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I am at a werid spot with this trade cause to me it can 1 of 3 ways
1. We get luongo for a reasonable price, fill the MASSIVE hole in goal and the team starts to round into fotm this is what I think happens.
2 We don't get luongo BUT reimer stays healthy and discovers the form he had as rookie the team proves to have a much younger, cheaper #1 goalie.
3. we don't get luongo team is crap goes on a mini rebuild keeps gardiner and Reilley adds a 1st rounder or 2 by trading lupul, possibly kessel, macarthur but keeps the likes of JVR Gardiner, Reilley adds, another blue chip prospect in Mackion, Jones, Barkov and uses their cap space in an effort to do a philly style rebuild they did in 2007
personally any way this goes i'm good there is no bad path to me
Ohhh, i could easily see disaster on this.
We trade much needed youth Gard or Kadri for Lou and only play well enough the next few seasons to barely miss the PO s and also keep us from prime draft territory.
His last 5 prime years only nets us a couple of just make it POs and some just misses, drafting in almost no mans land for a week team, then he gets to be hell on our books for another 5 years.
The only use i see us getting Lou is if we can land some top UFAs in the next 2 years and we all know our track record on that front.
See, I don't think it's as clandestine as that. I think its more just everyone concerned, from the MLSE and Burke camps, saying "don't worry about it, it happened, move on" then strategic. I don't think philosophy or potential trades can be dismissed entirely from the equation, but past transactions, the team failing to get a whiff of playoffs in his 4 years despite promises, personality...it's a rich tapestry and odd timing. Who knows, maybe everyone concerned just wants to sell papers?
Is there any chance they wanted to keep BB on just for the work he was doing on the CBA? Regarding the timing issue. Hell, for all we know, GB might of had a hand in the timing.
Lets face it, we did not bring in a outsider to fill the job, DN above all is able to hit the ground running with this and is a capable GM.
I agree with the tone of your post, this is more about to many things on the fire side of the ledger then the not to fire regarding BB.
What if The Panthers & Tallon go all Alex Anthopolous on us and do what AA did in MLB?? Could they win a cup? I think they could.
Rumors of Roberto Luongo to Florida are strong and I believe could be very real if the price was right. They Panthers cannot afford his $65 million dollars price tag and his likelihood of retirement before his remaining 8 years is finished are high. No one is doubting that Luongo was the reason for Florida never folding all those years ago. He was their hero, on and off the ice and I believe he’d help draw the fans back.
Toronto needs building blocks. Every championship team needs in my mind 2 centres, 2 defense & a goalie to build around. It doesn’t have to be that combination of 5 players but it needs to be 5 players.
Some examples of strong cores for contending teams
Pittsburgh: Crosby/Malkin/Staal all centres, Letang & Fleury
Detroit: Zetterberg/Datsyuk (centres), Kronwall/Smith & Howard -- Lidstrom retiring will hurt and they will need new guys to replace their aging star forwards but thats a discussion for another day.
Boston: Krejci/Bergeron/Seguin (centres), Lucic (Wing), Hamilton & Rask - Chara obviously but this is their future
Chicago: Toews/Kane, Seabrook, Keith & Crawford. Jury is out on Crawford. If they could Chicago would want an upgrade in net but none the less a great core to build around.
Whats Toronto’s core? Gardiner, Rielly, Kessel, JVR (no goalie)
This isn’t bad. However, to build a championship caliber team moving Kessel is the RIGHT thing to do.
What I propose is all 3 teams (Florida, Leafs & Canucks) get together and work out a deal that improves all parties. 3 way deals aren’t in hockey as often and I wish they were.
To Florida Panthers : Kessel, Blacker, Franson, Booth, Luongo (with 1/2 of contract retained by Vancouver) & Vancouver’s 1st in 2013
To Vancouver Canucks: Bozak, Bjugstad & Theodore
To Toronto Maple Leafs : Huberdeau & Gudbranson
Reasons why for each team:
Florida Panthers: Look at all the star powered players they get back in this deal. They get both players who were formally the face of the franchise back in Booth & Luongo. Luongo is still a top 10 goalie in the NHL and if it wasn’t for his contract he’d get a kings ransom for Vancouver. However, his length and money owed sucks! With Vancouver eating half of his contract makes this a lot more attractive for Florida. With Carolina gearing up by adding Semin & Jordan Staal, they are looking like the favourites of that division. With this 3way trade, the Panthers are adding Kessel (top 5 goal scorer in NHL last year), a power forward in Booth who hasn’t panned out the way Vancouver hoped; he is cap relief for Vancouver. Blacker isn’t NHL worthy yet but he gives depth to on defense especially with Garrison walking to Vancouver before the lockout began. Franson, still young at 26 years old is reportedly about to sign a very cheap contract with the Leafs. He’s monstrous at 6’6. He’s got a great shot from the point and would look great on the Power Play with Campbell feeding him passes all night. Putting Kessel & Booth on Weiss’s wings would give you one dangerous 1st line. Doing this might actually help Florida retain Weiss who is set to become an unrestricted free agent. Weiss wasn’t pleased when Booth was traded to Vancouver. With the addition of Peter Mueller who has tons of talent & if healthy could still be a top 2 centre in this league. If he doesn’t pan out his contract of $1,725,000 as well as Santorelli $1,600,000 are expiring deals that would probably be enough money to resign Weiss to a contract he deserves. It would suck to lose Bjugstad, Huberdeau & Gudbranson all of which are top picks in the draft. However, as Alex Anthopolous has shown you cannot have top prospects forever. They either make you winners now OR you move them for proven talent that can make you something dangerous. As good as Huberdeau might become on offense, he is not what Kessel is now. Florida still has other solid prospects in Markstrom (potential franchise goalie), Grimaldi, Rau, Petrovic, Matheson, Howden & Hyman.
The salary total that Florida gets in this trade $13,815,000
FLA gives up $7,894,000
To me thats a deeper and better team then Washington, Carolina, Tampa Bay & Winnipeg. In fact thats a Stanley Cup contending team.
Why Vancouver does this deal.
Luongo drama is out of town, even if they have to retain half of his salary.
Theodore is a viable option if Schneider flops in a shortened season (that won’t be the case). Either way, he’s still a good safety net. Theodore is also an expiring contract at seasons end.
Bjugstad -- Big centre & after this season would probably join the team giving the Canucks centre position tons of depth. 1. H. Sedin, 2. Kesler, 3. Bjugstad & 4. Bozak (if resigned) or Malhotra (if resigned) probably would be Bozak IMO.
Bozak is a guy they really want in Vancouver who can easily step into # 2 role and hold his own until Kesler is back and healthy. Once Kesler is back, he can easily be an excellent # 3 centre on any contending team.
After this season the Canucks can buyout Ballard $4,200,000 + riding of Theodore’s contract $1,500,000 and if Bozak is resigned and Malhotra isn’t riding $2,500,000 off the cap as well. Raymond ($2,275,000), Higgins ($1,900,000), Lapierre ($1,000,000), Alberts ($1,225,000) would give VAN $14,600,000 to go after big name free agents like Perry if available and resign Alex Edler who they cannot afford to lose on the back end & retain Tyler Bozak who shouldn’t come at a high price tag.
Why Toronto does this deal.
This one is simple, they are rebuilding. It sucks for Toronto fans to hear it. They won’t win a cup with Kessel and even if they were the ones who traded for Luongo they still need # 1 centre, size up the middle, better defense & another Winger with size.
Adding Huberdeau & Gudbranson to the team and Toronto is now building its core properly like teams mentioned earlier in post.
A potential core of Huberdeau, JVR & Kadri up front with Gardiner, Gudbranson & Rielly on back would set this franchise up for a long time.
The reality is this will probably NEVER happen. However, all teams benefit from this 3 way trade.
Thanks for reading, and looking forward to some of your responses!
It's fun reading luongo's "value" at the early threads, and watching the same posters with completely different offers now.
Before people were saying that luongo would be lucky to even get a prospect and a late pick.
Now it's bare minimum a guy like kadri + bozak + 2nd.
I don't want Lou at that price.
I'm not even sure i want him, this is a seriously tricky situation long term on many fronts.
Are we really in a position to leave prime time draft territory just yet? For very iffy PO pushes and even more iffy success if we are there? At best, what? 4/5 solid years from Lou and then what?
Lets do some math on this, so maybe at best 2 years to build more around Lou to take a somewhat real shot at it and then that gets us 2/3 shots at it MAYBE? Uhhhg i'd rather have Schneider.
Frankly, i think trading for Lou would just put the midas stamp on why this has been such a pathetic organization for the majority of the last 40 years.
Does Lou actually change the landscape enough here where we have legit shots at top UFAs?
Man, i need more comfy fence to sit on this one is giving me splinters in my butt.
What if The Panthers & Tallon go all Alex Anthopolous on us and do what AA did in MLB?? Could they win a cup? I think they could.
Rumors of Roberto Luongo to Florida are strong and I believe could be very real if the price was right. They Panthers cannot afford his $65 million dollars price tag and his likelihood of retirement before his remaining 8 years is finished are high. No one is doubting that Luongo was the reason for Florida never folding all those years ago. He was their hero, on and off the ice and I believe he’d help draw the fans back.
Toronto needs building blocks. Every championship team needs in my mind 2 centres, 2 defense & a goalie to build around. It doesn’t have to be that combination of 5 players but it needs to be 5 players.
Some examples of strong cores for contending teams
Pittsburgh: Crosby/Malkin/Staal all centres, Letang & Fleury
Detroit: Zetterberg/Datsyuk (centres), Kronwall/Smith & Howard -- Lidstrom retiring will hurt and they will need new guys to replace their aging star forwards but thats a discussion for another day.
Boston: Krejci/Bergeron/Seguin (centres), Lucic (Wing), Hamilton & Rask - Chara obviously but this is their future
Chicago: Toews/Kane, Seabrook, Keith & Crawford. Jury is out on Crawford. If they could Chicago would want an upgrade in net but none the less a great core to build around.
Whats Toronto’s core? Gardiner, Rielly, Kessel, JVR (no goalie)
This isn’t bad. However, to build a championship caliber team moving Kessel is the RIGHT thing to do.
What I propose is all 3 teams (Florida, Leafs & Canucks) get together and work out a deal that improves all parties. 3 way deals aren’t in hockey as often and I wish they were.
To Florida Panthers : Kessel, Blacker, Franson, Booth, Luongo (with 1/2 of contract retained by Vancouver) & Vancouver’s 1st in 2013
To Vancouver Canucks: Bozak, Bjugstad & Theodore
To Toronto Maple Leafs : Huberdeau & Gudbranson
Reasons why for each team:
Florida Panthers: Look at all the star powered players they get back in this deal. They get both players who were formally the face of the franchise back in Booth & Luongo. Luongo is still a top 10 goalie in the NHL and if it wasn’t for his contract he’d get a kings ransom for Vancouver. However, his length and money owed sucks! With Vancouver eating half of his contract makes this a lot more attractive for Florida. With Carolina gearing up by adding Semin & Jordan Staal, they are looking like the favourites of that division. With this 3way trade, the Panthers are adding Kessel (top 5 goal scorer in NHL last year), a power forward in Booth who hasn’t panned out the way Vancouver hoped; he is cap relief for Vancouver. Blacker isn’t NHL worthy yet but he gives depth to on defense especially with Garrison walking to Vancouver before the lockout began. Franson, still young at 26 years old is reportedly about to sign a very cheap contract with the Leafs. He’s monstrous at 6’6. He’s got a great shot from the point and would look great on the Power Play with Campbell feeding him passes all night. Putting Kessel & Booth on Weiss’s wings would give you one dangerous 1st line. Doing this might actually help Florida retain Weiss who is set to become an unrestricted free agent. Weiss wasn’t pleased when Booth was traded to Vancouver. With the addition of Peter Mueller who has tons of talent & if healthy could still be a top 2 centre in this league. If he doesn’t pan out his contract of $1,725,000 as well as Santorelli $1,600,000 are expiring deals that would probably be enough money to resign Weiss to a contract he deserves. It would suck to lose Bjugstad, Huberdeau & Gudbranson all of which are top picks in the draft. However, as Alex Anthopolous has shown you cannot have top prospects forever. They either make you winners now OR you move them for proven talent that can make you something dangerous. As good as Huberdeau might become on offense, he is not what Kessel is now. Florida still has other solid prospects in Markstrom (potential franchise goalie), Grimaldi, Rau, Petrovic, Matheson, Howden & Hyman.
The salary total that Florida gets in this trade $13,815,000
FLA gives up $7,894,000
To me thats a deeper and better team then Washington, Carolina, Tampa Bay & Winnipeg. In fact thats a Stanley Cup contending team.
Why Vancouver does this deal.
Luongo drama is out of town, even if they have to retain half of his salary.
Theodore is a viable option if Schneider flops in a shortened season (that won’t be the case). Either way, he’s still a good safety net. Theodore is also an expiring contract at seasons end.
Bjugstad -- Big centre & after this season would probably join the team giving the Canucks centre position tons of depth. 1. H. Sedin, 2. Kesler, 3. Bjugstad & 4. Bozak (if resigned) or Malhotra (if resigned) probably would be Bozak IMO.
Bozak is a guy they really want in Vancouver who can easily step into # 2 role and hold his own until Kesler is back and healthy. Once Kesler is back, he can easily be an excellent # 3 centre on any contending team.
After this season the Canucks can buyout Ballard $4,200,000 + riding of Theodore’s contract $1,500,000 and if Bozak is resigned and Malhotra isn’t riding $2,500,000 off the cap as well. Raymond ($2,275,000), Higgins ($1,900,000), Lapierre ($1,000,000), Alberts ($1,225,000) would give VAN $14,600,000 to go after big name free agents like Perry if available and resign Alex Edler who they cannot afford to lose on the back end & retain Tyler Bozak who shouldn’t come at a high price tag.
Why Toronto does this deal.
This one is simple, they are rebuilding. It sucks for Toronto fans to hear it. They won’t win a cup with Kessel and even if they were the ones who traded for Luongo they still need # 1 centre, size up the middle, better defense & another Winger with size.
Adding Huberdeau & Gudbranson to the team and Toronto is now building its core properly like teams mentioned earlier in post.
A potential core of Huberdeau, JVR & Kadri up front with Gardiner, Gudbranson & Rielly on back would set this franchise up for a long time.
The reality is this will probably NEVER happen. However, all teams benefit from this 3 way trade.
Thanks for reading, and looking forward to some of your responses!
Vancouver takes your mother out to a nice seafood dinner and never calls her back again.
What Toronto NEEDS to do, is absolutely nothing. Draft and ride with the core you have, have patience. You've already moved two huge pieces for Kessel, if you aren't getting back at least equal value, you shouldn't do anything with him.
I'm not even sure i want him, this is a seriously tricky situation long term on many fronts.
Are we really in a position to leave prime time draft territory just yet? For very iffy PO pushes and even more iffy success if we are there? At best, what? 4/5 solid years from Lou and then what?
Lets do some math on this, so maybe at best 2 years to build more around Lou to take a somewhat real shot at it and then that gets us 2/3 shots at it MAYBE? Uhhhg i'd rather have Schneider.
Frankly, i think trading for Lou would just put the midas stamp on why this has been such a pathetic organization for the majority of the last 40 years.
Does Lou actually change the landscape enough here where we have legit shots at top UFAs?
Man, i need more comfy fence to sit on this one is giving me splinters in my butt.
Leafs can do better than that. They are gutted in this trade. Not to mention that there is also the chance at getting Percy and/or Getzlaf in the summer since the usually players Nyr, Philly, Vancouver etc are too close to the cap to afford them when the cap drops. Doing this trade all but cancels out any chance that they have at getting these guys.
Depends on what you count as a Luongo thread. I'd say we're on #48 since the playoffs ended, but it could be a couple more or less depending on how you score it.
