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Easton E28 (and Bauer P14) Curve Discussion

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Old
01-07-2013, 08:22 AM
  #26
AIREAYE
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Curve and parents. Parents don't want to spend ~$300 for their 13 year old to 'experiment' with a wild new curve. For adults it's different, but toe curves have never done well at retail. Easton knows this, so that's a reason why you see these videos.

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01-07-2013, 09:31 AM
  #27
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I started my kid out with a mild Sakic

But are parents really calling the shots on the curves? I mean most kids I see can pick out whatever stick/curve/flex they want, the parents only care about the price tag.

Bjugstad is responsible for both this E28 curve and (if the rumors were correct) the Bauer P14. I recall reading on Mod Squad a few years ago that he recommended to all his students to use the P14 (which might be based on his pro curve), so our local shops started carrying a lot of P14 Bauer sticks.

...and now that I'm thinking of that, I really want to try a P14.

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01-07-2013, 10:03 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
I started my kid out with a mild Sakic

But are parents really calling the shots on the curves? I mean most kids I see can pick out whatever stick/curve/flex they want, the parents only care about the price tag.

Bjugstad is responsible for both this E28 curve and (if the rumors were correct) the Bauer P14. I recall reading on Mod Squad a few years ago that he recommended to all his students to use the P14 (which might be based on his pro curve), so our local shops started carrying a lot of P14 Bauer sticks.

...and now that I'm thinking of that, I really want to try a P14.
I have a p14 on my x60 ops. It's not to far off from a p88. Though I feel like there is less overall surface area on the P14 for one timers etc.

Good jack of all trades great at none IMO

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01-07-2013, 10:16 AM
  #29
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The profile seems similar but it looks more open at the toe. I'll take a look tonight.

I just need something to get back on track, even if it's mental, and I've been missing the net A LOT lately.

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01-07-2013, 10:49 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
The profile seems similar but it looks more open at the toe. I'll take a look tonight.

I just need something to get back on track, even if it's mental, and I've been missing the net A LOT lately.
Sounds right. I have both curves, ill take a look when I get home. You'll need less heel action on this than a lot of blades. At least that's my impression.

Puck hops the blade a lot if the incoming pass is bobbling a bit, but it's fantastic for bringing slightly airborne pucks under control, I also couldn't imagine getting that blade in a softer version. The x60 blades are pingy, but work well with that pattern.

I have no loft issues forehand or backhand. Less cupping of the puck is needed which is nice.

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01-07-2013, 11:01 AM
  #31
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I'm looking at the Miken Z9 in the P14 clone. $80 on clearance and they've had good online reviews from testers.

I'm a "cup the puck and shoot from the mid-toe" kind of guy, but I'm thinking the rocker at the toe could be throwing things off for me. Having a flat mid to toe area of the blade that's open, yet there's still some mid curve for stick handling, sounds excellent.

For me it could be a nice way to force consistency into my shooting. Much like when I first used the Drury and shot from the mid-heel, the consistent rocker and curve and loft helped a lot, but shots and passes were too high and the Sakic was easier for stickhandling.

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01-07-2013, 12:44 PM
  #32
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You'll have a lot of parents with kids in A-AAA (rep) hockey watching their kid's shooting like a hawk. We have a Rapidshot setup in our store and a lot of parents do care.

But at the same time, most of the kids will be intrigued by these crazy curves, but quickly realize that it's too much for them.

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01-07-2013, 01:11 PM
  #33
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Oh man I'm jealous.

I just moved to St Paul, which is of course the other "twin" city aside from Minneapolis. And there's no hockey shops here. Granted, Minneapolis doesn't have any either, but St Paul has tons of little shops.

It'd be a fun little dream to open up a hockey shop here. Find an empty shop (lots of them here), get lots of inventory, sell hockey gear all day, hook up some cool stuff.

If I had some money and wasn't lazy, I could probably make some money doing that. Would be a blast.

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01-07-2013, 02:28 PM
  #34
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after not paying much attention to this tread until just now, I can say I'm very intrigued by the E28 pattern. I had bought a pro stock Patrik Berglund Dolomite on eBay a year and a half ago and when I got it, it had this god awful ugly hook on the blade. Long story short, I fell in love with it, it broke a couple months ago, and now I'm on the hunt for something similar haha

So...I may hold off on the E28/Mako 2 for now as Jarick has pointed out the Miken Z9(grip for me)...and like him, the BP14 pattern intrigues me...so many decisions

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01-07-2013, 07:13 PM
  #35
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The younger kids around my area that I talk to, and I classify this as Bantam age, never really spent time playing around with curves much. Seems most just get thrown at the P92 or PM9 and then work there way from there as their sticks break.

Though, I'm fairly certain that's a product of not having a pro shop in the area that carries more than the standard few curves(backstrom, stamkos, kane or iggy, hall, and forsberg).

Though with total hockey's entrance I hope that changes.

Oh, and as far as the z9.
My buddy had one for a bit. He wasn't a huge fan but for 80 bucks, I don't really think you can do wrong. It was light, but I think he didn't like the feel? I don't recall exactly.
Now the zero limit, that stick is a whole different story.

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01-08-2013, 04:19 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AIREAYE View Post
Well I can't say anything because I haven't seen/tried it now have I?

But probably not, no, I can't shoot like that Edina HS kid nor can I shoot like Bjugstad.
It's really not as hard as you're thinking it is. I've only been playing hockey for 2 years and ever since I saw that video I've been shooting off the toe of my P92 TotalONE and my shot has visibly improved. I mean, Easton definitely has a point in saying that this is a more "evolved" form of shooting because if you look at modern day NHL'ers and how they take their snap-shot, almost all of them are shooting off the toe of their blade. I feel like my stick flexes MUCH more when I load it up from the toe. And also, just think about the mechanics of a snap-shot (modern day)... it just makes more sense to pull the puck in a little bit with your toe and load up and snap it off.

That said, Idk if Easton's new blade pattern (what is it the E28 or some crap?) will really make much of a difference in doing so but I would like to try it out for myself.

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01-08-2013, 09:06 AM
  #37
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Maybe it's not as hard, but I wouldn't imagine many people wanting to completely change their shooting technique just for the sake of experimenting with one curve on one stick. Especially the guys who have been taught to shoot from the heel.

You know what? Maybe that's why; I don't like toe curves because I'm a heel curve guy. Different schools of thought.

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01-08-2013, 11:06 AM
  #38
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I would say the spot on the blade that you shoot from (heel, mid, toe) is linked to the curve that you use.

You want to shoot from the part of the blade that gets optimum contact with the ice, because that will allow the puck to travel down the blade and get spin, giving better velocity and accuracy.

The heel and mid-heel curves tend to have a flat rocker and lie flat on the ice closer to the heel. So you tend to shoot from the heel (closer to a stickhandling position incidentally). Shooting from the toe has little blade contact so they flutter all over the place.

Mid to toe curves usually have a rounder rocker so you can stickhandle further away then pull the puck in tighter to shoot from close to the body, letting you lean into the shot more. Shooting from the heel might lose some velocity and you won't get any lift on the shot.

But too much rocker means you don't get as much contact between the puck and ice, and that leads to less velocity and puck flutter.

The P14 (and P88 somewhat) has a flatter rocker near the heel and a flatter rocker near the toe. So you get more blade contact with the blade for shooting from the toe area. More velocity, less flutter. The flatter rocker near the heel is probably for catching/making passes and stickhandling.

Made this little comparison picture (pics courtesy IceWarehouse.com):


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01-08-2013, 11:24 AM
  #39
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Moved all this discussion over here since it's fascinating to me

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01-08-2013, 01:48 PM
  #40
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I really wish the P14 had a bit more area to play with at the toe, other than that its great. im getting used to the p106 right now, and just from some shinny it was really nice getting a lot of blade contact with the puck. i have to decide soon what stick will be number 1 for me, because from the p14 to the p106 i had to alter my shot technique a good amount.

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01-08-2013, 02:46 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
I would say the spot on the blade that you shoot from (heel, mid, toe) is linked to the curve that you use.

You want to shoot from the part of the blade that gets optimum contact with the ice, because that will allow the puck to travel down the blade and get spin, giving better velocity and accuracy.


The heel and mid-heel curves tend to have a flat rocker and lie flat on the ice closer to the heel. So you tend to shoot from the heel (closer to a stickhandling position incidentally). Shooting from the toe has little blade contact so they flutter all over the place.

Mid to toe curves usually have a rounder rocker so you can stickhandle further away then pull the puck in tighter to shoot from close to the body, letting you lean into the shot more. Shooting from the heel might lose some velocity and you won't get any lift on the shot.

But too much rocker means you don't get as much contact between the puck and ice, and that leads to less velocity and puck flutter.

The P14 (and P88 somewhat) has a flatter rocker near the heel and a flatter rocker near the toe. So you get more blade contact with the blade for shooting from the toe area. More velocity, less flutter. The flatter rocker near the heel is probably for catching/making passes and stickhandling.
Got to agree with everything in this post, ESPECIALLY the bolded part.

A lot of players, even many upper tier players, just kind of do whatever vague muscle reflex they've been doing their whole lives, without thinking about the physics of how to optimize what they're doing.

I'm have no strength to speak of, but I just let my curve and leverage do all the work and I can get consistently good sauce on my passes and shots.

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01-10-2013, 12:18 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
I started my kid out with a mild Sakic

But are parents really calling the shots on the curves? I mean most kids I see can pick out whatever stick/curve/flex they want, the parents only care about the price tag.

Bjugstad is responsible for both this E28 curve and (if the rumors were correct) the Bauer P14. I recall reading on Mod Squad a few years ago that he recommended to all his students to use the P14 (which might be based on his pro curve), so our local shops started carrying a lot of P14 Bauer sticks.

...and now that I'm thinking of that, I really want to try a P14.
Yes, he developed the P14 curve for Bauer. Only Dave's Sport shop used to sell it in the metro. It was called the Bugsy curve. All the kids who would do Bjugstad's shooting clinic would use it. It has since expanded to other shops in the cities but it can still be tricky to find. Lot's of MN kids use the P14 curve.

I tried it out last winter but I just couldn't get used to stickhandling with it. I have since gone back to the P88 I've been using forever.

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01-10-2013, 03:14 PM
  #43
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I will also add that this shooting technique also seems to work well with the P08 from Bauer. It just requires more effort to keep shots down on the follow through.

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01-10-2013, 11:27 PM
  #44
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So I'm practicing snap shots.

I switch from the p88 to the p106 to the p14.

My best shots came with the 106. I found I was slicing my shots with the 14...I'm guessing I need to concentrate on impacting the puck at the mid heel point?

P88 was a 67 flex
P14 was 87 flex cut down about 4"
P106 is straight 87 flex

I noticed when the technique was good, flex didn't impact velocity too much...if anything the 67 flex felt weak even on the good shots, the stick is a ONE30, so that might have something to do with it. I used to think 87 might be too much, but I'm not have too much issue with the cut down, arms don't get tired after 50+ shots etc. I'm wondering if I lack the control right now to shoot off the toe though, but part of me really likes having a heavier blade contact.

One thing I noticed was in a really nice snap shot, the initial swing felt like a faster wrist shot, just due to how fluid the contact was, the snap coming at the end when I turned the blade over.

Final verdict, leaning heavily toward going with the 106 as my number 1, and eventually relegating the p14 to number 3, but I don't have a better all around stick at the moment.

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01-10-2013, 11:40 PM
  #45
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I don't know how you can jump from curve to curve so much. Stick to stick I get, but constant curve changes is hard.

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01-10-2013, 11:42 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aucoin11 View Post
I don't know how you can jump from curve to curve so much. Stick to stick I get, but constant curve changes is hard.
Trying to find which is the best for me .

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01-11-2013, 09:56 AM
  #47
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If you have the time, patience and proper resources, that is a great way to narrow down your preferences.

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01-11-2013, 11:32 AM
  #48
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My progression was something like:

2006: Bauer PM9, everyone said it's a good beginner's curve. My shot sucked here and I was using 87 flex sticks that I couldn't bend.

2007: Bauer P88, tried it and liked it, felt more curve gave more spin and harder shots. Also dropped down to 75 flex sticks. My shot improved and my accuracy was okay. Sometimes I'd snipe and more often I'd miss.

2009: Reebok P30 (deeper closed mid), deeper curve as an extension of above. Had harder shots but my accuracy was all over the place.

In 2010, I started to change my shot and instead of a big sweeping wrist shot (roll the puck from heel to toe) which was very heavy but inaccurate and slow release, I started moving towards a snap shot (cup the puck and fire) with a more compact release. This necessitated a more open curve.

2010: P91A, really improved my release and accuracy, started scoring a lot more goals, but my passes were going too high.

2011: P92, traded some velocity and height on the shots to keep the puck lower and also improved my ability to dangle/control the puck.

Been there pretty much ever since, and have been playing with different kick points and flexes to fine tune. Have dabbled back with the Drury sometimes as I miss the insane velocity of that curve but I like the mid vs heel. Also my accuracy has been slipping.

So now I'm try P14 to try and improve the accuracy and maybe the height, but I may end up trying a P08 if I can. I like the Sakic overall, just want a bit more loft.

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01-11-2013, 01:34 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
My progression was something like:

2006: Bauer PM9, everyone said it's a good beginner's curve. My shot sucked here and I was using 87 flex sticks that I couldn't bend.

2007: Bauer P88, tried it and liked it, felt more curve gave more spin and harder shots. Also dropped down to 75 flex sticks. My shot improved and my accuracy was okay. Sometimes I'd snipe and more often I'd miss.

2009: Reebok P30 (deeper closed mid), deeper curve as an extension of above. Had harder shots but my accuracy was all over the place.

In 2010, I started to change my shot and instead of a big sweeping wrist shot (roll the puck from heel to toe) which was very heavy but inaccurate and slow release, I started moving towards a snap shot (cup the puck and fire) with a more compact release. This necessitated a more open curve.

2010: P91A, really improved my release and accuracy, started scoring a lot more goals, but my passes were going too high.

2011: P92, traded some velocity and height on the shots to keep the puck lower and also improved my ability to dangle/control the puck.

Been there pretty much ever since, and have been playing with different kick points and flexes to fine tune. Have dabbled back with the Drury sometimes as I miss the insane velocity of that curve but I like the mid vs heel. Also my accuracy has been slipping.

So now I'm try P14 to try and improve the accuracy and maybe the height, but I may end up trying a P08 if I can. I like the Sakic overall, just want a bit more loft.
Yea I just bought some entry price point sticks to try different curves. the p14 i got for free, and then i bought my first two piece with the 106.

I have been using the forearm rule as a good baseline, the vapor x:60 has a nice sweet spot on the uncut shaft right below the R. keep in mind this is for snappers.

the mid toe (i think?)curve on the p14 isnt really how my body wants to shoot. i get a lot more success from the heel curves.

on my easton 65S i have a hall curve, which is mid. the p88 is mid, and the p106 is heel, and i get much better puck contact/control on those shots...so at least i have a general direction and preference to start with.

the 6 lie tends to be good for me...although im not sure how that is affected after cutting the stick down?

obviously everyone is different...im not of the belief one way of shooting is better than another...just which stil is easiest for your body to manipulate, my snap isnt fast enough to really get enough out of a toe curve, so instead i opt for a heel which gives me speed and puck contact.

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01-11-2013, 01:57 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by AIREAYE View Post
Nope, they haven't arrived in my area yet and my store isn't getting them haha. I've seen the curve online and scoff at all of Easton's marketing videos about this supposedly 'better' way of shooting that only a small fraction of the hockey population can pull off.
The only Easton marketing I trust is Cruikshank. That being said, I could easily be screwed once I get the Easton Mako skates but we'll have to see.

MLX is beast but who knows.

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