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C Curtis Lazar - Edmonton Oil Kings, WHL (2013, 17th overall, Ottawa)

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Old
12-30-2012, 06:39 PM
  #401
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Originally Posted by The Nuge View Post
That's just it. I don't think you're getting a guy with enough offense to be a true #1C, but if everything goes wrong, I still think you end up with a good shutdown #3C
Who wants to draft a guy with a 3rd line center UPSIDE in the top 15 of a stacked draft though? Personally, I rather go for the natural talents in the first round. You get the secondary players later on.

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12-31-2012, 01:24 AM
  #402
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Originally Posted by Lebowski View Post
Who wants to draft a guy with a 3rd line center UPSIDE in the top 15 of a stacked draft though? Personally, I rather go for the natural talents in the first round. You get the secondary players later on.
It's 3rd line center DOWNSIDE.

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12-31-2012, 02:57 AM
  #403
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Originally Posted by Lebowski View Post
Who wants to draft a guy with a 3rd line center UPSIDE in the top 15 of a stacked draft though? Personally, I rather go for the natural talents in the first round. You get the secondary players later on.
Good third line centres are hard to find, and are essential to winning teams. Look at the last several Stanley Cup finalists: Stoll, Henrique, Kelly, Malhotra, Staal, Filpula, Pahlsson, Vermette are/were all very good 3C's. Id take a good 3C if I were drafting in the 10-15 range

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12-31-2012, 06:32 AM
  #404
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Originally Posted by DropkickQuinn View Post
Good third line centres are hard to find, and are essential to winning teams. Look at the last several Stanley Cup finalists: Stoll, Henrique, Kelly, Malhotra, Staal, Filpula, Pahlsson, Vermette are/were all very good 3C's. Id take a good 3C if I were drafting in the 10-15 range
They are important but they are cheaper to find than first or second line centers. With the exception of Staal (only a third line center due to his team's depth chart) and Malhotra, all were drafted outside the first line. Compare that to first and second line centers where 14 out of 24 were drafted in the first round. (Malkin (twice), Crosby (twice), Giroux (or was it Carter?), Kopitar, Richards (twice), Sedin, Kesler, Toews, Spezza, Getzlaf and Zajac.

And of course, the biggest problem is that Lazar isn't a lock to become any thing, even a third line center. He may have the tools and drive to become a 3C if his offence doesn't make it to the NHL but he isn't one yet. If you want to use 10-20 pick to get a third line center, why not just trade it? Some other team will gladly use that pick.

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12-31-2012, 11:02 AM
  #405
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Originally Posted by Hynh View Post
They are important but they are cheaper to find than first or second line centers. With the exception of Staal (only a third line center due to his team's depth chart) and Malhotra, all were drafted outside the first line. Compare that to first and second line centers where 14 out of 24 were drafted in the first round. (Malkin (twice), Crosby (twice), Giroux (or was it Carter?), Kopitar, Richards (twice), Sedin, Kesler, Toews, Spezza, Getzlaf and Zajac.

And of course, the biggest problem is that Lazar isn't a lock to become any thing, even a third line center. He may have the tools and drive to become a 3C if his offence doesn't make it to the NHL but he isn't one yet. If you want to use 10-20 pick to get a third line center, why not just trade it? Some other team will gladly use that pick.
Why draft Lazar in the 10-20 range, rather than just trade the pick for immediate help in the form of a fully developed similar player? Well, let's look at my Mike Fisher comparison. First of all, Ottawa managed to get him in the 2nd round, but let's say he was more highly regarded and ended up a 10-20. They squeezed 11 really good years out of him, including that Cinderella cup run in which he was a pivotol player. Then, they flipped him for a 20-25th pick and nabbed Stefan Noessen at the draft. They'll likely see many years out of Noessen as well. That's a ton of productive hockey for that one selection. Who knows what Noessen will parlay into? That Mike Fisher pick could pay of for two decades.

Now let's look at it from Nashville's prospective. They moved that first and got a good player approaching his thirties. They'll likely get four great years out of him and then part ways. I'm not saying Nashville made a poor choice, but if by some magic you were guaranteed a Mike Fisher clone in this draft, you'd probably be well served to take him 6th or 7th overall. I'm not saying Lazar carries that guarantee, but I do like his chances, which is why I think he'd be worth a pick between 10-20, which is the range you mentioned.

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01-13-2013, 09:14 PM
  #406
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Scores all 3 goals in Edmontons 3-0 win over Medicine Hat.

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01-13-2013, 09:41 PM
  #407
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Originally Posted by rt View Post
Why draft Lazar in the 10-20 range, rather than just trade the pick for immediate help in the form of a fully developed similar player? Well, let's look at my Mike Fisher comparison. First of all, Ottawa managed to get him in the 2nd round, but let's say he was more highly regarded and ended up a 10-20. They squeezed 11 really good years out of him, including that Cinderella cup run in which he was a pivotol player. Then, they flipped him for a 20-25th pick and nabbed Stefan Noessen at the draft. They'll likely see many years out of Noessen as well. That's a ton of productive hockey for that one selection. Who knows what Noessen will parlay into? That Mike Fisher pick could pay of for two decades.

Now let's look at it from Nashville's prospective. They moved that first and got a good player approaching his thirties. They'll likely get four great years out of him and then part ways. I'm not saying Nashville made a poor choice, but if by some magic you were guaranteed a Mike Fisher clone in this draft, you'd probably be well served to take him 6th or 7th overall. I'm not saying Lazar carries that guarantee, but I do like his chances, which is why I think he'd be worth a pick between 10-20, which is the range you mentioned.
It's all in the roll of the dice.

It's funny, the further he slips on various lists the more I start to like him.

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01-13-2013, 10:37 PM
  #408
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Scores all 3 goals in Edmontons 3-0 win over Medicine Hat.
He has some nights where he is flat out the best player on the ice, and puts up points. Most nights he is noticeable, and plays very well, but doesn't dominate and comes away with no points. The good thing is rarely does he have a game where you could say, "that was a bad game". Basically he is a very safe pick to do well as a pro but its really hard to know how much offence your getting. I do have a feeling though that his 18-19 year old seasons are going to be very productive.

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01-14-2013, 12:10 AM
  #409
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How fast is he?

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01-14-2013, 10:22 AM
  #410
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How fast is he?
Not a super fast skater like a Duclair but he is a very powerful skater, he uses his speed well to cut to the net or gain the zone. Not a weakness of his by any means.

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02-02-2013, 12:36 PM
  #411
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Kids been on a tear as of late. Put up 5 goals, good for 6 points, in the last 4 games. He is currently tied for first in goal scoring on the oil kings. If he can sustain his play for the rest of the season and into the playoffs I could see him easily being a top 10 pick.

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02-02-2013, 12:54 PM
  #412
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Maybe it's a case of seeing him too much but I've seen him not really do much on enough nights that my perception is clouded right now. I probably wouldn't be advocating for him anywhere before 35.

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02-02-2013, 01:32 PM
  #413
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Originally Posted by oilsp1ll View Post
Maybe it's a case of seeing him too much but I've seen him not really do much on enough nights that my perception is clouded right now. I probably wouldn't be advocating for him anywhere before 35.
That's complete and utter nonsense.

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02-02-2013, 01:34 PM
  #414
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Originally Posted by oilsp1ll View Post
Maybe it's a case of seeing him too much but I've seen him not really do much on enough nights that my perception is clouded right now. I probably wouldn't be advocating for him anywhere before 35.
At this point I don't know if i would agree with you but if he can consistently produce like he has in his last chunk of games he will definitely be going under 35


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02-02-2013, 01:48 PM
  #415
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That's complete and utter nonsense.
I know you're a big Lazar guy, you go to more games than me but I still get out to a fair amount. I guess our opinions just differ a bit, I don't think he's a terrible prospect but not completely high-end. Could have a great year next year but just what I think for now.

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02-02-2013, 01:54 PM
  #416
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Originally Posted by oilsp1ll View Post
I know you're a big Lazar guy, you go to more games than me but I still get out to a fair amount. I guess our opinions just differ a bit, I don't think he's a terrible prospect but not completely high-end. Could have a great year next year but just what I think for now.
You are entitled to your opinion of course. Even if it is way off. No way Lazar drops out of the first round. We will know one way or the other come draft day.

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02-02-2013, 01:57 PM
  #417
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Would love for the Blues to draft this kid. Didn't think it was possible earlier in the year when scouts had him in the top 15ish, but Blues would pick around the 25 area so hopefully Lazar drops to us.

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02-02-2013, 01:59 PM
  #418
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Originally Posted by oilsp1ll View Post
Maybe it's a case of seeing him too much but I've seen him not really do much on enough nights that my perception is clouded right now. I probably wouldn't be advocating for him anywhere before 35.
I see him going in the 20-30 range if he plays on average the way he has been playing this season. I could also see a team taking a reach on him, he is the kind of player that teams fall in love with. I could see a team like Phoenix target him.

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02-02-2013, 02:05 PM
  #419
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You are entitled to your opinion of course. Even if it is way off. No way Lazar drops out of the first round. We will know one way or the other come draft day.
Yeah, I think there is enough love for him he goes 20-30, but personally I wouldn't go for it, but I'm not a professional.

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02-02-2013, 02:34 PM
  #420
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Watched him play against Swift Current last night and he was all over the ice. Scored a nice PP goal as well.

His offensive stats have disappointed a little bit this year, however. I could see him going somewhere in the late 1st, early 2nd round.

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02-02-2013, 02:35 PM
  #421
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You are entitled to your opinion of course. Even if it is way off. No way Lazar drops out of the first round. We will know one way or the other come draft day.
I'm with IATL on this one. Hes just an awesome kid. He isnt putting up numbers right now because he is rounding out his game and becoming a professional. Thats the way that the Oil Kings win, they preach defence first. If he wanted he could be 20-30 points above the PPG mark.

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02-02-2013, 02:38 PM
  #422
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I'm with IATL on this one. Hes just an awesome kid. He isnt putting up numbers right now because he is rounding out his game and becoming a professional. Thats the way that the Oil Kings win, they preach defence first. If he wanted he could be 20-30 points above the PPG mark.
"If he wanted"? No. I don't think so. That's one of the worst things I've ever read.

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02-02-2013, 02:44 PM
  #423
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"If he wanted"? No. I don't think so. That's one of the worst things I've ever read.
Haha. Whatever man, your opinion.

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02-02-2013, 02:46 PM
  #424
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Haha. Whatever man, your opinion.
20-30 points above the PPG mark would give him 73-83 points in 53 games this season. Sorry, but I don't see it.

I've been to 6-7 Oil Kings games this season and he's stuck playing second fiddle to St. Croix, Samuelsson and Wruck.

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02-02-2013, 02:52 PM
  #425
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20-30 points above the PPG mark would give him 73-83 points in 53 games this season. Sorry, but I don't see it.

I've been to 6-7 Oil Kings games this season and he's stuck playing second fiddle to St. Croix, Samuelsson and Wruck.
I guess its just a matter of perspective. Ive seen a bunch of Oil Kings games this year as well as last year and he's looked great. He's obviously a better prospect than the three guys you mentioned. Hes done well with his role. If he was put in a more offensive role, I would see him putting up more points. It's not about how hes playing, its about what he projects to be. I guess my opinon of where he projects to be is much higher than your own.

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