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Grand Rapids Griffins 2012-13 ‎- Part 2

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01-14-2013, 01:37 PM
  #201
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Just out of curiosity, why is that?
To clear up roster space

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01-14-2013, 01:40 PM
  #202
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Originally Posted by sully61 View Post
To clear up roster space
For the Griffins? Neither Pearce nor Pare are on the Wings roster, so why would they be put on waivers?

This has been a really ****** day so far, so forgive me if I'm being a little dense.

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01-14-2013, 01:40 PM
  #203
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Well that's just where we'll have to disagree then.



Nobody expects him to, true, but in my opinion he could get to that point with a season or two of NHL duty.

** Just as a reminder, this is the first season I've actually been able to watch the Griffins, so it's highly likely I'm not going to see eye-to-eye with a lot of people. Any opinions I manufacture are based on research and what I see this year. **
LOL
Just last year, Lashoff didn't even look like NHL material.

Get a grip.

I think Almquist is the next Kronwall!

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01-14-2013, 01:48 PM
  #204
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For the Griffins? Neither Pearce nor Pare are on the Wings roster, so why would they be put on waivers?

This has been a really ****** day so far, so forgive me if I'm being a little dense.
They're under contract with the wings though. Each team is allowed 50 contracts I believe, including those in NHL, AHL, CHL, Europe and any other league.

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01-14-2013, 01:52 PM
  #205
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LOL
Just last year, Lashoff didn't even look like NHL material.

Get a grip.

I think Almquist is the next Kronwall!
Did you bother to read the part at the bottom? Might have saved you a little typing; THIS YEAR is what I'm referring to, not last year, nor the year before. Hell, not even the year before that. I also stated -- and quite clearly, I might add -- that it was MY OPINION, and last time I checked everyone was entitled to theirs without having to worry about being ridiculed.

Oh, but wait, I forgot this is CBBoards.hockeysfuture.com, and everyone must agree with Captain Bob or be wrong. Perhaps you should be the one attempting to find a grip of some sort.

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Originally Posted by sully61 View Post
They're under contract with the wings though. Each team is allowed 50 contracts I believe, including those in NHL, AHL, CHL, Europe and any other league.
I mean, I realize there's a contract limit, but I still don't get what good it does to place those two on waivers.

Eh, whatever. I'm just going to sit back in my fog and wait out the day.

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01-14-2013, 01:55 PM
  #206
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Yeah let's not forget Stuart never lived up to his draft status and bounced around the NHL for making lots of boneheaded plays. He only found a home in Detroit because there was no expectation at all for offensive production. Lashoff will be a similar type of stay at home d-man with good mobility and physical play and will PK a bit. No one who actually follows this team expects him to play Stuart's minutes at ES and on the PK but that doesn't change the fact they are used in very similar situations and have similar skill sets. I for one like the fact we have a bigger defensive d-man as our 7th d-man and I hope he gives Jakub Kindl all he can handle for that 6th d-man spot.
That's the silliest assessment I've read on this board ina long time.

First of all, there is one major reason Stuart didn't produce points

Player. ESTOI ESPts PPTOI PPPoints
Kronwall 1418 36 220 14
Stuart 1423 21 25 1
Lidstrom 1286 17 258 17
White 1456 32 230 10
Ericsson 1031 11 7 0
Quincey 1238 14 169 10
Kindl 723 13 34 1

Powerplay usage
At even strenghth, he produced at a greater rate than Lidstrom, Quincey and Ericsson.

And for all "stuart's" boneheaded plays, somehow, despite being paired with Kronwall most of the year, he was easily a plus player while Kronwall was -2.

The Red Wings are going to miss having someone who can hit, play tough in the corners, play tough in front of the net, only take 29 PIM ... plus skate well and outproduce Lidstrom and Quincey.

Bonehead Brad Stuart took 12 minor penalties last year ..

Quincey 37
Ericsson 21
Kronwall 19
Lidstrom 14
Stuart 12
White 11
Kindl 10

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01-14-2013, 01:57 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by redmenace View Post
did you bother to read the part at the bottom? Might have saved you a little typing; this year is what i'm referring to, not last year, nor the year before. Hell, not even the year before that. I also stated -- and quite clearly, i might add -- that it was my opinion, and last time i checked everyone was entitled to theirs without having to worry about being ridiculed.

Oh, but wait, i forgot this is cbboards.hockeysfuture.com, and everyone must agree with captain bob or be wrong. Perhaps you should be the one attempting to find a grip of some sort.


Eh, whatever. I'm just going to sit back in my fog and wait out the day.
brian lashoff is mediocre

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01-14-2013, 02:02 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by RedMenace View Post
Did you bother to read the part at the bottom? Might have saved you a little typing; THIS YEAR is what I'm referring to, not last year, nor the year before. Hell, not even the year before that. I also stated -- and quite clearly, I might add -- that it was MY OPINION, and last time I checked everyone was entitled to theirs without having to worry about being ridiculed.

Oh, but wait, I forgot this is CBBoards.hockeysfuture.com, and everyone must agree with Captain Bob or be wrong. Perhaps you should be the one attempting to find a grip of some sort.



I mean, I realize there's a contract limit, but I still don't get what good it does to place those two on waivers.

Eh, whatever. I'm just going to sit back in my fog and wait out the day.
Maybe they're preparing to sign some rookies or free agents or maybe making room for trades

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01-14-2013, 02:08 PM
  #209
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And that's just, like, your opinion man -- which you're certainly entitled to.

Telling me to "get a grip" because mine differs from yours is childish at best.
No, i think you need to get a grip because you're penciling a guy who's done nothing in the AHL level to be a guy who has been top pairing and top 4 defenseman in the NHL for a decade.

You got Malik'd. No biggie. Happens to lots of RW fans who read his tripe.

People take these little tidbits of information and run with them... like all the stupid BS about Pulkkinen being a Hull type player because of a single quote from Nill or Andersson or whoever.

If Lashoff is going to be a Brad Stuart type -- what's Almquist going to be? How about Smith? How about Sproul? Ouellet? How about McKee?

They aren't all going to be NHLers. Jakub Kindl played top line minutes with the Griffs and he can't win a job. Jon Ericsson was an AHL all-star and he's still not proven to be more than a third pairing guy yet.

So year, some undrafted UFA gets signed and can skate and play stay at home -- that doesn't make him the next Brad Stuart. Guy as nothing yet.

Lashoff, who had a brutal year last year, is 22.
here's where Stuart was at 22:
He was in SJ, playing his 3rd NHL season, scoring 6 goals and 29 points.


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01-14-2013, 02:16 PM
  #210
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Originally Posted by Captain Bob View Post
No, i think you need to get a grip because you're penciling a guy who's done nothing in the AHL level to a guy who has been top pairing and top 4 defenseman in the NHL for a decade.

You got Malik'd. No biggie. Happens to lots of RW fans who read his tripe.
It appears many people on this board, you excluded, have seen Lashoff step up his play tremendously, and enough so that they think he can step into a role on the Red Wings. You disagree, but you appear to be the little chihuahua barking at the pack of wolves when you constantly insinuate that all of our opinions are wrong that we need to "get a grip" or "learn how to read." It's silly and childish.

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01-14-2013, 02:21 PM
  #211
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It appears many people on this board, you excluded, have seen Lashoff step up his play tremendously, and enough so that they think he can step into a role on the Red Wings. You disagree, but you appear to be the little chihuahua barking at the pack of wolves when you constantly insinuate that all of our opinions are wrong that we need to "get a grip" or "learn how to read." It's silly and childish.
LOL.
Dude, that's selective.

Some guy decides to make it personal, so I say "Learn to Read"
BFD.

And I have seen Lashoff this year. He's been hit and miss in the games I've watched. I don't NHL level anticipation.

I think Kindl is 3x the defenseman Lashoff is and he can't get his foot in the door.

Not much chance for Lashoff, IMO

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01-14-2013, 02:25 PM
  #212
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Originally Posted by RedMenace View Post
For the Griffins? Neither Pearce nor Pare are on the Wings roster, so why would they be put on waivers?

This has been a really ****** day so far, so forgive me if I'm being a little dense.
They need to go through waivers in order to be able to play going forward, every team is doing this. New CBA, don't know why exactly but probably has to do with their amount of seasons or games played. I.e. if another NHL team wants to pick them up and give them a chance this would be the time. If they get picked up elsewhere, they can't be sent to the minors without going through waivers again.

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01-14-2013, 02:28 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by Captain Bob View Post
No, i think you need to get a grip because you're penciling a guy who's done nothing in the AHL level to a guy who has been top pairing and top 4 defenseman in the NHL for a decade.

You got Malik'd. No biggie. Happens to lots of RW fans who read his tripe.
Done nothing at the AHL level? This is his 3rd year as a pro. His 1st full season with the Griffins, he was injured and played 37 games; his 2nd, he played every game, scored 19 points, and was a -9 with 41 PIMS on a Griffins team that didn't do a whole lot; this year, he's an Assistant Captain with 6 points at a +5 with 8 PIMS in 37 games in a fairly big defensive/PK role.

Now if you want to compare those stats with Brad Stuart -- oh wait, you can't, because they've each taken different routes to the NHL with different teams. However, they both play the same style, and whether or not Lashoff can step it up in the NHL is yet to be seen.

It's obvious your definition of "doing nothing" is suspect, and again, belittling someone (Malik, in this case) for not agreeing with you isn't very becoming.

Quote:
If Lashoff is going to be a Brad Stuart type -- what's Almquist going to be? How about Smith? How about Sproul? Ouellet? How about McKee?

They aren't all going to be NHLers. Jakub Kindl played top line minutes with the Griffs and he can't win a job. Jon Ericsson was an AHL all-star and he's still not proven to be more than a third pairing guy yet.

So year, some undrafted UFA gets signed and can skate and play stay at home -- that doesn't make him the next Brad Stuart. Guy as nothing yet.
But instead of saying "He's done nothing and never will LOLURDUMB," how about looking at potential with regard to how he's playing NOW?

Quote:
Lashoff, who had a brutal year last year, is 22.
On what appears to have been a pretty brutal Griffins squad.

Quote:
here's where Stuart was at 22:
He was in SJ, playing his 3rd NHL season, scoring 6 goals and 29 points.
And San Jose was a playoff-bubble team the year he came into the league, whereas Detroit has had a pretty solid defensive core since Lashoff has been in the system.

Apples to garbage trucks, man.

Quote:
And I have seen Lashoff this year. He's been hit and miss in the games I've watched. I don't NHL level anticipation.
I don't know which games you've seen, but he's had very few poor games, and defends the vast majority of the competition he faces rather well/easily.

Quote:
I think Kindl is 3x the defenseman Lashoff is and he can't get his foot in the door.

Not much chance for Lashoff, IMO
Last time I checked, Kindl wasn't a defensive, stay-at-home, PK type, fighting for a spot on a roster filled with offensive defensemen.


Last edited by RedMenace: 01-14-2013 at 02:47 PM.
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01-14-2013, 02:28 PM
  #214
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Lashoff has improved tremendously as a prospect in the past year. He sucked before that. People need to better translate this Brad Stuart comparison. Lashoff is not a top 4 NHL guy, and he never will be. Right now he's an injury callup and maybe someday he'll find a home on our bottom pairing, and he happens to have the physical stay at home prowess similar to Stuart.

Smith is not a HHOF #1 defenseman because his skating is similar to Scott Niedermayer.
Pulu is not Brett Hull just because he can find open ice well and use the Holy Slapper.
Etc.

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01-14-2013, 02:30 PM
  #215
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They need to go through waivers in order to be able to play going forward, every team is doing this. New CBA, don't know why exactly but probably has to do with their amount of seasons or games played. I.e. if another NHL team wants to pick them up and give them a chance this would be the time. If they get picked up elsewhere, they can't be sent to the minors without going through waivers again.
Yeah, if a player is out of options then he needs to go through waivers before he can be assigned to Grand Rapids. This is why Cory Emmerton is on the Wings, they are concerned someone would claim him. Why? I can't really tell you but anyone who has the slightest chance of playing in the NHL will be added to the roster...hence us having like 18 forwards along with Mike Knuble coming in for a tryout.

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01-14-2013, 02:32 PM
  #216
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LOL.
Dude, that's selective.

Some guy decides to make it personal, so I say "Learn to Read"
BFD.

And I have seen Lashoff this year. He's been hit and miss in the games I've watched. I don't NHL level anticipation.

I think Kindl is 3x the defenseman Lashoff is and he can't get his foot in the door.

Not much chance for Lashoff, IMO
I've seen Lashoff this year as well. He looked pretty good, and I have no recollection of him doing anything bad either, and my memory rarely ever fails me. I'm growing ever impatient with this condescending attitude of yours. Drop it and act like a normal civilized Red Wings Fan for once. I couldn't care any less you disagree. You have no right to insult us.

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01-14-2013, 02:48 PM
  #217
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Yeah, if a player is out of options then he needs to go through waivers before he can be assigned to Grand Rapids. This is why Cory Emmerton is on the Wings, they are concerned someone would claim him. Why? I can't really tell you but anyone who has the slightest chance of playing in the NHL will be added to the roster...hence us having like 18 forwards along with Mike Knuble coming in for a tryout.
But Pare and Pearce are already in Grand Rapids, which is why I don't get the waiving thing (unless it does have to do with the number of seasons played as Joe mentioned previously)...

... wait, what am I doing trying to claw out of this fog?

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01-14-2013, 02:52 PM
  #218
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But Pare and Pearce are already in Grand Rapids, which is why I don't get the waiving thing (unless it does have to do with the number of seasons played as Joe mentioned previously)...

... wait, what am I doing trying to claw out of this fog?
I'm not sure but I think it's something like this: when the NHL season starts, all non waiver-free AHL players have to be put through waivers. Normally this would happen in Sep/Oct but due to the lockout it's happening now.

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01-14-2013, 03:06 PM
  #219
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I'm not sure but I think it's something like this: when the NHL season starts, all non waiver-free AHL players have to be put through waivers. Normally this would happen in Sep/Oct but due to the lockout it's happening now.
Wow, that seems like a silly rule. You'd think it'd only apply to players who'd actually played in the NHL for a certain number of games the season prior or something.

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01-14-2013, 03:12 PM
  #220
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Some people in here want kids on the roster, and accuse Holland signing those veterans instead of kids, but looks like Brian Lashoff is the wrong kid.

MOD


Last edited by Fugu: 01-17-2013 at 11:56 PM. Reason: not needed
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01-14-2013, 03:23 PM
  #221
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Some people in here want kids on the roster, and accuse Holland signing those veterans instead of kids, but looks like Brian Lashoff is the wrong kid.
Exactly. I for one hope Lashoff can push Kindl for ice time. At least Lashoff is getting his first shot at NHL action. Can he possibly be better than Kindl, a first round draft pick? If he can PK that means he'd likely be more valuable than Kindl, who can only play very limited mins at ES.

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01-14-2013, 03:46 PM
  #222
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Exactly. I for one hope Lashoff can push Kindl for ice time. At least Lashoff is getting his first shot at NHL action. Can he possibly be better than Kindl, a first round draft pick? If he can PK that means he'd likely be more valuable than Kindl, who can only play very limited mins at ES.
Well don't get too crazy there Kindl was on the pk in Grand Rapids, he pk'd for the Czech team in the EHT's this year. He can do it, they don't let him and chances are they will treat Lashoff the same way. In almost no way is Lashoff a better option than Kindl, if he was more consistent with his physicality I would say there, but just like Kindl he doesn't use it all the time although he is certainly improving there.

I hope Lashoff makes it, but the problem is the expectations and comparisons are interesting from the pro Lashoff crowd. He is like Stuart in that he is a defensive d-man and pretty much there the comparisons should stop. Brad Stuart was a top 5 draft pick, he has considerably more talent in almost every area. His puck skills, physical game, positioning, and hockey IQ all are a daunting task for Lashoff even on a good/great development track to catch. I mean Lashoff could turn into a useful #6/7 on a good team. I think this idea he can become a top 4 d-man is a little interesting and if happens in Detroit it means we suck. I sure hope for him he does in Detroit and that I am wrong, but I just don't see it. Because for those trotting that out it will mean he beat out Kronwall (not going anywhere for a while), Ericsson, Sproul, Ouellet, Backman, Smith, Marchenko, Jensen, Quincey, and Kindl. Plus lets be honest how many of us want Edler or some d-man on July 1st this year? So to call him a top 4 d-man is a little off base and to say he could be Brad Stuart is saying he will be just that.

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01-14-2013, 03:52 PM
  #223
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I hope Lashoff makes it, but the problem is the expectations and comparisons are interesting from the pro Lashoff crowd. He is like Stuart in that he is a defensive d-man and pretty much there the comparisons should stop. Brad Stuart was a top 5 draft pick, he has considerably more talent in almost every area. His puck skills, physical game, positioning, and hockey IQ all are a daunting task for Lashoff even on a good/great development track to catch. I mean Lashoff could turn into a useful #6/7 on a good team. I think this idea he can become a top 4 d-man is a little interesting and if happens in Detroit it means we suck. I sure hope for him he does in Detroit and that I am wrong, but I just don't see it. Because for those trotting that out it will mean he beat out Kronwall (not going anywhere for a while), Ericsson, Sproul, Ouellet, Backman, Smith, Marchenko, Jensen, Quincey, and Kindl. Plus lets be honest how many of us want Edler or some d-man on July 1st this year? So to call him a top 4 d-man is a little off base and to say he could be Brad Stuart is saying he will be just that.
I don't know who is putting Lashoff into Top4 defence? This Stuart-comparison went to wrong direction? Lashoff is "Stuart-like", but a 3rd pairing guy. I still think Lashoff's career maximum potential is the 3rd pair + 1st PK unit and even though we have Ouellet's and Sproul's coming, they don't compete against this Lashoff's role at all. They are going to hit the TOP4 and overtake Lashoff for sure, if they pan out. Lashoff will compete against Nicastro, Nedomlel, McKee etc.

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01-14-2013, 04:19 PM
  #224
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Some people in here want kids on the roster, and accuse Holland signing those veterans instead of kids, but looks like Brian Lashoff is the wrong kid.
Some people try to be clever and post ridiculous logic fails.

Doubting whether Lashoff is a quality defenseman isn't at odds wanting kid who has proven their ability to get a shot.


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01-14-2013, 04:24 PM
  #225
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Why do you have to act like a tool because someone sees upside in Lashoff? I agree that him being as good as a 2008 Stuart is unlikely, but in a few years it wont surprise me if he is doing what Stuart did for the wings last year, hes having a really good season this year, hes finally healthy and his play has been good with that. I think Lashoff can be a 5 or 6 dman for the wings who kills penalties. Weren't you saying earlier you'v barely watched any games this year because redwingslive doesnt work for you?

Ferraro also looked like a complete bust up until halfway through last season, would you say hes not going to be an NHLer now? Players improve..
Aren't you the guy who thinks every prospect is a future NHLer?
At the same time, you denegrate the valuable contributions of the only NHL defenseman we had who plays with any heart.

The Red Wings are the same team that takes 5 years before they give Brendan Smith a shot. Unless Lashoff finds a level I haven't seen from him yet, I don't see him getting a real shot.

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