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*ALL* Luongo Talk (News/Speculation/Rumors/Proposals)

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01-13-2013, 06:33 PM
  #1
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*ALL* Luongo Talk (News/Speculation/Rumors/Proposals)

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01-13-2013, 06:34 PM
  #2
Deuce Awesome
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Originally Posted by JackJ View Post
By all means, prove me wrong once his contract is over.
We are in agreement.

The interview you cited was what convinced me as well. The new ownership group couldn't stand Burke right from the beginning. Started out with Micheal Cope and then grew from there. Anselmei basically confirmed the conflict on that prime time sports interview.

It will be interesting to see the truth with regards to the timing of the firing, from what Ive read its been either due to Burkes involvement with the CBA, or wanting to trade to much for Luongo, or not wanting to trade for Luongo, or finally turning off Tannenbaum to make the group in agreement to axe Burkie....

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01-13-2013, 06:36 PM
  #3
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Yes I do. They operate to make a profit which in hockey means winning.
Whether you're a CEO, VP or in this case GM of a hockey team if you don't show results you get canned.
Leafs are the most profitable team in the NHL and have been for years.

Quote:
But the sport’s three most profitable teams–the Maple Leafs ($81.9 million), Rangers ($74 million), Canadians ($51.6 million)–accounted for 83% of the league’s income, while 13 of 30 teams lost money, before non-cash expenses and interest payments.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozan...rth-1-billion/
Next argument.

Of course playoffs add to the bottom line but we're not financially dependent on it.

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01-13-2013, 06:36 PM
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Luongo's current value is a matter of circumstance. The NTC + Big Contract (I don't even think he's signed to a bad contract) play the largest roles.

On an open market without a NTC involved, Luongo would garner the value that Canucks fans are expecting. Unfortunately for them, this is not the case. Don't see why it's so difficult to understand.

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Old
01-13-2013, 06:40 PM
  #5
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Originally Posted by PhillyFrisco View Post
Luongo's current value is a matter of circumstance. The NTC + Big Contract (I don't even think he's signed to a bad contract) play the largest roles.

On an open market without a NTC involved, Luongo would garner the value that Canucks fans are expecting. Unfortunately for them, this is not the case. Don't see why it's so difficult to understand.
? Canuck fans are expecting less than what was traded to get Luongo in the first place...

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01-13-2013, 06:41 PM
  #6
DougGilmour93
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To Bourne Endevour


That was what I expect to be Nonis's offer to be.

I, am of the opinion, that having a solid goaltender, especially one of Luongo's calibre, would be very adventagous as to attract upcoming "big" name free agents.

My offer would be..

Bozak + Kadri + Ashton + 2nd

for

Luongo + Raymond/Schroeder

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01-13-2013, 06:44 PM
  #7
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I'd like someone to find this mythical goaltender who doesn't age ...

heh ... when does the title "aging player" actually make sense?

One figures it must be primarily based on actual physical play vs just some general consensus on years lived ...
As clearly Gomez or Redden (as example of earlier diminishing skillset players), vs Hasek, Brodeur, or Roloson players, who still performed at a high level into their 40's make it impossible to predict when an individual player's slide will begin, and at what rate it will slide.

All the posters applying the term to Luongo completely disregard the fact he's shown no deterioration in his on ice play. They may as well claim he's now 4 inches shorter or turned has into a jar of peanut butter. heh fun times.

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Old
01-13-2013, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhillyFrisco View Post
Luongo's current value is a matter of circumstance. The NTC + Big Contract (I don't even think he's signed to a bad contract) play the largest roles.

On an open market without a NTC involved, Luongo would garner the value that Canucks fans are expecting. Unfortunately for them, this is not the case. Don't see why it's so difficult to understand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LickTheEnvelope View Post
? Canuck fans are expecting less than what was traded to get Luongo in the first place...
That and he has said he would waive if he was asked....multiple times from when we were eliminated last spring. Honestly, the NTC doesn't, and wouldn't, play into our discussions here unless Toronto fans seem to think Columbus or Edmonton will give us a better deal. If it did, I think he as a list of several or something, it's not a full NMC.

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Old
01-13-2013, 06:45 PM
  #9
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"END ALREADY FFS" says every hockey fan alive.

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Old
01-13-2013, 06:47 PM
  #10
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Originally Posted by quat View Post
I'd like someone to find this mythical goaltender who doesn't age ...

heh ... when does the title "aging player" actually make sense?

One figures it must be primarily based on actual physical play vs just some general consensus on years lived ...
As clearly Gomez or Redden (as example of earlier diminishing skillset players), vs Hasek, Brodeur, or Roloson players, who still performed at a high level into their 40's make it impossible to predict when an individual player's slide will begin, and at what rate it will slide.

All the posters applying the term to Luongo completely disregard the fact he's shown no deterioration in his on ice play. They may as well claim he's now 4 inches shorter or turned has into a jar of peanut butter. heh fun times.
All speculative BS. The only complaint that hasn't been throughly debunked is this cap penalty for the number of years played at a discount. If he's old and retires early, theres less of a hit, and if he stays on for longer, diminished skill set or not, that penalty is diminished too. Age, NTC, all that jazz has been bandied about in 50 odd other threads and, I hope, been shot down for good. He will retire when he doesn't feel he is of use to the team, versus his cap hit, at which case, the penalty is less then his hit.

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01-13-2013, 06:49 PM
  #11
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Originally Posted by Deuce Awesome View Post
We are in agreement.

The interview you cited was what convinced me as well. The new ownership group couldn't stand Burke right from the beginning. Started out with Micheal Cope and then grew from there. Anselmei basically confirmed the conflict on that prime time sports interview.

It will be interesting to see the truth with regards to the timing of the firing, from what Ive read its been either due to Burkes involvement with the CBA, or wanting to trade to much for Luongo, or not wanting to trade for Luongo, or finally turning off Tannenbaum to make the group in agreement to axe Burkie....
The fact that Tannenbaum avoided the conference and the media at the CBA singings leads me to believe Rogers & Bell trumped his decision.

Quote:
Burke got the axe Wednesday morning because Bell boss George Cope, after months of campaigning for Burke’s dismissal, finally wore out the Rogers suits and Larry Tanenbaum. The deal is that Rogers and Bell will vote as a bloc on all matters, and Cope is the lead actor in this stage play. It took him a while but he got his way and Rogers had to roll with the tide.

..

Cope didn’t like Burke’s style, his manners, his profanity, his lifestyle. Some people don’t. Burke is a polarizing character, to be sure, and makes no apologies for that.

The Rogers people might not have been in love with Burke either but they weren’t prepared to axe him. Until Wednesday. It was like the decision-makers rolled out of bed, didn’t like their eggs Benedict and decided to fire the GM of the hockey team.

http://www.thestar.com/sports/leafs/...cked-class-cox
Quote:
They didn’t dislike what Brian Burke was doing with the Toronto Maple Leafs. They just don’t like Brian Burke.

For “they’’ insert this name: George Cope.

Doesn’t ring a bell? That’s funny, actually.

Cope is president and CEO of BCE and Bell Canada, which jointly with Rogers now owns 75 per cent of Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment. The corporate consortium — Megabuckszilla — took custodianship of Canada’s most illustrious sports property from the Ontario Teachers’ Pension Fund last summer.

Cope wanted Burke out, sources have told the Star. Cope got his way. Didn’t like the cut of Burke’s jib, his personality, the perennially loosened tie, the combustible temper, the maverick independence, the swagger or the mouth that so often roared. The “branding’’ wasn’t right.

http://www.thestar.com/sports/leafs/...cision-dimanno


Last edited by JackJ: 01-13-2013 at 06:58 PM.
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Old
01-13-2013, 06:52 PM
  #12
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"END ALREADY FFS" says every hockey fan alive.
"In a surprise move, the Canucks deal Eddie Lack, stunning both the Canucks faithful, as well as fans of teams that were bidding on Roberto Luongo and Cory Schneider. It seems both goaltenders will be staying put, as Mike Gillis, President and General Manager for the Canucks, said that this was always the plan. This however, was not well received by any fans, and speculation that one, or the other, will be traded before Schneider's 3 year contract with the Canucks ends will likely run rampant until then. For HFBoards News, this is Cogburn, back to you mods."

......

It will never end.

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01-13-2013, 06:52 PM
  #13
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Unless Gillis gives Luongo to the Leafs (not in a million years), they'll ship him elsewhere.

Still believe Florida is the destination. Luongo for the next 5-6 years ensures a competitive team.

Once Gillis becomes reasonable the deal will happen.

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01-13-2013, 06:54 PM
  #14
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To Bourne Endevour


That was what I expect to be Nonis's offer to be.

I, am of the opinion, that having a solid goaltender, especially one of Luongo's calibre, would be very adventagous as to attract upcoming "big" name free agents.

My offer would be..

Bozak + Kadri + Ashton + 2nd

for

Luongo + Raymond/Schroeder
Bozak and Raymond become a wash, so: Lu for Kadri, Ashton and a 2nd.

Pass. Never thought I'd say it but I would rather Raymond. Sub in Frattin over Ashton and maybe it works. Even than I doubt Raymond is apart of it.


Last edited by Bourne Endeavor: 01-13-2013 at 07:00 PM.
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Old
01-13-2013, 06:57 PM
  #15
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Doesn’t ring a bell? That’s funny, actually.
I see what you did there.

Cope isn't going to just fire someone he doesn't see eye to eye with if the results are there, but there has been no progression in 4 years. Kadri was, what, 7th overall? Then the team would have the 2nd overall the next year, then the 10th, and when they can pick again, they're in the bottom five for standings again. Forget playoffs, would you continue to employ someone that had 4 years to show progression of some kind, but in the end actually regressed? 7 -> 2 -> 10 -> 5.

The timing was off, but between having 2 weeks between the ownership being finalized and the lockout, during which I don't think they could have fired Burke, and personality probably played a role in it, but Burke didn't improve the Leafs, he made them worse in his time there.

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01-13-2013, 06:58 PM
  #16
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Leafs are the most profitable team in the NHL and have been for years.



Next argument.

Of course playoffs add to the bottom line but we're not financially dependent on it.
Sorry that's not how public companies operate. You'd have to be pretty naive to not understand that MLSE wants the playoffs to drive revenue and sales of merchandise as well. The fact the team already makes lots of money is irrelevant. I don't ever recall Microsoft or Apple saying that we already make money so we don't care if we make any more.

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01-13-2013, 06:59 PM
  #17
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Originally Posted by JackJ View Post
Unless Gillis gives Luongo to the Leafs (not in a million years), they'll ship him elsewhere.

Still believe Florida is the destination. Luongo for the next 5-6 years ensures a competitive team.

Once Gillis becomes reasonable the deal will happen.
Star player for spare players and 3rd liners...sounds reasonable. It'll be the boards call if Nonis ponies up for Luongo, and if they decide not to, super, we'll keep him or move him else where. It's not like there is incentive for us to move Luongo to Toronto based on these boards...

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01-13-2013, 07:00 PM
  #18
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Unless Gillis gives Luongo to the Leafs (not in a million years), they'll ship him elsewhere.

Still believe Florida is the destination. Luongo for the next 5-6 years ensures a competitive team.

Once Gillis becomes reasonable the deal will happen.
I'd change that to Nonis. And i believe Nonis will make a deal by next Saturday. He really has no other options.

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01-13-2013, 07:01 PM
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Sorry that's not how public companies operate. You'd have to be preety naive to not understand that MLSE wants the playoffs to drive revenue and sales of merchandise as well. The fact the team already makes lots of money is irrelevant.
Bell and Rogers are both cutting benefits for employees and are almost to the point of downsizing. If they leave money on the table in the form of playoff revenues after buying MLSE, there will likely be a full on revolt at the respective companies.

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01-13-2013, 07:02 PM
  #20
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Bell and Rogers are both cutting benefits for employees and are almost to the point of downsizing. If they leave money on the table in the form of playoff revenues after buying MLSE, there will likely be a full on revolt at the respective companies.
Agreed. The playoffs would be huge.
Not to mention that the owners want their products to be asociated with a successful team.

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01-13-2013, 07:04 PM
  #21
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I see what you did there.
Part of the article.

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Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
Cope isn't going to just fire someone he doesn't see eye to eye with if the results are there, but there has been no progression in 4 years. Kadri was, what, 7th overall? Then the team would have the 2nd overall the next year, then the 10th, and when they can pick again, they're in the bottom five for standings again. Forget playoffs, would you continue to employ someone that had 4 years to show progression of some kind, but in the end actually regressed? 7 -> 2 -> 10 -> 5.

The timing was off, but between having 2 weeks between the ownership being finalized and the lockout, during which I don't think they could have fired Burke, and personality probably played a role in it, but Burke didn't improve the Leafs, he made them worse in his time there.
The Kessel deal was Burkes way of proving to fans that he wouldn't tank, OIlers style, to rebuild this hockey team and of course he paid for it dearly. On numerous occasions his ego and beliefs were put ahead of the hockey teams best interests.

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01-13-2013, 07:04 PM
  #22
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Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
Bozak and Raymond become a wash, so: Lu for Kadri, Ashton and a 2nd.

Pass. Never thought I'd say it but I would rather Raymond. Sub in Frattin over Ashton and maybe it works. Even than I doubt Raymond is apart of it.
How about something like this...


Bozak + Ashton + 1st in 2014

for

Luongo + Schroeder

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Old
01-13-2013, 07:05 PM
  #23
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Sorry that's not how public companies operate. You'd have to be pretty naive to not understand that MLSE wants the playoffs to drive revenue and sales of merchandise as well. The fact the team already makes lots of money is irrelevant. I don't ever recall Microsoft or Apple saying that we already make money so we don't care if we make any more.
Mircosoft and Apple don't benefit from losing (top draft picks).

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I'd change that to Nonis. And i believe Nonis will make a deal by next Saturday. He really has no other options.
He does, nothing.

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01-13-2013, 07:09 PM
  #24
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Mircosoft and Apple don't benefit from losing (top draft picks).
No, but the bottomline is the bottomline. That's why Burke was canned and that's how public companies operate. Four years is enough time to show improvement. He didn't and he's gone. It's insulting to the fans' intelligence to try to say it's because of his personality.

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01-13-2013, 07:09 PM
  #25
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Quote:
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Part of the article.



The Kessel deal was Burkes way of proving to fans that he wouldn't tank, OIlers style, to rebuild this hockey team and of course he paid for it dearly. On numerous occasions his ego and beliefs were put ahead of the hockey teams best interests.
Either way, I enjoyed the pun.

I'm not commenting strictly on the Kessel trade, as hindsights' always 20/20 (Phaneuf for 30 goal scorer Hagman, top 4 D Ian White, 2C Matt Stajan and perennial bruiser Jamal Mayers...could have gone the other way too). However, the team trading these picks, then proceeding to tank not once, not twice, but three times after that...that's not progress. If it had gone in sequence after the Kadri draft, say 7 -> 2 -> 5 -> 10, I maintain Burke probably would have kept his job. Speculative history isn't a strong are of discussion though, as there is no end game, no proof, and even the evidence is scant at best.

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