HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Vancouver Canucks
Notices

Luongo Talk: The Final Countdown...?

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-08-2013, 09:42 PM
  #701
arsmaster
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 16,133
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
Again the hockey gods decided the Canucks should go into the playoffs in a brain fuzz, without their best winger, breaking up through injury what was going to be a solid 2nd line in Booth, Kesler, Higgins... AV was an idiot Injuries scare me more than anything, which is why depth on all 4 lines is going to be key.

Luongo on the bench, incase of an injury changes nothing... depth from a trade for Luongo allows the team to overcome a goaltending challenge. Luongo simply must be traded.
The team isn't better with Bozak and Kadri and a 2nd round pick than it would be with Luongo.

It's that simple for me, unless the deal really improves the club, it makes no sense to do it before a compressed season.

I'm done with this topic for now, I feel like I'm back in July.

*edit* agree with PG, if it's Weiss ++ yeah, but not Bozak and Kadri....there truly is NO incentive to make that deal from the Canucks POV, scraps are always available, top tier goalies aren't.

arsmaster is online now  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:44 PM
  #702
Drop the Sopel
Feaster famine
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: calgary
Posts: 15,260
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
What Makes Frattin better?

It's truly a grass is greener belief for you here.
Frattin scored 36 goals in 44 games at North Dakota in '10-11. Since then he's scored at a 50 goal pace in the AHL - 33G/58GP.

Frattin's shot and nose for the net is what makes him better than Weise IMO.

I don't think it's a 'grass is greener' issue here. I just think you don't know enough about Matt Frattin. You said Weise is more productive...

Drop the Sopel is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:45 PM
  #703
Biggest Canuck Fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: West Kelowna, BC
Posts: 10,447
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Biggest Canuck Fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by PG Canuck View Post
Risk is the same, but I'd rather not take a risk and have both goalies than have scraps, is all.
So let's not talk about scraps cause there is no way GMMG trades Lu for scraps. He would've done it in July. He is going to make a trade that makes sense for the Canucks, not for the Leafs, and whoever gets him is going to have to give up something of value.

It simply comes back to this... Luongo indeed makes the Leafs, and Panthers better teams. He improves their chances, even if they lose some players, because he can make a bigger impact for those teams.

If you are Burke, you need to make the playoffs, you have no choice. Well I guess you do, miss the playoffs and get fired, or bite the bullet, and next year find improvements.

Biggest Canuck Fan is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:47 PM
  #704
Canucker
Registered User
 
Canucker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Prince Rupert, BC
Posts: 18,165
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
Frattin scored 36 goals in 44 games at North Dakota in '10-11. Since then he's scored at a 50 goal pace in the AHL - 33G/58GP.

Frattin's shot and nose for the net is what makes him better than Weise IMO.

I don't think it's a 'grass is greener' issue here. I just think you don't know enough about Matt Frattin. You said Weise is more productive...
If you count his Dutch league exploits, he is more productive.

Canucker is online now  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:47 PM
  #705
Biggest Canuck Fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: West Kelowna, BC
Posts: 10,447
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Biggest Canuck Fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
The team isn't better with Bozak and Kadri and a 2nd round pick than it would be with Luongo.

It's that simple for me, unless the deal really improves the club, it makes no sense to do it before a compressed season.

I'm done with this topic for now, I feel like I'm back in July.

*edit* agree with PG, if it's Weiss ++ yeah, but not Bozak and Kadri....there truly is NO incentive to make that deal from the Canucks POV, scraps are always available, top tier goalies aren't.
And I agree as well, Weiss makes most sense from Canucks perspective. Even if you let him walk in off season, for this season he is the best option and gives you some cap space as well if i'm not mistaken.

Biggest Canuck Fan is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:49 PM
  #706
PG Canuck
Global Moderator
 
PG Canuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Prince George, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,499
vCash: 1512
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
So let's not talk about scraps cause there is no way GMMG trades Lu for scraps. He would've done it in July. He is going to make a trade that makes sense for the Canucks, not for the Leafs, and whoever gets him is going to have to give up something of value.

It simply comes back to this... Luongo indeed makes the Leafs, and Panthers better teams. He improves their chances, even if they lose some players, because he can make a bigger impact for those teams.

If you are Burke, you need to make the playoffs, you have no choice. Well I guess you do, miss the playoffs and get fired, or bite the bullet, and next year find improvements.
Agreed he won't trade Luongo for scraps. This is why I think Toronto will lose out on Luongo: nothing of value to offer, or won't give up anything of value. I still like Florida, and I bring up Weiss again. If the rumours about him are true, hopefully we can make a move and get him.

PG Canuck is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:52 PM
  #707
Canucker
Registered User
 
Canucker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Prince Rupert, BC
Posts: 18,165
vCash: 500
Still not getting why Florida trades Weiss now instead of at the deadline. He's their #1 offensive center on a team with nobody to fill his shoes.

Canucker is online now  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:52 PM
  #708
Outside99*
Sedins off Kas
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,347
vCash: 796
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
That's an odd way to evaluate players. Quote their AHl numbers and give Weise credit for playing more games in the NHL with significantly less production...

Weise has 4G, 4A in 78 NHL games - Frattin had twice as many goals and assists in 20 less games.

Frattin also scored 24 goals in 36 AHL games in '11-12. Miles better than anything Weise has ever done as a pro.

I take Frattin over Weise without thinking twice. And I don't mind Weise as a 12-13 th forward project.

'Lateral at best' is a much tougher stance to defend...
I agree. What's intriguing about Frattin is his shot/release.

Outside99* is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:53 PM
  #709
Biggest Canuck Fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: West Kelowna, BC
Posts: 10,447
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Biggest Canuck Fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canucker View Post
Still not getting why Florida trades Weiss now instead of at the deadline. He's their #1 offensive center on a team with nobody to fill his shoes.
They have some strong young players ready to play on ELC's and Luongo has 6 years of great hockey left in him.

If he has no plans to sign in FLA, you trade for Lu, and get your young guns going.

Biggest Canuck Fan is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:55 PM
  #710
PG Canuck
Global Moderator
 
PG Canuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Prince George, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,499
vCash: 1512
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canucker View Post
Still not getting why Florida trades Weiss now instead of at the deadline. He's their #1 offensive center on a team with nobody to fill his shoes.
I agree it seems like more of a deadline deal to me, that's if Florida isn't in the playoff picture. They may want a C back, and all we really have to offer is Schroeder.

PG Canuck is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:56 PM
  #711
jammyrft
Registered User
 
jammyrft's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Up North eh
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,828
vCash: 500
I hope we don't trade a star goalie for tweeners on a lottery team

jammyrft is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:57 PM
  #712
Canucker
Registered User
 
Canucker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Prince Rupert, BC
Posts: 18,165
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
They have some strong young players ready to play on ELC's and Luongo has 6 years of great hockey left in him.

If he has no plans to sign in FLA, you trade for Lu, and get your young guns going.
Who is going to step right into a #1 center role? Not Bjugstad, he's staying in college. Nobody else they have is ready for a #1 center role.

The most prudent thing they could do is hang onto Weiss until they know where they sit in the playoff picture and then sell him at the deadline if they are on the outside looking in...nothing else makes sense.

Canucker is online now  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:57 PM
  #713
Drop the Sopel
Feaster famine
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: calgary
Posts: 15,260
vCash: 500


Matt Frattin has 27 even strength goals in 58 AHL games. I wonder where that ranks him in even strength goals. That's absurd 5 on 5 finishing ability - let alone for someone with less than 60 games under their belt as a pro...

Drop the Sopel is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 09:58 PM
  #714
LiquidSnake
Agent of Chaos...
 
LiquidSnake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 26,589
vCash: 883
Agree with Arsemaster here as well about trade value.

Heard Tony Gallagher on 1040 today. He seems to think that the Weiss story may be planted by the Panthers through Doug Maclean and Keenan in order to get something out there.

And Bob Mac mentioned something along the lines of hearing Weiss' name being brought up as well. I'm sure the Panthers would need to add though

LiquidSnake is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:07 PM
  #715
y2kcanucks
Cult of Personality
 
y2kcanucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Surrey, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 46,227
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to y2kcanucks
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
Frattin would make our 4th line IMO. Upgrade on Dale Weiss.

We're not a Schneider injury away from the draft lottery. Could potentially miss the playoffs though with a slew of injuries to our top players. Like every other team in the league...
You realize missing the playoffs puts us in the draft lottery, right? So yes, we are likely a Schneider injury away from the draft lottery if we do that trade.

Oh great, you suggest we trade Luongo for an upgrade to our 4th line now???

__________________
http://www.vancitynitetours.com
y2kcanucks is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:08 PM
  #716
Biggest Canuck Fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: West Kelowna, BC
Posts: 10,447
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Biggest Canuck Fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
You realize missing the playoffs puts us in the draft lottery, right? So yes, we are likely a Schneider injury away from the draft lottery if we do that trade.

Oh great, you suggest we trade Luongo for an upgrade to our 4th line now???
Who do you trade Luongo for?

Biggest Canuck Fan is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:10 PM
  #717
ZenMaster*
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 555
vCash: 500
Frattin + Bozak?

That trade isn't bad at all, we essentially upgraded the bottom six for a redundant asset. People are really underrating Matt Frattin here, he's built a like a tank, hustles every shift, and produces.

ZenMaster* is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:11 PM
  #718
Canucker
Registered User
 
Canucker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Prince Rupert, BC
Posts: 18,165
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenMaster View Post
Frattin + Bozak?

That trade isn't bad at all, we essentially upgraded the bottom six for a redundant asset. People are really underrating Matt Frattin here, he's built a like a tank, hustles every shift, and produces.
By suggesting that trade you are seriously underrating Luongo. No thanks.

Canucker is online now  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:12 PM
  #719
y2kcanucks
Cult of Personality
 
y2kcanucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Surrey, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 46,227
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to y2kcanucks
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggest Canuck Fan View Post
Who do you trade Luongo for?
Someone who's better than a crap third line center and a 4th line upgrade?

I'd target Weiss from Florida. From Toronto I'd ask for Lupul, Biggs, and a 1st round pick. Or Gardiner and a 1st round pick.

And no, that's not overvaluing Luongo, that's simply me refusing to undervalue a top 5 goalie!

y2kcanucks is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:13 PM
  #720
arsmaster
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 16,133
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LiquidSnake View Post
Agree with Arsemaster here as well about trade value.

Heard Tony Gallagher on 1040 today. He seems to think that the Weiss story may be planted by the Panthers through Doug Maclean and Keenan in order to get something out there.

And Bob Mac mentioned something along the lines of hearing Weiss' name being brought up as well. I'm sure the Panthers would need to add though
Where do you guys always find the 'e' after 'ars'....on another note, Florida would most certainly have to add.

arsmaster is online now  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:13 PM
  #721
PG Canuck
Global Moderator
 
PG Canuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Prince George, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,499
vCash: 1512
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenMaster View Post
Frattin + Bozak?

That trade isn't bad at all, we essentially upgraded the bottom six for a redundant asset. People are really underrating Matt Frattin here, he's built a like a tank, hustles every shift, and produces.
It's pretty bad. At no point does a goalie of Luongo's calibre equal Bozak, and Frattin. Sure, Frattin may not be bad, but he's not going to be a top six player on the Canucks in the future, I can tell you that. Bozak is just ugh.

PG Canuck is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:14 PM
  #722
Drop the Sopel
Feaster famine
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: calgary
Posts: 15,260
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Oh great, you suggest we trade Luongo for an upgrade to our 4th line now???
Yet you want to trade our elite, top 5 goalie for MPS.

Yeah, let's trade our superstar goalie for a guy with 4 goals in 35 AHL games.

You're fired. And I curse you to go 50 years between erections!

Drop the Sopel is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:15 PM
  #723
Vankiller Whale
Maybe HE can score
 
Vankiller Whale's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,807
vCash: 5555
Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
Where do you guys always find the 'e' after 'ars'....on another note, Florida would most certainly have to add.

Vankiller Whale is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:17 PM
  #724
y2kcanucks
Cult of Personality
 
y2kcanucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Surrey, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 46,227
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to y2kcanucks
Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
Where do you guys always find the 'e' after 'ars'....on another note, Florida would most certainly have to add.
To be fair I always thought that's sorta what you were going for too lol.

Weiss, Petrovic and a 1 for Luongo and Raymond works for me.

y2kcanucks is offline  
Old
01-08-2013, 10:17 PM
  #725
Biggest Canuck Fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: West Kelowna, BC
Posts: 10,447
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Biggest Canuck Fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Someone who's better than a crap third line center and a 4th line upgrade?

I'd target Weiss from Florida. From Toronto I'd ask for Lupul, Biggs, and a 1st round pick. Or Gardiner and a 1st round pick.

And no, that's not overvaluing Luongo, that's simply me refusing to undervalue a top 5 goalie!
I agree with this, and I think that is what the Canucks will get. But not Gardiner cause of the Concussion. But I do think what you proposed will be what you get for Luongo.

Biggest Canuck Fan is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:41 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.