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*ALL* Luongo Talk (News/Speculation/Rumors/Proposals)

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:19 PM
  #126
Vankiller Whale
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Originally Posted by var View Post
Alright, getting close to trade time, and rather than debate the merits of trades, let's see some honest guesses for what a completed Lu trade will look like.

Gardiner
2nd
4th

Lu

Think their desire for a LH D and a future prospect will point them to Gardiner before it points to Schenn, although depending on what Phil offers, could be close.
We have no desire for a LH D. Unless it's Gardiner. If this were Schenn from a year ago then it wouldn't be close who I'd prefer. But now it's Gardiner simply based on talent. Neither would be great fits for us.

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01-11-2013, 03:19 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Fogelhund View Post
I know, sad isn't it? The thing is... we have no prospects that fill that role. Lot's of puck movers, or two way guys.. no Defensive D. I'm not bothered by the Schenn deal, moreso by moving Aulie. Hey, have you got a stay at home, hard hitting guy, who can actually skate?
Less on the hard hitting but defensively solid would be Tanev. He actually makes Ballard look good.

If it wasn't for our own lack of that type of defenseman. His name might pop around in these trades more. Wouldn't be surprised if you guys try to add one before the deadline, unless Gardiner or Rielly excel. Perhaps, Volchenkov but his contract may be too risky.

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01-11-2013, 03:21 PM
  #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by var View Post
Alright, getting close to trade time, and rather than debate the merits of trades, let's see some honest guesses for what a completed Lu trade will look like.

Gardiner
2nd
4th

Lu

Think their desire for a LH D and a future prospect will point them to Gardiner before it points to Schenn, although depending on what Phil offers, could be close.
Well I say we acquiesce on the prospect and go with pure need:

Bozak, Franson, 1st.

Not happy with that but after going back and forth on this a million times I think that's where we end up. One reason I don't like it is that it hurts TO in both positions. Which means we pay for it in overall return.


Sedin Sedin Burr
Higgins Bozak Booth
Raymond Schroeder Hansen
Malhotra Lappy Kassian

Kes IR, Ebbet, Wiese

Hamhuis Bieksa
Garrison Edler
Ballard Tanev
Alberts Franson

Raymond (CAR, PIT, PHO) and Ballard (OTT, MIN, NYI, DAL) obvious trade fodder.


Last edited by ginner classic: 01-11-2013 at 03:30 PM.
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Old
01-11-2013, 03:24 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Fogelhund View Post
Rielly won't play this year, and I don't think Liles or Franson stick around for too long. But we have Blacker, Finn, Percy, Ranger, Holzer, Fraser, Kotska.. Fraser could be a decent Defensive D, good size, and throw the mitts when needed. Ranger was decent in his first stint in the NHL, and is doing well with the Marlies. Kotska is likely a career AHL guy, but great numbers this year. Holzer is more likely to be on the team this year than Franson IMO, but you never know.
People need to stop saying this. The Leafs have no connection with Ranger. He's under contract with the Toronto Marlies, basically a UFA as far as anyone in the NHL is concerned.

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:24 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Fogelhund View Post
Well, I am all set for the arguments to go from.

Vancouver fans - Kadri is a prospect who won`t amount to anything, Bozak is a dime a dozen player. We can't give Luongo up for these useless parts
Toronto fans - Kadri is a critical part of our future, we can`t afford to trade him, Bozak is our #1C, and a useful component of any team... We can't afford this price.

to post trade.

Toronto fans. - Kadri was a waste of a pick floater, who couldn't make a non-playoff team, Bozak's points were all as a result of who he played with, we stole Luongo
Vancouver fans - Kadri is a steal, he'll be a useful part of our top six, Bozak is a good utility player and we got rid of a high cap hit goalie who couldn't preform in the playoffs.

some of us have stated bozak is useless since day 1

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:25 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Hodgson for Kassian? Seems like he was high on him, and didn't wait to find a better return for him.

We could have waited and maybe traded Hodgson for someone like Gardiner, or for a high enough pick last year to draft Forsberg(from Anaheim, Dallas, etc)
You don't think of Kassian as highly as Gillis does.

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01-11-2013, 03:26 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Nash View Post
If Kadri makes the next step. He is as questionable a prospect as Kassian right now.

Also, in 5 years no one can predict what your roster will be. Here is your roster from 5 years ago... http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/l...000382008.html

There are zero players remaining from then. Stajan, Wellwood and White were all supposed to become stars and Tlusty, Kulemon, Rask, Pogge and Earl were the future.
Kulemin is still here. Stuart Percy is here as result of chain of trades from Tlusty. Stajan and White brought us our captain.

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01-11-2013, 03:26 PM
  #133
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People need to stop saying this. The Leafs have no connection with Ranger. He's under contract with the Toronto Marlies, basically a UFA as far as anyone in the NHL is concerned.
ranger will be a Leaf

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01-11-2013, 03:30 PM
  #134
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You don't think of Kassian as highly as Gillis does.
I agree, which is why I hope he doesn't do something like Frattin + 2nd, just because he's high on him.

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:33 PM
  #135
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I'll go off the board and away from the rumoured deals.
Kulemin, Frattin and a second if Toronto.
Shore and a second and a lower roster player if Florida. Here's Florida's prospect center depth according to HF:
1. Jonathan Huberdeau CHL 8.5 B
2. Rocco Grimaldi NCAA 8.0 D
3. Nick Bjugstad NCAA 7.5 B
4. Kyle Rau NCAA 7.0 C
5. Drew Shore 7.0 C

This may make Shore expendible. With Markstrom in the wings and the cash risk with Luongo's contract I think Florida a more difficult sell but Gillis and Tallon have a history.

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01-11-2013, 03:35 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
I'll go off the board and away from the rumoured deals.
Kulemin, Frattin and a second if Toronto.
Shore and a second and a lower roster player if Florida. Here's Florida's prospect center depth according to HF:
1. Jonathan Huberdeau CHL 8.5 B
2. Rocco Grimaldi NCAA 8.0 D
3. Nick Bjugstad NCAA 7.5 B
4. Kyle Rau NCAA 7.0 C
5. Drew Shore 7.0 C

This may make Shore expendible.With Markstrom in the wings and the cash risk with Luongo's contract I think Florida a more difficult sell but Gillis and Tallon have a history..
HF ratings are worthless when proving a point. Especially with Huberdeau most likely moving to wing, and Grimaldi being like 5'6.

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01-11-2013, 03:35 PM
  #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
I'll go off the board and away from the rumoured deals.
Kulemin, Frattin and a second if Toronto.
Shore and a second and a lower roster player if Florida. Here's Florida's prospect center depth according to HF:
1. Jonathan Huberdeau CHL 8.5 B
2. Rocco Grimaldi NCAA 8.0 D
3. Nick Bjugstad NCAA 7.5 B
4. Kyle Rau NCAA 7.0 C
5. Drew Shore 7.0 C

This may make Shore expendible.With Markstrom in the wings and the cash risk with Luongo's contract I think Florida a more difficult sell but Gillis and Tallon have a history..
I think Huberdeau will start at LW but with the depth they ahve there you might be right to keep him at center. Grimaldi is a boom bust and needs time in the AHL. Shore has jumped into 3rd at this point if you consider Huberdeau a center. 2nd if you do not.

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01-11-2013, 03:35 PM
  #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
I'll go off the board and away from the rumoured deals.
Kulemin, Frattin and a second if Toronto.
Shore and a second and a lower roster player if Florida. Here's Florida's prospect center depth according to HF:
1. Jonathan Huberdeau CHL 8.5 B
2. Rocco Grimaldi NCAA 8.0 D
3. Nick Bjugstad NCAA 7.5 B
4. Kyle Rau NCAA 7.0 C
5. Drew Shore 7.0 C

This may make Shore expendible.With Markstrom in the wings and the cash risk with Luongo's contract I think Florida a more difficult sell but Gillis and Tallon have a history..
IMO it's more like:

1) Nick Bjugstad
2) Drew Shore
3) Rocco Grimaldi
4) Vincent Trochek
5) Kyle Rau

With Hubs being #1LW prospect.

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01-11-2013, 03:37 PM
  #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StringerBell View Post
IMO it's more like:

1) Nick Bjugstad
2) Drew Shore
3) Rocco Grimaldi
4) Vincent Trochek
5) Kyle Rau

With Hubs being #1LW prospect.
Beat ya to it. :-)

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:39 PM
  #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StringerBell View Post
IMO it's more like:

1) Nick Bjugstad
2) Drew Shore
3) Rocco Grimaldi
4) Vincent Trochek
5) Kyle Rau

With Hubs being #1LW prospect.
Ginner Classic:

"I think Huberdeau will start at LW but with the depth they ahve there you might be right to keep him at center. Grimaldi is a boom bust and needs time in the AHL. Shore has jumped into 3rd at this point if you consider Huberdeau a center. 2nd if you do "


Thanks for that both of you! That changes things quite a bit then. He's certainly a key prospect for them especially given their lack of scoring. Still, the kind of deal I hope we get is one that is built around one key piece that Gillis wants rather than a few spare parts. I fear the latter may be what we settle for though.

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:40 PM
  #141
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People need to stop saying this. The Leafs have no connection with Ranger. He's under contract with the Toronto Marlies, basically a UFA as far as anyone in the NHL is concerned.
Ranger has made it pretty clear he's only interested in playing in Toronto, so if he's NHL-level that's where he will be. You've essentially retained his rights without signing him to a contract. Pretty sweet deal.

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:40 PM
  #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
That changes things quite a bit then. He's certainly a key prospect for them especially given their lack of scoring. Still, the kind of deal I hope we get is one that is built around one key piece that Gillis wants rather than a few spare parts. I fear the latter may be what we settle for though.
If it's Toronto we deal with that one key piece needs to be their 1st round pick.

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:43 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by stevecanuck16 View Post
Ranger has made it pretty clear he's only interested in playing in Toronto, so if he's NHL-level that's where he will be. You've essentially retained his rights without signing him to a contract. Pretty sweet deal.
I'm thinking he is really only interested in the AHL at this point.

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01-11-2013, 03:43 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by ginner classic View Post
If it's Toronto we deal with that one key piece needs to be their 1st round pick.
I agree with that. While the Kessel trade may make them hesitant, that shouldn't change Gillis' target.

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:45 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by ginner classic View Post
If it's Toronto we deal with that one key piece needs to be their 1st round pick.
No way that will ever be included.

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:46 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by stevecanuck16 View Post
Ranger has made it pretty clear he's only interested in playing in Toronto, so if he's NHL-level that's where he will be. You've essentially retained his rights without signing him to a contract. Pretty sweet deal.
He looks to be NHL level, the question is whether or not he wants to play in the NHL. From interviews and reports from insiders he sounds like a guy who loves the game but doesn't care about the money or the fame.

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Old
01-11-2013, 03:49 PM
  #147
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Drew Shore or Nazim Kadri? Who's the preferred prospect?

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01-11-2013, 03:49 PM
  #148
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I'm going to go with Bozak, Kadri and 2nd.
That is about the value I see to Toronto. Maybe different pieces but that is about the valuation.
And maybe they get a better offer from another team but I would be shocked if they get much more from us.

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01-11-2013, 03:51 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by StringerBell View Post
Drew Shore or Nazim Kadri? Who's the preferred prospect?
Imo: Kadri

In Gillis' opinion: Probably Shore

I'd like Petrovic over either, though.

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01-11-2013, 03:52 PM
  #150
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Kulemin is still here. Stuart Percy is here as result of chain of trades from Tlusty. Stajan and White brought us our captain.
So from 8 players/prospects, you ended up with Phaneuf and Kulemin, plus another potential player. That's not great, but it's not bad either. So many people on this website expect 80% of their prospects to excel. None of those 8 became a star and turning them into Phaneuf alone is pretty decent.

But back to the original point, 5 years from now who knows what your roster will be like. Toronto has zero players from 5 years ago. Vancouver, who has been fairly competitive, only has 9 players from 5 years ago and Luongo won't be here too much longer.

GMs in the league talk about building for the future, but the reality is that most of them don't stick around 5 years and it takes close to that to completely alter a team. For most of them, the future is either now or in the next 3 seasons.

It's great to take a long term approach, but rarely does it happen and even when a team takes that route, it does not guarantee success.

I just can't see management being okay with 2-4 more seasons of missing the playoffs in Toronto. For a big market, the limit most franchises should find acceptable is five years, and that is based on going full rebuild.

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