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The Lockout Thread: Good Things Come To Those Who Wait

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Old
12-20-2012, 04:55 PM
  #926
HisIceness
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So regarding todays announcement, if nothing gets done before MLK day, season is probably going to be cancelled yes?

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12-20-2012, 06:01 PM
  #927
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I've tried my best to not give in to sensationalism, but honestly, given how far the sides are apart, if we lose a season I will find it very hard to come back.

It's infuriating. Neither side wants to work together in negotiation: they just want to screw the other side as much as possible.

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12-20-2012, 07:51 PM
  #928
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HisIceness View Post
So regarding todays announcement, if nothing gets done before MLK day, season is probably going to be cancelled yes?
Games are cancelled to the 14th of January. If an agreement is not made by then, that is the deadline date for cancelling the whole season.

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12-21-2012, 08:12 PM
  #929
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I feel like there is something missing from my life. Something that should be there but it isn't. I would like nothing more than to watch a live Canes game right now but that isn't possible. I've tried NFL, NCAA sports, NBA, etc. They just don't do it for me. I have no interest. It's 9:11 on a Saturday night I should be watching hockey dammit!

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12-23-2012, 06:37 PM
  #930
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Can anyone explain what is going on?

The NHLPA has filed a "disclaimer of interest", and the NHL has responded by taking them to court.

I don't know what these mean, but they sound like they will take time we don't have.

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12-23-2012, 07:55 PM
  #931
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Originally Posted by Plan The Parade View Post
Can anyone explain what is going on?

The NHLPA has filed a "disclaimer of interest", and the NHL has responded by taking them to court.

I don't know what these mean, but they sound like they will take time we don't have.
This should help:

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=411804

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12-23-2012, 09:30 PM
  #932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Plan The Parade View Post
Can anyone explain what is going on?

The NHLPA has filed a "disclaimer of interest", and the NHL has responded by taking them to court.

I don't know what these mean, but they sound like they will take time we don't have.
In all honesty, the stage we're at right now isn't worth your time and attention. Nobody's doing anything meaningful till January, and the court actions are just brinksmanship leading up to the real action in a couple of weeks.

Do the same thing Fehr and Bettman are doing; enjoy your holidays and think about this crap after the New Year.

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12-24-2012, 08:15 AM
  #933
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We've got 8.5 months to worry about everything besides hockey.

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12-27-2012, 01:44 AM
  #934
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and the NHL wonders why it's a bottom feeder league with TV dollars and attendance...

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12-27-2012, 01:45 AM
  #935
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I really would like the next game played that every fan would get to their seats, stand up, turn around and refuse to watch the 1st period

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12-27-2012, 08:26 AM
  #936
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It would be more meaningful if no one showed up...at all.

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12-27-2012, 07:39 PM
  #937
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Personally i am enjoying the owners standing firm against that cockaroach fehr--stupid players for enlisting this *****--i hope they enjoy their unpaid year!

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12-27-2012, 11:34 PM
  #938
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Originally Posted by snakepliskin View Post
Personally i am enjoying the owners standing firm against that cockaroach fehr--stupid players for enlisting this *****--i hope they enjoy their unpaid year!
this

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Old
12-28-2012, 09:51 AM
  #939
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As if the owners weren't responsible for this mess as well...

Also, Fehr's strategy may be deplorable, but it's working. The NHL has, time and time again, budged from their "final" offer. If you can get the other side to negotiate against themselves, there's no reason not to. It doesn't do much to help the players in the present, but if the new CBA is 10 years (as expected) then it'll help them in the long run to wait the owners out.


Last edited by Blueline Bomber: 12-28-2012 at 10:04 AM.
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12-28-2012, 03:50 PM
  #940
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I think the players/owners are underestimating the long term damage this whole debacle is doing to future HRR. I've already cashed out my season tickets. I'm sure I'm not the only one. When it is all said and done, both sides are going to regret this and there will be no "winner."

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12-28-2012, 05:31 PM
  #941
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@NYP_Brooksie: Talk within NHL of flipping Winnipeg and Columbus for this year only pending future realignment...

The Jack Johnson saga continues...

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12-28-2012, 05:44 PM
  #942
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perfect. It gets a reasonable division with a worse team in the SE (no offense Jackets fans), and gives me reason to actually like the Jets now that they're no longer division opponents (no offense Guerzy and other Jets fans). Also it makes the travel distances a LOT more reasonable.

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12-28-2012, 09:25 PM
  #943
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It makes way too much sense so it'll never happen.

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12-29-2012, 10:46 AM
  #944
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
Also, Fehr's strategy may be deplorable, but it's working.
Working at doing what? Gaining tiny "concessions" which are just adjustments to how much this will hurt the PA, at the cost of a billion dollars of revenue and irreparable damage to the industry? That's what he wants to do?

Quote:
The NHL has, time and time again, budged from their "final" offer. If you can get the other side to negotiate against themselves, there's no reason not to.
Of course there's a reason not to, when there's an $800m price tag attached to tiny, nearly-irrelevant shifts in stance. 5% variance on contracts, one amnesty buyout per team and an extra year's contract maximum for re-signed players is worth the current situation? When they don't even affect the majority of players at all?

What have the players actually gained in all of this? Nothing but some easy throwaways regarding medical treatment and hotel rooms.

Quote:
It doesn't do much to help the players in the present, but if the new CBA is 10 years (as expected) then it'll help them in the long run to wait the owners out.
Except Fehr is the one pushing for a shorter CBA. If he gets his way, these small "concessions" are going to be even less significant.

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12-29-2012, 02:39 PM
  #945
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Originally Posted by tarheelhockey View Post
Working at doing what? Gaining tiny "concessions" which are just adjustments to how much this will hurt the PA, at the cost of a billion dollars of revenue and irreparable damage to the industry? That's what he wants to do?
Fehr's job is to get the best deal for the players in this new CBA. By waiting, he's doing that. Yes, it's costing them money now, but it's helping the players situation with regards to this new CBA.

I don't understand how people can claim the players should just accept whatever new proposal the NHL throws at them simply because "they're losing money now".

Yes, they're losing money now. And they're attempting to make sure they don't lose money in the future as well. By accepting a deal that's less than favorable, they would be doing just that.

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12-29-2012, 11:34 PM
  #946
tarheelhockey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
Fehr's job is to get the best deal for the players in this new CBA. By waiting, he's doing that.
His job is a lot bigger than that. He's the Executive Director of the PA. Negotiating the CBA is his top priority right now, but his greater responsibility is to protect the interests of the players in the bigger picture. Small budges on the fringes of the CBA are not worth the damage done to the players' earning potential. It's that simple. This process has cost them more than it has gained.


Quote:
Yes, it's costing them money now, but it's helping the players situation with regards to this new CBA.
Which players, the ones with 6-7 year contracts with huge year-to-year variance? That's, what, like 15 guys in the whole league?

Quote:
I don't understand how people can claim the players should just accept whatever new proposal the NHL throws at them simply because "they're losing money now".
Can't help you there, as that's not what I said.

My point is that Fehr doesn't get a gold star for extracting a few tiny drops of blood from the owners at the cost of a gallon from the PA. His strategy stopped making financial sense a long time ago, and it would take a HUGE win in this final round of talks for him to get the players back to neutral ground. Huge as in, a massive influx of cash to offset their reduced immediate and future earnings. If they cancel the season, forget it. No realistic agreement could offset that damage, in either the short or long term.

At this point there's a lot of face-saving going on. Both sides lost.

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12-30-2012, 08:44 AM
  #947
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Originally Posted by tarheelhockey View Post
At this point there's a lot of face-saving going on. Both sides lost.
Exactly. With a 48 game season, if EVERY SINGLE FAN returned, the $3.3 billion in HRR would only be $1.9 billion. Split 50/50, that's $950 million for the players (instead of $1.65 billion).

The lost games have cost the players $700 million. Money they'll never see again.

We all know that it will take MANY years for revenue to return to the level it was pre-lockout.

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12-31-2012, 08:08 AM
  #948
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Both sides are losers here both financially and in public image and they know it. At this point the players side is just trying to reverse the trend of being bent over by the owners every time a CBA expires and the owners are trying to protect their ability to do exactly that.

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12-31-2012, 08:16 AM
  #949
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But the players did anything BUT get bent over the last two times there's been a new CBA. The first lockout resulted in players making 2/3rds of all HRR, which led to the second lockout. That one led to a cap, record revenues, and the lowest entry level salary becoming the highest of the 4 major NA sports. Now I'm not saying that Fehr should have just let the owners run roughshod over the players in this new one obviously, but he's been obstructionist at best and has been using stall tactics since day one of his position as PA head. For something that should have been done by Thanksgiving if both sides had the intention of actually cooperating and negotiating in good faith, we're pushing MLK day. And given Fehr's history with the MLBPA and the tactics he's used here I have to conclude that he's the biggest problem here much as Jacobs is the biggest problem on the NHL side of things.

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Old
12-31-2012, 09:16 AM
  #950
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Owners seem to understand that the business they are operating isn't a successful one (18 out of 30 teams need to make the playoffs to make money), and are trying to rectify that with this CBA. Players, on the other hand, seem to think they are playing the most popular professional sport in the world and thus should be signing a CBA that is in accordance with that belief. The sooner the players realize they are a "niche" sport, the sooner this will all get settled.

And I love hockey. Always have. But there's a reason it doesn't have a TV deal. It's just not popular enough.

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