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Old
01-02-2013, 01:16 PM
  #26
shutehinside
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Originally Posted by DJ Breadman View Post
well it's not really a rumor because this has actually been discussed, the only problem is it won't be put in place untill this summer so we are stuck with gomez for this year
If there is a buyout provision, I was under the impression it will take place BEFORE this season takes place. Gomez could be out as soon as the next week or so!

My only complaint is that there's only one buyout being discussed. It woul have been nice to buy him and Kaberle out but I'll take it. $7.37 M off the cap, just like that.

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01-02-2013, 01:24 PM
  #27
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Is the 9 games rule for CHL players up for change or not in effect for this season (because of a shortened season)?

Assuming we can and probably will keep Galchenyuk up for at least 9 games, we almost need 2 lineups.

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01-02-2013, 01:25 PM
  #28
Marc the Habs Fan
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I've been following the talks closely, I don't think it's ever been clarified if it would be available for this season or just after this season and before 2013-14 begins. It's usually termed as ''prior'' to 2013-14.

Either way, like CP wrote, Gomez can just be sent to the AHL/Europe anyway for this season. Cap space won't be a problem either way with a 70 M cap this year, even if he's counting for 7.3 M.

Frozen, that has not been determined.

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01-02-2013, 01:27 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
If there is a buyout provision, I was under the impression it will take place BEFORE this season takes place. Gomez could be out as soon as the next week or so!

My only complaint is that there's only one buyout being discussed. It woul have been nice to buy him and Kaberle out but I'll take it. $7.37 M off the cap, just like that.
My understanding is that the teams will keep the $70.2 million payroll (or cap hit) for this season and when they reduce it to $60 million for next season they will allow a compliance buyout for each team at the end of this season.

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01-02-2013, 01:30 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Hopefully a new CBA is in place in the next 5-7 days and a season starts January 19th, it's looking good so far.

What would the Habs lineup look like?

Goal:
Price(25)
Budaj(30)
***pretty much set barring something unforseen

Defense:
Subban(23-RFA)
Gorges(28)
Markov(34)
Kaberle(34)
Emelin(26)
Bouillon(37)
Diaz(26)
Weber(24)
St.Denis(26)(waivers)
***either St Denis gets waived to Hmailton or another d-man is traded, I expect them to keep 8 d-men

Forwards:
Plekanec(30)
Pacioretty(24)
Cole(34)
Gionta(33)
Desharnais(26)
Bourque(31)
Eller(23)
Prust(28)
Armstrong(30)
Moen(30)
White(24)
Nokelainen(26)

Others?
LeBlanc(21)
Galcheyuk(18)
Palushaj(23)
Blunden(26)

***I think we may see Palushaj traded if they are not going to keep him , though his injury complicates things. I wonder if Galchenyuk would get an exhibition game or two. LeBlanc is likely to stay in Hamilton recovering from that high ankle sprain. I expect blunden as #13 forward unless a trade happens or Galchenyuk makes the team.
I dont think they will do exhibition game?

Small Camp + season

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01-02-2013, 01:34 PM
  #31
shutehinside
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
My understanding is that the teams will keep the $70.2 million payroll (or cap hit) for this season and when they reduce it to $60 million for next season they will allow a compliance buyout for each team at the end of this season.
I guess it's not set in stone yet as they're still negociating the new CBA. Last time this happened the teams were able to buy out players during a short term window before the start of the season. That was during the summer, so who knows if a January start will make a difference.

Still, in my head, anyways, it makes more sense to be able to buy the players out ASAP. If this isn't the case then no biggy. Gomez must know he doesn't have a future with this team and we've all but moved on from him. The only positive will be getting to the $60M cap, if that is the case, will be a lot easier with no Gomez and/or Kaberle.

I did find this article by Engels. I guess it doesn't really shed any light either:

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eric-...s8230/82/48167

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01-02-2013, 01:35 PM
  #32
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You guys forget that PK Subban isn't sign yet. This mean we might not see him this year even if a new CBA is sign. PK won't go to the training camp without a contract and after that he has to come to an agreement with the Canadiens. Markov might stay in Russia for the full year (he already states that). Another poster said earlier we are stuck with Gomez. I see the Canadiens missing the playoff another time this year (I hope I'm wrong) unless Therrien can squeaze the best out of all his players.

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01-02-2013, 01:36 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
I don't see how having Galchenyuk on the team can contribute to most important task: the rebuild.

The priority is to maximize trade value at the deadline of the players we'd like to deal, as we're not making any noise in the playoffs this year, and to maximize the development of young players.

Forwards:

Pacioretty-DD-Bourque (minutes as easy as last year's)
Plekanec-Eller-Cole
Armstrong-Gomez-Gionta
Prust-Noke-Moen
Spares and injury replacements: White, Leblanc

The above is a forward lineup that maximizes any potential trade value for Bourque and Armstrong. It also allows Eller to take the next step up. It also puts Gomez in a position to succeed, meaning we could conceivably extract a 3rd rounder from him at the end of the year if he bounces back and gets 30 points as the 3rd line center. I remind everyone that Gomez has a cap hit exceeding his salary by 3 million dollar next year.

Defense:

Markov-Subban
Kaberle-Gorges
Bouillon-Emelin
spares: Diaz, Weber

This is a defensive lineup that puts Andrei Markov in a protective position to succeed, as he will be covered by the best defensemen on the team, giving him room to grow back. Kaberle-Gorges is a good pairing at both ends of the ice, and they compensate for each other's weaknesses, meaning we could flip Kaberle for a 1st rounder. Bouillon-Emelin can be the shutdown pairing.
I think this is right for the D and about Gomez. At least to start: "Jul 3, 2012 – GM Marc Bergevin on Scott Gomez: 'He's a Montreal Canadien, so he'll come here and we'll see what happens. But I'm not buying him out.'"

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2012/...eal_canadiens/

Of course, this might no longer apply with a new CBA.

Also, we all forget... Gomez was injured and his linemates were all smurfs. Just sayin'. Maybe give the guy something to work with so he doesn't have to dig the puck out himself all the time?

Gally doesn't look ready to me. Looks like he could add some muscle and work on his lateral movement. This is Montreal, you can't throw him to the sharks.

Offense:

Pacioretty-DD-Cole
Eller-Plekanec-Gionta
Prust-Gomez-Bourque
Moen-White-Armstrong
Spares and injury replacements: Noke, Leblanc


Defense:

Markov-Subban
Kaberle-Gorges
Bouillon-Emelin
spares: Diaz, Weber


Last edited by tinyzombies: 01-02-2013 at 01:55 PM.
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Old
01-02-2013, 01:41 PM
  #34
habs03
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Can Max play both wing positions?
Has played LW only both in Mtl and with the Dogs, so I doubt it, but it would be possible, its more often to see LHS play RW than have a guy like Gionta(RHS) move to LW.

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01-02-2013, 01:42 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
I guess it's not set in stone yet as they're still negociating the new CBA. Last time this happened the teams were able to buy out players during a short term window before the start of the season. That was during the summer, so who knows if a January start will make a difference.

Still, in my head, anyways, it makes more sense to be able to buy the players out ASAP. If this isn't the case then no biggy. Gomez must know he doesn't have a future with this team and we've all but moved on from him. The only positive will be getting to the $60M cap, if that is the case, will be a lot easier with no Gomez and/or Kaberle.

I did find this article by Engels. I guess it doesn't really shed any light either:

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eric-...s8230/82/48167
Most teams have their rosters set, Redden is going to the AHL, etc, it just makes it easier if 15 or 20 veterans aren't all of a sudden cast adrift. But, who knows with Fehr and Bettman.

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01-02-2013, 01:47 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geester76 View Post
You guys forget that PK Subban isn't sign yet. This mean we might not see him this year even if a new CBA is sign. PK won't go to the training camp without a contract and after that he has to come to an agreement with the Canadiens.
He won't spend the whole year as a holdout. Come on...

Quote:
Markov might stay in Russia for the full year (he already states that).
The NHL-KHL agreement prevents it.

Quote:
Another poster said earlier we are stuck with Gomez.
We aren't. If we don't want him on our roster, he's not on it.

And is Engels serious? Bouillon-Gorges as a shutdown pairing? Keeping Tinordi as a 7th?

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01-02-2013, 01:57 PM
  #37
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I could see Bergevin making some trades as well. We have a lot of surplus. Plus some rookies might surprise.

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01-02-2013, 01:58 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
If there is a buyout provision, I was under the impression it will take place BEFORE this season takes place. Gomez could be out as soon as the next week or so!

My only complaint is that there's only one buyout being discussed. It woul have been nice to buy him and Kaberle out but I'll take it. $7.37 M off the cap, just like that.
We have nothing to gain by buying out Kaberle. Like Bourque we're better off letting a new coach and new season light a fire under them and get an asset(s) back instead of giving them away. Both guys have very good contracts if they bounce back.

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01-02-2013, 02:04 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Geester76 View Post
You guys forget that PK Subban isn't sign yet. This mean we might not see him this year even if a new CBA is sign. PK won't go to the training camp without a contract and after that he has to come to an agreement with the Canadiens. Markov might stay in Russia for the full year (he already states that). Another poster said earlier we are stuck with Gomez. I see the Canadiens missing the playoff another time this year (I hope I'm wrong) unless Therrien can squeaze the best out of all his players.
I'm sure they can work out a deal with Subban's camp...worst case make it a 1 year deal at compromise amount, both parties buy more time.

Markov said he isn't staying in Russia, based on where he is playing it would make no sense at all.

I don't think Therrien needs any miracles, just a few bounce back seasons(Markov Bourque Kaberle Gionta) and a better record in tight games/OT/SO. We added a lot of grit so that will surely help, I also think Price can do better if for no other reason than a better defense(Bouillon for depth/experience, healthy Markov, Diaz/Emelin with a year under their belt, bounce back for Kaberle).

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01-02-2013, 02:06 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I'm sure they can work out a deal with Subban's camp...worst case make it a 1 year deal at compromise amount, both parties buy more time.

Markov said he isn't staying in Russia, based on where he is playing it would make no sense at all.

I don't think Therrien needs any miracles, just a few bounce back seasons(Markov Bourque Kaberle Gionta) and a better record in tight games/OT/SO. We added a lot of grit so that will surely help, I also think Price can do better if for no other reason than a better defense(Bouillon for depth/experience, healthy Markov, Diaz/Emelin with a year under their belt, bounce back for Kaberle).
What if Price gets hurt? (cry)

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01-02-2013, 02:06 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by tinyzombies View Post
I could see Bergevin making some trades as well. We have a lot of surplus. Plus some rookies might surprise.
I could see guys like Weber and Palushaj moved for picks or other young players, they don't seem to fit here.

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01-02-2013, 02:08 PM
  #42
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What if Price gets hurt? (cry)
What if Giroux gets hurt? ...or Richards? ...or Kessel? ...or Spezza? ...or Crosby? ...or Charra?

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01-02-2013, 02:19 PM
  #43
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IF Markov is back to being 100%, or atleast can just get our PP to be top 10, we will finish 6th in the East. Our pk is great, and in previous years, when we had good special teams, our 5on5 was horrible. But not last year, at least not under a real NHL coach in JM, we were 11th in 5on5 scoring under JM last year.

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01-02-2013, 02:22 PM
  #44
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[QUOTE=Marc the Habs Fan;57016559]He won't spend the whole year as a holdout. Come on...

I hope you are right the new CBA might be an obstacle with a lower salary CAP for making a quick agreement with Subban.

The NHL-KHL agreement prevents it.

I was not aware there was such an agreement if he comes back healthy I'm all for it

We aren't. If we don't want him on our roster, he's not on it.

I think Gomez contract start to be interesting for teams who want to respect the salary bottom and don't want to pay the whole salary. If the Canadiens put him on the waiver they have to pay half is salary for this year 2.25M maybe 1.125M if half the season is play and the cap hit would be for the other team 7.35M for the season and 3.6M for the Cap hit. I think if we want to buy out a contract it should be someone else.

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01-02-2013, 02:24 PM
  #45
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IF Markov is back to being 100%, or atleast can just get our PP to be top 10, we will finish 6th in the East. Our pk is great, and in previous years, when we had good special teams, our 5on5 was horrible. But not last year, at least not under a real NHL coach in JM, we were 11th in 5on5 scoring under JM last year.
With a group that includes Diaz Subban Markov Kaberle our point play should be a complete non issue this year. Hopefully our coaches have a better strategy than Cunney's "pass it to the point and bomb away" strategy.

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01-02-2013, 02:38 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Geester76 View Post
f the Canadiens put him on the waiver they have to pay half is salary for this year 2.25M maybe 1.125M if half the season is play and the cap hit would be for the other team 7.35M for the season and 3.6M for the Cap hit. I think if we want to buy out a contract it should be someone else.
Re-entry waivers (the half and half stuff you mention) is reportedly being abolished.

If we put him on waivers, the team that claims him takes on 100% of his cap hit.

But either way...it's not an issue for this year. Even with Gomez counting we have 7.4 M of room in a 70 M cap (which seems like a lock, the NHL keeps proposing it). More than enough to re-sign Subban. Gomez could be in the AHL and still count on our cap in full...and it won't hurt us since I doubt we are buyers anyway.

And yes, there is a KHL-NHL agreement where they respect each other's contracts. Markov can not play in the KHL if the lockout ends.


Quote:
Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
But not last year, at least not under a real NHL coach in JM, we were 11th in 5on5 scoring under JM last year.
It's not the same group of skilled forwards though. And it will be a totally different system so I am not sure what happened over a year ago is relevant.

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Old
01-02-2013, 03:06 PM
  #47
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I still can't get my head around the idea of seeing Michel Therrien behind the Canadiens bench in a few weeks.

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01-02-2013, 03:08 PM
  #48
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[QUOTE=Marc the Habs Fan;57018245]Re-entry waivers (the half and half stuff you mention) is reportedly being abolished.

If we put him on waivers, the team that claims him takes on 100% of his cap hit.
But either way...it's not an issue for this year. Even with Gomez counting we have 7.4 M of room in a 70 M cap (which seems like a lock, the NHL keeps proposing it). More than enough to re-sign Subban. Gomez could be in the AHL and still count on our cap in full...and it won't hurt us since I doubt we are buyers anyway.



This is even better from my point of view. A team who don't want to spend a lot on salary and have a BIG cap hit can invest on Gomez. His salary will drop down next year and have the same cap hit. Gomez isn't worth his salary but he's not THAT bad his main problem his that Glen Sather gave him that contract and than Gainey trade for him... A team like Phoenix in financial jeopardy might want him and even market his name being from a Mexican-American lineage.....

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01-02-2013, 03:45 PM
  #49
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Pacioretty - Desharnais - Cole
Eller - Plekanec - Galchenyuk
Bourque - Gomez - Gionta
Moen - White - Prust
Armstrong/Noke

Gorges - Subban
Markov - Emelin
Kaberle - Diaz
Weber

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01-02-2013, 03:47 PM
  #50
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Oh right, Gomez buyout...

Pacioretty - Desharnais - Cole
Bourque - Plekanec - Galchenyuk
Moen - Eller - Gionta
Prust - White - Armstrong
Noke

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