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Old
01-03-2013, 03:44 PM
  #901
Jarick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nickschultzfan View Post
I don't think Dumba's hockey IQ is that "low". He reads the offensive play pretty well. And he knows when to lay a hit.

But I think he's a more impulsive, less thinking, player ala Burns. He is best when he just goes for it and tries to make an impact.
Here's my best guess:

Dumba probably doesn't have "low" hockey IQ. It's probably average or better than average.

He's probably struggling because his new coach is asking him to play differently, and instead of using his instincts, he's having to think and react on the ice instead of doing so naturally.

And statistically I'm guessing it's partially new system (more defensive?) and lack of scorers.

But hopefully he starts to break out soon, like it took Bussieres a month or two to start ripping it up.

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01-03-2013, 03:55 PM
  #902
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Also I double checked, and they fired their coach mid-November and Brent Sutter took over. So add in a new coach to the mix, which makes me feel a lot better about his whole WJC disaster.

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01-03-2013, 04:08 PM
  #903
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
I think "hockey IQ" is my new, least favorite phrase.
Exactly. It's the new "puck poise."

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Old
01-03-2013, 04:14 PM
  #904
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IQ isn't measured by scoring at lower levels, IQ is something you see in a player as they play games, you can see their ability to anticipate the play, their ability to read the ice and the flow of the game, its not a stat.

to me Dumba is dominant and played well because he was more athletically gifted at the time, he just has some pure athletic ability however as you go higher your trade, that athletic ability means less, you will be competing against the best and if you are lacking smarts you will get hung out to dry.

I just question that pick because the two years prior, we got guys who had high IQ's then all the sudden we gamble on a character guy, not even a forward i could live with a forward who could just be a 3rd line ass hole even that high, but if his defensive play doesn't come along he will just be a physical MAB...

mind you, as much as i am down on Dumba, i do hope that i'm sorely wrong, that he just dominates, but the cynic in me is doubful

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01-03-2013, 04:26 PM
  #905
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forthewild View Post
IQ isn't measured by scoring at lower levels, IQ is something you see in a player as they play games, you can see their ability to anticipate the play, their ability to read the ice and the flow of the game, its not a stat.

to me Dumba is dominant and played well because he was more athletically gifted at the time, he just has some pure athletic ability however as you go higher your trade, that athletic ability means less, you will be competing against the best and if you are lacking smarts you will get hung out to dry.

I just question that pick because the two years prior, we got guys who had high IQ's then all the sudden we gamble on a character guy, not even a forward i could live with a forward who could just be a 3rd line ass hole even that high, but if his defensive play doesn't come along he will just be a physical MAB...

mind you, as much as i am down on Dumba, i do hope that i'm sorely wrong, that he just dominates, but the cynic in me is doubful
Here's this huge leap again, where does it come from? It's like, he's not going to be an A+ defensive player, so we're going to skip this huge middle spectrum and go right to the worst case scenario. Could he also not be a less defensive, more offensive Kronwall? I think that would still be good for a 2nd pairing defenseman and probably more likely than complete failure.

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Old
01-03-2013, 04:45 PM
  #906
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forthewild View Post
to me Dumba is dominant and played well because he was more athletically gifted at the time, he just has some pure athletic ability however as you go higher your trade, that athletic ability means less, you will be competing against the best and if you are lacking smarts you will get hung out to dry.
He's still playing at the same level that he "dominated" last year.

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Old
01-04-2013, 12:37 AM
  #907
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Originally Posted by Nsjohn130 View Post
While is not fair of me to expect anything like the production that Parise has shown in the NHL, Zucker could def. be as productive as Parise in the NHL if he continues performing as well as the difficulty gradient goes up when he joins the team in the NHL. He has shown no self doubt or trouble in his adaptation of every level of the game. He is already Parise size, and has jets. They do play a different game. Here's to hoping he is good for 25 goals a season, at least.

Zucker is on pace to be a Cammalleri. Not a Parise..

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01-04-2013, 12:39 AM
  #908
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Originally Posted by this providence View Post
Granted, this team does have an upper echelon-type system.
you mean a top 3 in the NHL type system?

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01-04-2013, 12:43 AM
  #909
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Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo View Post
Not really; Granlund and Brodin were excelling in their 2nd year in a men's league that is a step below the AHL. You also had Zucker, Larsson and even Bulmer doing well after their draft along with Lucia.

The one thing about Dumba that is concerning is you can't teach hockey IQ. You can have the tools but if you don't have the toolbox, it's hard to build one.

After that Bussieres is meh, Draeger and Gilmour is meh, Gunnarsson is an overager and might be a decent pick, Bertschy has looked bad and Nanne was a token pick. While I understand that the draft was a bunch of projects, it doesn't look like are going to be anything special.

BTW I would have loved Forsberg, Grigs or Trouba over Dumba.

After what CF and company have done with the prospect pool here and recent drafts..considering almost every pick in the draft before has panned out near to perfectly..

Im gonna trust in Fletch here with the Dumba pick.

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01-04-2013, 01:21 AM
  #910
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beegoalie View Post
After what CF and company have done with the prospect pool here and recent drafts..considering almost every pick in the draft before has panned out near to perfectly..

Im gonna trust in Fletch here with the Dumba pick.
That doesn't mean he won't pick a bad pick. It's a project pick. He picked up some safe prospects the last two years. I mean look at Detroit, Colorado and their drafting. They'll hit on some duds once in a while.

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01-04-2013, 01:46 AM
  #911
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Gonna hang out here for now since the OT Thread is infected with a virus(s) at the moment.

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01-04-2013, 08:22 AM
  #912
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I think not drafting Grigorenko was big mistake. That guys a beast.

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Old
01-04-2013, 01:20 PM
  #913
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Originally Posted by WILDhockeyfan View Post
Gonna hang out here for now since the OT Thread is infected with a virus(s) at the moment.
Virus?

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Old
01-04-2013, 01:34 PM
  #914
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Originally Posted by Northland Wild Man View Post
Virus?
Go take a loot at pages 10-15 (or somewhere around there) and you'll see our OT Thread was infected by posters from the Lounge who just spammed the crap out of it for about half an hour.

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Old
01-04-2013, 02:51 PM
  #915
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Interesting analysis that piggy backs on my age theory:

Behind the Net: Significance of Age

Quote:
...there is also a strong quantitative relationship between past and future performance. Based on the performance of thousands of drafted players, we can predict how many points a player will score in the NHL when he’s 21-years-old. If he’s 17, four years later, we expect him to score at 72% of his junior rate. But if he’s 20, on average, he’ll retain just 26% of his scoring.

There is a caveat: younger players are a bit less predictable than older players. For a 17-year-old, the middle 50% range of the projection is from 45% to 98%, while for a 20-year-old, it’s from 17% to 33%. This wide range reflects how unpredictable future performance is for NHL players.
Unfortunately, the chart seems to be lost here, but he compiled data on lots (maybe all?) NHL players over the last few decades and found things like:

Quote:
A 17-year-old player with 2 PPG in Junior can expect, on average, to score 1.5 PPG in the NHL at age 22, while an 18-year-old Junior doing the same thing has an NHL projection of 1.0 PPG, which is 40 fewer points over the course of a season.
Essentially, better performance at a younger age translates to better performance in the NHL.

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Old
01-04-2013, 03:01 PM
  #916
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnesota View Post
Exactly. It's the new "puck poise."
Which was the old intangibles.

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01-04-2013, 11:11 PM
  #917
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Just watched last year's gold medal game and, damn, Brodin is really effing good. I have zero worries about his offense. With the right group of forwards, he's a 40 assist guy.

Sidenote: Sweden is amazing. Winning gold last year without Landeskog and Larsson and getting to the gold medal game without Brodin, Klefbom and H. Lindholm is damn impressive. Swedes are too polite, if that was Canada we'd never hear the end of it.

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01-05-2013, 06:51 AM
  #918
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Just watched last year's gold medal game and, damn, Brodin is really effing good. I have zero worries about his offense. With the right group of forwards, he's a 40 assist guy.

Sidenote: Sweden is amazing. Winning gold last year without Landeskog and Larsson and getting to the gold medal game without Brodin, Klefbom and H. Lindholm is damn impressive. Swedes are too polite, if that was Canada we'd never hear the end of it.

in that 3rd period vs Russia brodin just dominated, he stifled like 10 of their chances, read plays so well, never gave them a chance to attack, the announcers were calling Brodins name every other minute he made sure that game didn't end badly for the swedes.

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Old
01-05-2013, 09:28 AM
  #919
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Graovac has been traded
Quote:
AJ Jakubec ‏@AJonSports
Tyler Graovac goes to Belleville for Sergei Kuptsov, a 2nd round pick, a 3rd round pick and a conditional 7th round pick. #67s #OHL
Retweeted by Bob McKenzie

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Old
01-05-2013, 11:02 AM
  #920
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Looking back at Brodin's video from the entry draft and I gotta lol at Pierre "Minnesota has enough physical on the backend coming with Marco Scandella and Spurgeon.... Also Nick Schultz."

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01-05-2013, 02:17 PM
  #921
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Quote:
Originally Posted by P10p View Post
Looking back at Brodin's video from the entry draft and I gotta lol at Pierre "Minnesota has enough physical on the backend coming with Marco Scandella and Spurgeon.... Also Nick Schultz."
He clearly meant to say Clayton Stoner.

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Old
01-05-2013, 08:56 PM
  #922
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Graovac had 1g and 3a for 4pts tonight in his first game with Belleville.

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Old
01-05-2013, 09:00 PM
  #923
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Originally Posted by Jbcraig1883 View Post
Graovac had 1g and 3a for 4pts tonight in his first game with Belleville.
Someone who knows the CHL: I take it this was a good move for Graovac. From what I understood the 67's were kinda meh.

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Old
01-05-2013, 09:04 PM
  #924
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I think not drafting Grigorenko was big mistake. That guys a beast.
much much rather have Trouba.

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Old
01-06-2013, 02:55 PM
  #925
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much much rather have Trouba.
I'm still on the Trouba train. Never should have passed on him.

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