HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > International Tournaments
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

Roster Talk '13 — Finland

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-31-2012, 10:16 AM
  #701
FiLe
Mr. Know-It-Nothing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Finland
Posts: 2,925
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by behemolari View Post
no way youre not saying theyre locked out to their "professional teams" next year. not gonna happen, they will stick in FEL
Yes way. Both have a very high chance to end up at least in the AHL. If they do, it'll be a crapshoot whether they get released or not.

Should they stay in SM-liiga (which is of course also possible), then they're of course locks.

FiLe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 10:16 AM
  #702
heksagon
Registered User
 
heksagon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Finland
Country: Tokelau
Posts: 922
vCash: 500
I really wish the Finnish ice hockey federation would take this tournament seriously and give the U-20 team a proven winning coach. If Helminen is the head coach next year I just don't know what to say.

heksagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 10:16 AM
  #703
Monaakko
Registered User
 
Monaakko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Finland
Country: Finland
Posts: 75
vCash: 500
I don't think this team was that weak, certainly it looked that way against the czech and from time to time against sweden, but when they actually started playing hard they won puck battles and got to the net. Unfortunately they only played this way when trailing, so I wonder if that is a coaching choice or just the players themselves. What was more disturbing to me though was getting to loose pucks, which could indicate poor skating, but while they certainly weren't as good skaters as the swedes on average it didn't look that bad to me. I think it mostly was about lack of support and poor positioning. I don't remember how many times the swedes entered our zone and the d-man (was really impressed by how well Ristolainen did this) took the body just for another swede to grab the loose puck.

Monaakko is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 10:20 AM
  #704
SPMaximus
Re-sign=/=Resign
 
SPMaximus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,320
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by heksagon View Post
I really wish the Finnish ice hockey federation would take this tournament seriously and give the U-20 team a proven winning coach. If Helminen is the head coach next year I just don't know what to say.
you could always go to their headquarters and protest




SPMaximus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 10:22 AM
  #705
behemolari
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 885
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monaakko View Post
I don't think this team was that weak, certainly it looked that way against the czech and from time to time against sweden, but when they actually started playing hard they won puck battles and got to the net. Unfortunately they only played this way when trailing, so I wonder if that is a coaching choice or just the players themselves. What was more disturbing to me though was getting to loose pucks, which could indicate poor skating, but while they certainly weren't as good skaters as the swedes on average it didn't look that bad to me. I think it mostly was about lack of support and poor positioning. I don't remember how many times the swedes entered our zone and the d-man (was really impressed by how well Ristolainen did this) took the body just for another swede to grab the loose puck.
you really don't? at last time i checked there was midgets on the roster. they just were outplayed by strength, every position of the game. you know what is true on hockey, youre playing with skills only on premilinary/practice etc. until real games starts it's endurance, strength, hockey IQ and size which matters more..


Last edited by behemolari: 12-31-2012 at 10:29 AM.
behemolari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 10:26 AM
  #706
SPMaximus
Re-sign=/=Resign
 
SPMaximus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,320
vCash: 50
size was decent, the only short player was Järveläinen

http://www.eliteprospects.com/team.p...=Height&year0=

loool he is 14 centimeters shorter than the second shortest player? hahahaha Ristolainen is 28 centimeters taller than him

average size/weight was on par with the other teams, maybe even a bit bigger if you remove the likes of Bilbo Järveläinen

SPMaximus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 10:27 AM
  #707
Monaakko
Registered User
 
Monaakko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Finland
Country: Finland
Posts: 75
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by behemolari View Post
you really don't? at last time i checked there was midgets on the roster
Yes, but we didn't get physically dominated, apart from by the czechs, but as I said, when we actually tried to play physically and forecheck hard, we were quite good at it. And I agree, with hindsight, Järveläinen shouldn't have been on the team.

Monaakko is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 10:37 AM
  #708
behemolari
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 885
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monaakko View Post
Yes, but we didn't get physically dominated, apart from by the czechs, but as I said, when we actually tried to play physically and forecheck hard, we were quite good at it. And I agree, with hindsight, Järveläinen shouldn't have been on the team.
exactly, to win games you need to be able to dominate way or another. we saw team of skillfully players not physically dominated, so what then.. beeing happy to not being run over by others,.. than one team

behemolari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 10:50 AM
  #709
Monaakko
Registered User
 
Monaakko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Finland
Country: Finland
Posts: 75
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by behemolari View Post
exactly, to win games you need to be able to dominate way or another. we saw team of skillfully players not physically dominated, so what then.. beeing happy to not being run over by others,.. than one team
I agree, we were outplayed by both the swedes and the czechs and we were sloppy against the swiss. But we didn't lack the qualities to play better, and on the powerplay you could clearly see the skill of the team. Had we played the same game as the swedes and czechs or with the intensity of the swiss we could easily have won the group. I don't know why we didn't, but it wasn't because we couldn't.

Monaakko is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 11:17 AM
  #710
Gaps
Registered User
 
Gaps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,525
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by behemolari View Post
would be surprised if they they actually draft someone at first round from this team
This comment doesn't even deserve to be answered.

Two guys will get picked in 1st round- Barkov and Ristolainen. Ristolainen probably gained a few points with the scouts thanks to this tournament, but Barkov didn't mess it up nearly as bad as you make it sound.

This tournament doesn't make or break anyone's career.

Gaps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 11:19 AM
  #711
behemolari
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 885
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monaakko View Post
I agree, we were outplayed by both the swedes and the czechs and we were sloppy against the swiss. But we didn't lack the qualities to play better, and on the powerplay you could clearly see the skill of the team. Had we played the same game as the swedes and czechs or with the intensity of the swiss we could easily have won the group. I don't know why we didn't, but it wasn't because we couldn't.
it's because of mentality and model of finnish roleplayer, they are totally one dimensional. whole system is *****ed up from the very beginning. then there is some exceptions who can actually be creative and be team player at the same time, without em we would be totally screwed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaps View Post
This comment doesn't even deserve to be answered.

Two guys will get picked in 1st round- Barkov and Ristolainen. Ristolainen probably gained a few points with the scouts thanks to this tournament, but Barkov didn't mess it up nearly as bad as you make it sound.

This tournament doesn't make or break anyone's career.
i was just that dissapointed, barkov top10 ristolainen top30 to be honest

behemolari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 11:19 AM
  #712
bebl
Registered User
 
bebl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Finland
Posts: 692
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by heksagon View Post
i really wish the finnish ice hockey federation would take this tournament seriously and give the u-20 team a proven winning coach. If helminen is the head coach next year i just don't know what to say.

this!

bebl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 11:22 AM
  #713
behemolari
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 885
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bebl View Post

this!
that would help a lot

behemolari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 11:39 AM
  #714
bebl
Registered User
 
bebl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Finland
Posts: 692
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by behemolari View Post
would be surprised if they they actually draft someone at first round from this team
I thought fools like you only watch wc like every redneck from Finland.

bebl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 11:49 AM
  #715
nonoob12
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 161
vCash: 500
I hope that all these finnish players would go to CHL
finland is not best place development in CHL they will learn how to play on the boards and score and skate.
coaching is much better in NA too

take a example from czechs they have crabby leagues but still they can produce guys like Hertl,Frk and Jaskin when they leave young in NA they become more professionals.

Just like Määttä become much better in there im sure that guys like Armia would much more dangerous player if he had gone to NA at 16 years old.

nonoob12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 11:55 AM
  #716
toewsintangibles
Registered User
 
toewsintangibles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 1,324
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nonoob12 View Post
I hope that all these finnish players would go to CHL
finland is not best place development in CHL they will learn how to play on the boards and score and skate.
coaching is much better in NA too

take a example from czechs they have crabby leagues but still they can produce guys like Hertl,Frk and Jaskin when they leave young in NA they become more professionals.

Just like Määttä become much better in there im sure that guys like Armia would much more dangerous player if he had gone to NA at 16 years old.
Not that I disagree necessarily, but Hertl plays in Europe and was the most impressive of the lot

toewsintangibles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 12:14 PM
  #717
helgo
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Country: Czech_ Republic
Posts: 184
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nonoob12 View Post
take a example from czechs they have crabby leagues but still they can produce guys like Hertl,Frk and Jaskin when they leave young in NA they become more professionals.
Jaškin is playing in NA for few months and you're making it sound like he learned hockey there or something, his game was always the same, he just gained more confidence and is healthy. And Hertl doesn't even play in NA, so i guess these crabby leagues aren't too shabby either...

helgo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 12:27 PM
  #718
Monaakko
Registered User
 
Monaakko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Finland
Country: Finland
Posts: 75
vCash: 500
I'll give my thoughts on some of the players now as I most likely won't watch the relegation round games (if that's even possible).

Ristolainen: Imo the best player of the team, and the best defenceman on the ice in all games he played. Good in both ends of the ice. Had a physical presence and sometimes got called on it. Overall very pleased with his play. He had the highest +/- on the team and was the only dman along with Pokka with a positive +/--

Teräväinen: The best forward for team Finland. Had a poor showing against Sweden, but was good in the other games. Showed good hands, a good shot, and distributed the puck well on the power play. Sometimes tried to carry puck alone into the offensive zone and turned it over and it was a bit too easy to knock him off the puck.

Armia:In the Sweden game he showed why he was on the team. When he's on his game he's deadly. Excellent shot and he showed some nice playmaking on the powerplay aswell. In the second and third periods against Sweden he and Barkov had good pressure in the swedish zone. Needs far more consistency, but to his credit he stepped up in an important game. Overall a slight disappointment, but we knew what we were getting.

Barkov:Was a slight disappointment, but still I must say that in my opinion he outplayed all other draft eligibles he has come up against so far (apart from Ristolainen). Showed glimpses of his skill, especially in the later periods of the Sweden game and somewhat in the Switzerland game too. Was good on the dot and decent on the powerplay. Shorthanded he was good positionally, but could have been more aggressive. Played well defensively, at least compared to the rest of the team. He'll have his chance again next year (hopefully).

Määttä:Was disappointing, not at all as good as he was in the pre-tournament games. Was mostly stable in the defensive end, but didn't contribute much offensively. Was very poor in the Sweden game, but I'll attribute that to illness. Was still decent overall, but decent for Määttä is a disappointment.

Pokka:Played to his level. Was a little insecure in his own end, but it improved game for game. Offensively he was better than Määttä, and should have been on the powerplay from the start. Had a positive +/- which is impressive considering the circumstances.

Lindbohm:Played as well as he had to. Seemed confident enough in his own end and wasn't lost offensively even though his contributions were limited. He exceeded my expectations, and fit in well in the top-4.

Lehkonen:Had a goal immediately to start the tournament, after that he had no impact whatsoever. Was weak on the puck and made some bad plays, but overall he wasn't a liability. His current style of play seems to be suited to a low tempo game (as in FEL), where he can outwork opponents with his energy. Ofcourse, that should improve with more strenght, when that playing style will work when his opponents also have a higher tempo. Should be better next year.

Granlund:Was bad. Had some points but other than that he failed to reach his level. Began well in the Latvia game and played decently against the Swiss, but for Finland to have had a shot he had to play better. Got outmuscled constantly, played poorly defensively and seemed to play triggerman on a line with Armia.

Salomäki:The biggest disappointment. Took unnecessary penalties, failed to create space for his line and didn't manage to finish of plays. Probably had some decent play too, but I fail to recall any examples.

As for the rest: the fourth line mostly did it's job and was rather consistent, Korpisalo played decently, but that is not enough. The defenders outside the top-4 were from time to time terrifying to watch, but also had stretches of completely decent play. Järvinen, Nykopp and Leino, varied good play with bad. Overall the biggest blame however falls on the coaching. I feel they tried too hard to force a certain playstyle, when it clearly didn't work, they failed to prepare the team and keep up energy and the constant switching of lines (although some might argue for it) made the team unable to form any chemistry.

Monaakko is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 12:27 PM
  #719
Gaps
Registered User
 
Gaps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,525
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaps View Post
I'm putting my faith on the Czechs to beat the Swiss in regulation. If that happens, we can afford to lose to Sweden in regulation.

I called Markus Granlund mediocre after the last game, and today he scored three times. Tonight I'm going to call Joel Armia a mediocre prospect who can't get anything in. Let's hope it works.

If we go into relegation with a team like this, it'll be the biggest Finnish hockey fiasco of the century.
The saddest thing is that this actually seemed to work, it just wasn't enough.

Gaps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 12:37 PM
  #720
Gaps
Registered User
 
Gaps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,525
vCash: 500
In case anyone cares, we need 2 points from the relegation round in order not to be relegated.

Gaps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 12:43 PM
  #721
nonoob12
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 161
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by helgo View Post
Jaškin is playing in NA for few months and you're making it sound like he learned hockey there or something, his game was always the same, he just gained more confidence and is healthy. And Hertl doesn't even play in NA, so i guess these crabby leagues aren't too shabby either...
oops my mistake well hertl looked like NHL player in game against finland he was best player in the ice that game

but still my point is that many players of czech team are playing in NA
and i hope that more finns will go there in future too
its much more developmenting to play much in CHL against best players of your age groub than 4th line in sm liiga or mestis
finlands u20 league is so horrible that its not even worth mention

also its good for all finns to learn speak better english too

nonoob12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 01:42 PM
  #722
RorschachWJK
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Kuusamo
Country: Finland
Posts: 3,379
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaps View Post
In case anyone cares, we need 2 points from the relegation round in order not to be relegated.
In fact I hope that we do get relegated to the lower division. That is likely the only shock treatment strong enough to really shake the foundations of that old fatso Kummola's club of sauna buddies.

RorschachWJK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 02:25 PM
  #723
Hagged
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Country:
Posts: 1,567
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RorschachWJK View Post
In fact I hope that we do get relegated to the lower division. That is likely the only shock treatment strong enough to really shake the foundations of that old fatso Kummola's club of sauna buddies.
Also couple of years from now Barkov might get nice U20 stats playing in the lower division

Hagged is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 02:32 PM
  #724
FiLe
Mr. Know-It-Nothing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Finland
Posts: 2,925
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaps View Post
In case anyone cares, we need 2 points from the relegation round in order not to be relegated.
This is in the "worst" case scenario. In the best, Latvia loses a single game in regulation (or gets an OTW+OTL and no more than three points in total). Then we need none.

But given how we've got no help from other teams thus far, we best damn well win a game just to be sure.

FiLe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-31-2012, 03:25 PM
  #725
Nash
Registered User
 
Nash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: North Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,916
vCash: 500
What a shocker. I had Finland top 3 going into the tournament. Sometimes a team just doesn't click or loses some close ones that make a difference. Very hard to believe that a team with as much individual talent as this doesn't make it through. I feel bad for you guys. This age group had do much promise. And to have Sweden officially knock you out must sting even worse. Good luck next year.

Nash is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:41 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.