HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Business of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, and NHL revenues.

2014 Olympics and the NHL (UPD: NHL, NHLPA, IIHF, IOC meeting this week)

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-31-2012, 12:03 PM
  #26
colchar
Registered User
 
colchar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,376
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DieHardJoe View Post
Okay, so between watching Miracle and tape-delayed World Junior games, I'm getting desperate for hockey. And I know this is probably one of the lowest priorities right now as far as hammering out a CBA goes. But I was just wondering if anyone had heard if the league was including this in whatever their latest offer is. I'm pretty sure I remember that in past conversations that the owners weren't thrilled with this idea, but the players definitely wanted it, especially players like Malkin and Ovechkin, since the Olympics will be in Russia.

It might have been included in the league's latest proposal but prior to that I don't think it had come up in meetings at all, at least not according to media reports.

colchar is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:04 PM
  #27
sipowicz
The Original
 
sipowicz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,877
vCash: 800
Quote:
Originally Posted by BLONG7 View Post
Not a fan of NHL players in the Olympics...I always thought the Olympics was about amateur athletes, not paid professionals...?
Hockey's the biggest draw at the Winter Oly's, why would a city even bid without NHL talent on the rosters, unless your a fan of dancing with the stars on ice or watching women shooting at targets with XC- ski's on.

sipowicz is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:40 PM
  #28
thinkwild
Veni Vidi Toga
 
thinkwild's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,293
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
I do sympathize with the NHL on this issue, and really, unless the IOC coughs up, Id be pulling participation, creating a World Cup or whatever to replace Olympic participation altogether.
So soon after the wounds of the current owner-player collective exploitation process, would both sides then want to be exploited by the IOC even worse? Perhaps not. That would be cheeky though, pull out and stage a World Cup where NHL and PA split the money and schedule it during the Olympic break except live during prime time. Would it increase the years revenues? Would fans accept it outside the Olympic framework if so blatantly done during the Olympics, That would be funny.

thinkwild is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:46 PM
  #29
Killion
Global Moderator
 
Killion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Casablanca
Country: Morocco
Posts: 22,453
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by thinkwild View Post
Would fans accept it outside the Olympic framework if so blatantly done during the Olympics, That would be funny.
Amusing suggestion, but no, no I dont they'd want to give Rene Fasel
& the IOC a bloody nose on top of withdrawing from the Olympics.

Killion is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 01:04 PM
  #30
19Yzerman19
Registered User
 
19Yzerman19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Country: United States
Posts: 1,698
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davebo View Post
Don't look at it as an nhl shut down - look at it as a mere reshuffling of teams Hockey is still played - at quite a high level.

If the nhl doesn't allow players to participate in the 2014 games, then that's another nail the nhl's coffin.
Yes because everyone would stop watching the NHL if the players don't go right?

19Yzerman19 is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 01:49 AM
  #31
Mant*
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,911
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helo View Post
Olympics is the highest quality hockey in the world no doubt,but i do wonder how would Canadian team for example look without NHL players,can anyone make a roster without NHL players to send to Olympics? (just out of pure speculation)
Not even close. Olympic hockey is nothing more than an all star game. The teams are made up of a random assortment of players that mostly do not play together, under a coach that most of them do not normally play for. Take any of the top ten NHL teams and they will beat any olympic team every time because they have chemistry, familiarity, their own strategies that they work on perfecting daily. A real team will always have an advantage over a team that just gets put together once every four years and has one or two practices before going into a short tournament.

Olympic hockey may show off the best players, but it does not show off the best quality of game.

Mant* is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 06:12 AM
  #32
rojac
HFBoards Sponsor
 
rojac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Waterloo, ON
Posts: 6,586
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by thinkwild View Post
So soon after the wounds of the current owner-player collective exploitation process, would both sides then want to be exploited by the IOC even worse? Perhaps not. That would be cheeky though, pull out and stage a World Cup where NHL and PA split the money and schedule it during the Olympic break except live during prime time. Would it increase the years revenues? Would fans accept it outside the Olympic framework if so blatantly done during the Olympics, That would be funny.
So, instead of shutting the league down for one meaningless (in terms of the NHL season) series of exhibition games, you want to shut it down for a different one.

rojac is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 06:17 AM
  #33
premadonna
Registered User
 
premadonna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,221
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by rojac View Post
So, instead of shutting the league down for one meaningless (in terms of the NHL season) series of exhibition games, you want to shut it down for a different one.
At least last time the World Cup was played during the NHL off-season.

premadonna is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 06:20 AM
  #34
Mr Writer
Registered User
 
Mr Writer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,757
vCash: 500
The NHL will participate in the Olympics and the payoff for that, the IIHF endorses a new World Cup format which will be organized by and all revenues flow to the NHL with some compensation going to the 8 national federations that will participate.

Mr Writer is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 08:37 AM
  #35
predfan98
Registered User
 
predfan98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,479
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DyerMaker66 View Post
When was the Olympics ever about amateur athletes?
go look at olympic history..... lake placid.... hockey.... dream team--- basketball...1992....(first pro bball players from us in olympics)

other numerous sports have rules where you can't have been paid to participate in the olympics...

predfan98 is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 08:51 AM
  #36
Theokritos
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,010
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DyerMaker66 View Post
I agree, and it's a poor idea, imo. Why exclude the best athletes when trying to decide which athletes are the best?
The idea was to heal the world from materialism through sublime if not sacred competition for higher goods like honor.

Theokritos is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 08:55 AM
  #37
sandysan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 4,968
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helo View Post
Olympics is the highest quality hockey in the world no doubt,but i do wonder how would Canadian team for example look without NHL players,can anyone make a roster without NHL players to send to Olympics? (just out of pure speculation)
We could fill it with ahl players or with juniors like the wjc team ( without rnh). Why would anyone want t see that? The world junior championship have been pretty good so far, but its a completely different game with NHL players.

sandysan is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 10:42 AM
  #38
worstfaceoffmanever
These Snacks Are Odd
 
worstfaceoffmanever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Winston-Salem, NC
Country: United States
Posts: 12,454
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by fredrikstad View Post
Having NHL players in The Olympics, is a huge boost for hockey interesset around the world.
So if there are no NHL's players in the Olympics, there are one big looser.....Hockey.

I bet if The Olympics where held in let say Rogers Arena again, you be all for it. Don't be negative just because it happens to be in Russia this time.
While I agree, his post perfectly articulates the stance of the NHL. The league's largest market on potential is still the United States. What good does it do to suspend the league for two weeks to send the players halfway around the world for a tournament very few people will watch? They have significantly less to gain from the Sochi Games than they did from the Vancouver Games.

I hope they see reason and allow the players to go, because barring them from playing would do severe damage to their reputation with Europeans and the long-term quality of the league, but I wouldn't put anything past them...

worstfaceoffmanever is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 11:06 AM
  #39
Xref
Registered User
 
Xref's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 754
vCash: 500
By allowing NHL players to represent the US (and other countries), there will never be another opportunity for a Miracle on Ice. That, in and of itself, is reason enough to keep NHL'rs off team USA rosters. If any of you are old enough like me to have witnessed that event, you'll know what I mean.

Ever since the NHL started to participate in the Olympics, it's been a downer for me. Just a pick-up game of pond hockey. And in some cases, an embarrassment to the NHL and the US (recall the hotel trashing, etc). Between all this, and shutting down the NHL for 2 weeks to accommodate it, NO THANKS!

Xref is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 11:21 AM
  #40
BLONG7
Registered User
 
BLONG7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 12,465
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xref View Post
By allowing NHL players to represent the US (and other countries), there will never be another opportunity for a Miracle on Ice. That, in and of itself, is reason enough to keep NHL'rs off team USA rosters. If any of you are old enough like me to have witnessed that event, you'll know what I mean.

Ever since the NHL started to participate in the Olympics, it's been a downer for me. Just a pick-up game of pond hockey. And in some cases, an embarrassment to the NHL and the US (recall the hotel trashing, etc). Between all this, and shutting down the NHL for 2 weeks to accommodate it, NO THANKS!
Thank-you!!

BLONG7 is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 11:51 AM
  #41
ScottyBowman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Detroit
Country: United States
Posts: 2,021
vCash: 500
I hope not. The NHL has little to gain from participating in the olympics especially when nobody watches the winter olympics except for some northern countries.

ScottyBowman is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 12:11 PM
  #42
Confucius
Registered User
 
Confucius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,630
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xref View Post
By allowing NHL players to represent the US (and other countries), there will never be another opportunity for a Miracle on Ice. That, in and of itself, is reason enough to keep NHL'rs off team USA rosters. If any of you are old enough like me to have witnessed that event, you'll know what I mean.

Ever since the NHL started to participate in the Olympics, it's been a downer for me. Just a pick-up game of pond hockey. And in some cases, an embarrassment to the NHL and the US (recall the hotel trashing, etc). Between all this, and shutting down the NHL for 2 weeks to accommodate it, NO THANKS!
Won't happen again anyway whether the NHL participates nor not. Since the best players would be playing in the NHL. Therefore Ovy, Malkin, Kovy won't be there either.

Since the U S amateurs have gotten better they never will be as large an underdog as Norway or Latvia would be.

Confucius is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 12:36 PM
  #43
Xref
Registered User
 
Xref's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 754
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stix and Stones View Post
Won't happen again anyway whether the NHL participates nor not. Since the best players would be playing in the NHL. Therefore Ovy, Malkin, Kovy won't be there either.

Since the U S amateurs have gotten better they never will be as large an underdog as Norway or Latvia would be.
It doesn't matter that those countries wont have their stars. All that matters is college players having the opportunity to win gold. This gives them something to look forward to and strive for. Let the pros have their bloated paychecks, give the Olympic dream back to the kids where it belongs.

Xref is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 12:50 PM
  #44
RJ8812
Gunner Stahl #9
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Sudbury
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,548
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by predfan98 View Post
go look at olympic history..... lake placid.... hockey.... dream team--- basketball...1992....(first pro bball players from us in olympics)

other numerous sports have rules where you can't have been paid to participate in the olympics...
Olympics athletes are not paid to participate in the Olympics...

RJ8812 is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 12:55 PM
  #45
RJ8812
Gunner Stahl #9
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Sudbury
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,548
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xref View Post
By allowing NHL players to represent the US (and other countries), there will never be another opportunity for a Miracle on Ice. That, in and of itself, is reason enough to keep NHL'rs off team USA rosters. If any of you are old enough like me to have witnessed that event, you'll know what I mean.

Ever since the NHL started to participate in the Olympics, it's been a downer for me. Just a pick-up game of pond hockey. And in some cases, an embarrassment to the NHL and the US (recall the hotel trashing, etc). Between all this, and shutting down the NHL for 2 weeks to accommodate it, NO THANKS!
Nobody will care about hockey in the Olympics if NHL players are not allowed to participate. If they would have kept it the way it was, then there would be no difference in popularity, but once they allowed NHL players to play, if they don't allow them anymore, most people will stop watching.

The Olympics should always be about watching the best athletes in the World compete and the NHL is where the vast majority of the best hockey players play.

RJ8812 is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 01:09 PM
  #46
Killion
Global Moderator
 
Killion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Casablanca
Country: Morocco
Posts: 22,453
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
Olympics athletes are not paid to participate in the Olympics...
That simply isnt true. Now, granted there arent any "appearance" fee's for showing up & competing, but most receive training stipends from there various sports federations, including in a lot of instances financial reward for Medaling, in some cases mid six figure bonuses. Then theres their individual sponsorship deals, be it Nike, Adidas, Puma, Ski Rossignol, Dynamic' or whomever; again, 6 figure cash bonus if you Medal; Bronze, Silver or Gold, sliding scale, individual or team. Then theres the direct financial gain one can capitalize on through corporate sponsorships if successful, including appointments to various corporate boards, well paid public speaking gigs and so on & so forth.

Absolutely nothing "amateur" about the Olympics with the exception of the fact that the IOC itself treats it as such, pocketing billions in broadcasting & sponsorship revenues themselves without paying a dime for the talent, which in the case of the NHL & the rest of the pro leagues from which talent is sourced, not a sou paid in compensation for shutting down their businesses for 10-12 days during peak season every 4yrs. And this is supposed to be accepted, that its "good for the game", the IOC doubling if not trebling the money in broadcasting & sponsorship fee's that they'd normally get without NHL player participation. Its a con. Sure the hockeys great, but why should the NHL make a "gift" of hundreds of millions when they could create & own a "World Cup" or whatever themselves? I would actually prefer to watch NCAA, CIAU & amateur status athletes playing hockey for Team's Sweden, Canada etc at a Winter Olympics than the pro's; the pro's returning to the Canada Cup type formats.

Killion is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 01:24 PM
  #47
DyerMaker66
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 4,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by predfan98 View Post
go look at olympic history..... lake placid.... hockey.... dream team--- basketball...1992....(first pro bball players from us in olympics)

other numerous sports have rules where you can't have been paid to participate in the olympics...
Vladislav Tretiak played at the 1980 Olympics and I'm pretty sure he was a professional hockey player (regardless of what the IOC says).

NHL players aren't payed to play at the Olympics, they're payed to play in the NHL.

Like Swimming and Running? I'm sure Michael Phelps and Usain Bolt aren't payed athletes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Theokritos View Post
The idea was to heal the world from materialism through sublime if not sacred competition for higher goods like honor.
"Hey go play hockey for honour but bring back that shiny gold medal!"

DyerMaker66 is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 01:29 PM
  #48
DyerMaker66
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 4,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by worstfaceoffmanever View Post
While I agree, his post perfectly articulates the stance of the NHL. The league's largest market on potential is still the United States. What good does it do to suspend the league for two weeks to send the players halfway around the world for a tournament very few people will watch? They have significantly less to gain from the Sochi Games than they did from the Vancouver Games.

I hope they see reason and allow the players to go, because barring them from playing would do severe damage to their reputation with Europeans and the long-term quality of the league, but I wouldn't put anything past them...
It will legitimately achieve Gary's goal of growing the game, perhaps attracting Asian and European markets to NHL viewing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
That simply isnt true. Now, granted there arent any "appearance" fee's for showing up & competing, but most receive training stipends from there various sports federations, including in a lot of instances financial reward for Medaling, in some cases mid six figure bonuses. Then theres their individual sponsorship deals, be it Nike, Adidas, Puma, Ski Rossignol, Dynamic' or whomever; again, 6 figure cash bonus if you Medal; Bronze, Silver or Gold, sliding scale, individual or team. Then theres the direct financial gain one can capitalize on through corporate sponsorships if successful, including appointments to various corporate boards, well paid public speaking gigs and so on & so forth.

Absolutely nothing "amateur" about the Olympics with the exception of the fact that the IOC itself treats it as such, pocketing billions in broadcasting & sponsorship revenues themselves without paying a dime for the talent, which in the case of the NHL & the rest of the pro leagues from which talent is sourced, not a sou paid in compensation for shutting down their businesses for 10-12 days during peak season every 4yrs. And this is supposed to be accepted, that its "good for the game", the IOC doubling if not trebling the money in broadcasting & sponsorship fee's that they'd normally get without NHL player participation. Its a con. Sure the hockeys great, but why should the NHL make a "gift" of hundreds of millions when they could create & own a "World Cup" or whatever themselves? I would actually prefer to watch NCAA, CIAU & amateur status athletes playing hockey for Team's Sweden, Canada etc at a Winter Olympics than the pro's; the pro's returning to the Canada Cup type formats.
Bingo: There are 0 unpaid athletes at the Olympics.

I'd hate that though: Why would I watch the people compete to be the best, when I know the best aren't even competing?


Last edited by DyerMaker66: 01-01-2013 at 01:36 PM.
DyerMaker66 is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 01:32 PM
  #49
DyerMaker66
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 4,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
Nobody will care about hockey in the Olympics if NHL players are not allowed to participate. If they would have kept it the way it was, then there would be no difference in popularity, but once they allowed NHL players to play, if they don't allow them anymore, most people will stop watching.

The Olympics should always be about watching the best athletes in the World compete and the NHL is where the vast majority of the best hockey players play.
Completely agreed, though I think Fifa has done a good job of keeping the World Cup as the premier soccer tournament while ensuring a high level of play at the Olympics.

DyerMaker66 is offline  
Old
01-01-2013, 02:24 PM
  #50
Roughneck
Registered User
 
Roughneck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Calgary
Country: Ireland
Posts: 8,642
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Roughneck
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theokritos View Post
The Olympic Movement originally considered professionalism as an disease of modern society. But that's an idea of the 19th century that has faded a long time ago.
That's because there aren't as many aristocratic gentleman who don't want to exclude the type of people that would need to receive money to compete in a sporting event, essentially keeping lower class people out of upper class activities. The lower classes of course being the type of people who would be likely to harm the integrity of the sport by letting money affect their performance, whereas a proper gentleman would have the wealth and status to not even be put in such a situation.

Roughneck is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:58 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.