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Subban to DET

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Old
01-13-2013, 12:30 PM
  #26
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Subban is by far better than smith

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Old
01-13-2013, 12:51 PM
  #27
Keenan87
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Jay Bouwmeester

for

PK Subban

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Old
01-13-2013, 05:49 PM
  #28
Trembz420
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Subban + 4th round pick for Kronwall + Martin Frk

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Old
01-13-2013, 06:32 PM
  #29
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^^


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Old
01-13-2013, 07:33 PM
  #30
ginovegas
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Subban plays right D which is an extra bonus in the league
With Gorges signed for 6 years, and our top 2 prospects also leftys (beaulieu and tinordi) Subbans value become even more important

in 2 years Habs d will probably look like this

Tinordi / Subban
Beaulieu / Ellis
Emelin / Gorges


Last edited by ginovegas: 01-13-2013 at 08:03 PM.
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Old
01-13-2013, 07:51 PM
  #31
Hugo Sham
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Originally Posted by Keenan87 View Post
Jay Bouwmeester

for

PK Subban
God no, from habs POV

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Old
01-13-2013, 09:08 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by theboss View Post
Subban is by far better than smith
Thanks for the amazing analysis. In other news, Narnia better than Montreal or Detroit.

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Old
01-13-2013, 09:14 PM
  #33
FanHabtic
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Thanks for the amazing analysis. In other news, Narnia better than Montreal or Detroit.
It wasn't analysis. It was fact.

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Old
01-13-2013, 10:17 PM
  #34
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It wasn't analysis. It was fact.
Thanks, that was helpful. Couldn't figure out why 2+2 = 4 until I got the Subban/Smith equation explained. I am pretty sure hoverboards are right around the corner.

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Old
01-13-2013, 11:13 PM
  #35
Hipster Doofus
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Originally Posted by BeersHockey View Post
Thanks, that was helpful. Couldn't figure out why 2+2 = 4 until I got the Subban/Smith equation explained. I am pretty sure hoverboards are right around the corner.
You're a comedian

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Old
01-14-2013, 12:01 AM
  #36
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That was a good read. Thank you. Quite informative.

Surprised Subban is that good at PK (or at least his defensive pairing is). My opinion of Subban went up a fair bit today. I am not 100% believer in Corsi but they are helpful and a useful indicator.

Though I still stand by Smith vs. Subban is a hard trade for either side. I cant see detroit adding any significant value with those types of players. For example even if Det added a 1st it would not be enough for MTL. And Det probably would rather see what Smith can do.

I think you will be surprised by Smith. He went .5ppg in 14 games last season from the bottom of our lineup. (2nd pp 2nd/3rd pair). One of the best +- on the team in that stretch.
Glad you liked the article, I wrote it as a resource for discussions like this.

On the subject of Subban's PK work. When making an assesement we are fortunate that we can compare him against two teammates (Gorges and Gill) who have results that are historically in the upper quartile of penalty kill defensemen and who both widely seen as very good with the man-disadvantage.

Both clearly preformed better with Subban than without him even with each other. I'd imagine there was a degree of synergy there, video review shows how they held the most important areas of the ice around the goal mouth on the kill while Subban's job was to attack the opposition. But probably the biggest thing was that Subban is phenomenal at vacuuming up lose pucks and transitioning the puck out of the defensive zone. This leads to far less offensive zone time for the opposition to attempt to set up a scoring play. Which is a big reason Subban is so effective on the kill despite not resembling your traditional PK stud like a Hal Gill, a big positional defender that holds the net. Subban excels at "active" defense, which reduces the requirement for that kind of "passive" defense.

You can see the effectiveness of various pairings here:

http://www.cs.unb.ca/~mwf/habs/index.html

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Old
01-14-2013, 12:05 AM
  #37
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If a trade were to really go down, I think Smith+Nyquist would cut it for Subban. Detroit gives their best forward prospect and their best D prospect for a #1D. Maybe detroit adds a 2nd, but thats just me.

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Old
01-14-2013, 12:17 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by zombi View Post


Filppula
Nyquist
Jurco
Ouellet
2nd 2013



Subban
Holy ****. I understand PK is good but damn. Detroit's roster gets obliterated, and he's not even under contract.

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Old
01-14-2013, 12:43 AM
  #39
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36 point Number 1 dman. Good luck with that. Subban sucked last season. He has a long way to go to be a number 1 or a franchise dman that MTL thinks he can become. But I was speaking strictly value.

If you want to keep a dman keep a dman. The OP's proposal (value wise) puts you in the discussion for quite a few top defenseman better than Subban.
and smith close to subban ? geez ur so lost

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Old
01-14-2013, 12:46 AM
  #40
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Comparing Smith to Subban with 14 NHL games is ridiculous.

That said, talking like Smith is some pushover is equally ridiculous.

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01-14-2013, 12:47 AM
  #41
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That's WAAAYYYY too much for Subban.

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Old
01-14-2013, 05:22 AM
  #42
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That's WAAAYYYY too much for Subban.
yup.

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Old
01-14-2013, 06:20 AM
  #43
IceDaddy
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If I am the Habs Id want a top 6 guy and 2 prospects at a minimum and thats probably not enough

Filppula
Ouellet
Smith

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Old
01-14-2013, 07:25 AM
  #44
Osgood As It Gets
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombi View Post


Filppula
Nyquist
Jurco
Ouellet
2nd 2013



Subban
With a package like that, the Wings could land Perry!

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Old
01-14-2013, 07:56 AM
  #45
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With a package like that, the Wings could land Perry!
Yeah 48 games of Perry since he's UFA this summer.......

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Old
01-14-2013, 08:13 AM
  #46
Osgood As It Gets
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Yeah 48 games of Perry since he's UFA this summer.......
And then you can sign him. Funny how UFA work, right?

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Old
01-14-2013, 10:13 AM
  #47
EveryDay
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And then you can sign him. Funny how UFA work, right?
What if he leave after the season? you would lost Filppula-Ouellet-Nyquist-Jurco-2nd for 48 games of Perry, does it make any sense to you?

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Old
01-14-2013, 10:17 AM
  #48
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With a package like that, the Wings could land Perry!
I wouldn't trade Perry straight up for Subban, even if he was signed to an extension. I'd want someone younger, it's all about the future for the Habs.

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Old
01-14-2013, 10:52 AM
  #49
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I wouldn't trade Perry straight up for Subban, even if he was signed to an extension. I'd want someone younger, it's all about the future for the Habs.
Perry is 27 and won a Rocket Richard trophy. I would trade Subban for Perry if he had an extension without thinking twice.

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Old
01-14-2013, 11:02 AM
  #50
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If I am the Habs Id want a top 6 guy and 2 prospects at a minimum and thats probably not enough

Filppula
Ouellet
Smith
So you want a top six forward, a potential top six forward, and a potential top pairing defender for a current top pairing defender?


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