HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

More Luongo Talk

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-30-2012, 07:14 PM
  #651
kthsn
Registered User
 
kthsn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,727
vCash: 1785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
Which teams would be interested? Which teams need a goalie and have cap space + actual dollars to trade for Luongo?
The most obvious one would be Florida or have you missed the Tallon asking ownership about Luongo's contract?

kthsn is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 07:41 PM
  #652
SufferingCatFan
Registered User
 
SufferingCatFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: fort lauderdale
Country: United States
Posts: 1,810
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverback91 View Post
Lol look up canucks don't have to use the amnesty on anyone. If they hold on to both goalies and no one takes Ballard for even a 7th worst case scenario is amnesty him to get under

Hell it would be better to dump lou off for a 7th than amnesty him too as it saves the owner money! But keep dreaming about Lou having n the amnesty clause used on him
Respectfully, I did look it up on capgeek. In 2013-14, the Nucks with 13 signed players will have a $55 million cap hit. At the proposed $60 million cap in the current NHL proposal, that will leave $5 million to sign 10 players. Yes, the Nucks could amnesty Ballard to create another $4.5 million, but then they will only have $9.5 million to sign 3 defenders, and 6-7 forwards.

I suspect that a more rational plan would be to amnesty Lou and try to trade either Booth or Ballard and possibly both.

In any event, the Nucks are not alone. Under the old CBA, the Nucks and a number of other teams were in reasonable shape. Now, the teams that dumped salary are looking better positioned under the new CBA.

SufferingCatFan is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 08:30 PM
  #653
blankall
Registered User
 
blankall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 5,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Respectfully, I did look it up on capgeek. In 2013-14, the Nucks with 13 signed players will have a $55 million cap hit. At the proposed $60 million cap in the current NHL proposal, that will leave $5 million to sign 10 players. Yes, the Nucks could amnesty Ballard to create another $4.5 million, but then they will only have $9.5 million to sign 3 defenders, and 6-7 forwards.

I suspect that a more rational plan would be to amnesty Lou and try to trade either Booth or Ballard and possibly both.

In any event, the Nucks are not alone. Under the old CBA, the Nucks and a number of other teams were in reasonable shape. Now, the teams that dumped salary are looking better positioned under the new CBA.
The cap won't drop to 60 million right away. It'll take a couple of years.

Something like 65 for the 2013/2014 and then 60 for the 2014/2015 season is a worst case scenario.

Agreed that the Canucks are not in great cap shape, but hardly as bad as your scenario makes it out to be.

blankall is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 08:56 PM
  #654
Zonk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 197
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall View Post
The cap won't drop to 60 million right away. It'll take a couple of years.

Something like 65 for the 2013/2014 and then 60 for the 2014/2015 season is a worst case scenario.

Agreed that the Canucks are not in great cap shape, but hardly as bad as your scenario makes it out to be.
My understanding is that the cap will drop to $60 million for 2013-14.

As indicated in the earlier post, the Canucks will have roughly $5 million to sign 10 players before the amnesty of one buyout. Keeping Luongo is a viable option for this year, but not for next.

Zonk is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 09:02 PM
  #655
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,102
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Respectfully, I did look it up on capgeek. In 2013-14, the Nucks with 13 signed players will have a $55 million cap hit. At the proposed $60 million cap in the current NHL proposal, that will leave $5 million to sign 10 players. Yes, the Nucks could amnesty Ballard to create another $4.5 million, but then they will only have $9.5 million to sign 3 defenders, and 6-7 forwards.

I suspect that a more rational plan would be to amnesty Lou and try to trade either Booth or Ballard and possibly both.

In any event, the Nucks are not alone. Under the old CBA, the Nucks and a number of other teams were in reasonable shape. Now, the teams that dumped salary are looking better positioned under the new CBA.
If we traded Lui, (most likely outcome) that gives us another 5.3 mil, with only Edler to get a raise, and only 4th liners to sign. We will be fine, despite the Mayan's prophecy the world will not end.

racerjoe is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 09:12 PM
  #656
SufferingCatFan
Registered User
 
SufferingCatFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: fort lauderdale
Country: United States
Posts: 1,810
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by racerjoe View Post
If we traded Lui, (most likely outcome) that gives us another 5.3 mil, with only Edler to get a raise, and only 4th liners to sign. We will be fine, despite the Mayan's prophecy the world will not end.
Regardless of whether Lou is traded or cut, it still only leaves the Nucks with around $10 million to sign 11 players in 2013-14 (assuming a $60 million cap, which may or may not end up being the number). That is an average of less than $800,000 per player to sign or resign 7 forwards, 3 defenders and 1 back-up goalie.How does that equate to being "fine?"

SufferingCatFan is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 09:22 PM
  #657
kthsn
Registered User
 
kthsn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,727
vCash: 1785
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
How does that equate to being "fine?"
As an armchair GM I can pull this roster off, I'm sure a professional like Gillis could do better.

FORWARDS
Daniel Sedin ($6.100m) / Henrik Sedin ($6.100m) / Alexandre Burrows ($4.500m)
David Booth ($4.250m) / Ryan Kesler ($5.000m) / Zack Kassian ($0.870m)
Nicklas Jensen ($0.894m) / Jordan Schroeder ($1.025m) / Jannik Hansen ($1.350m)
Aaron Volpatti ($0.600m) / Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Dale Weise ($0.615m)
Andrew Ebbett ($0.600m) /

DEFENSEMEN
Jason Garrison ($4.600m) / Kevin Bieksa ($4.600m)
Dan Hamhuis ($4.500m) / Chris Tanev ($0.900m)
Alexander Edler ($5.250m) / #6 ($1.00M)
Derek Joslin ($0.700m)

GOALTENDERS
Cory Schneider ($4.000m)
Eddie Lack ($0.750m)

CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $220,833

Luongo + Ballard are traded/amnestied.

kthsn is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 09:22 PM
  #658
Ched Brosky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,873
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Regardless of whether Lou is traded or cut, it still only leaves the Nucks with around $10 million to sign 11 players in 2013-14 (assuming a $60 million cap, which may or may not end up being the number). That is an average of less than $800,000 per player to sign or resign 7 forwards, 3 defenders and 1 back-up goalie.How does that equate to being "fine?"
I showed u a complete roster the canucks could run with that is competitive that still has luongo on the team and Schneider that fits right at the 60M mark

Granted its a 20 man roster I'm sure gillis and gillman can find ways around calling players up and remaining under the cap when injuries occur

Not to mention we move Lou lack makes 700k which leaves 4.6M to upgrade. Use 600k for an extra player case of short term injury that leaves 4M to upgrade. Hell take 1.8M out to have a 23 man roster that leaves us with 2.8M to upgrade on top of what the player being upgraded on already makes

Even with me showing u exactly how the canucks can manage to get under the 60M cap u seem to ignore it and keep talking about how it doesn't seem likely they could


Last edited by Ched Brosky: 12-30-2012 at 09:32 PM.
Ched Brosky is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 01:12 AM
  #659
WeridAl
YuckaFlux
 
WeridAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 10ft of Snow
Posts: 1,749
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by racerjoe View Post
All of these teams have been reported as intested, with TO and EDM making serious offers (don't know what that means). FLA cleared taking on his contract as well. It was reported CHI offered Bolland +, so as you can see buying out Luongo would make no sense what so ever.

Plus with the Buyout option it means Vancouver can now take on another terrible contract, so his value may actually go up.
Did I miss something, when has it been reported that Edmonton had made a serious offer for Luongo.
Someone's pipe dream if you ask me (Stauffer's) and with Dubnyck's performance at the Spengler Cup I think the Oilers worries about their goalkeeping is a lot less. If I was a Canucks fan I would be worry about Cory Schneider, didn't look the best against Canada.

WeridAl is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 01:34 AM
  #660
Ched Brosky
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,873
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeridAl View Post
Did I miss something, when has it been reported that Edmonton had made a serious offer for Luongo.
Someone's pipe dream if you ask me (Stauffer's) and with Dubnyck's performance at the Spengler Cup I think the Oilers worries about their goalkeeping is a lot less. If I was a Canucks fan I would be worry about Cory Schneider, didn't look the best against Canada.
Yes because one game makes a huge difference! Cory is playing for the worst team in the league and is averaging a .920+ sv % and a below 2.75 gaa their best player besides him was Richard park until they signed duchene for 22 days

Ched Brosky is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 01:59 AM
  #661
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,102
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeridAl View Post
Did I miss something, when has it been reported that Edmonton had made a serious offer for Luongo.
Someone's pipe dream if you ask me (Stauffer's) and with Dubnyck's performance at the Spengler Cup I think the Oilers worries about their goalkeeping is a lot less. If I was a Canucks fan I would be worry about Cory Schneider, didn't look the best against Canada.
It was reported they made an offer that then sparked the leafs to make a counter. I have no idea what was offered. This is what then seemingly caused (I say this, because it was right after the report of the leafs counter) the leafs to make a deal with the Nucks according to the sportsnet guys.

racerjoe is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 02:17 AM
  #662
WeridAl
YuckaFlux
 
WeridAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 10ft of Snow
Posts: 1,749
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by racerjoe View Post
It was reported they made an offer that then sparked the leafs to make a counter. I have no idea what was offered. This is what then seemingly caused (I say this, because it was right after the report of the leafs counter) the leafs to make a deal with the Nucks according to the sportsnet guys.
Who reported it, or was it a bunch of wishful thinking. Anyone with half a brain would know neither team would do a trade involving Luongo. Vancouver wouldn't do it. because Luongo could hurt them in the playoffs, and the Oilers wouldn't do it because of the cost and that crazy contract of Luongo's.

That brain fart Stauffer at onetime started a buzz about a WOW-trade and everyone assumed it dealt with Luongo. If anything it's all be hearsay by the media.

WeridAl is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 02:27 AM
  #663
WeridAl
YuckaFlux
 
WeridAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 10ft of Snow
Posts: 1,749
vCash: 500
deleted


Last edited by WeridAl: 12-31-2012 at 05:53 AM. Reason: received wrong information
WeridAl is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 02:50 AM
  #664
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,102
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeridAl View Post
Who reported it, or was it a bunch of wishful thinking. Anyone with half a brain would know neither team would do a trade involving Luongo. Vancouver wouldn't do it. because Luongo could hurt them in the playoffs, and the Oilers wouldn't do it because of the cost and that crazy contract of Luongo's.

That brain fart Stauffer at onetime started a buzz about a WOW-trade and everyone assumed it dealt with Luongo. If anything it's all be hearsay by the media.
look through the threads. I am not doing your homework for you. Gillis, has actually said he would trade with anyone, as long as it made us better.

It was not the wow trade thing either, it was after that, about a day before the lockout. Or at least that is when it was leaked, and it was more leaked that the leafs were countering because of the EDM offer. Then Sportsnet jumped in about the deal being done with TO.

Anyone with half a brain would know, that as rare as inter division trades still happen right Kessel and Kaberle.

racerjoe is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 02:57 AM
  #665
WeridAl
YuckaFlux
 
WeridAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 10ft of Snow
Posts: 1,749
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by racerjoe View Post
look through the threads. I am not doing your homework for you. Gillis, has actually said he would trade with anyone, as long as it made us better.

It was not the wow trade thing either, it was after that, about a day before the lockout. Or at least that is when it was leaked, and it was more leaked that the leafs were countering because of the EDM offer. Then Sportsnet jumped in about the deal being done with TO.

Anyone with half a brain would know, that as rare as inter division trades still happen right Kessel and Kaberle.
If it was leaked just before the lockout, it wouldn't make any sense, because the Oilers had signed Dubnyck to a contract. Sounds like the TO media trying to create a story.

WeridAl is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 03:01 AM
  #666
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,102
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeridAl View Post
If it was leaked just before the lockout, it wouldn't make any sense, because the Oilers had signed Dubnyck to a contract. Sounds like the TO media trying to create a story.
Believe whatever you want to believe. Justify what ever you want.

racerjoe is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 03:16 AM
  #667
capitalsrock
Registered User
 
capitalsrock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Country: United States
Posts: 1,890
vCash: 500
Van:

Luongo
Edler
Schroeder


Edm:

Eberle/Yakupov+

How about it?

capitalsrock is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 04:50 AM
  #668
Lonny Bohonos
Kassian = P.A.G.A.N
 
Lonny Bohonos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Country: United Nations
Posts: 8,024
vCash: 500


And this is why I dont bother with these threads.


Quote:
Originally Posted by WeridAl View Post
He looked pretty lost against Canada and Fribourg is currently in 1st place in the Swiss League.

http://www.sportstats.com/hockey/swi...ain/standings/

Lonny Bohonos is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 05:52 AM
  #669
WeridAl
YuckaFlux
 
WeridAl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 10ft of Snow
Posts: 1,749
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonny Bohonos View Post


And this is why I dont bother with these threads.
My mistake, read a piece in a news article and they had the wrong, should of check,


Last edited by WeridAl: 12-31-2012 at 06:05 AM.
WeridAl is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 07:44 AM
  #670
SufferingCatFan
Registered User
 
SufferingCatFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: fort lauderdale
Country: United States
Posts: 1,810
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverback91 View Post
I showed u a complete roster the canucks could run with that is competitive that still has luongo on the team and Schneider that fits right at the 60M mark

Granted its a 20 man roster I'm sure gillis and gillman can find ways around calling players up and remaining under the cap when injuries occur

Not to mention we move Lou lack makes 700k which leaves 4.6M to upgrade. Use 600k for an extra player case of short term injury that leaves 4M to upgrade. Hell take 1.8M out to have a 23 man roster that leaves us with 2.8M to upgrade on top of what the player being upgraded on already makes

Even with me showing u exactly how the canucks can manage to get under the 60M cap u seem to ignore it and keep talking about how it doesn't seem likely they could
Actually, you showed me a 20 man roster after you manufactured a fictional trade of Ballard for a 3rd rounder. In a $60 million dollar cap world, I doubt that any team would trade a 3rd in order to take on Ballard's $4.5 million contract, but you could amnesty him so the Nucks can enjoy the benefit of tying up about 10% of their cap space paying a second string goalie to sit on the bench.

SufferingCatFan is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 07:58 AM
  #671
Liferleafer
RIP Mrs Doubtfire
 
Liferleafer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 9,397
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAFS FAN 4 EVER View Post
Just read on The Hockey News Mobile App where they mention an article from Ben Kuzma of the Vancouver Province where he says if the Canucks want to trade Luongo to Toronto then they should ask for Tyler Bozak and Cody Franson in return. His reason is help until Ryan Kesler returns which is the reason for Bozak and extra insurance if Alex Edler and Jason Garrison get hurt.
Bozak and Franson for Luongo?? As much as i don't want to aquire Lu in a shortened season......can't pass that up!!!

Liferleafer is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 08:39 AM
  #672
Bleach Clean
Registered User
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 15,333
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Actually, you showed me a 20 man roster after you manufactured a fictional trade of Ballard for a 3rd rounder. In a $60 million dollar cap world, I doubt that any team would trade a 3rd in order to take on Ballard's $4.5 million contract, but you could amnesty him so the Nucks can enjoy the benefit of tying up about 10% of their cap space paying a second string goalie to sit on the bench.


Can you comment on kthsn's 22-man roster above? He still has more quality in the depth than I think is necessary. He's also giving Edler more than I think he will get (5m per max). Lastly, it doesn't maximize LTIR which the Canucks have been known to do for years now to make their rosters better than the cap would otherwise allow.


From a team building perspective, Malhotra and Raymond are expected to walk to FA after this year. Luongo is expected to be traded during the year, leaving Ballard as the only remaining player. And if Ballard cannot be traded without taking salary back, the Canucks can always waive him and eat the salary in the minors... but I doubt he ever gets there. There are options.


Any substantial room over 60m, only allows them to keep Higgins where otherwise they could not have. Still a very good team IMO.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 08:42 AM
  #673
Pepper
Registered User
 
Pepper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,412
vCash: 500
There's so much wishful thinking here. Ballard and/or Luongo traded without having to take any salary back?

Ballard for 3rd rounder? Not seeing that happening.

Also lot of people confusing "reported" and "rumored".

Pepper is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 08:53 AM
  #674
Coolburn
Registered User
 
Coolburn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: South Florida
Country: Hungary
Posts: 7,781
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Coolburn Send a message via MSN to Coolburn Send a message via Yahoo to Coolburn
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Can you comment on kthsn's 22-man roster above? He still has more quality in the depth than I think is necessary. He's also giving Edler more than I think he will get (5m per max). Lastly, it doesn't maximize LTIR which the Canucks have been known to do for years now to make their rosters better than the cap would otherwise allow.


From a team building perspective, Malhotra and Raymond are expected to walk to FA after this year. Luongo is expected to be traded during the year, leaving Ballard as the only remaining player. And if Ballard cannot be traded without taking salary back, the Canucks can always waive him and eat the salary in the minors... but I doubt he ever gets there. There are options.


Any substantial room over 60m, only allows them to keep Higgins where otherwise they could not have. Still a very good team IMO.
Actually there is a provision in the currently proposed CBA that players in another professional league (including AHL) would still count against the cap but not against the players share. That would eliminate that option from the Canucks.

That said, one option for the Canucks could be, without actually taking a salary back, would be to trade Ballard while keeping a portion of his cap hit. That may make it palatable for a team to trade for him. There will be a few teams that will need to reach the cap floor and if the the new proposal goes thru, teams that previously used rookie bonuses to reach the floor will no longer be able too. One such team is the Islanders but I think there may be others. If the Canucks absorb say $1 million of his cap hit, he becomes more valuable and easier to trade.

If the Canucks absorbed any of Luongo's salary, that would also make him easier to move for a salary conscious team (like the Panthers). But then it may make it difficult for them to get under the $60M threshold next season so not sure that even works for them.
Quote:
- Money paid (above a defined threshold) to Players on NHL SPCs in another professional league (e.g., the AHL or a European league) will be charged against the NHL team's Cap, but not against the Players' Share.

- Ability for Clubs to retain/allocate Salary and Cap Charges in the context of Player Trades within specified parameters.

- Flexibility-related adjustments to Payroll Range System, including (in addition to Salary/Cap Charge allocation in Player trades):
1. Lower Limit obligation without performance bonuses;
Source: http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=412383

Coolburn is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 08:53 AM
  #675
Bleach Clean
Registered User
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 15,333
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAFS FAN 4 EVER View Post
Just read on The Hockey News Mobile App where they mention an article from Ben Kuzma of the Vancouver Province where he says if the Canucks want to trade Luongo to Toronto then they should ask for Tyler Bozak and Cody Franson in return. His reason is help until Ryan Kesler returns which is the reason for Bozak and extra insurance if Alex Edler and Jason Garrison get hurt.



I believe Kuzma has said this before, can't remember where. In any event, he's wrong in his assertion. Kesler was expected to be out half the year, but then with the lockout, it has allowed him the time to recover without needing a fill-in. If the play again soon, how much longer could he be out? This puts the Bozak inquiries in doubt IMO.


Do they really need him anymore? They have Schroeder in-house, so why not just run him with Lapierre taking the 3rd line C spot, followed by Malhotra as the 4C? This should tide them over for enough time that it takes Kesler to come back. So interest in Bozak should be dwindling.


There's no room for Franson either.


The larger interest should be in futures. The Canucks couldn't sustain anything else beyond this year anyways, with the cap crunch looming.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:51 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.