely are called this way because, quite frankly, refs from some of the nations we play do not understand it.
But think about it...you don't throw a hit to make nice. You throw it to hurt. If the kid keeps his head up, he is hurt, but he is also out the next shift with a new appreciation of Canadian bodychecking, and maybe being a man and looking for a bit of redemption. Because he makes a mistake and refuses to protect himself, he got himself injured.
It seems simple. I think it is for most hockey purists like myself.
^^^ Exactly this.
IIHF is looking like a semi-contact friendly beer league...
He should hit him because he has the puck and it's a body contact sport. Throwing more checks helps you win in the long run that's why your coach tells you to go out and finish your checks.
And if the coach knows you are going to be sent off for it, he better tell you to cool it. The point is to keep it consistent. "Semi-contact" is fine with me.
And if the coach knows you are going to be sent off for it, he better tell you to cool it. The point is to keep it consistent. "Semi-contact" is fine with me.
It may be fine with you, but it isn't hockey.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maybam
I'm just going to go ahead and point out that the point of "check" is supposed to be to separate a player from the puck. Not to "hurt".
Of course it is, but you don't throw a hit at half force and hope it knocks him off the puck. You throw a hit with all your weight and make sure you knock him off the puck.
And if the coach knows you are going to be sent off for it, he better tell you to cool it. The point is to keep it consistent. "Semi-contact" is fine with me.
This is sad. I don't even know how to respond to this.
Check your local arena for youth hockey with a reasonable amount of contact- not too much, wouldn't want you to get rattled.
You hit to hurt- not to injure, but to hurt. To hurt enough that next time you fore check, they cough up the puck and you capitalize. To hurt enough that when they enter your zone, they don't cut across the ice to get a shot in the slot. You hit to hurt, so they don't try long breakaway passes. You keep it clean, but you get in their head and establish fear/doubt so they're off their game.
Semi-contact is meant to rub someone off the puck. That's not high level hockey. That's pond hockey. That's not what I pay to watch.
Funny northamericans have stubbornly debated for years how the iihf refs are fine, first year in forever u dont get special treatment to get away with ur crap and ur whining?
Justice is a wonderful thing
Funny how North Americans have NEVER said that IIHF reffing has been fine. It's a joke year after year.
Nice strawman, lol. Why compare to a different sport all together, when the comparison is actually concerned with the relative style/appeal of the various stages of a specific sport's growth/history?
Pffft. I'm just gonna drop this here as one example among, well, a LOT more, showing how much physicality and "chippiness" was involved along the journey to that Canada Cup gold:
If I say Alexander Ovechkin is not a goal scorer and show a bunch of videos where he does not score. Is that a fair video?
Last edited by The Latvian: 12-29-2012 at 08:19 PM.
Check your local arena for youth hockey with a reasonable amount of contact- not too much, wouldn't want you to get rattled.
You hit to hurt- not to injure, but to hurt. To hurt enough that next time you fore check, they cough up the puck and you capitalize. To hurt enough that when they enter your zone, they don't cut across the ice to get a shot in the slot. You hit to hurt, so they don't try long breakaway passes. You keep it clean, but you get in their head and establish fear/doubt so they're off their game.
Semi-contact is meant to rub someone off the puck. That's not high level hockey. That's pond hockey. That's not what I pay to watch.
maybe you are just a Devils fan and are to used to the trap and you are not used to seeing an actual forecheck?....kidding...I am...Go Devils...
Anyways .....I don't ever see guys coming and skating around someone or simply poke checking without taking the body, and in this case any body contact with speed is gonna hurt the slovak player. He simply left himself dangerously prone.
I would bet almost any coach around the world would want their forechecker closing the distance that quickly and pressuring the defense to make a play like what happened (unless the team is in purely defenesive positioning...i.e. pk, protecting a lead, trapping style team play etc.)
You see this play a hundred times a game and nothing happens because the defensman has his head up and/or anticipates contact so nothing happens. Usually resulting with both players bouncing off eachother or tangled on the boards.
pssst, take a peek at my user name...its what he shoulda done....Like Don Cherry says in Rock em Sock em 3 "take a peek, it doesn't mean your chicken"
Last edited by take a peak: 12-29-2012 at 08:21 PM.
Pffft. I'm just gonna drop this here as one example among, well, a LOT more, showing how much physicality and "chippiness" was involved along the journey to that Canada Cup gold:
Context is everything. The fact is that's the way the game was called and played back then. Both teams were as physical and chippy back then, as you can tell by watching the full games, despite what the selective editing by the person who made the video you posted tries to fool you into believing.
Check your local arena for youth hockey with a reasonable amount of contact- not too much, wouldn't want you to get rattled.
You hit to hurt- not to injure, but to hurt. To hurt enough that next time you fore check, they cough up the puck and you capitalize. To hurt enough that when they enter your zone, they don't cut across the ice to get a shot in the slot. You hit to hurt, so they don't try long breakaway passes. You keep it clean, but you get in their head and establish fear/doubt so they're off their game.
Semi-contact is meant to rub someone off the puck. That's not high level hockey. That's pond hockey. That's not what I pay to watch.
Well said. These are things that people who have never been involved in high-level hockey do not realize.
How would him misspelling words in his head prevent him from getting hurt
uuummmm, say the words in his head?
I was not recommending him to to say anything in his head, I was saying he should do that action, as it get your eyes off the ice and look around.
(not suer wht you tink is spelled wrong...... but I wrote what I meant and my user name is indeed what it is meant to be..... pointing out a spelling mistake your rebuttal is outstanding and I must bow out of this so called discussion..)
One of the best parts of Gretzky's game was understanding the physicality, and developing the elusiveness and awareness required to be that productive despite being the target, physically, of every opposing player. That involves knowing who is on the ice, where you are on the ice, and how little time you have to move the puck against top players.
McSorley, Semenko and McClelland say hi. In fact, 99 was smart enough to insist on Marty coming along for the ride to LA.
McSorley, Semenko and McClelland say hi. In fact, 99 was smart enough to insist on Marty coming along for the ride to LA.
They were there more to ensure no cheap shots or post whistle ******** than to prevent Gretz from ever getting hit. Gretzky was talented enough to avoid getting cranked.
__________________ CanadianHockey________ __ __________Sens, Oilers, and Team Canada
They were there more to ensure no cheap shots or post whistle ******** than to prevent Gretz from ever getting hit. Gretzky was talented enough to avoid getting cranked.
I think that the fact that the most famous hit taken by Gretzky from his Oiler days (by Bill McCreary of all people) resulted in nothing but a few words to the offending player by the Oilers proves this.
The youtube of that hit:
Don't see no Oiler players going after him there.
ETA: McCreary had 4 minutes in penalties in his entire career, so there were no fights later in the game, either.
The only time I was a Devils fan was in 2001-2002, when Larry Robinson coached them. Or whenever they play the Rangers
Quote:
Originally Posted by take a peak
I would bet almost any coach around the world would want their forechecker closing the distance that quickly and pressuring the defense to make a play like what happened (unless the team is in purely defenesive positioning...i.e. pk, protecting a lead, trapping style team play etc.)
You see this play a hundred times a game and nothing happens because the defensman has his head up and/or anticipates contact so nothing happens. Usually resulting with both players bouncing off eachother or tangled on the boards.
But here we are talking KIDS. They don't anticipate, especially not coming from European youth championships.
To Beaker: I'm fine with pro-hockey becoming more like pond hockey. If every forward turns into Datsyuk and every defenseman into Lidstrom, who can take a puck away from you without as much as touching you, hockey will benefit greatly, IMHO.
They were there more to ensure no cheap shots or post whistle ******** than to prevent Gretz from ever getting hit. Gretzky was talented enough to avoid getting cranked.
If you do not believe that those players were a deterrent then we should just stop talking about it. As a guy who was a pr*** when he played hockey, I know I was always much more behaved against teams that had a coule of guys that might send me to the dentist.
The only time I was a Devils fan was in 2001-2002, when Larry Robinson coached them. Or whenever they play the Rangers
But here we are talking KIDS. They don't anticipate, especially not coming from European youth championships.
To Beaker: I'm fine with pro-hockey becoming more like pond hockey. If every forward turns into Datsyuk and every defenseman into Lidstrom, who can take a puck away from you without as much as touching you, hockey will benefit greatly, IMHO.
Yeah gee if only everyone was talented like Datsyuk/Lidstom/et al.
your rebuttal is outstanding and I must bow out of this so called discussion..)
