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Don Cherry rants about foreign players in the CHL

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01-05-2013, 06:46 AM
  #126
CR15
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I don't mind Don at all but sorry I would rather see the Yakupov's and Landeskogs in the OHL than than Jonny junior B talent who got cut.

I'd rather see more high end guys continue to come over and make the talent level higher going to games is not getting any cheaper so I want to enjoy the highest quality of players possible.

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01-05-2013, 06:51 AM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Jet View Post
I'm not going to get into the whole how many foreign players should be in the CHL debate.

I came here to say one thing: I know Don Cherry personally. He is absolutely NOT a racist man. Anyone who knows him on a real level knows that.

He is patriotic, sometimes misguided, and absolutely old school. I don't agree with everything he says but I am really glad he says what he feels. Its up to you to decide if you agree with him or not.
I think the problem is that whilst his views are actually xenophobic or racist. The way the media has changed in these days makes it like they should be perceived as that because of the PC culture we live in. When they're not.

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01-05-2013, 07:32 AM
  #128
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As one who has though an "import limit" has been ridiculous for a long time, I obviously disagree with Cherry's comments. Guy is just an old fool who's "best by" date passed a decade ago.

Limiting player numbers by birthplace just doesn't make any sense. Why limit the talent level willingly? It'd be as dumb as saying a team can only have 2 right hand shooters.

IMO, these artificial limits are why most grinder types in NHL are Canadians/north Americans. CHL teams only want top end non-NA talent due to these limits, hence 3rd or 4th line types are never seen over here for the most part, never really have the chance.

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01-05-2013, 07:54 AM
  #129
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I find it sad that he thinks this, the foreign players in the CHL need to give up just as much to come and play in the CHL. They leave their home in their own country at 16 years old and come up and play in Rouyn Noranda living in a basement of someone that he does not know, speaking a language that is foreign to him as well. Hats off to foreign guys who come and play in NA. They need to travel on buses for long hours and have a terrible schedule until the off season rolls around. These kids care about their future enough to want to learn more about the way that hockey is played in NA and adapt their development to it. Just seems like a logical step for guys like Grigorenko and Yakupov to come and play in the CHL.

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01-05-2013, 08:21 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by BonMorrison View Post
Thoughts? Personally I find Cherry to be a xenophobic dinosaur but I'm interested in hearing other opinions on his thoughts on the CHL.
Sounds like sour grapes to me!

Sorry, I couldn't resist and it is the truth.

I find it rather distatseful when people have to put the blame somewhere, why can't it just be that Sweden (Russia and the US too)had a better team?

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01-05-2013, 08:36 AM
  #131
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It's a damn shame that we have people in this world that love their country as much as Cherry loves Canada. Shame on him.

I don't think it is an anti-foreigner thing with Cherry. I took it as the CHL brings in these players, trains them, makes them better, and then Canadians get pissed when these players beat Team Canada on the National level. Think it is also his way of simply saying how the CHL is the best league in the world for developing young players.

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01-05-2013, 10:15 AM
  #132
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There are lots of Junior B and Major Midget kids who have not peaked yet and thereby get squeezed out of the CHL ...

There are two school of thought at play here ....

* Those who love their Country and wish to see it do well and develop the full potential of its Citizens - even if that means a higher cost of Living;

* Those who believe in Global Competition and that the "cream will rise" as long as there is pure competition - even at the expense of their own Country.

It's the whole Free-Trade versus Tariff Wall dichotomy again.

The Tarrif Wall was better for manual workers.

Free-Trade was better for consumers.

The truth is likely between the two poles.

Why not set Import Limits for Foreign-born players in the CHL ?

The NCAA sets conditions on what they consider "International Student-Athletes".

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01-05-2013, 01:28 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by patnyrnyg View Post
It's a damn shame that we have people in this world that love their country as much as Cherry loves Canada. Shame on him.

I don't think it is an anti-foreigner thing with Cherry. I took it as the CHL brings in these players, trains them, makes them better, and then Canadians get pissed when these players beat Team Canada on the National level. Think it is also his way of simply saying how the CHL is the best league in the world for developing young players.
I think he said something like after Canada lost the United States in 2010. because he mentioned how a lot of the Americans from their team played in the CHL.

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01-05-2013, 01:57 PM
  #134
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Cherry's essential an Anglo-Canadian ultranationalist when it comes to hockey. Whenever he starts talking about anything remotely close to something like this, everybody should be smart enough to know what's coming and ignore him by now.

As for his point about Canadian boys getting cut for Euros or how foreigners don't pay their taxes, since when was the CHL a governmental institution and since when was a CHL's mission statement anything other than trying to make a profit and winning games?

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01-05-2013, 01:59 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by patnyrnyg View Post
I took it as the CHL brings in these players, trains them, makes them better, and then Canadians get pissed when these players beat Team Canada on the National level. Think it is also his way of simply saying how the CHL is the best league in the world for developing young players.
What exactly is there to suggest that Swedish or Russian players are any better off playing in the CHL than they would be remaining their country?

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01-05-2013, 02:29 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by jekoh View Post
What exactly is there to suggest that Swedish or Russian players are any better off playing in the CHL than they would be remaining their country?
If there wasn't an advantage, then why would they go to the CHL? How often do you hear someone say, "European Player X is going to the OHL or WHL or Q to get more accustomed to the North American style of play."

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01-05-2013, 02:38 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by LEAFS FAN 4 EVER View Post
I think he said something like after Canada lost the United States in 2010. because he mentioned how a lot of the Americans from their team played in the CHL.
It's true, although for a long time many believed USA Hockey had a bias against players that elected to go the CHL instead of playing NCAA. On this year's squad, 13 play NCAA, 9 play in the CHL, and 1 in the AHL. The AHL'er is JT Miller who played in the US National Team before going to the OHL as an 18-year old. So, I would put him in the CHL ranks.

However, there are plenty of Canadians playing in the NCAA. Pretty sure there would be an uproar if the NCAA turned around and said only Americans could play NCAA hockey.

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01-05-2013, 02:44 PM
  #138
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Cherry is just sticking up for Canadian kids. Not sure what xenophobia has to do with it. Maybe, protectionist. I think there should be limits as these guys mostly come over just to boost their draft ranking. Sure, the overall quality might improve but so would chopping the # of teams.

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01-05-2013, 02:52 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by patnyrnyg View Post
If there wasn't an advantage, then why would they go to the CHL? How often do you hear someone say, "European Player X is going to the OHL or WHL or Q to get more accustomed to the North American style of play."
They go for exposure. There's a lot more scouts in the CHL than in the european leagues. They might also want to show their commitment to making the NHL, by going abroad and playing on small ice. Regardless, there's nothing indicating that foreign kids develop better in the CHL than elsewhere.

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01-05-2013, 02:58 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by SympathyForTheDevils View Post
They go for exposure. There's a lot more scouts in the CHL than in the european leagues. They might also want to show their commitment to making the NHL, by going abroad and playing on small ice. Regardless, there's nothing indicating that foreign kids develop better in the CHL than elsewhere.
Considering that many come AFTER they have been drafted, not sure why exposure plays a part of it.

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01-05-2013, 03:01 PM
  #141
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If someone's good enough to win an athletic scholarship, he or she will win one. There are countless American colleges that offer them. Heck, New England Patriots running back Danny Woodhead went to Chadron State. Doesn't seem to have held him back, has it?

1) Division II schools like Chadron give out less scholarships than Div. I schools, so there isn't an endless supply of scholarships out there.

2) Having foreign players getting a scholarship does mean a US kid doesn't. It is in fact a zero sum game, no matter how many schools there are that give out scholarships, there there more kids that want them. If one kid gets a scholarship that means another kid doesn't.

3) Yes in the 103 years that Chadron state has been around, 2 football players have made it to the NFL. I guess that means that it makes no difference whether or not a player gets a scholarship to Alabama or Chadron. Awesome logic.

4) What you also neglect to mention is that Woodhead went undrafted, in fact, he wasn't even invited to the NFL Combine. He was waived in the NFL 3 times.

Yeah it didn't hold him back at all that he played at a division 2 school. I don't know why more players don't just sign with Chadron or Valdosta State or Shippensburg and instead go to play for Alabama or Florida or LSU? I mean, it makes no difference if you can play, so why not?

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01-05-2013, 03:02 PM
  #142
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I posted this in another thread on this subject in the WJHC forum but it fits just as well here:

This is just reactionary fear due to Canada not winning gold every year in tournaments such as this. The rest of the world has caught up to us and all of a sudden people want to close the borders to foreign players. How xenophobic. How reactionary. How short-sighted. How dunderheaded. Statements like this make Don Cherry seem like the Ann Coulter of the hockey world.

It's no longer "Our game". It's the world's game. And that can't be anything but a good thing for the sport. Does that mean Canada might not win as much as people are used to? Maybe. But we as a nation need to get over this notion that it's our god-given right to rule the hockey world. It makes us seem like spoiled brats taking our ball and going home the minute we don't get what we want.

The game has matured. Time for us to do the same.


Last edited by scythe: 01-05-2013 at 03:22 PM.
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01-05-2013, 03:23 PM
  #143
patnyrnyg
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Originally Posted by scythe View Post
I posted this in another thread on this subject in the WJHC forum but it fits just as well here:

This is just reactionary fear due to Canada not winning gold every year in tournaments such as this. The rest of the world has caught up to us and all of a sudden people want to close the borders to foreign players. How xenophobic. How reactionary. How short-sighted. How dunderheaded.

It's no longer "Our game". It's the world's game. And that can't be anything but a good thing for the sport. Does that mean Canada might not win as much as people are used to? Maybe. But we as a nation need to get over this notion that it's our god-given right to rule the hockey world. It makes us seem like spoiled brats taking our ball and going home the minute we don't get what we want.

The game has matured. Time for us to do the same.
Canada has gone in streaks. They won 5 in a row from 93-97, then didn't win for 6 straight years, then won 5 in a row again, now haven't won in 4 years? Although, Russia threw away the 2009 semis. Idiot got selfish and shot for the empty net from in front of his own crease, missed, got called for icing with about 5 or 6 seconds left, and then Eberle tied it off the face-off. Should have just chipped it out, but that is a different discussion.

Anyways, Canada is going to be back, still always going to be a favorite, still is the deepest country. If it was a tournament where countries could send a B, C, D, E, F team, pretty sure Canada would have the best showing overall each year. They just happened to play a bad game against the U.S. in the semis and lost an OT game for the bronze.

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01-05-2013, 03:25 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by Dr Quincy View Post
1) Division II schools like Chadron give out less scholarships than Div. I schools, so there isn't an endless supply of scholarships out there.

2) Having foreign players getting a scholarship does mean a US kid doesn't. It is in fact a zero sum game, no matter how many schools there are that give out scholarships, there there more kids that want them. If one kid gets a scholarship that means another kid doesn't.

3) Yes in the 103 years that Chadron state has been around, 2 football players have made it to the NFL. I guess that means that it makes no difference whether or not a player gets a scholarship to Alabama or Chadron. Awesome logic.

4) What you also neglect to mention is that Woodhead went undrafted, in fact, he wasn't even invited to the NFL Combine. He was waived in the NFL 3 times.

Yeah it didn't hold him back at all that he played at a division 2 school. I don't know why more players don't just sign with Chadron or Valdosta State or Shippensburg and instead go to play for Alabama or Florida or LSU? I mean, it makes no difference if you can play, so why not?
Victor Cruz said he met Michael Strahan when he was either a senior in HS or freshman in college at UMass. Strahan said, "I went to Texas Southern, not a football power. Osi (Umenyiora) and DeMarcus Ware played together at Troy St. If you are good enough, they WILL find you."

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01-05-2013, 04:24 PM
  #145
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Don Cherry is an idiot.

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01-05-2013, 04:24 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by patnyrnyg View Post
It's a damn shame that we have people in this world that love their country as much as Cherry loves Canada. Shame on him.

I don't think it is an anti-foreigner thing with Cherry. .
Huh? You don't remember the dozens,and dozens of anti-European remarks he has made over the last 20 years? It's not like this is anything new with him and it doesn't usually have to do with the CHL. He has been calling Euros names for years. He continually has called them soft, dirty, and berated them taking the places of good Canadian boys in the NHL. He even sinks to really childish levels of making up snide nicknames as a way of insulting them. Remember Yammy Jagr. Yeah, he's not xenophobic. Not much.

And for anyone who doesn't remember, he used to make a lot of anti-US remarks too. Somewhere along the line he decided to shut up about the Yanks.

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01-05-2013, 05:34 PM
  #147
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Gretzky, Sakic, Andreychuk, Statsny first come to mind... Canadian hockey is better without any kind of immigration indeed.

This guy is not faking it, he's really stupid.

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01-05-2013, 05:47 PM
  #148
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Gretzky, Sakic, Andreychuk, Statsny first come to mind... Canadian hockey is better without any kind of immigration indeed.

This guy is not faking it, he's really stupid.
How is this relevant to the allowing foreign teenagers to play in a hockey league? Immigration???? And you're calling someone else stupid? Please note that immigration and foreign work visas are different issues.

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01-05-2013, 05:50 PM
  #149
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Every player in the world deserves the best coaching an opportunity available to better themselves.

We allow foreign students into our schools, this is really no different.

They're the best players available, so they get the best coaching.
Agreed. What if the Swedish leagues had told Kopitar "sorry you can't play here you aren't Swedish" He most likely would have never made it, how is that fair?

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01-05-2013, 07:41 PM
  #150
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How is this relevant to the allowing foreign teenagers to play in a hockey league? Immigration???? And you're calling someone else stupid? Please note that immigration and foreign work visas are different issues.
Too much question marks... You can't see any correlation possible ? If you are not authorized to come overseas as a teenager, maybe you will never do it, even as professional player.

Let's take a fictional scenario:
We're in 2014 and this new "Don Cherry law" is voted. Teenage hockey players are not authorized anymore to come overseas. You're a talent that expected to play CHL because the NHL is the league you want to play for. And Canada seems like a lovable place to live too. Staying in North America after retirement still sounds like a good plan !


You're now 22, screw Canada and the NHL after all, KHL and motherland are fine enough today, in 2018. Family, friends and fans love you and this Natasha girl is so hot !

A few years after retiring you finally acknowledge to yourself that maybe you weren't such a great hockey player, not good enough to make the HOF at least. But you don't care about this anymore. You don't care because you gave your son the same love for the game, and your kid IS that next generational talent. But sorry Don, he's born in City of Magnitogorsk, Chelyabinsk Oblast. Russia.

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