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Prospect Talk PART V

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Old
12-30-2012, 12:26 PM
  #276
Degeneration Rex
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A little off topic but there is another Strome on the way to the OHL, 15 year old Dylan.
Already taller than Ryan at the same age, will be a top pick in the OHL draft. You
can read about him in the Hockey News, the World Junior preview issue.

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12-30-2012, 12:40 PM
  #277
InformTheMasses
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Well if the Islanders stay true to their history, Dylan will undoubtedly be the 'better' Strome.

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12-30-2012, 01:17 PM
  #278
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
I think you underestimate how hard it is to develop them properly.

Think of the promising young guys we have had. Brought in early, meddled with, coddled or rushed or whatnot. I look at our success with early rounders and then look at Detroit's success with late rounders and see their approach (NO ONE plays early. They are ready or they rot) and then our approach (9 game tryout, meddle with junior/college team, meddle, meddle, meddle) and see one superior developmental philosophy and one with a less than stellar developmental program.

If prospects were chickens, Detroit gets them done every time and NYI makes their fans vomit or move into a water closet. Now....Snow seems to be moving closer to 162* on his chickens......thankfully.

I guess some might miss the friendly toilet seat conversations.

Again, if the choice is rush a promising asset who will pay off dividends if we wait or go with cheap throwaways, I'll take a few fliers on some Bruin farmhands and a few more losses.

That could mean several wins per season gained (rather than a slew of Okposo "maybe one day he'll get it" types) in the coming seasons as a result. That is good, isn't it?
I know you like to bring up Detroit but it doesn't support your argument. They generally haven't handled their best prospects with kid gloves. Most of their top players have made it to the show in 1 or 2 years of post-draft development. Lidstrom, Zetterberg and Datsyuk took two, Fedorov took one, Yzerman took 0. Yzerman was the only one drafted top-5(4th overall), where guys like Strome, Reinhart and Nino went. I know you are going to respond with "Strome isn't Yzerman," but back in '83 I doubt Yzerman was Yzerman. His OHL point totals were actually very similar to Strome's pre-draft point totals(Strome had 15 more points in 9 more games. I know they are different time periods, but the point is Yzerman wasn't exactly Gretzky or even Tavares coming out of Junior Hockey).

If anything this proves that Detroit has drafted better than the Islanders, not that they've been more patient with development.

Either way, if you can find me a worthy 2nd-line stopgap who would sign here for one year, or one we can trade for without giving up anything of significant value(Strome/Nelson/Griff/1st), I'll be all for it. I would just personally rather have a Strome vs Nelson 2013 TC competition than bring in Matt Cullen for one year.

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12-30-2012, 01:21 PM
  #279
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Originally Posted by msv957 View Post
I have no idea why the Isles picked Reinhart over Trouba in last year's draft. Trouba looks to be having a much better and much more noticeable WJC.
I don't think it's too fair to Big Griff to compare the two based on this tournament. Reinhart isn't getting anywhere near the minutes Trouba is getting on Team USA, due to a completely stacked Canadian blue-line. Add in the fact that his role is to be a shut-down defender. I don't necessarily think Spott wants Reinhart jumping up in the play.

I admit that Trouba has looked awesome, and he could very well end up being the better player, but this comparison doesn't really work IMO. Either way, regardless of how Trouba turns out I'm happy with Reinhart. Think he's going to be an NHL beast.

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12-30-2012, 02:37 PM
  #280
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i doubt Miika is considered a 'credible source', but can we just pretend he is an Isles fan, and is posting his opinion?

Over the next month, the Studs and Duds feature will recap various hockey leagues spanning from North America to Europe. This week, we showcase SM-liiga enthusiast, Miika Arponen (@miikaarponen), as he breaks down the latest happenings from Finland.

"One of the best lockout players in the whole league is New York Islanders power forward Jesse Joensuu. 25 years old Joensuu has scored 11 goals and 24 points in 20 games so far and has been very good throughout the season"


he seems to have gone off the fan radar, but might fit in well with us. we need size... and he's 25, which should appease some fans on this board...


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Old
12-30-2012, 02:48 PM
  #281
InformTheMasses
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Joensuu missed the last 5 weeks with an injured hand. He was supposed to be out two months, but just came back this week. Hopefully he can get back to form soon enough.

BTW right before he got injured he was recognized by Sportsnet as a top 30 NHLer overseas. Pretty good company.....
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2012/...europe_malkin/

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Old
12-30-2012, 03:06 PM
  #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blinkman360 View Post
I don't think it's too fair to Big Griff to compare the two based on this tournament. Reinhart isn't getting anywhere near the minutes Trouba is getting on Team USA, due to a completely stacked Canadian blue-line. Add in the fact that his role is to be a shut-down defender. I don't necessarily think Spott wants Reinhart jumping up in the play.

I admit that Trouba has looked awesome, and he could very well end up being the better player, but this comparison doesn't really work IMO. Either way, regardless of how Trouba turns out I'm happy with Reinhart. Think he's going to be an NHL beast.
Completely different players. I'd say Reinhart is much more suited to NHL play than Trouba. Trouba won't be able to play this way in the NHL, against that level of play, not a chance. Ryan Murphy will face similar challenges, as will Morgan Rielly and even Dougie Hamilton.

Reinhart wasn't great today, he got beat a few times both off the rush and along the boards but he was good when he needed to be as well. The US team was pretty good, feisty, fast, they played Canada pretty tough too, just couldn't get enough going offensively.

As good as these guys look against Germany (and the lower teams), you can see how much tougher it is against better teams. Where was Galchenyuk today? Project to the NHL and the reality is, these guys aren't ready for that level of play, they have a ways to go, all of them.

I think Strome played very well, which is great to see.

Drouin looks like a player!


Quote:
Originally Posted by InformTheMasses View Post
Well if the Islanders stay true to their history, Dylan will undoubtedly be the 'better' Strome.
well done!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JumpOceanless View Post
trouba will be the best dman of his draft
Trouba wouldn't even make Team Canada. Let's not fall in love with other prospects on the basis of a WJC game or tournament. He looked good, yes, but I think as an NHL defenseman his game needs to be much different.

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Old
12-30-2012, 03:41 PM
  #283
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Originally Posted by redbull View Post
Completely different players. I'd say Reinhart is much more suited to NHL play than Trouba. Trouba won't be able to play this way in the NHL, against that level of play, not a chance. Ryan Murphy will face similar challenges, as will Morgan Rielly and even Dougie Hamilton.

Reinhart wasn't great today, he got beat a few times both off the rush and along the boards but he was good when he needed to be as well. The US team was pretty good, feisty, fast, they played Canada pretty tough too, just couldn't get enough going offensively.

As good as these guys look against Germany (and the lower teams), you can see how much tougher it is against better teams. Where was Galchenyuk today? Project to the NHL and the reality is, these guys aren't ready for that level of play, they have a ways to go, all of them.

I think Strome played very well, which is great to see.

Drouin looks like a player!




well done!



Trouba wouldn't even make Team Canada. Let's not fall in love with other prospects on the basis of a WJC game or tournament. He looked good, yes, but I think as an NHL defenseman his game needs to be much different.
I don't think Trouba has to change his style one iota. He plays hard, good positional defense, and adds in offensive instincts. I think Trouba suffered through Couturier-itis prior to the draft, so over analyzed, yet before the sexy newcomers came around (Reilly, Reinhart & Dumba), Trouba was always spoken about as the best defenseman available. Trouba is having a great freshman season and a great tournament so far. Most people think he's going to be a stud 2-way defenseman.

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Old
12-30-2012, 03:56 PM
  #284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott99 View Post
I don't think Trouba has to change his style one iota. He plays hard, good positional defense, and adds in offensive instincts. I think Trouba suffered through Couturier-itis prior to the draft, so over analyzed, yet before the sexy newcomers came around (Reilly, Reinhart & Dumba), Trouba was always spoken about as the best defenseman available. Trouba is having a great freshman season and a great tournament so far. Most people think he's going to be a stud 2-way defenseman.
I think it was Ryan Murray. Also, the three guys you mentioned were not "newcomers".

This is 2nd post from Griffs prospect thread (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...d.php?t=792262) written by Renegade Stylings, who knows his WHL stuff, in 2010 :

Quote:
Saw him live tonight. Had to pick my jaw up off the floor a few times. Very impressive total package on this kid. 6'4. Tough. Great skater. Good passer. Hard shot. He fought. Good offensive skills with 16 pts in 32 games this year as a 16 year old. The Oil Kings have a real good player on their hands.

Might be the best 16 year old in the WHL this year. Him and Ryan Murray are likely the top 2 in my mind.


Last edited by kuwo: 12-30-2012 at 04:02 PM.
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Old
12-30-2012, 05:01 PM
  #285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott99 View Post
I don't think Trouba has to change his style one iota. He plays hard, good positional defense, and adds in offensive instincts. I think Trouba suffered through Couturier-itis prior to the draft, so over analyzed, yet before the sexy newcomers came around (Reilly, Reinhart & Dumba), Trouba was always spoken about as the best defenseman available. Trouba is having a great freshman season and a great tournament so far. Most people think he's going to be a stud 2-way defenseman.
I think the development of Luke Schenn scared some teams off of Trouba. For some reason a lot of people compared Trouba to Schenn, saying he had basically zero offensive game. That's turning out to be completely false.

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12-30-2012, 07:14 PM
  #286
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I think the development of Luke Schenn scared some teams off of Trouba. For some reason a lot of people compared Trouba to Schenn, saying he had basically zero offensive game. That's turning out to be completely false.
Haha. You can't compare NHL with the WJC. He has been a good d-man in this tournament, against players who have never been playing together before... Let's wait and see what Trouba can achieve in the NHL.

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Old
12-30-2012, 07:30 PM
  #287
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Happened in the game before USA-CAN. Anybody hear if he is hurt badly?

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Old
12-30-2012, 07:43 PM
  #288
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Pokka returned to the game, luckily it was not anything serious.

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Old
12-30-2012, 08:10 PM
  #289
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This is the first year i have NHL Network & have been able to follow the WJCs.

If this were the Olympics I'd be rooting like crazy for the US to win. But I have a hard time getting patriotic over a bunch of teenagers. Since Canada has 2 of our top prospects & Finland has 1, I'm hoping one of those teams win.

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12-30-2012, 09:02 PM
  #290
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If you haven't watched the Chris King interview with Weight on islanders website I recommend it. You can get a sense of the organizations view on some of our guys. Totally unbiased of course .Very cool interview and a great guy. He is just as much a fan as we are.

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12-30-2012, 09:18 PM
  #291
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I'm rooting for Canada for the same reason. The USA, I only know about 4 or 5 names, while the Canadian team has more well-known junior names. And as much as you heard about RNH-Huberdeau-Rielly going into the tournament, the key guys have been RNH and Ryan Strome, getting all the mentions. When we drafted Strome in 2011, we had missed out on Larsson, we were debating who was the best pick left, Dougie Hamilton, Strome, Couturier; some were hot for Ryan Murphy. Last year, many thought picking Strome turned out to be a mistake, especially with the year Hamilton had in the OHL, and the playoffs Couturier had with the Flyers. The Isles pick is looking excellent now.

Also, in 2012, 2nd round, Pokke was off the radar, but he's a key top-2 for Finland. Griffin Reinhart, exactly the type of player we needed, not distinguishing himself like the other two Isles picks in the World Juniors, but at least having a decent tournament.

The World Juniors so far is one that Isles fans can be happy about.

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12-31-2012, 10:26 AM
  #292
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If you haven't watched the Chris King interview with Weight on islanders website I recommend it. You can get a sense of the organizations view on some of our guys. Totally unbiased of course .Very cool interview and a great guy. He is just as much a fan as we are.
Wow Cappy has lost a ton of weight (not Doug). He is a thin man now. No more fat Jack jokes.

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12-31-2012, 12:50 PM
  #293
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Strome won four(maybe three?) straight defensive zone face offs in the last minute of the game today.

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12-31-2012, 12:52 PM
  #294
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Haha. You can't compare NHL with the WJC. He has been a good d-man in this tournament, against players who have never been playing together before... Let's wait and see what Trouba can achieve in the NHL.
I don't think it matters what level he's doing it at. You can clearly see the offensive instincts are there, even if he wasn't putting up any points. Schenn was never that kind of player, even in the WHL.

I don't get the anti-Trouba stuff. If Reinhart were putting up these points everyone would be going nuts around here. I don't think it's fair to dismiss what Trouba's doing as "it's only at the Junior level playing against kids who've never played together before." It's impressive, any way you look at it.

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12-31-2012, 12:55 PM
  #295
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I don't think it matters what level he's doing it at. You can clearly see the offensive instincts are there, even if he wasn't putting up any points. Schenn was never that kind of player, even in the WHL.

I don't get the anti-Trouba stuff. If Reinhart were putting up these points everyone would be going nuts around here. I don't think it's fair to dismiss what Trouba's doing as "it's only at the Junior level playing against kids who've never played together before." It's impressive, any way you look at it.
I doesn't matter what he is doing. He isn't our player.

Happy new year, folks.

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12-31-2012, 01:07 PM
  #296
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I don't think it matters what level he's doing it at. You can clearly see the offensive instincts are there, even if he wasn't putting up any points. Schenn was never that kind of player, even in the WHL.

I don't get the anti-Trouba stuff. If Reinhart were putting up these points everyone would be going nuts around here. I don't think it's fair to dismiss what Trouba's doing as "it's only at the Junior level playing against kids who've never played together before." It's impressive, any way you look at it.
Agreed, especially impressive no matter where he's doing it. He's playing great in college, he's playing great in the WJHC's. Also, Schenn never had the all around abilities of Trouba.

Strome fell from 2nd to a tie for 3rd w/Schiefele in points in the tournament by being shut out today. He is STILL tied for the goal scoring lead in the tournament, with 4 goals, tied with :Shiefele, Arvidsson, and you guessed it, JACOB TROUBA !

Huberdeau and Galchenyuk jumped ahead of Strome now, they each have 7 points. RNH is being very Gretzky like, he has more assists than anyone else has points, what a ridiculous offensive talent.


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12-31-2012, 01:18 PM
  #297
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Strome won four(maybe three?) straight defensive zone face offs in the last minute of the game today.
Under-rated aspect of his game.

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12-31-2012, 01:28 PM
  #298
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Under-rated aspect of his game.
That might be the most impressive thing I've seen so far from him. He's won pretty much every faceoff I've seen him take. Aside from the penalties(one of which was weak and the other seemed like a bit of bad luck), he's been impressive overall in this tournament so far.

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12-31-2012, 01:31 PM
  #299
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Huberdeau and Galchenyuk jumped ahead of Strome now, they each have 7 points. RNH is being very Gretzky like, he has more assists than anyone else has points, what a ridiculous offensive talent.
He's very Gretzky-like (except not in the same planet in terms of the level of output) - but he's so impressive against same-age juniors, clearly the best player on the ice in every game I've seen. Not even close.

Huberdeau's been very unimpressive though, despite the points.

I think Strome, given the relatively low minutes and limited PP time has been very productive and impressive out there. Not because I'm an Isles fan but he's been better this tournament than I expected and better than I've seen him play since he was drafted.

I've maintained for a long time that Strome isn't NHL-ready and I still believe that - but in THIS TOURNAMENT, he's proving to be "more ready" than I thought/expected. The next level is a big jump, let's see how camp goes if they settle the lockout!!

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12-31-2012, 02:01 PM
  #300
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Strome won four(maybe three?) straight defensive zone face offs in the last minute of the game today.
And a lot of people on these boards think he should be a winger.

Everything about Strome's game says centerman. Even more so to the point: every international tournament, this one included, natural centermen are shifted to the wing when put on his line. He posses the vision, developing all-around game, faceoff ability, and all necessary traits of a ceterman.

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