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Why can't Czech Republic, Finland, Slovakia produce any great skaters anymore?

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Old
01-03-2013, 04:39 PM
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
Which one of those is a good skater? They're all anywhere from average to below average. Or did you not read the first post in this thread?

It's disappointing to see how many people just straight up haven't read the first post. It mentions speed, mobility, etc. several times. It's clearly not a thread about the quality of players but about their skating.
That is also just an opinion, once again I guess it is just me, but I see nothing wrong with Hertl's stride, speed and lateral movement. His acceleration could use some work but has already improved a bunch from last year. I wouldn't call him a weak skater, heck consider his size I would probably call him above average, if he gets a more explosive first step he is flat out elite. His problem is it takes him three steps to get to top flight, but once he is there make no mistake he is a very fast hockey player.

So you can bag on a couple these guys but two or three listed have acceleration problems, not outright speed problems. A factor to be sure, but not nearly as bad as the picture painted in the OP in my opinion. Now that does point to the power skating point also probably the fact (this is pure speculation) that they might not do the kind of lifting and lower body exercises most North American coaches and programs make kids do over here.

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01-03-2013, 04:48 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by fahad203 View Post
I suspect poor economy in the past 5 years has something to do with it. Hockey is an expensive sports as it is. Manage local hockey teams are even tougher slovaks not having infrastructure like Finland or Sweden.
In Finland the warm winters of the past 15 or so years(with the 2010 and 2011 being exceptions) have done their fair share of damage.

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01-03-2013, 04:51 PM
  #53
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demographically, all those countries, like the rest of Europe, are dying (so to speak). They'll have a smaller and smaller pool of talent to draw from in the future.

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01-03-2013, 05:14 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by who_me? View Post
demographically, all those countries, like the rest of Europe, are dying (so to speak). They'll have a smaller and smaller pool of talent to draw from in the future.
Huh, why?
I can't quite see why would example Finland and Sweden do any worst in the future. For Finland it seems like we have hit the rock bottom and are now coming back with promising, young talent pool. Sweden of course has been constantly growing great players on the younger age groups.
To me the only reason for Finnish hockey to see major decline would be if football finally would take the country in storm. Though in Sweden, like rest of the Europe, football is number one and swedes seem to do just fine.


EDIT: I hope you are not talking about economics btw (Fox news much?). Countries were hockey is popular is the growing part of Europe in population and economically.


Last edited by Tissotti: 01-03-2013 at 05:24 PM.
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01-03-2013, 08:56 PM
  #55
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Just to clarify by good skaters I was not speaking of skilled players on the ice but rather skating ability. Sorry for the confusion.

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01-03-2013, 09:00 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by slovakiasnextone View Post
And if it is just about B, why the hell is Finland included in this topic?
Because of their elite prospects produced recently (Armia, Granlund, Pulkinnen, Barkov, etc) how many of these players can be considered really good skaters?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
Which one of those is a good skater? They're all anywhere from average to below average. Or did you not read the first post in this thread?

It's disappointing to see how many people just straight up haven't read the first post. It mentions speed, mobility, etc. several times. It's clearly not a thread about the quality of players but about their skating.
Thank you, I'm glad someone understood, although I could have been a bit more clear perhaps.

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01-03-2013, 09:17 PM
  #57
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To fix this problem, i think Slovakia and the Czech Republic should merge again and become Czechoslovakia one more time. Finland should merge and become a part of Sweden just like before 1809. Think about the unbelievable hockey we would witness between Canada, USA, Russia, Sweden and Czechoslovakia. My co-worker who was born in the former Czechoslovakia but recently moved to Toronto, was talking about the Gold Medals the last twenty years Czechoslovakia could have

achieved in the WJC, WC and Olympics. They would have been arguably the top country in the world in hockey right up there with Canada the last two decades. For my entertainment purposes, and because i like seeing great hockey, i urge the people of the Czech Republic and Slovakia to merge again. Finland should become part of Sweden just like two hundred years ago. This solves the problem of these three nations not producing great skaters, and results in great hockey for the fans of this sport. It is a win-win situation. Make it happen the citizens of these three countries.

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01-03-2013, 09:52 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Mehar View Post
To fix this problem, i think Slovakia and the Czech Republic should merge again and become Czechoslovakia one more time. Finland should merge and become a part of Sweden just like before 1809. Think about the unbelievable hockey we would witness between Canada, USA, Russia, Sweden and Czechoslovakia. My co-worker who was born in the former Czechoslovakia but recently moved to Toronto, was talking about the Gold Medals the last twenty years Czechoslovakia could have

achieved in the WJC, WC and Olympics. They would have been arguably the top country in the world in hockey right up there with Canada the last two decades. For my entertainment purposes, and because i like seeing great hockey, i urge the people of the Czech Republic and Slovakia to merge again. Finland should become part of Sweden just like two hundred years ago. This solves the problem of these three nations not producing great skaters, and results in great hockey for the fans of this sport. It is a win-win situation. Make it happen the citizens of these three countries.
Ya...I don't think this will happen anytime soon....

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01-03-2013, 10:31 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Mehar View Post
To fix this problem, i think Slovakia and the Czech Republic should merge again and become Czechoslovakia one more time. Finland should merge and become a part of Sweden
I stopped reading at this part.


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01-03-2013, 11:01 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
I stopped reading at this part.

I do not care if you stopped reading. If Finland became part of Sweden again just like it was over two hundred years ago, look at the unbelievable hockey team that would be assembled on the world stage. Czechoslovakia and the new country of Sweden would be fighting for the top spot. They would be ahead of Canada, Russia, and the US. You Finns complain about your team choking on the world stage all the

time, and when i give you a good option of having Finland become part of Sweden again, you scoff. For hockey purposes, the unification of Sweden and Finland would be amazing. Same with Czechoslovakia. I urge the citizens of Finland, Slovakia and the Czech Republic to make it happen for my entertainment purposes, and for the betterment of the game of hockey. Forget the political BS. It should be done for hockey purposes.

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01-03-2013, 11:38 PM
  #61
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Czechs and Slovaks for one would do well to unite for international competitions. Czechoslovakia was a pretty big country and won lots of medals. Been harder when Czech and Slovak have been separated. Just looking at the senior teams now. If you combined Hossa, Chara, and Gaborik with the Czech guys they'd be a big hockey power but separately they're both just ok.

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01-04-2013, 12:29 AM
  #62
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Why don't we just merge Canada and the US, that is on par with what some of you're saying here.

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01-04-2013, 12:33 AM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedWings19405 View Post
Why don't we just merge Canada and the US, that is on par with what some of you're saying here.
Czechoslovakia was a country from 1918-1993 and was a great hockey nation during that time. Obviously politics would prevent that from happening but in a "what could have been" sort of way it would benefit international hockey to get another power instead of two pretty good nations. Sweden and Finland have not been united for a very long time so obviously that is a bit more silly.

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01-04-2013, 06:55 AM
  #64
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Yeah, let's simply put aside all these different national entities, whatever differences in culture and language the countries can have... and most importantly, their whole national identities, and rejoin as countries... for what? So that we could have a kick-backside hockey team!

...riiiiiiiight.






The countries are not joining, so talking about what kind of combined teams they might have is a moot point. Even if passable as a fantasy "what if" -scenario, one really has to wonder what another is thinking if they're suggesting something like this with an apparently straight face, especially if the only reason is for this one given purpose.

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01-04-2013, 07:10 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mehar View Post
I do not care if you stopped reading. If Finland became part of Sweden again just like it was over two hundred years....
Just give Canada back to indians and polar bears like it was to stop this kind of opinions. People like mehar would unite to USA and get at least some kind of common sense. Also united north american hockey team would become better :

With Sweden, we totally agree on 1 following thing at least:

Sweden do not want to unite with Finland.

Finland do not want Swedish players to ruin our hockey team.

Couldn't happen.


Last edited by QnebO: 01-04-2013 at 07:19 AM.
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01-04-2013, 07:13 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
In Finland the warm winters of the past 15 or so years(with the 2010 and 2011 being exceptions) have done their fair share of damage.
I'd say past 5-8 years or so, with those exceptions. But it hasn't even affected the outside hockey rinks, they have been iced every year, just like they are now.

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01-04-2013, 07:36 AM
  #67
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Only Canada has more year-round ice rinks per capita than Finland. Infrastructure, accessibility and popularity of the sport aren't the problem in Finland even though it is an expensive sport. Hockey's still a very attractive option for the most athletically gifted kids just because it's much "easier" for a Finnish kid to became a well-paid pro player in hockey than pretty much in any other sport. BUT we really need some new, young quality players and NHL stars - let's just hope our current top prospects like Granlund, Armia, Teräväinen, Vatanen, Määttä, Barkov etc. can eventually make it in the NHL.


Last edited by premadonna: 01-04-2013 at 07:49 AM.
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01-04-2013, 07:39 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by QnebO View Post
I'd say past 5-8 years or so, with those exceptions. But it hasn't even affected the outside hockey rinks, they have been iced every year, just like they are now.
Oh it's been longer than that. The outside hockey rinks are mostly affected by the warm weather in November and December. In the 80's and early 90's, the natural ice rinks were commonly in place where I live (southwest coast of Finland) in early December at the latest.

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01-04-2013, 08:04 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QnebO View Post
Just give Canada back to indians and polar bears like it was to stop this kind of opinions. People like mehar would unite to USA and get at least some kind of common sense. Also united north american hockey team would become better :

With Sweden, we totally agree on 1 following thing at least:

Sweden do not want to unite with Finland.

Finland do not want Swedish players to ruin our hockey team.

Couldn't happen.
To me as a Swede, Finland is still a vasal state to the Kingdom of Sweden. We pretty much own Finland.

Thus the Finish gold at the IIHF world championship 2011 really is Swedish.


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01-04-2013, 08:53 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Tomas W View Post
To me as a Swede, Finland is still a vasal state to the Kingdom of Sweden. We pretty much own Finland.

Thus the Finish gold at the IIHF world championship 2011 really is Swedish.

Sweden really was drawn in to the world map literally only because of Finnish hakkapeliitat, so basicly how the things are saw today is that Finland was the core of the Sweden, and therefore all swedish history basicly is really finnish..

Arguing with you Swedes is usually really fun, unless its hockey game (against any one, you wont cheer for us) that we are losing.


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01-04-2013, 09:39 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by Tomas W View Post
Thus the Finish gold at the IIHF world championship 2011 really is Swedish.
Finland has the distinction of being the country that has won the WHC gold medal game with the widest margin.

So I guess that makes Sweden the biggest winner and the biggest loser at the same time?


No wonder there's this Nordic grand plan to collectively battle schitzophrenia by establishing brand new wards to each country... one to Oslo, one to Copenhagen, one to Helsinki... and as a final step, they're going to erect a huge fence around Stockholm.

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01-04-2013, 12:06 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedWings19405 View Post
Why don't we just merge Canada and the US, that is on par with what some of you're saying here.
You are being silly. Canada and US was never one country. Czechoslovakia was a country up until twenty years back like an another poster mentioned. Finland was a part of Sweden up until 1809. Okay, so my idea of Finland merging with Sweden to create a super hockey team was a far fetched idea, but for international purposes,

having the Czechs and Slovaks as one hockey team is not far fetched. I got the idea talking with my co-worker here in Toronto, who still considers himself "Czechoslovakian". Instead of two average hockey nations, Czechoslovakia would be a world power in hockey.

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01-04-2013, 01:29 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by WarriorofTime View Post
Czechs and Slovaks for one would do well to unite for international competitions. Czechoslovakia was a pretty big country and won lots of medals. Been harder when Czech and Slovak have been separated. Just looking at the senior teams now. If you combined Hossa, Chara, and Gaborik with the Czech guys they'd be a big hockey power but separately they're both just ok.
The Czech Rep has continued to rack up medals since 1993.

If we are going to consider the Czech Rep an "average" or "ok" hockey nation than there are only like 2 or 3 above average or better than OK hockey nations in the world. As it stands now at the senior level they are a legit contender in any tournament they enter.


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01-04-2013, 02:28 PM
  #74
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You are being silly. Canada and US was never one country.
You know, technically they were actually, since both started out as British colonies.

In fact, they share more common ancestry than the Finns and the Swedes or the Czechs and the Slovaks, given how they've been self-identifying ethnic groups with their own languages and customs since at least the 16th century - no matter what Crown they served. Wheras by that time, there was no one who possibly be identified as an American or a Canadian, you were all Brits.

So it's no less far fetched than suggesting Finland and Sweden should combine, given how the Americans stopped bowing to the King of England after the Revolution, mere 40 years before the Finns and the Swedes departed. Your common ancestry is even more hemmed in by the fact that you Canadians still do so.

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01-04-2013, 02:30 PM
  #75
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Mirtle commented on this in the lounge the other day

Should tweet him and get him to show up again

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