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2012-13 Lockout Discussion Part X: Is There Any Hope? Edition

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Old
01-01-2013, 03:58 PM
  #876
Bleed Ranger Blue
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Originally Posted by mschmidt64 View Post
Rangers have nothing to do with it. You can't make the argument that it's good for the sport to have teams having to trade away their best players merely to comply with a cap that they didn't anticipate.

Conversely, you can make the argument that a lot of the other owner proposals are good for the sport. Such as the ability to get out from bad contracts sooner, since bad contracts force teams to continue to employ bad players (or players who aren't earning their spots at least), and it waters down the product on the ice.

This proposal isn't good for the game.
How is competitive balance not in the best interests of the NHL as a whole? Large market teams having to make cuts - other teams able to pick up noteworthy players in a diluted market? Where does 90% of the league sign up for that deal? Do you think Marian Gaborik brings a sold out crowd to the Garden every night? He could be a bigger help for the game playing somewhere else. Sucks as a Ranger fan, but if you were willing to side with the owners and succumb to the financials argument...this is to be expected.

Admittedly, at least I see a reason for the opposition. As for the "get out of jail free" stuff? I want to have a system in place that doesnt give Glen Sather the ability to make a questionable decision at all. A meeting that ends with "...yea and we can send him to the minors if it doesnt work out" usually winds up with a Scott Gomez or Wade Redden on your roster.

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01-01-2013, 04:05 PM
  #877
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None of the comments criticizing any player seems justified to me. It seems like people expect guys to be unbiased, despite the fact that they are solidly on one side of the dispute. That's just unrealistic. Some guys are more militant than others, of course. That's the way it always is. But criticism over it? Uncalled for.
Thankfully most of them shut up about it.

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01-01-2013, 04:09 PM
  #878
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already? lol.. maybe he has to make his fashionably late entrance since he was too early.

Aaron Ward ‏@aaronward_nhl
Don and Steve Fehr, along with NHLPA staff have left NHL offices. #TSN

https://twitter.com/aaronward_nhl/st...28223522656256

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01-01-2013, 04:09 PM
  #879
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
already? lol.. maybe he has to make his fashionably late entrance since he was too early.

Aaron Ward ‏@aaronward_nhl
Don and Steve Fehr, along with NHLPA staff have left NHL offices. #TSN

https://twitter.com/aaronward_nhl/st...28223522656256
Aaron Ward ‏@aaronward_nhl
NHLPA departure was end to the smaller group meetings with the NHL.NHLPA will return with full group for 7 PM meeting tonight. #TSN

https://twitter.com/aaronward_nhl/st...30466653216771

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01-01-2013, 04:09 PM
  #880
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Face-to-face bargaining between the league and players will begin between 6:30 and 7 p.m. tonight in NYC.

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01-01-2013, 04:12 PM
  #881
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Originally Posted by Henriks Broadway Hat View Post
Aaron Ward ‏@aaronward_nhl
NHLPA departure was end to the smaller group meetings with the NHL.NHLPA will return with full group for 7 PM meeting tonight. #TSN

https://twitter.com/aaronward_nhl/st...30466653216771
lol, I just figured he wanted to make his usual late entrance.

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01-01-2013, 04:13 PM
  #882
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anyway, best thing to come out of the talks tonight is an agreement to meet tomorrow and continue talking without anyone walking out or throwing a fit.

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01-01-2013, 04:17 PM
  #883
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
anyway, best thing to come out of the talks tonight is an agreement to meet tomorrow and continue talking without anyone walking out or throwing a fit.
Some might call that the point of any meeting ever.

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01-01-2013, 04:20 PM
  #884
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Honestly Hank is one of the few players who I think has handled this very well. I could be wrong, but I think some people may be associating some terrible tweets from a fake Lundqvist account with the real man.

On the flip side, don't let the door hit you Prust.

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01-01-2013, 04:20 PM
  #885
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Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
I still don't get why people say this. He has absolutely not been one of the more classy players. For the first few months of the lockout, he's been complaining the entire time.

For some reason, when Lundqvist says something stupid, it has been ignored, but when he says something smart, everyone praises him for it.
I do remember him saying some things earlier in the lockout that I guess you could consider complaining. Nothing too overboard, but perhaps there's a good chance I might have missed something.

Back in September though I actually saw a few things said by Prust that I liked. Now everytime I read something from him I wanna pull my eyes out to ensure I'll never read stuff so ridiculous!

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01-01-2013, 04:29 PM
  #886
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Yea, unless I am missing something the terrible tweets were from @henriklundqvist which is not his real account. Hank has been nothing but class, again as far as I can tell.

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01-01-2013, 04:41 PM
  #887
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Night in the city...Start of the NHL/PA bargaining session here in NYC now pushed back to 6:30-7 p.m.
Steve Zipay (twitter) @stevezipay

I think we all know this already, but figured id relay the tweet anyways.

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01-01-2013, 04:46 PM
  #888
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He was NOT on "prust levels".

It comes down to whether or not you agree. He said from the start, if its broken, let's work together to find a system. If you want the same system, its not broken. Considering the circumstances of the last lockout and the revenues since, this bargaining should have been much more collaborative and not a dictation of terms.

His gm followed the rules as well as anyone and built a contender. His owner helped end the NBA lockout. Neither have been included in this process. The new cba attacks big markets as much as players. They have to pay huge charity amounts and still suffer petty tactics from the bottom to dismantle their contenders.

You can get his frustration.

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Old
01-01-2013, 04:46 PM
  #889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
Yea, unless I am missing something the terrible tweets were from @henriklundqvist which is not his real account. Hank has been nothing but class, again as far as I can tell.
From Lundqvist's real account, @HLundqvist30, he mentioned Bettman's salary and complained about the SEL because he couldn't get a job there. Both tweets were from his real account and the first one was retweeted by Richards.

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01-01-2013, 04:53 PM
  #890
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
From Lundqvist's real account, @HLundqvist30, he mentioned Bettman's salary and complained about the SEL because he couldn't get a job there. Both tweets were from his real account and the first one was retweeted by Richards.
well, anything against bettman I agree with because well I just don't agree that he has done a good job in his position and he has hurt the league and the sport, but that's just my opinion. And the comment he made about the SEL, I may be mistaken, but he just said not enough money for him to be apart of a team in there or something about the rules of having nhl players on a team in the SEL, I didn't consider that complaining at all, just stating facts and explaining why he is not playing on a team. These are just my opinions, just conflicting of yours because I think everyone will have different opinions about any player comments about the lockout.

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01-01-2013, 04:55 PM
  #891
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
How is competitive balance not in the best interests of the NHL as a whole? Large market teams having to make cuts - other teams able to pick up noteworthy players in a diluted market? Where does 90% of the league sign up for that deal? Do you think Marian Gaborik brings a sold out crowd to the Garden every night? He could be a bigger help for the game playing somewhere else. Sucks as a Ranger fan, but if you were willing to side with the owners and succumb to the financials argument...this is to be expected.

Admittedly, at least I see a reason for the opposition. As for the "get out of jail free" stuff? I want to have a system in place that doesnt give Glen Sather the ability to make a questionable decision at all. A meeting that ends with "...yea and we can send him to the minors if it doesnt work out" usually winds up with a Scott Gomez or Wade Redden on your roster.
Increased revenue sharing, increased cap constraints, removal of any competitive advantage from deeper pockets... fine. So be it. But essentially dispersing talent on the level of Gaborik? Why draft? Maybe force Ken Holland to Phoenix. The Ranger Euro scouts to Carolina.

Once we get to the point where we ensure a 1/30 chance of a cup for every team every year, you remove the reason to follow this for-all-intents-and-purposes soap opera year in and year out. It diminishes the path to a cup. If and when we won with this roster, it will be all the sweeter considering how we rebuilt the right way after shortcuts failed. I don't want a pity cup.

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Old
01-01-2013, 04:56 PM
  #892
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Originally Posted by Maineice11 View Post
well, anything against bettman I agree with because well I just don't agree that he has done a good job in his position and he has hurt the league and the sport, but that's just my opinion. And the comment he made about the SEL, I may be mistaken, but he just said not enough money for him to be apart of a team in there or something about the rules of having nhl players on a team in the SEL, I didn't consider that complaining at all, just stating facts and explaining why he is not playing on a team. These are just my opinions, just conflicting of yours because I think everyone will have different opinions about any player comments about the lockout.
Players should shut up. I think Don Fehr would be the first to tell them that.

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01-01-2013, 05:50 PM
  #893
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
How is competitive balance not in the best interests of the NHL as a whole? Large market teams having to make cuts - other teams able to pick up noteworthy players in a diluted market?
Well that's the point, it's not just the Rangers, it's a lot of the large market teams.

The cap in general creates competitive balance. Having 10 teams or so have to strip down or go with holes because they can't afford to properly fill out their rosters isn't good.

Quote:
As for the "get out of jail free" stuff? I want to have a system in place that doesnt give Glen Sather the ability to make a questionable decision at all. A meeting that ends with "...yea and we can send him to the minors if it doesnt work out" usually winds up with a Scott Gomez or Wade Redden on your roster.
Owners will never stop making bad signings because it's a system where they have to take risks to outbid each other and that should be encouraged, not discouraged.

Obviously the bidding system encourages more bad signings if they get do-overs, but I still think it is better than being stuck with a bad deal.

NFL's got the perfect system.

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Old
01-01-2013, 05:50 PM
  #894
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Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
From Lundqvist's real account, @HLundqvist30, he mentioned Bettman's salary and complained about the SEL because he couldn't get a job there. Both tweets were from his real account and the first one was retweeted by Richards.
Oh the horror the guy dislikes Bettman just like everyone else, AND wants to play hockey!


How in any way does he deserve to be bashed? He hasn't been an idiot about the lockout in any way. The guy has been one of the better players in this whole situation.


Some people...

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Old
01-01-2013, 05:52 PM
  #895
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Oh the horror the guy dislikes Bettman just like everyone else, AND wants to play hockey!


How in any way does he deserve to be bashed? He hasn't been an idiot about the lockout in any way. The guy has been one of the better players in this whole situation.


Some people...
When did I say he deserves to be bashed? Please, I'd like you to show me.

The only thing I don't get is how Lundqvist has been classy this entire time. It's clearly proven that he has not been. Maybe he's been one of the "more" classy players, but he has definitely not been classy during the ENTIRE lockout. I guess he has been classy during the entire lockout if it's considered classy to tweet someone's salary and mention how "If Bettman's getting paid X amount, the league can't be doing that bad." Very classy.

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Old
01-01-2013, 06:29 PM
  #896
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Negotiations still have yet to resume tonight b/w the NHL and NHLPA. They are expected to at some point. When is still TBD
Dan Rosen (twitter) @drosennhl


Last edited by Maineice11: 01-01-2013 at 06:47 PM.
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01-01-2013, 06:49 PM
  #897
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Tweeted by Al tonight. That's one good looking banner, and a well-earned one at that.


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01-01-2013, 07:05 PM
  #898
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It is now 8pm. 3 hours after the #nhl and #nhlpa were supposed to meet face-to-face. It hasn't happened yet...This night will be long..
David Alter (twitter) @DavidAlter590

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01-01-2013, 07:13 PM
  #899
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The #nhl has requested to meet with the pa at 9pm.
David Alter (twitter) @DavidAlter590

Quote:
Update: meeting now expected to start at 9 pm ET. League needed extra time to complete its response to NHLPA counter.
Pierre LeBrun (twitter) @Real_ESPNLeBrun

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01-01-2013, 07:13 PM
  #900
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Tom Gulitti ‏@TGfireandice

NHLPA waiting for word from NHL when to come over for the meeting. NHLPA says that's likely to be soon, but no set time yet.

Tom Gulitti ‏@TGfireandice

NHL still is doing its preparation for tonight's meeting. Hasnt told NHLPA to come back for meeting yet.

So at least it's not Fehr stalling or anything like that.

And this just in

Tom Gulitti ‏@TGfireandice

NHL-NHLPA meeting now expected to start at 9 p,m.

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