HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Contracts and Salary Cap (Contract Info in Posts #1 & #2)

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-07-2013, 11:54 AM
  #76
ECL
Very slippery slope
 
ECL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Middle America
Country: United States
Posts: 80,041
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ECL
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Fehr did a good job looking out for the big market teams and the players.
Well, the big market teams were basically aligned with the players (they were so far to that side that you may as well say that -- they want a large cap with freedom to move contracts). So it makes sense.

__________________
"Of course giving Sather cap space is like giving teenagers whiskey and car keys." - SBOB
"Watching Sather build a team is like watching a blind man with no fingers trying to put together an elaborate puzzle." - Shadowtron
I still think there should be a section of people at MSG behind the visiting bench, in curly wigs, and dark rimmed glasses, calling themselves the Pidtophiles. - Zamboner
ECL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 11:54 AM
  #77
ECL
Very slippery slope
 
ECL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Middle America
Country: United States
Posts: 80,041
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ECL
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
So the team that signed the player to the contract is on the hook for the charge if the player ends his career before the conclusion of the deal? That seems crazy. If you acquire a player in a trade you ought to then be responsible for all future charges, IMO.
Agreed.

ECL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 11:58 AM
  #78
HatTrick Swayze
Tomato Potato
 
HatTrick Swayze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 10,130
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
So the team that signed the player to the contract is on the hook for the charge if the player ends his career before the conclusion of the deal? That seems crazy. If you acquire a player in a trade you ought to then be responsible for all future charges, IMO.
That language makes it sound like Philly will be on the hook for Carter/Richards.

1. Applies to existing deals
2. "the effective Cap charge would revert to the Club that originally entered into the contract."

__________________
"Here we can see the agression of american people. They love fighting and guns. when they wont win they try to kill us all." -HalfOfFame
HatTrick Swayze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:00 PM
  #79
Cliffy1814
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 813
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
I don't think anyone's suggesting that Redden's attractive for cap floor purposes. If it happens, it would happen in exchange for a (much) more expensive buyout candidate. Wade will be owed peanuts next season (in real dollars) compared to some of the other potential candidates. Saving 8 figures on a buyout would be very attractive, especially to small market owners.

(Of course, one thing we don't yet know is if this is even possible - if I'm not mistaken, under the NBA CBA you could only buy out a player who was on your roster at the time of the CBA signing.)
I only find three players that fit the criteria above (which makes sense)
Wisnewski is owned $27m , Umburger $23m, and Ville Leiono about $23m. If the intention of those teams is to buy the player out next summer, they could trade them for Redden (only owed $13m) and save thmselves significant cash by buying him out instead. From Ranger perspective, if those players don't pan out it's not a big deal as you can buy them out next summer anyway.
Actually, I can see Wisnewski or Umburger fitting in fairly well.

Cliffy1814 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:02 PM
  #80
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,130
vCash: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
So the team that signed the player to the contract is on the hook for the charge if the player ends his career before the conclusion of the deal? That seems crazy. If you acquire a player in a trade you ought to then be responsible for all future charges, IMO.
I guess that's a mechanism to make sure that the team that signed the circumventing deal gets punished. Otherwise the Wild could trade Suter and Parise to a cap-floor team (who view the cap benefit recapture hit as an asset) minutes before they retire.

Thirty One is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:03 PM
  #81
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,130
vCash: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
That language makes it sound like Philly will be on the hook for Carter/Richards.

1. Applies to existing deals
2. "the effective Cap charge would revert to the Club that originally entered into the contract."
Oh God I hope so.

Thirty One is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:11 PM
  #82
Rangers Fail
free james sheppard
 
Rangers Fail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: NY
Country: United States
Posts: 24,470
vCash: 500
Wait. Does this mean that Philly carries Carter's and Richards' cap hit?

Rangers Fail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:14 PM
  #83
HatTrick Swayze
Tomato Potato
 
HatTrick Swayze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 10,130
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henriks Broadway Hat View Post
Wait. Does this mean that Philly carries Carter's and Richards' cap hit?
Nothing is official but it sounds like they would carry the retirement cap charge if/when they retire under their current deals.

HatTrick Swayze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:15 PM
  #84
iamitter
Thornton's Hen
 
iamitter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 3,478
vCash: 500
James Mirtle ‏@mirtle
Quote:
Here's how salary cap will function in this CBA: It will be 15% above the midpoint, to a minimum of $8-million and maximum of $14-million.
ie. Midpoint is 60 mil. Cap is 69 mil.

iamitter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:15 PM
  #85
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,130
vCash: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henriks Broadway Hat View Post
Wait. Does this mean that Philly carries Carter's and Richards' cap hit?
No, they may (still unclear) carry a cap benefit recapture charge if they retire before their contracts expire.

Richards contract expires when he's 35 and Carter's when he is 37, so I'd say it's unlikely, anyways.

Thirty One is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:17 PM
  #86
NYR Viper
Moderator
 
NYR Viper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: United States
Posts: 29,547
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henriks Broadway Hat View Post
Wait. Does this mean that Philly carries Carter's and Richards' cap hit?
If they retire during this deal than I believe that would be the case, yes.

NYR Viper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:40 PM
  #87
MadHookUp
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 363
vCash: 500
I like that it hurts the team that signed him to the insane contract. That way if New Jersey traded Kovy to a team trying to reach the cap floor, and Kovy retired 2 minutes after the trade was completed, New Jersey still takes the hit. I think the teams that got around the cap like this should be punished.

MadHookUp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 12:45 PM
  #88
nyr2k2
Can't Beat Him
 
nyr2k2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 24,635
vCash: 50
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
I guess that's a mechanism to make sure that the team that signed the circumventing deal gets punished. Otherwise the Wild could trade Suter and Parise to a cap-floor team (who view the cap benefit recapture hit as an asset) minutes before they retire.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadHookUp View Post
I like that it hurts the team that signed him to the insane contract. That way if New Jersey traded Kovy to a team trying to reach the cap floor, and Kovy retired 2 minutes after the trade was completed, New Jersey still takes the hit. I think the teams that got around the cap like this should be punished.
Yeah that makes sense. I have trouble wrapping my feeble brain around some of this stuff.

Still, not sure I like it. I guess it's just because I dislike the cap and don't mind "circumvention" attempts.

__________________

It's just pain.
nyr2k2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 01:14 PM
  #89
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
 
Tawnos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Charlotte, NC
Country: United States
Posts: 13,473
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
James Mirtle ‏@mirtle


ie. Midpoint is 60 mil. Cap is 69 mil.
Only true if revenue is over 3.55B. If it is less, the midpoint+15% is less than $64.3m and the minimum ceiling kicks into effect. Sounds like the floor will still be midpoint-15% in that case.

Tawnos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 01:27 PM
  #90
ECL
Very slippery slope
 
ECL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Middle America
Country: United States
Posts: 80,041
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to ECL
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Yeah that makes sense. I have trouble wrapping my feeble brain around some of this stuff.

Still, not sure I like it. I guess it's just because I dislike the cap and don't mind "circumvention" attempts.
I am in the same boat. IMHO, the cap should be a soft cap with revenue sharing toing to small market teams. Let the Rangers pay a 150M salary if they want. Just that 80M of that above the 70M soft cap would then be doubled and paid into a revenue sharing pool (160M would be paid by the Rangers to a revenue sharing pool in my world).

It would allow teams to spend as much as they want and still benefit the **** market teams that shouldn't exist.

ECL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 01:50 PM
  #91
Leetch3
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,435
vCash: 500
its a joke to make rules retroactive and punish teams for doing things that were allowed under the old cba

Leetch3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 02:01 PM
  #92
iamitter
Thornton's Hen
 
iamitter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 3,478
vCash: 500
James Mirtle ‏@mirtle
Quote:
Teams will be able to retain salary/cap hit in a trade. This will be a very complex and carefully worded portion of new CBA I'm sure.
https://twitter.com/mirtle/status/288374375911129088

iamitter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 02:05 PM
  #93
Leetch3
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,435
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
thats a life-saver for anyone potentially hit with cap hits after guys retire...depending on how it works, it might let us trade the dead cap space richards creates if he retires to a team that wants to get to the floor without actually spending.

Leetch3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 02:06 PM
  #94
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
 
Tawnos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Charlotte, NC
Country: United States
Posts: 13,473
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CM PUNK View Post
thats a life-saver for anyone potentially hit with cap hits after guys retire...depending on how it works, it might let us trade the dead cap space richards creates if he retires to a team that wants to get to the floor without actually spending.
The wording sounds like it's going to say that the recapture hits the original team, no matter who the guy retires with.

Tawnos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 02:07 PM
  #95
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,130
vCash: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by CM PUNK View Post
thats a life-saver for anyone potentially hit with cap hits after guys retire...depending on how it works, it might let us trade the dead cap space richards creates if he retires to a team that wants to get to the floor without actually spending.
Doubt you'll be able to do that.

Thirty One is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 02:09 PM
  #96
iamitter
Thornton's Hen
 
iamitter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 3,478
vCash: 500
I wonder which it is - can you retain salary in a trade? Can you retain cap hit?

If we're at the trade deadline, can the acquiring team absorb the full salary but only half the cap hit? That has the potential to stack some teams.

On the flip side, can you trade away players and keep paying them in part while the new team gets the full cap hit but only part of the salary?

Maybe both?

iamitter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 02:12 PM
  #97
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
 
Tawnos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Charlotte, NC
Country: United States
Posts: 13,473
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
I wonder which it is - can you retain salary in a trade? Can you retain cap hit?

If we're at the trade deadline, can the acquiring team absorb the full salary but only half the cap hit? That has the potential to stack some teams.

On the flip side, can you trade away players and keep paying them in part while the new team gets the full cap hit but only part of the salary?

Maybe both?
It's going to be both. You're not going to be able to do one without the other. It's going to be maximum 50% for contracts under $6m or $3m for contracts over $6m, it sounds like. You pay both the salary and take the cap hit.

If a guy is making $4m, but his cap hit is $5m, then if you're paying 50% you take on $2m in salary and a $2.5m cap hit. It's the only logical way to do it.

Tawnos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 02:13 PM
  #98
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,130
vCash: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
I wonder which it is - can you retain salary in a trade? Can you retain cap hit?

If we're at the trade deadline, can the acquiring team absorb the full salary but only half the cap hit? That has the potential to stack some teams.

On the flip side, can you trade away players and keep paying them in part while the new team gets the full cap hit but only part of the salary?

Maybe both?
No to both.

Early indications were that you could assume a portion of the cap hit relative to the salary you're paying.

Thirty One is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 02:14 PM
  #99
Fire Sather
4 MORE YEARS!
 
Fire Sather's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Connecticut
Country: United States
Posts: 22,478
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Fire Sather
Honestly, with it coming out that the retired players thing counting against the cap it really makes it a possibility to buy out Richards in summer 2014..

I realize this is a silly conversation to have now, especially if his next 2 years are top notch, but none of us here see Richards being nearly as effective after 5-6 years of this deal. It would be wise to replace that money with a player in his prime and not have to worry about Richards' aging process.

I doubt it happens though if Richards has (hopefully) two good seasons coming up here

Fire Sather is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-07-2013, 02:15 PM
  #100
Thirty One
portnor, pls
 
Thirty One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,130
vCash: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fire Sather View Post
Honestly, with it coming out that the retired players thing counting against the cap it really makes it a possibility to buy out Richards in summer 2014.
Yeah, but we're still unclear if you will be able to use the amnesty in the summers of 2013 and 2014, or just 2013.

Thirty One is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:09 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.