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PK Subban for Nail Yakupov

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Old
01-10-2013, 12:49 PM
  #51
Petro Points
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceDaddy View Post
Maybe..but maybe not

no one knows for sure...thats my point.
would your point remain the same if Mckinnon is unanimoulsy declared the top prospect and selected 1st overall ?

"maybee he'll be good maybe not"

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01-10-2013, 12:52 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by mavstar View Post
Lets all listen to an Oilers fan named "Yakubot" for an unbiased opinion concerning Yakupov.
From 2000 and onward, which 1st overall forwards have not panned out? I'm dying to know.

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01-10-2013, 12:52 PM
  #53
Petro Points
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Originally Posted by IceDaddy View Post
You really dont see the difference do you?
one is Oiler property therefore useless while the guy who was ranked below by just about every proefssional scout is the real deal and therefore untouchable unless Stamkos is offered.

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01-10-2013, 12:53 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceDaddy View Post
Maybe..but maybe not

no one knows for sure...thats my point.
Fair enough, but I have no problem putting my money down on the 1st overall. Those guys tend to be pretty good. Sometimes you have to roll the dice on the big gain. To me, this is one of those times.

I am glad we both agree there is no deal to be made here though.

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01-10-2013, 12:53 PM
  #55
IceDaddy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
would your point remain the same if Mckinnon is unanimoulsy declared the top prospect and selected 1st overall ?

"maybee he'll be good maybe not"
Mckinnon
Yakupov
Galchenyuk

the prospect does not matter one bit. They are just that, prospects. Some work out awesome, some average, some bust out.

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01-10-2013, 12:58 PM
  #56
Petro Points
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceDaddy View Post
Mckinnon
Yakupov
Galchenyuk

the prospect does not matter one bit. They are just that, prospects. Some work out awesome, some average, some bust out.
yet stupid GMs reportedly still go around and offer Hemsky+Eberle for them even before they are drafted..

The % of top picks busting is very minimal in the new NHL.

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01-10-2013, 01:02 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
one is Oiler property therefore useless while the guy who was ranked below by just about every proefssional scout is the real deal and therefore untouchable unless Stamkos is offered.
Wrong

The Habs have a stud goalie, stud top pairing d-man, stud winger. The big need is a stud centerman. if a stud center is available for trade then Gally would be on the table for sure.


Oiler fans would rather keep 4 young forwards with tons of potential rather than trade one to fill a huge hole on defense.

Also, trading Yakupov doesnt create a hole for edmonton. However trading Subban does create a huge problem for the Habs.

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01-10-2013, 01:07 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mavstar View Post
Why would MTL do this? Yakupov is a gamble, first overall picks don't always pan out. We KNOW that Subban is a legit top-pairing defenceman and future star.
That fights with his own team members . We don't need him and Hall getting into it . Hall just fell into Eberle on his own going up the steps . Eberle nothing ,Hall has added some more stitches to his collection

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01-10-2013, 01:10 PM
  #59
Petro Points
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceDaddy View Post
Wrong

The Habs have a stud goalie, stud top pairing d-man, stud winger. The big need is a stud centerman. if a stud center is available for trade then Gally would be on the table for sure.


Oiler fans would rather keep 4 young forwards with tons of potential rather than trade one to fill a huge hole on defense.

Also, trading Yakupov doesnt create a hole for edmonton. However trading Subban does create a huge problem for the habs.
trade Galchenyuk for Krejci or Marleau and shore up your lineup ..
EDM does not have a huge hole on RD .. With the addition if Schultz we just need a physical #5 Dman. If Whitney struggles then we would have a big hole to fill.

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01-10-2013, 01:13 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceDaddy View Post
Wrong

The Habs have a stud goalie, stud top pairing d-man, stud winger. The big need is a stud centerman. if a stud center is available for trade then Gally would be on the table for sure.


Oiler fans would rather keep 4 young forwards with tons of potential rather than trade one to fill a huge hole on defense.

Also, trading Yakupov doesnt create a hole for edmonton. However trading Subban does create a huge problem for the Habs.
Yes it does create a hole . You need to watch some games . Last year the Oilers had no scoring out side of the big 3 , adding Yakupov should give us 2 scoring lines

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01-10-2013, 01:13 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
trade Galchenyuk for Krejci or Marleau and shore up your lineup ..
EDM does not have a huge hole on RD .. With the addition if Schultz we just need a physical #5 Dman. If Whitney struggles then we would have a big hole to fill.
I said stud center, not a good one or an aging one.

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01-10-2013, 01:41 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceDaddy View Post
I dont think you got the point of my post. In terms of value, Subban has more value. In the future who knows but today....Subban holds more value than yakupov.
Subban has more value, really? I guess he's better in your opinion, but ones opinion doesn't always mean it's correct.

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01-10-2013, 02:05 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
they dont have to be as long as they can hold their own and put up similar stats.
Petry proved that he could play the tough minutes, can hit, can block shot.
J.Schultz has proven that he can be a decent option on the PP. We are fine with these 2 plus N.Schultz rounding off the right side.

MTL fans tend to bash on the unproven prospects until the wonder boy Galchenyuk is borught up. Trade Galy for Fowler or Gardiner if puck movers are that valuable.
One problem with that. Gally could (and I truly believe he will), become the most valuable player out of that draft, at least best forward. He's an extremely talented centreman (adds value imo as opposed to wingers), has decent size and great two way ability. In fact, some scouts even believed that Gally is more talented and well rounded than Yakupov. Subban *could* turn out to be a top 5 d-man in the league. Gardiner and Fowler (from my subjective opinion) will never come close to that. Perhaps Fowler for a couple of years, but Subban is simply far and away the better defenseman with much higher potential to boot.

You're not looking at talent level. By your logic, any specific role, say for example a powerforward can have immense value when trading for pieces, rather than basing it on a combination of role + talent + work ethic, etc....

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01-10-2013, 02:10 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadienShark View Post
One problem with that. Gally could (and I truly believe he will), become the most valuable player out of that draft, at least best forward. He's an extremely talented centreman (adds value imo as opposed to wingers), has decent size and great two way ability. In fact, some scouts even believed that Gally is more talented and well rounded than Yakupov. Subban *could* turn out to be a top 5 d-man in the league. Gardiner and Fowler (from my subjective opinion) will never come close to that. Perhaps Fowler for a couple of years, but Subban is simply far and away the better defenseman with much higher potential to boot.

You're not looking at talent level. By your logic, any specific role, say for example a powerforward can have immense value, rather than basing it on a combination of role + talent + work ethic, etc....
That is the same problem EDM has... not just EDM fans but almost all the pro scouting agencies share this view..
Until Galchenyuk proves otherwise Yakupov is clearly the better player.

Like your fellow MTL fans say... your player is garbage until he proves otherwise..
Maybe Galchenyuk will be a star... maybe he'll bust.. who knows

EDM and the 'experts' all factored in the positions these prospects played.. We selected Yakupov knowing we have a huge hole to fill on D (before Schultz) and a hole on #2C spot. Yakupov is just that good.

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01-10-2013, 02:23 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
would your point remain the same if Mckinnon is unanimoulsy declared the top prospect and selected 1st overall ?

"maybee he'll be good maybe not"
The experts can declare who ever they want 1st overall, doesn't matter to me. I'd rather have Seth Jones, Barkov or Drouin before him and if we took a poll of Habs fans I'm sure that most would agree with me.

Which is the same when Yakupov was drafted, most Habs fans wanted Galchenyuk.

Yakupov was one of the very best players in the draft and the only reason he was picked 1st overall was because of the 5 lottery teams, Edmonton picked 1st overall. I'm pretty sure the Islanders and Columbus would of taken Murray and Montreal would of taken Galchenyuk if we won but even Burke got the best player in the draft (Rielly, lol), so there you go.

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01-10-2013, 02:32 PM
  #66
Petro Points
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
The experts can declare who ever they want 1st overall, doesn't matter . I'd rather have Seth Jones, Barkov or Drouin before him and if we took a poll of Habs fans I'm sure that most would agree with me.

Which is the same when Yakupov was drafted, most Habs fans wanted Galchenyuk.

Yakupov was one of the very best players in the draft and the only reason he was picked 1st overall was because of the 5 lottery teams, Edmonton picked 1st overall. I'm pretty sure the Islanders and Columbus would of taken Murray and Montreal would of taken Galchenyuk if we won but even Burke got the best player in the draft (Rielly, lol), so there you go.

Yah we know that it doesnt matter to you or any MTL or TML fan who the experts\ professional scouts declare #1 ... Just dont force your opinions on others..
Yakupov was the clear best in the draft.
Despite a lousy WJHC playing on a team with no offense he was able to score as much as Galchenyuk.

edit: There were many people who believed Yakupov to be better than RNH a year ago.. and if he was available he wouldve gone 1st overall before RNH..
Get drafted by Oilers and you become junk.

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01-10-2013, 02:41 PM
  #67
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Like many people have said, I think the value is pretty much there, but both sides pass. Montreal (the city) absolutely loves Subban, and he's very good at both ends of the ice while still a young player. Those don't come by all the time, and the habs don't have enough depth at D to abandon a first pairing defenseman. Even though Yakupov has the potential to be a great player.

Like I said in the Plekanec for Couturier thread, I value a proven player more than one who isn't (generally), so I think I ought to keep Subban in montreal.

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01-10-2013, 02:50 PM
  #68
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Call me crazy but I'd probably do this trade and I love Subban in MTL.

Galchenyuk-Yakupov would be dynamite going forward and they can try to trade for a suitable replacement with a package or trade up in the draft with their 3 2nd's and 1st to draft a stud.

Just seems too good to pass up for me but it is a high risk/high reward type scenario.

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01-10-2013, 02:53 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by IceDaddy View Post
Hasn't this one been beaten to death? Both sides hate the idea, which probably means its a fair deal but whatever.....
Exactly, just like the CBA.

Subban brings that grit and talent that Edmonton needs and Yakupov gives MTL an explosive duo.

Realistically Edmonton would have to add, not sure what though..

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01-10-2013, 03:06 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
Yah we know that it doesnt matter to you or any MTL or TML fan who the experts\ professional scouts declare #1 ... Just dont force your opinions on others..
Yakupov was the clear best in the draft.
Despite a lousy WJHC playing on a team with no offense he was able to score as much as Galchenyuk.

edit: There were many people who believed Yakupov to be better than RNH a year ago.. and if he was available he wouldve gone 1st overall before RNH..
Get drafted by Oilers and you become junk.
Did you watch Galchenyuk play because playing with teammates with no offensive skills apply much more to Galchenyuk then they do to Yakupov - who was playing on Russia's top line. I'd take Yakupov's line mates to Galchenyuk's line mates any day of the week.

Your comments about Yakupov and RNH are just being silly. Edmonton shot down any idea of trading the RNH pick and were willing to listen to offers for Yakupov, but nobody was willing to pony much up for him.

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Old
01-10-2013, 03:12 PM
  #71
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A D-Man like Subban is way more valuable than a forward like Yakupov.

Subban has the potential to become one of the 10 best d-men in the NHL., even a top-5.

With Galchenyuk, Collberg, Bozon, Hudon, Kristo and Gallagher, they have already some good young forwards to take charge.

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01-10-2013, 03:22 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by supert View Post
Yes it does create a hole . You need to watch some games . Last year the Oilers had no scoring out side of the big 3 , adding Yakupov should give us 2 scoring lines
Yakupov needs to play before the Oilers or even the NHL before you can say that he's filled a hole for you. As of now, you're still no better or worse off than last year (with that hole remaining), however you HOPE that Yakupov (your reward for winning the lottery) can fill that hole. Trading him wouldn't create one when there already is one there.

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01-10-2013, 03:23 PM
  #73
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We've been over this. No from both sides.

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01-10-2013, 03:23 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by StarsFan74 View Post
To reiterate:

"Scoring wingers are a lot easier to come by than puck-moving offensive d-men. Bergevin does not do this if he is smart."

Clearly, I am *not* making the above statement from Edmonton's perspective.
this - and from a 3rd party source. as a hab fan i agree. i don't have to disparage Yakupov. he'll probably be ovechkin light and score 35-40 per year which is great. but habs are not trading their best young d man since chelios. not. going. to. happen.

i'm also jittery about trading for talented russians. maybe the kovalchuk situation is just an anomaly, but it would be a nightmare to lose yakupov - regardless of what he's saying now.

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01-10-2013, 03:35 PM
  #75
CanadienShark
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
trade Galchenyuk for Krejci or Marleau and shore up your lineup ..
EDM does not have a huge hole on RD .. With the addition if Schultz we just need a physical #5 Dman. If Whitney struggles then we would have a big hole to fill.
Krejci is good, not a stud. Marleau WAS a stud a few years ago, and he's since converted to LW. Plus I'd like to see him and Joe retire as Sharks. Best case scenario would be a combination of my two teams :

Pacioretty - Thornton - Havlat
Marleau - Pavelski - Couture
Clowe - Plekanec - Cole
Galchenyuk - Eller - Gionta

Burns - Subban
Boyle - Gorges
Markov/Stuart - Vlasic

Price
Niemi
Greiss

................ :drools: haha

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