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who would you want to see phoenix pursue via trade

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Old
01-11-2013, 09:12 AM
  #176
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Originally Posted by hbk View Post
I'd be shocked if Yandle was not in play. D is at a premium right now and Maloney has a very good chip to play IF he gets the right offer.
What is Yandle worth in trade then? Krejci? Nice forward, but not so amazing that I'd drive Yandle to the airport.

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01-11-2013, 10:42 AM
  #177
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Yandle?
A good 2-way center who can chip in some offense. If it's with Boston, I would like an expanded trade with Krejci and Yandle as the main pieces.

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01-11-2013, 11:01 AM
  #178
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A good 2-way center who can chip in some offense.
We've got one of those. Vermette. Adding another at the cost of Yandle doesn't make much sense, unless Maloney thinks Krejci can be 'the guy' for a long time to come. Yandle hasn't even theoretically peaked, and I'm uncomfortable trading the guy based off the assumption that OEL will continue upwards and the AHL guys developing. This is a long term trade here, not a deadline rental. You have to consider all likely scenarios.

I'm curious as to why Yandle is always in play. Isn't he the odds on favorite to inherit the captaincy? He also re-signed, and at a pretty good rate too. They've got a 40+ point #2 locked down for 4 more years and yet want to move him? Is there something I'm missing beyond him being the only real trading chip we have?

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01-11-2013, 11:02 AM
  #179
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So Yandle makes huge strides year after year developmentally. Improves leaps and bounds every year since being drafted until he finally gets a nice fat contract. Then, in trying to live up to it, some hesitation creeps in. Clutches the stick a little harder and starts having second thoughts on the ice. As a result, his game takes maybe a half a step back. One little back step. Only so glaringly noticeable because the whole world was expecting yet another leap forward. And now he's expendable? I'm not buying that. He likes playing for Dave Tippett, in Phoenix. He's next in line for the captaincy.

What makes this guy expendable? Nobody expects Chris Summers, David Schlemko or Michael Stone to be first pairing defensemen, do they? I like the upside of all three, but I see none as 1-2 guys. Stone could be a 3-4, and I think the other two are 5-6 types. Connor Murphy has got great upside. He's averaged 31gp each of the last four seasons, and has now had his fifth consecutive season ended by injury. I'd say there is at least a fifty percent chance he never plays and NHL game, let alone becoming a top two D. Our bluechips are Brandon Gormley and David Rundblad, right? They are the highly touted pair with the accolades and hype. Neither have adjusted to North American Professional hockey in a seamless fashion. We've seen both experience some pretty obvious and challenging growing pains. Gormley's mobility and Rundblad's decision making are definitely being put to the test. Many of us were at least penciling them into projected rosters and expecting them to compete for NHL spots. They aren't even blowing the AHL away, let alone making an NHL squad. I believe both will be effective NHL players and fairly soon. I believe both have top pairing upside. I also believe both have a long, long way to go, and a whole lot of things to work on before they get there, and there is a really, really good chance they never make it to that level. That's just the nature of prospects. 99.5% of them don't pan out as well as you hope.

I can't believe Yandle is actually on the table. He might be used as a conversation starter, just to get talks going about the philosophical swap of D for F, but I can't see him realistically being discussed in actual trade talk.

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01-11-2013, 12:40 PM
  #180
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We've got one of those. Vermette. Adding another at the cost of Yandle doesn't make much sense, unless Maloney thinks Krejci can be 'the guy' for a long time to come. Yandle hasn't even theoretically peaked, and I'm uncomfortable trading the guy based off the assumption that OEL will continue upwards and the AHL guys developing. This is a long term trade here, not a deadline rental. You have to consider all likely scenarios.

I'm curious as to why Yandle is always in play. Isn't he the odds on favorite to inherit the captaincy? He also re-signed, and at a pretty good rate too. They've got a 40+ point #2 locked down for 4 more years and yet want to move him? Is there something I'm missing beyond him being the only real trading chip we have?
Don't get me wrong I do not advocate trading Yandle at this time. I also believe that if the Bruins asked about the availability of Yandle, the 1st thing Maloney would ask is if Bergeron would be in play. The Bruins would say no, but Krejci could be. Maloney would then suggest Peverley (and thought about Horton) should be included. Maybe Philly inquires, Couturier & (one of) Simmonds/Voracek/Schenn. Or Colorado with RO'R, still need to add. I did not want to imply for just a 1-1 trade, but only believe in, if it improves the team. Most of my posts are to generate feedback and not so much of what I perceive as fair. I do not believe in fair in a trade. Only if the 'Yotes get the best deal out of it (from an AZ Coyote fan perspective). I also would be very surprised if KY gets traded.
My response has more to do with trying to 2nd guess Maloney, That in itself is kinda stupid, because I could never guess an actually trade, but I do believe I have an idea of what kind of player GMDM may be trying to acquire.
I do believe that Yandle has a 70 point season in him, as well as believe OEL can net 20+ goals...

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01-11-2013, 01:39 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by Sinurgy View Post
I think part of Bux's post was accidentally clipped...I've added the line he's missing for him:

Lol.

I just think that when you look at who we have, OEL being groomed for that #1 D spot and we brought back Michalek for a reason, all other d-men are in play. While turning Stone or Summers around for offense is a possibility, those players alone would likely not fetch us more than a 4th line type.

Yandle and Klesla would result in a more sufficient return on offense (2nd line forward) but the risk is filling those minutes. Yandle's minutes would be harder to fill than Klesla's, as Stone is more similar to Rusty's playing style, but Yandle would get the bigger return.

Hard to say what happens, but those two would be my best guess for trade returns that are valuable...

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01-11-2013, 01:42 PM
  #182
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I can't believe Yandle is actually on the table. He might be used as a conversation starter, just to get talks going about the philosophical swap of D for F, but I can't see him realistically being discussed in actual trade talk.
Sounds like the Coyotes are taking a page out of the Diamondbacks player relations hand book.

IMO, team personnel should NEVER comment on who is "available". Even with the caveat of "Well they have to blow us away". That's obvious and only harm can be done by saying it.

Only if you have a malcontent with a trade demand on your hands should you even address that.

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01-11-2013, 01:57 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by rt View Post
So Yandle makes huge strides year after year developmentally. Improves leaps and bounds every year since being drafted until he finally gets a nice fat contract. Then, in trying to live up to it, some hesitation creeps in. Clutches the stick a little harder and starts having second thoughts on the ice. As a result, his game takes maybe a half a step back. One little back step. Only so glaringly noticeable because the whole world was expecting yet another leap forward. And now he's expendable? I'm not buying that. He likes playing for Dave Tippett, in Phoenix. He's next in line for the captaincy.

What makes this guy expendable? Nobody expects Chris Summers, David Schlemko or Michael Stone to be first pairing defensemen, do they? I like the upside of all three, but I see none as 1-2 guys. Stone could be a 3-4, and I think the other two are 5-6 types. Connor Murphy has got great upside. He's averaged 31gp each of the last four seasons, and has now had his fifth consecutive season ended by injury. I'd say there is at least a fifty percent chance he never plays and NHL game, let alone becoming a top two D. Our bluechips are Brandon Gormley and David Rundblad, right? They are the highly touted pair with the accolades and hype. Neither have adjusted to North American Professional hockey in a seamless fashion. We've seen both experience some pretty obvious and challenging growing pains. Gormley's mobility and Rundblad's decision making are definitely being put to the test. Many of us were at least penciling them into projected rosters and expecting them to compete for NHL spots. They aren't even blowing the AHL away, let alone making an NHL squad. I believe both will be effective NHL players and fairly soon. I believe both have top pairing upside. I also believe both have a long, long way to go, and a whole lot of things to work on before they get there, and there is a really, really good chance they never make it to that level. That's just the nature of prospects. 99.5% of them don't pan out as well as you hope.

I can't believe Yandle is actually on the table. He might be used as a conversation starter, just to get talks going about the philosophical swap of D for F, but I can't see him realistically being discussed in actual trade talk.
The logic makes sense, but I don't know if we can define it as a regression on Yandle's part. I was watching replays of some of the playoff games and select regular season games on NHL Network and FSAZ, and there were some teams that we played where the passes made were more shots in the dark to move the puck up ice, as opposed to a pass that our forwards could (with effort) corral into the zone.

OEL's passes, for the most part, are tape-to-tape and very smooth. No wasted effort. No panic. Sometimes that happens with Yandle, but I feel like the issue is that he hasn't slowed the game down for himself (so to speak). It is not as bad as Carcillo was with fighting, where the switch simply can't be turned off, but there are times when I feel like Keith expects that he can do no wrong. It's a good, yet somewhat dangerous habit, b/c when on, he is capable of the 60 point season. He could also be a 60 point guy who earns most if it on the power play, and his +/- is down b/c he tries to do more in 5-on-5 than necessary. Since our PP is not what I would call dangerous, this is that risk that he will wind up being more of a 40-45 point guy, who is more dependent on PP points to get to the magic number that turns him into an all-star year after year.

Expendable is not the greatest word to use. He only would be expendable if the return is pretty equivalent, which would put it more in the category of hockey trade, rather than expendable at all costs.

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01-11-2013, 02:02 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by BUX7PHX View Post
Lol.

I just think that when you look at who we have, OEL being groomed for that #1 D spot and we brought back Michalek for a reason, all other d-men are in play. While turning Stone or Summers around for offense is a possibility, those players alone would likely not fetch us more than a 4th line type.

Yandle and Klesla would result in a more sufficient return on offense (2nd line forward) but the risk is filling those minutes. Yandle's minutes would be harder to fill than Klesla's, as Stone is more similar to Rusty's playing style, but Yandle would get the bigger return.

Hard to say what happens, but those two would be my best guess for trade returns that are valuable...
First of all, i am not one of the few that wants to see Yandle traded. With that said, if he IS traded, it won't be for a 2nd line player. Maloney is smarter than that. Yandle may nake mistakes, but the dude is a friggin number one defensman. He does WAY more good then bad.

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01-11-2013, 05:00 PM
  #185
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First of all, i am not one of the few that wants to see Yandle traded. With that said, if he IS traded, it won't be for a 2nd line player. Maloney is smarter than that. Yandle may nake mistakes, but the dude is a friggin number one defensman. He does WAY more good then bad.
Agreed and I'm starting to get tired of the Yandle trade ideas myself. At this point he shouldn't even be considered a trade option since there isn't much in the way of D-Men in our system ready to be in the NHL and threating to take over his position. At the rate things are going for us, the draft looks more than likely the only way we are going to get the 1st line scoring help.

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01-11-2013, 05:09 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by rabbit3119 View Post
First of all, i am not one of the few that wants to see Yandle traded. With that said, if he IS traded, it won't be for a 2nd line player. Maloney is smarter than that. Yandle may nake mistakes, but the dude is a friggin number one defensman. He does WAY more good then bad.
A 2nd line forward would be the bare minimum in return. Could be a young player with first line potential, but just caught on a team where he can't advance up to that line.

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01-11-2013, 08:05 PM
  #187
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So Yandle makes huge strides year after year developmentally. Improves leaps and bounds every year since being drafted until he finally gets a nice fat contract. Then, in trying to live up to it, some hesitation creeps in. Clutches the stick a little harder and starts having second thoughts on the ice. As a result, his game takes maybe a half a step back. One little back step. Only so glaringly noticeable because the whole world was expecting yet another leap forward. And now he's expendable? I'm not buying that. He likes playing for Dave Tippett, in Phoenix. He's next in line for the captaincy.

What makes this guy expendable? Nobody expects Chris Summers, David Schlemko or Michael Stone to be first pairing defensemen, do they? I like the upside of all three, but I see none as 1-2 guys. Stone could be a 3-4, and I think the other two are 5-6 types. Connor Murphy has got great upside. He's averaged 31gp each of the last four seasons, and has now had his fifth consecutive season ended by injury. I'd say there is at least a fifty percent chance he never plays and NHL game, let alone becoming a top two D. Our bluechips are Brandon Gormley and David Rundblad, right? They are the highly touted pair with the accolades and hype. Neither have adjusted to North American Professional hockey in a seamless fashion. We've seen both experience some pretty obvious and challenging growing pains. Gormley's mobility and Rundblad's decision making are definitely being put to the test. Many of us were at least penciling them into projected rosters and expecting them to compete for NHL spots. They aren't even blowing the AHL away, let alone making an NHL squad. I believe both will be effective NHL players and fairly soon. I believe both have top pairing upside. I also believe both have a long, long way to go, and a whole lot of things to work on before they get there, and there is a really, really good chance they never make it to that level. That's just the nature of prospects. 99.5% of them don't pan out as well as you hope.

I can't believe Yandle is actually on the table. He might be used as a conversation starter, just to get talks going about the philosophical swap of D for F, but I can't see him realistically being discussed in actual trade talk.
For me, Yandle falls into a very small circle of Coyotes along with Doan and Hanzal. They sign reasonable contracts and express their desire to live and play in Arizona, and want to develop an awareness of NHL hockey here. Unlike all the players who have been more than happy to force their way out of Phoenix, refuse any sort of hometown discount to play elsewhere, or can't seem to depart without the 'ol backhanded insult about the Arizona hockey market (not that I disagree with them, only disagree about having to say it to the media).

You don't trade those players away from what is a super fragile hockey market, unless someone overpays, or you fill a glaring need (and with our coach, it's hard to imagine offense would be seen as a glaring need).

That said, I don't doubt anything said by Maloney, and I certainly am not going to blow what he says out of proportion. From what I understood him to say, he really didn't say anything at all. If for whatever reason they did trade Yandle I'm confident after the initial shock wore off, I would either understand why he made the deal, or even if I didn't, I'm sure I'd be proved wrong over time...as Maloney always seems to do.

And the best thing about Maloney is even when he does trade someone away, or let them leave via free agency, he does it without burning bridges, which always leaves the possibility of them returning (Morris, Vrbata, Michalek).

Back to Yandle, Doan, and Hanzal....there's 1 other key thing they have in common which is of utmost importance, they want to play for a coach like Dave Tippett. It's pretty easy to see why those type of players succeed, and those who don't go on and are easily forgotten.

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01-11-2013, 08:27 PM
  #188
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Just think about it fellas, we have 2 legitimate #1 d-men in Yandle and OEL, Yandle is going to be the one that has a higher pt total, but isn't as good on the back end and OEL is going to be Mr Stud, a 50pt 2-way unbelievable player.

We finished 18th in offense last season and much of it can be attributed to how Yandle & OEL move the puck around and are difficult to defend. Now add Rundblad and you've got 3 higher skilled offensive weapons on the blue line and we only need to have a couple forwards step up and we can continue to be a playoff team.

We're never going to be able to afford a max salary cap team, and as such, we'll need players like Vrbata and hopefully Boedker this year to produce points with lower salaries than normal 50-60pt guys get.

I'm excited to have Vermette for an entire season and hopefully Boedker breaks out and Hanzal doesn't get injured. The only thing I think we need is a 3rd line center so we can drop Gordon into the 4th line slot and have someone with a little more creativity playing with Korpikoski and Moss.

A 3rd line center should cost us a 3rd round draft spot and there we go.

Boedker/Vermette/Doan
Sullivan/Hanzal/Vrbata
Korpikoski/Lombardi/Moss
Torres/Gordon/Chipchura

Also, I'd actually like to get rid of Biz and actually find someone who can play a regular shift but keep the other teams honest. Biz can't do it and isn't mean enough to be considered a deterrent, all he does is stage fights, so there really is zero point to his game other than his comical tweeting ability.

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01-11-2013, 08:54 PM
  #189
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If Yandle goes we better get a ****ing STAR back. I mean it, not a "solid" guy, not "good fundamentals" guy, not a "hard worker", etc. etc. If Yandle goes, we better have a ****ing star player back. The kind of player that gets people out of their seats, the kind of player teams market, the kind of player people buy jerseys of...AND that player sure as hell better be a Tippet player!!!!

So what does all that mean? Basically we better as hell not trade Yandle!!!!

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01-11-2013, 09:36 PM
  #190
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I'd imagine that the only place Yandle trade talks get serious is on HF Boards.

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01-11-2013, 11:26 PM
  #191
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What is Yandle worth in trade then? Krejci? Nice forward, but not so amazing that I'd drive Yandle to the airport.
Given the number of traditional powerhouse teams (Detroit, Philadelphia, etc.) and teams who are just desperate for high end skill on the blue line if they even want a sniff at the playoffs (Edmonton) the market on A player like Yandle is potentially very high. Provided a team blows us away with an offer we could not refuse and we get pieces that fit into Maloneys and Tippets long term strategy I would understand such a transaction. I trust in Maloney and in no way shape or form am I advocating giving this asset away.

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01-11-2013, 11:32 PM
  #192
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I'd imagine that the only place Yandle trade talks get serious is on HF Boards.
We were apparently linked to discussions on Yandle at the draft with Pittsburgh and Edmonton. At one point we mulled a deal overnight but said no. Widely speculated that offer included MPS and Gagner.

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01-12-2013, 12:49 AM
  #193
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We were apparently linked to discussions on Yandle at the draft with Pittsburgh and Edmonton. At one point we mulled a deal overnight but said no. Widely speculated that offer included MPS and Gagner.
Wildly speculated by Oilers' fans! I believe it was with Pittsburgh and dealt with Michalek, Staal, and then the 'Canes offer for Staal (and why it took so long - 3 team trade). I do not believe for a minute that Maloney would consider trading Yandle for Gags and MPS, not without the #1 pick being involved. If the 'Canes had a decent to offer instead of d'men, KY may be a Penguin at this time. IMO, Michalek, Sutter, Skinner, and the 8th pick might of done it. But now the Coyotes have Michalek, Moss, and Sullivan as additions. I'm glad that GMDM didn't trade Yandle at that time, it wasn't as dire as 1st thought. He did pretty good during the free agency period.

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01-12-2013, 02:06 AM
  #194
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Wildly speculated by Oilers' fans! I believe it was with Pittsburgh and dealt with Michalek, Staal, and then the 'Canes offer for Staal (and why it took so long - 3 team trade). I do not believe for a minute that Maloney would consider trading Yandle for Gags and MPS, not without the #1 pick being involved. If the 'Canes had a decent to offer instead of d'men, KY may be a Penguin at this time. IMO, Michalek, Sutter, Skinner, and the 8th pick might of done it. But now the Coyotes have Michalek, Moss, and Sullivan as additions. I'm glad that GMDM didn't trade Yandle at that time, it wasn't as dire as 1st thought. He did pretty good during the free agency period.
Yeah I would imagine the actual conversation went something like:

Other team's GM "So Don, what would you want in return for Yandle"

DM "A top line scoring forward"

Other team's GM "Ok, thanks for the info. Talk to you later"

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01-12-2013, 02:33 AM
  #195
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Given the number of traditional powerhouse teams (Detroit, Philadelphia, etc.) and teams who are just desperate for high end skill on the blue line if they even want a sniff at the playoffs (Edmonton) the market on A player like Yandle is potentially very high. Provided a team blows us away with an offer we could not refuse and we get pieces that fit into Maloneys and Tippets long term strategy I would understand such a transaction. I trust in Maloney and in no way shape or form am I advocating giving this asset away.
I agree, Yandle has high trade value. He is a legitimate 1st line D, has to be one of the top 30 in the league. How could he be traded if a first line forward is not coming back? I say no way. D are worth more straight up then forwards. I think GMDM will be patient, because he knows at the end of the day, somebody will be desperate at the deadline or the summer, to dump a forward, and we can get him without moving Yandle. I think it will be more likely that we move say Stone, Runblad and a pick for a first line star forward from an under achieving team looking for assets to rebuild. All teams are giddy right now, but that will change quickly once all these high powered, potential teams, like Edmonton, loose 6 to 4 every night, because they have no defense. Then the phone rings for D men looking to build a solid foundation like Tip and GMDM have in today's NHL.

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01-12-2013, 02:40 AM
  #196
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I agree, Yandle has high trade value. He is a legitimate 1st line D, has to be one of the top 30 in the league. How could he be traded if a first line forward is not coming back? I say no way. D are worth more straight up then forwards. I think GMDM will be patient, because he knows at the end of the day, somebody will be desperate at the deadline or the summer, to dump a forward, and we can get him without moving Yandle. I think it will be more likely that we move say Stone, Runblad and a pick for a first line star forward from an under achieving team looking for assets to rebuild. All teams are giddy right now, but that will change quickly once all these high powered, potential teams, like Edmonton, loose 6 to 4 every night, because they have no defense. Then the phone rings for D men looking to build a solid foundation like Tip and GMDM have in today's NHL.
Gotta view it as a game of poker. Our biggest question is what asset or assets would fit into this Dave Tippett led team.

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01-12-2013, 08:05 AM
  #197
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Wildly speculated by Oilers' fans! I believe it was with Pittsburgh and dealt with Michalek, Staal, and then the 'Canes offer for Staal (and why it took so long - 3 team trade). I do not believe for a minute that Maloney would consider trading Yandle for Gags and MPS, not without the #1 pick being involved. If the 'Canes had a decent to offer instead of d'men, KY may be a Penguin at this time. IMO, Michalek, Sutter, Skinner, and the 8th pick might of done it. But now the Coyotes have Michalek, Moss, and Sullivan as additions. I'm glad that GMDM didn't trade Yandle at that time, it wasn't as dire as 1st thought. He did pretty good during the free agency period.
Jordan Staal for Yandle was talked about as pretty even at that time. Would you take or do you think Yandle's value is what Staal fetched? Sutter, Dumoulin, and #9 overall? Sutter would fit Tippett's system really well and Forsberg was still on the board at #9, and I believe the club had him ranked really high.

It sounds like most fans on these boards are only willing to see Yandle moved in a one-for-one or as part of a package - not, to fetch a selection of pieces.

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01-12-2013, 01:11 PM
  #198
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Zach Boychuk - especially if JR/Muller decide he's looking like waiver fodder.

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=89914

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01-12-2013, 01:36 PM
  #199
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I wouldn't have traded Yandle for Sutter and Forsberg. Maybe Staal, but only if he was willing to sign a long extension. Even then he's a 50pt forward.


Last edited by rt: 01-12-2013 at 01:41 PM.
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01-12-2013, 01:48 PM
  #200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
I wouldn't have traded Yandle for Sutter and Forsberg. Maybe Staal, but only if he was willing to sign a long extension. Even then he's a 50pt forward.
Quote:
Coyotes defenseman Keith Yandle’s decision to stay stateside during the lockout had little to do conditioning and competition.

Both were offered at his off-season home and native Boston, where he skated at Boston University with other players in drills led by former NHL player Mike Grier.

Instead, Yandle focused on the process of picking a team and putting on a new uniform. And he didn’t feel right doing either.

“The Coyotes are my team,” Yandle said. “I didn’t want to play for another team and be with another organization. I wanted to just always be loyal to this team and always play here. Obviously a lot of guys went to play, but I’m happy with my decision to stay.”
http://www.azcentral.com/sports/coyo...x-coyotes.html

Why do I feel like this is the kiss of death?

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