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Old
01-06-2013, 01:49 PM
  #726
RJ8812
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Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
They were holding out for Schenn and/or Couturier even before the OS. They didn't get them, so they matched. Regardless, it still would have cost 4 firsts, hardly just a money trade, which was my whole point.
I would have gladly given up 4 1st round draft picks for Weber

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01-06-2013, 01:54 PM
  #727
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A #1 is definitely a need for the Flyers as they currently stand and with the system they run. They need that guy that can be a rock for 25 minutes a night and play in all situations. Look at the impact Pronger made when he was healthy. A team like the Devils who run a team defensive system can get away without having one. Even with that said, they got what they think is their franchise guy in Larsson. Jones to me is a clear step above him.

I think we are overvaluing Schenn and Coururier a little bit right now. Everyone says Jones isn't a sure thing, but neither are they. We're hopeful they will someday become 1B/2A centers, but until they do, they are just as much a risk if not more.

Like I said earlier, it depends how you feel about Jones as a prospect. I'm as sure about him as I can remember about a defenseman and that's why I wouldn't hesitate to trade either player. But again this is all hypothetical because neither Schenn or Couturier, barring a massive breakout, gets you the #1 pick.

The Penguins and Canucks didn't have a no. 1 defensemen when they made the finals either. The Penguins even won a cup without a no 1 defensemen.

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01-06-2013, 02:27 PM
  #728
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Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
They were holding out for Schenn and/or Couturier even before the OS. They didn't get them, so they matched. Regardless, it still would have cost 4 firsts, hardly just a money trade, which was my whole point.
your absolutely right, i overlooked that. with that said i still take weber at the cost of 4 1st rounders and the cash. we would have had him from 12-13 season too which shouldn't be overlooked. as it turns out it will be a shortened season but we would have had a much better opportunity to win a cup this year, with him as a 27 yo, and into the foreseeable future then with the 4 1st rounders.

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01-06-2013, 02:27 PM
  #729
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Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
I would have gladly given up 4 1st round draft picks for Weber
Sure but its still a loss of assets.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLegendkiller View Post
The Penguins and Canucks didn't have a no. 1 defensemen when they made the finals either. The Penguins even won a cup without a no 1 defensemen.
Cup winners since the lockout:
2012- Kings- Doughty
2011- Bruins- Chara
2010- Blackhawks- Keith/Seabrook
2009- Penguins- Letang was emerging, Gonchar provided enough offense, not a true #1 but Malkin and Crosby made up for it.
2008- Red Wings- Lidstrom
2007- Ducks- Pronger....Niedermayer
2006- Canes- Got me here. Hedican was decent IIRC.

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01-06-2013, 02:30 PM
  #730
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your absolutely right, i overlooked that. with that said i still take weber at the cost of 4 1st rounders and the cash. we would have had him from 12-13 season too which shouldn't be overlooked. as it turns out it will be a shortened season but we would have had a much better opportunity to win a cup this year, with him as a 27 yo, and into the foreseeable future then with the 4 1st rounders.
Oh I'm not arguing Weber's value versus four first round picks. He's absolutely worth it. But you have to consider those 4 firsts as additional trade chips at the very least.

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01-06-2013, 02:43 PM
  #731
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Oh I'm not arguing Weber's value versus four first round picks. He's absolutely worth it. But you have to consider those 4 firsts as additional trade chips at the very least.
thats true too. could you imagine potentially missing out on Versteeg type deal

just kidding. i could see why someone would think a trade for Jones would be worth it.

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01-06-2013, 06:57 PM
  #732
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Larsson is pretty good and had a decent season as a rookie defender. He'll take over for then
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Adam Larson will be a #1 defenseman in this league, and the devils played a very good team defense system. Oh and they also have a guy named Martin Brodeur who stepped it up in the playoffs. Having 3 good centers, regardless of how good they are in their own end, is meaningless if you have no defense and unreliable goaltending.
I know Larsson WILL be good, but he's not there yet. He's not a #1. The Devils made a Cup run last season without a number 1. Hell, you could argue they didn't have a 2. They rode the system, responsible play and a hot goalie.

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yes, they made it out of a weak Eastern Conference and got their ***** handed to them in the SCF
Bunch of BS, East wasn't at all weak. They got they're **** handed to them by a team who absolutely bulldozed everything in their path. No one would have beat the Kings last season.

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Old
01-06-2013, 07:13 PM
  #733
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Whats the chances we offer Marcoux an ELC?

He's been pretty good in the QMJHL and if we give him an ELC, I believe he wouldn't count against the contract cap until next year since he would finish the season in the QMJHL with the Armada

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01-06-2013, 07:17 PM
  #734
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Whats the chances we offer Marcoux an ELC?

He's been pretty good in the QMJHL and if we give him an ELC, I believe he wouldn't count against the contract cap until next year since he would finish the season in the QMJHL with the Armada
Can you sign a guy now though? We're under different circumstances. If that's the case JC Lipon must be getting a lot of interest.

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01-06-2013, 07:20 PM
  #735
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Can you sign a guy now though? We're under different circumstances. If that's the case JC Lipon must be getting a lot of interest.
I don't see why you couldn't sign a guy now.

Looks like Lipon is going to the Avs' training camp

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01-06-2013, 08:17 PM
  #736
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I don't see why you couldn't sign a guy now.

Looks like Lipon is going to the Avs' training camp
Usually there is a deadline you have to sign a guy by, but with the lockout things are different I guess.

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Old
01-06-2013, 10:00 PM
  #737
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Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
Sure but its still a loss of assets.



Cup winners since the lockout:
2012- Kings- Doughty
2011- Bruins- Chara
2010- Blackhawks- Keith/Seabrook
2009- Penguins- Letang was emerging, Gonchar provided enough offense, not a true #1 but Malkin and Crosby made up for it.
2008- Red Wings- Lidstrom
2007- Ducks- Pronger....Niedermayer
2006- Canes- Got me here. Hedican was decent IIRC.
I like the Canes method in their Cup run. They basically had 6 six #2-4 defensmen on the team with players like Aaron Ward, Wesley, Hedican, Wallin, F. Kaberle and Commodore. You could put any pairing out and they would be decent.

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01-06-2013, 10:53 PM
  #738
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I like the Canes method in their Cup run. They basically had 6 six #2-4 defensmen on the team with players like Aaron Ward, Wesley, Hedican, Wallin, F. Kaberle and Commodore. You could put any pairing out and they would be decent.
Sounds like what the Flyers have had the last 2 seasons. Wonder what Lavy is doint different?

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Old
01-06-2013, 11:04 PM
  #739
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Sounds like what the Flyers have had the last 2 seasons. Wonder what Lavy is doint different?
Don't have Cam Ward in net

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01-06-2013, 11:16 PM
  #740
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Don't have Cam Ward in net
Not sure how I overlooked that

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01-07-2013, 04:18 AM
  #741
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I like the Canes method in their Cup run. They basically had 6 six #2-4 defensmen on the team with players like Aaron Ward, Wesley, Hedican, Wallin, F. Kaberle and Commodore. You could put any pairing out and they would be decent.
Let's not overlook the fact, if Roloson doesn't get hurt, and if Conklin doesn't **** up Edmonton's hopes of game #1 with an own goal, 2006 ends with Edmonton winning the Stanley Cup instead of the Carolina Hurricanes, and Pronger skates away with the Conn Smythe, completing the near perfect trend.

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01-07-2013, 08:30 AM
  #742
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Let's not overlook the fact, if Roloson doesn't get hurt, and if Conklin doesn't **** up Edmonton's hopes of game #1 with an own goal, 2006 ends with Edmonton winning the Stanley Cup instead of the Carolina Hurricanes, and Pronger skates away with the Conn Smythe, completing the near perfect trend.
Buffalo's defense also fell apart in the Eastern Conference Final. They were using 4 AHL defensemen in Game 7.

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01-07-2013, 09:37 AM
  #743
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Some updates on some non AHL/ECHL prospects:

Parks is back from injury and has 2 goals in 2 games since returning
Laughton and Leier are both very close to a point per game but keep in mind how offensive the winterhawks are. (Even with that factored in I'm still pretty stoked about Leier)
Cousins leads his team with 60 points in 41 games and unlike the 2 above is basically the only offensive guy on his team (has almost double the points of their number 2 guy)
Placek has played in 11 games and has only 1 point (not too sure how much to read into that in their low scoring system though)
Mathers has 10 points in 40 games but wasn't drafted for points. If you want to see why he was drafted search for McGuire and Mathers on you-tube. They are 2 of the best (if that is your sort of thing) and have gone at it a number of times. Personally I see him as a AHL enforcer and would be surprised to see him ever make the NHL. The AHL still seems to need goons.

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01-07-2013, 09:42 AM
  #744
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I don't understand why this team wastes draft picks on goons

remember Garrett Klotz? wasted a 3rd round draft pick on him after posting a unbelievable 6 points in 100 OHL games when we could have drafted someone like Jamie Benn

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01-07-2013, 10:33 AM
  #745
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I don't get it either anymore. 15 years ago yes. 25 years ago for sure. 35 years ago, essential. Now? whats the point? Fighting is still high but not with true enforcers.

Klotz wasn't even a good goon. Good goons don't almost die in a fight.

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01-07-2013, 11:02 AM
  #746
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I remember watching Placek at the prospect camp a couple years ago (don't think he was at this year's). Big kid and looked to have pretty good hands.

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01-07-2013, 11:53 AM
  #747
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Shocking drop off in production from Matt Ford this year vs last. He better step up once Couturier and Schenn are gone.

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01-07-2013, 11:58 AM
  #748
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Anyone have any updates on Cousins? 60 points in 43 games this year. Not sure on his current legal situation, but I wonder if Holmgren wants to take a peek at him for the 9 games?

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Old
01-07-2013, 12:21 PM
  #749
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I don't understand why this team wastes draft picks on goons

remember Garrett Klotz? wasted a 3rd round draft pick on him after posting a unbelievable 6 points in 100 OHL games when we could have drafted someone like Jamie Benn
Are you saying The Klotz was a wasted draft pick?

Get out of here

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01-07-2013, 12:27 PM
  #750
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Shocking drop off in production from Matt Ford this year vs last. He better step up once Couturier and Schenn are gone.
he isnt even a regular this season IIRC

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Are you saying The Klotz was a wasted draft pick?

Get out of here

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