HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Business of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, and NHL revenues.

Quebec City Part VII: Si J'avais les ailes d'un ange

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-29-2012, 02:32 PM
  #276
Keep Your Head Up
Registered User
 
Keep Your Head Up's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Québec city
Country: Canada
Posts: 86
vCash: 500
I too think PKP would come out winner of a bidding war. He would fork whatever money is needed,; he knows it would turn into profits in a couple o'years max, since he won't have to pay for a tv deal or media coverage(all the media he owns would cover his team).

Keep Your Head Up is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 02:42 PM
  #277
Undertakerqc
Registered User
 
Undertakerqc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,282
vCash: 500
Richelieu is always saying that but its he's own little theory based on nothing. His basis is that an expansion team will cost 500 millions $ anywhere which is completly innacurate. In Toronto it might but nowhere else.

Undertakerqc is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 02:50 PM
  #278
Stanley Cup
Bettman's ice bucket
 
Stanley Cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Quebec City
Country: Martinique
Posts: 1,595
vCash: 58
Buying a team at 400+ M$ would be stupid as the franchise would likely be worth roughly 200M. It'd take him a long time to make up for the potential 200M capital loss.

Stanley Cup is online now  
Old
12-29-2012, 03:07 PM
  #279
Undertakerqc
Registered User
 
Undertakerqc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stanley Cup View Post
Buying a team at 400+ M$ would be stupid as the franchise would likely be worth roughly 200M. It'd take him a long time to make up for the potential 200M capital loss.
An expansion franchise anywhere but Toronto will cost a maximum of 300 millions dollars.

Undertakerqc is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 03:14 PM
  #280
Confucius
Registered User
 
Confucius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,486
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patofqc View Post
An expansion franchise anywhere but Toronto will cost a maximum of 300 millions dollars.
Id say maximum 150. existing teams sell for less than 300 million and they get all types of things thrown in, arena's, neighbouring real estate developing rights. Asking 300 million than telling a guy to workout getting an arena on top of that is way too expensive.

Confucius is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 03:50 PM
  #281
Stanley Cup
Bettman's ice bucket
 
Stanley Cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Quebec City
Country: Martinique
Posts: 1,595
vCash: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stix and Stones View Post
Id say maximum 150. existing teams sell for less than 300 million and they get all types of things thrown in, arena's, neighbouring real estate developing rights. Asking 300 million than telling a guy to workout getting an arena on top of that is way too expensive.
Idea behind high relocation fees and high price for expansion franchises is to prevent owners from simply buying and selling quickly to make a profit. You make sure they keep the team until it is worth the price they paid for it.

Stanley Cup is online now  
Old
12-29-2012, 04:13 PM
  #282
Stanley Cup
Bettman's ice bucket
 
Stanley Cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Quebec City
Country: Martinique
Posts: 1,595
vCash: 58
Last relocation fee was 60M, that's about 2M for each of the 29 other owners. You really think billionaires and ultra wealthy people will starve for 2M$? A pro sports franchise is nothing more than a toy that happens to create a big circle of connections and that is worth much more than any profit they can make with their club IMHO.

Stanley Cup is online now  
Old
12-29-2012, 04:18 PM
  #283
Killion
Global Moderator
 
Killion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Casablanca
Country: Morocco
Posts: 21,779
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keep Your Head Up View Post
I don't think the league's reflexion is that poussée (couldn't find the english word). Pretty sure making as much money as they can with this is what they have in mind.
The words you seek are "thrust" (literal translation of poussee) or "doctrine". Their philosophy, objective, direction, .... and yes, its really all about the $$$, franchise values, which have grown at phenomenal rates since the last lockout, let alone since 2000, 1990.

Killion is online now  
Old
12-29-2012, 04:19 PM
  #284
Keep Your Head Up
Registered User
 
Keep Your Head Up's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Québec city
Country: Canada
Posts: 86
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stanley Cup View Post
Idea behind high relocation fees and high price for expansion franchises is to prevent owners from simply buying and selling quickly to make a profit. You make sure they keep the team until it is worth the price they paid for it.
I don't think the league'sreflexion is that poussée(couldn't find the english word). Pretty sure making money is all they have in mind, like any business would.


Last edited by Killion: 12-29-2012 at 04:21 PM. Reason: yes... see my post above. Understood your meaning. Deleted earlier post.
Keep Your Head Up is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 04:25 PM
  #285
Stanley Cup
Bettman's ice bucket
 
Stanley Cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Quebec City
Country: Martinique
Posts: 1,595
vCash: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
The words you seek are "thrust" (literal translation of poussee) or "doctrine". Their philosophy, objective, direction, .... and yes, its really all about the $$$, franchise values, which have grown at phenomenal rates since the last lockout, let alone since 2000, 1990.
Disagree, don't you think the league is looking at steady owners? Why would you care about your franchise's worth if you don't intend to sell it? That's unless, of course, the team is bought by a company (legal entity) instead of a natural person in which case it would affect it's accountability.

Stanley Cup is online now  
Old
12-29-2012, 05:37 PM
  #286
Killion
Global Moderator
 
Killion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Casablanca
Country: Morocco
Posts: 21,779
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stanley Cup View Post
Disagree, don't you think the league is looking at steady owners? Why would you care about your franchise's worth if you don't intend to sell it? That's unless, of course, the team is bought by a company (legal entity) instead of a natural person in which case it would affect it's accountability.
They are, all of them, over the past 5-7-10-20yrs, bought to be sold. Operate under various LLC's & partnerships. Umbrella organizations. The team itself simply the emotional quotient in far grander schemes, be it real estate plays, media & content interests, tax & subsidy advantages, you name it. The Old Guard, the Jacobs, Snider's etc, all concerned now about "Legacy" issues, maybe winning once or twice more before they check out for good. Only in the cradles of hockey, Canada, the Northeast, and even then not exactly mandated, do you find the league or really a whole lot of the fans giving a tinkers about Owner A, B or C's actual "integrity", munificence & benevolence.

Killion is online now  
Old
12-29-2012, 09:12 PM
  #287
GF
Registered User
 
GF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 413
vCash: 500
I don't think PKP is stupid enough to pay over 200m$ for an expansion team. He's sitting on a great market, his own tv deal, will soon have the newest, most modern hockey venue in north america and all this while many franchise are struggling to make ends meet.

Why would he pay for a new franchise? Just wait, no rush, the new arena is still two 33months away. Chances are a franchise will need a great market, a tv deal and a new arena by then. Thrashers sold for 170m$, Blues for 150m$, no way this guy will be dumb enough to pay more to get an expansion team. No way. I don't believe this.

GF is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 09:15 PM
  #288
Confucius
Registered User
 
Confucius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,486
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GF View Post
I don't think PKP is stupid enough to pay over 200m$ for an expansion team. He's sitting on a great market, his own tv deal, will soon have the newest, most modern hockey venue in north america and all this while many franchise are struggling to make ends meet.

Why would he pay for a new franchise? Just wait, no rush, the new arena is still two 33months away. Chances are a franchise will need a great market, a tv deal and a new arena by then. Thrashers sold for 170m$, Blues for 150m$, no way this guy will be dumb enough to pay more to get an expansion team. No way. I don't believe this.
I thought it was just me:

Confucius is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 09:21 PM
  #289
Undertakerqc
Registered User
 
Undertakerqc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GF View Post
I don't think PKP is stupid enough to pay over 200m$ for an expansion team. He's sitting on a great market, his own tv deal, will soon have the newest, most modern hockey venue in north america and all this while many franchise are struggling to make ends meet.

Why would he pay for a new franchise? Just wait, no rush, the new arena is still two 33months away. Chances are a franchise will need a great market, a tv deal and a new arena by then. Thrashers sold for 170m$, Blues for 150m$, no way this guy will be dumb enough to pay more to get an expansion team. No way. I don't believe this.
This guy needs a team badly. His entire media strategy in Quebec is based on it. He started a new sport TV channel with the hope of getting a team to fill the airway. He needs content badly for his mobile phones products. An NHL franchise come available so rarely. Trust me he will pay what it will take to get a team when one becomes available, expansion team or not.

Undertakerqc is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 09:46 PM
  #290
No Fun Shogun
Global Moderator
34-38-61-10-13
 
No Fun Shogun's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Chicagoland, IL
Country: Fiji
Posts: 25,050
vCash: 50
Well let's not forget that if there is an expansion, I really doubt that we're going to be talking about much more than a hundred million dollars for an expansion fee. If it reaches $200 million or more, essentially everybody would balk at that, especially from interested buyers in America. Even if they wanted more from some markets versus others, doubt we'd be talking about a massive gulf like $100 million for Seattle and $200+ million for Quebec City.

No Fun Shogun is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 09:59 PM
  #291
Undertakerqc
Registered User
 
Undertakerqc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,282
vCash: 500
Just looked at this and it just reminded me how crazy NHL hockey would be in Québec. Man they filled the arena for this Quebec vs Montreal series made up of beer league players but coached by former NHL coach. Here on this video, Bob Hartley (Québec Head coach) and Patrice Brisebois (Montreal assistant coach) had choice words for one another

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oU5atKb7fbM

Undertakerqc is offline  
Old
12-29-2012, 10:24 PM
  #292
GF
Registered User
 
GF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 413
vCash: 500
At this point, I think the NHL needs PKP a lot more than PKP needs the NHL.

I guess time will tell. But if PKP agrees to pay 200m$ or more for an expansion team he's definately not the smart business man I thought he was and deserves what's coming his way.

GF is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 11:28 AM
  #293
GordonGraham
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,862
vCash: 500
Maybe that was his plan all along , not minding overpaying for the team since he got 100% publicly financed building

GordonGraham is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 11:38 AM
  #294
Keep Your Head Up
Registered User
 
Keep Your Head Up's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Québec city
Country: Canada
Posts: 86
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GF View Post
I don't think PKP is stupid enough to pay over 200m$ for an expansion team. He's sitting on a great market, his own tv deal, will soon have the newest, most modern hockey venue in north america and all this while many franchise are struggling to make ends meet.

Why would he pay for a new franchise? Just wait, no rush, the new arena is still two 33months away. Chances are a franchise will need a great market, a tv deal and a new arena by then. Thrashers sold for 170m$, Blues for 150m$, no way this guy will be dumb enough to pay more to get an expansion team. No way. I don't believe this.
I really hope the asking fee for a franchise will be around the numbers you evoked. As for the bolded, what worries me is that Bettman doesn't seem to be in a hurry to move money losing franchises, doesn't he

Keep Your Head Up is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 11:43 AM
  #295
Keep Your Head Up
Registered User
 
Keep Your Head Up's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Québec city
Country: Canada
Posts: 86
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GF View Post
At this point, I think the NHL needs PKP a lot more than PKP needs the NHL.

I guess time will tell. But if PKP agrees to pay 200m$ or more for an expansion team he's definately not the smart business man I thought he was and deserves what's coming his way.
Again, just because the league needs something doesn't mean Bettman will do it. He is a stubborn, stubborn man.

Many seem to assume a bunch teams will move, but what if he doesn't plan to move more than one team? A bidding war would then ensue between those markets in the hunt, driving the price up.
Hoppefully that price won't be too hefty


Last edited by Keep Your Head Up: 12-30-2012 at 11:49 AM.
Keep Your Head Up is offline  
Old
12-30-2012, 11:45 AM
  #296
McRib
2nd Rate Fan
 
McRib's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Saskatoon
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,466
vCash: 500
I still think it'll be the Coyotes moving. Jamison needs to close the deal by this time next month. I don't think he will.

McRib is offline  
Old
01-02-2013, 07:06 PM
  #297
madhi19
Registered User
 
madhi19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Cold and Dark place!
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,195
vCash: 500
The lockout could end this week maybe it good news for Nordiques fans. I speculated a while ago that a good way to divert attention at the end of the lockout would be to immediately announce after a CBA deak either an expansion to Qc or a relocation.

madhi19 is offline  
Old
01-02-2013, 08:33 PM
  #298
CHRDANHUTCH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Auburn, Maine
Country: United States
Posts: 14,853
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to CHRDANHUTCH Send a message via MSN to CHRDANHUTCH Send a message via Yahoo to CHRDANHUTCH
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoobs View Post
I still think it'll be the Coyotes moving. Jamison needs to close the deal by this time next month. I don't think he will.
Once the lockout ends, Scoobs, wasn't there already a MOU that the NHL already has Jamison approved, they just couldn't focus until a new CBA....

Isn't it also true that Glendale already has passed a lease agreement.... one thing Bettman also said Jamison was working on when the lockout interrupted the proceedings and suspended league business.

CHRDANHUTCH is offline  
Old
01-02-2013, 09:43 PM
  #299
Material Defender
Registered User
 
Material Defender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Country: Canada
Posts: 470
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CHRDANHUTCH View Post
Once the lockout ends, Scoobs, wasn't there already a MOU that the NHL already has Jamison approved, they just couldn't focus until a new CBA....

Isn't it also true that Glendale already has passed a lease agreement.... one thing Bettman also said Jamison was working on when the lockout interrupted the proceedings and suspended league business.
That all may be true but still, GJ HAS to buy this team! We still have to wait and see... My thoughts on this is that Yotes are stayin' but just until there are more than one buyer (PKP) to relocate them. In a couple of months, Seattle and Markham may be good contenders...

In the end, 'Yotes will move to Seattle. Quebec City and Markham will get expansion teams. May not be fair for Quebec fans but hey, remember good ol' Gary is not willing to lose face again after loosing the Thrashers to Canada!


Last edited by Material Defender: 01-02-2013 at 09:55 PM.
Material Defender is offline  
Old
01-02-2013, 10:00 PM
  #300
CHRDANHUTCH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Auburn, Maine
Country: United States
Posts: 14,853
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to CHRDANHUTCH Send a message via MSN to CHRDANHUTCH Send a message via Yahoo to CHRDANHUTCH
Quote:
Originally Posted by Material Defender View Post
That all may be true but still, GJ HAS to buy this team! We still have to wait and see...
Material:

all the BOG has to do is approve him, something they couldn't do until the CBA, unless there's some issue other than the lease.... why would the deal fall apart if publically there's no League business nor has PKP signed an intent letter much like TNSE/Chipman/Thomson did w/ the Thrashers....

CHRDANHUTCH is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:16 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.