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The Official Arena Thread Part 6

View Poll Results: On what day will city council vote to finalize a new arena for Edmonton's downtown?
Between now and Christmas 2012 8 7.41%
Between New Year's Day and the end of February 2013 30 27.78%
Between March and July, 2013 16 14.81%
Before the October 2013 civic election 14 12.96%
Not until 2014 4 3.70%
Not until 2015 3 2.78%
Not until 2016 1 0.93%
Not until 2017 6 5.56%
Never 26 24.07%
Voters: 108. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
01-04-2013, 10:28 AM
  #776
Gord
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
You don't honestly believe this do you?

How is it not going to take away from current lottery monies?

You think the guy that goes and puts $20 in VLT's everyday after work is now going to still put in that same $20 into VLT's and pul out a new $20 to put into Keno?

Or do you now believe that people like me who don't bother with VLT's will now be lining up at the bars to go play Keno?

I don't have any problem with using lottery money like this for public projects however when this new stream of money is going to take away from current monies going to charties(current VLT revenues) and such it isn't really a great idea.
sorry. I don't think there would be more revenues generated, just people would spend their gambling money a different way.
so, no, I can't see people spending more to play an Oiler Keno game, and I can't see many people starting to gamble just to help buy a new arena.

So you are right. some of the revenue that would normally go to other charities and the governent revenue would be redirected to the arena. The only way to adjust for that would be to decrease the chances of winning by another few percent.

i'm not a huge wildrose fan by any means, but I guess my thoughts got a bit screwy as I was a bit irked by the fellow who was throwing around all the vitroil towards them.

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01-04-2013, 10:37 AM
  #777
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They can bring that Keno in, but it should just be another added game to the gambling system. Them selling it as the way to pay for the 100mil shortfall is just stupid.

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01-04-2013, 11:17 AM
  #778
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They can bring that Keno in, but it should just be another added game to the gambling system. Them selling it as the way to pay for the 100mil shortfall is just stupid.
Exactly because any smart person would realize that the money is coming from the governments gaming and gambling revenues anyhow.

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01-04-2013, 11:20 AM
  #779
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Exactly because any smart person would realize that the money is coming from the governments gaming and gambling revenues anyhow.
They seem to be so dead set against a direct funding, but in reality they are just wasting so much time finding another way so this can be considered non-direct.

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01-04-2013, 11:23 AM
  #780
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They seem to be so dead set against a direct funding, but in reality they are just wasting so much time finding another way so this can be considered non-direct.
Pretty much same **** different pile & it's all about saving public face. Hopefully the charaties that stand to lose will speak up and get some media attention.

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01-04-2013, 11:33 AM
  #781
joestevens29
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Pretty much same **** different pile & it's all about saving public face. Hopefully the charaties that stand to lose will speak up and get some media attention.
Katz should just donate to some of the charities. Can't he write a part of it off?

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01-04-2013, 11:40 AM
  #782
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
They seem to be so dead set against a direct funding, but in reality they are just wasting so much time finding another way so this can be considered non-direct.
it really seems that way doesn't it? then why not just come out and fund it directly... the whole idea of robbing peter to pay paul isn't going to fool anybody.... the people who are against direct funding are still going to be against this indirect funding model, and the people are are for direct funding aren't going to care one way or the other

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01-04-2013, 11:44 AM
  #783
joestevens29
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Originally Posted by jadeddog View Post
it really seems that way doesn't it? then why not just come out and fund it directly... the whole idea of robbing peter to pay paul isn't going to fool anybody.... the people who are against direct funding are still going to be against this indirect funding model, and the people are are for direct funding aren't going to care one way or the other
It's politics. Nothing new here. Trying to please as many people as possible to get re-elected.

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01-04-2013, 11:45 AM
  #784
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Katz should just donate to some of the charities. Can't he write a part of it off?
You mean like how every member of his family and extended family make the max contributions to the Conservative party.

But yes a corporation can wrtite off 100% of charity donations for tax purposes within 75% of their net income.

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01-04-2013, 11:46 AM
  #785
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You mean like how every member of his family and extended family make the max contributions to the Conservative party.

But yes a corporation can wrtite off 100% of charity donations for tax purposes within 75% of their net income.
See you understand it.

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01-04-2013, 11:46 AM
  #786
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Originally Posted by jadeddog View Post
it really seems that way doesn't it? then why not just come out and fund it directly... the whole idea of robbing peter to pay paul isn't going to fool anybody.... the people who are against direct funding are still going to be against this indirect funding model, and the people are are for direct funding aren't going to care one way or the other
Ummm...yes it will.

Does advertising convince/sway people?

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01-04-2013, 11:48 AM
  #787
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Ummm...yes it will.

Does advertising convince/sway people?
I have yet to buy one tampon or maxipad, so no it doesn't sway people.

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:53 AM
  #788
Reimer
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I have yet to buy one tampon or maxipad, so no it doesn't sway people.
LOL I wonder why.

Regardless my point is that setting up the $100M shortfall to be paid by a new lottery's monies is basically a form of advertising/PR that may not sway everyone but it will definitly mak Joe citizen think they created and found a new revenue stream to help them out.

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01-04-2013, 11:54 AM
  #789
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LOL I wonder why.

Regardless my point is that setting up the $100M shortfall to be paid by a new lottery's monies is basically a form of advertising/PR that may not sway everyone but it will definitly mak Joe citizen think they created and found a new revenue stream to help them out.
i guess i think that the average person is smarter than you do.... which is kinda scary considering i don't think the average person is very smart, lol

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01-04-2013, 12:01 PM
  #790
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i guess i think that the average person is smarter than you do.... which is kinda scary considering i don't think the average person is very smart, lol
No again you're making the assumption that the average person is a free thinker.

I was out for a few beers last night and over heard some guys in their 40's talking and these are a few golden lines from their convo.

"Oh man I really hope they get this deal done but with the way it's shaping up now it's too bad they could have started the season under last years deal so that we would have Hopkins, Hall, Eberle, Yakumov all playing together. Now it's guaranteed that we will lose at least one of thme if not 2."

Then like 2 minutes later after exchanging some convo with his buddy this is what he had to say:

"**** them, ****ing idiots I hope they just implode the whole ****ing thing and lose this season, next season and 5 ****ing seasons for all I care. Start it all over and build it from the ground up properly."

My first comment to my buddy was that this dude will be there opening night for sure.

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01-04-2013, 12:14 PM
  #791
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Still, EVERYONE I talk to about this arena situation says a deal will get done.

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01-04-2013, 12:20 PM
  #792
Reimer
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Still, EVERYONE I talk to about this arena situation says a deal will get done.
No doubt about it. I've never once thought it would never get done. I mean there have already been workers in the area working underground for the last year.

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01-04-2013, 12:36 PM
  #793
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You mean like how every member of his family and extended family make the max contributions to the Conservative party.

But yes a corporation can wrtite off 100% of charity donations for tax purposes within 75% of their net income.
Funding political parties should be illegal. Such a scam.

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01-04-2013, 12:47 PM
  #794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
You don't honestly believe this do you?

How is it not going to take away from current lottery monies?

You think the guy that goes and puts $20 in VLT's everyday after work is now going to still put in that same $20 into VLT's and pul out a new $20 to put into Keno?

Or do you now believe that people like me who don't bother with VLT's will now be lining up at the bars to go play Keno?

I don't have any problem with using lottery money like this for public projects however when this new stream of money is going to take away from current monies going to charties(current VLT revenues) and such it isn't really a great idea.
If built up properly like it is in BC, then yeah, it wouldn't really take away from other gambling. It's something that gamblers in BC just grab a handful of tickets for, and then either go to their table games or slots and forget about them until they are ready to leave, then go check their tickets.

Keno in BC was in the same spot it was here, making no money. Then they converted it into something that supports the Canucks, and all of a sudden people came out to play it. People are a lot more passionate about sports teams then you might think.

You want to talk about something that needs to be removed, you mentioned it multiple times in your post. VLT's. Very little monies from those go to charities (because they are not in a licensed casino) and most of the money gets split between the bar and the government. Or maybe we can take some of the governments chunk of that for the rink.

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01-06-2013, 04:28 AM
  #795
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Can anyone give a clueless Uni student any idea of what's going in with the arena? This thread is just way too deep for me to understand it.. Just looking for an overall idea; positive, negative? Gonna get done, probably? Not gonna get done probably?

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01-06-2013, 05:23 AM
  #796
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Originally Posted by ChokeOnOil View Post
Can anyone give a clueless Uni student any idea of what's going in with the arena? This thread is just way too deep for me to understand it.. Just looking for an overall idea; positive, negative? Gonna get done, probably? Not gonna get done probably?
Opinions vary and no matter what transpires some folks will be upset. I think most people agree we need arena, I think a majority of people like the concept behind a new downtown arena but how it gets funded and by whom seems to be the larger part of the debate. Now that hockey has resumed perhaps it will be an easier sell and may speed up negotiations. I find it interesting that the WR party has shown some interest in the arena debate, it can only mean they are lobbying for votes in the next election.

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01-06-2013, 05:37 AM
  #797
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The arena is going to destroy the rest. Tons of research done.

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01-06-2013, 06:15 AM
  #798
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The arena is going to destroy the rest. Tons of research done.
Do you have a source or a link to any of this so called new info or are you just rambling ?

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01-06-2013, 06:25 AM
  #799
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Do you have a source or a link to any of this so called new info or are you just rambling ?
My lockout source is the same one. Oilers locker room is 2.5x bigger than any other team

Underground player parking and personnel parking. Lots of other stuff I can't talk about

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01-06-2013, 08:58 AM
  #800
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If built up properly like it is in BC, then yeah, it wouldn't really take away from other gambling. It's something that gamblers in BC just grab a handful of tickets for, and then either go to their table games or slots and forget about them until they are ready to leave, then go check their tickets.

Keno in BC was in the same spot it was here, making no money. Then they converted it into something that supports the Canucks, and all of a sudden people came out to play it. People are a lot more passionate about sports teams then you might think.
I think I agree that it's possible if done well. Look at the 50-50 draws at sporting events, over a short time they pull in a significant amount of cash and it's not taking away from other gambling revenues. It ends up being a tax on sports fans. Put it in sports bars and dont price it to high and it becomes something you just drop a couple bucks on now and then, more like a lotto ticket than VLT's or Casino games.

I do think the Wildrose are being hypocritical and trying to score political points for bringing the idea forward but it could work, the question is what happens if the revenues fall short?

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