Oiler fans love this deal--we have wanted him for awhile
which is strange because you've already watched Theo Peckham play for a couple of years and from what I understand you guys really don't care much for him.
A 6-7 D should garner more than a 3rd round pick? I liked his hitting and that was fun to watch, but I think it's a fair deal and I'm excited to see what Dillon does. Definitely has more upside, he seems to skate much better than the Fister.
I guess Jordie Benn is making the team as the #7. I don't think he's ready for that. We'll have to see what Rome's got as well, not convinced he's a real #6 either. The D is thin as cheesecloth.
Joe has really subtracted almost all of the team's physicality. I know we make fun of it, but this is one of the least "tough to play against" teams in the entire league now.
They had damn well better be able to score, and score often.
I don't think the Stars organization has really valued physicality from defensemen that much in recent years.
I don't know. They seem to have a long history of trying to get physical d-men. They drafted Erskine, Fistric, Grossman, and Olesiak pretty high.
They've tried acquiring physical d-men even recently when they brought on Woywitka, Pardy, Souray, and others, but sadly, those guys just weren't very good.
Seems like they've had some bad luck getting these guys to work out, so all of the ice time keeps going to guys like Robidas and Daley.
I don't know. They seem to have a long history of trying to get physical d-men. They drafted Erskine, Fistric, Grossman, and Olesiak pretty high.
They've tried acquiring physical d-men even recently when they brought on Woywitka, Pardy, Souray, and others, but sadly, those guys just weren't very good.
Seems like they've had some bad luck getting these guys to work out, so all of the ice time keeps going to guys like Robidas and Daley.
What about this? Would you agree they now tend to value mobility above physicality?
Oleksiak, Nemeth, and Dillon are large, physical D for sure, but they are also very mobile.
Erskine, Fistric, Grossman, and the free agents are all fairly limited in mobility with the exception of Woywitka.
I still believe they want the physical presence, but they won't give up puck possession and mobility for it.
The Red Wings are pretty tough to play against and their lineup hasn't exactly been very... rough and tumble lately. They just have tenacity in their bottom 6 and some solid D-men.
Fistric's puck skills are basically zero. His mobility isn't that great. He'd basically been replaced by Aaron Rome as the team's 6/7. I think Rome has considerably better puck skills and just as much physicality. Plus the Boston show'll be much more interesting next year.
It's not a bad trade. It's a completely logical trade to open a defensive roster spot and get a pick back for a guy that would likely never play because of his lack of actual systemic value.
I'm just not sold on Rome playing regularly. Or Jordie Benn. To be honest I'd really love to see Oleksiak stick, and I understand the displeasure of possible low ice time, but it's a short season and his ELC is ticking.
I have to strongly disagree with those that are saying we did not get enough in return for Fistric. he can hit, but that is really it. I think the return could easily have been a 5th so we should not scoff at a 3rd. I understand the toughness argument, but I think that Rome is a small upgrade over Fistric, and can be just as menacing. I also believe we are getting a 3rd for an asset that will continue to devalue the more he would have been, possibly, scratched as the year went on.
right time, right return.
Super nice guy, and I do wish him success, but I think this a good move by GMJN. Good luck in Edmonton, Mark!
I also believe we are getting a 3rd for an asset that will continue to devalue the more he would have been, possibly, scratched as the year went on.
I agree, and this is key for me. Whether you personally agree or not with their opinion, the organization isn't a fan anymore. I highly doubt he would have played much this year, and you aren't getting a 3rd at the trade deadline for a guy who hasn't been playing.
GMJN maximized an asset they were probably not going to seriously consider in the lineup.
If you pissed about the team not using him ... that's a different argument, IMO.
Contrary to what most of these people are saying Edmonton fans, you're getting a damn good stay at home defenseman. It's a shame our organization couldn't see it.
I have my doubts. That would be a good direction to go though.
I've always considered Dillon a lock so that's not surprising. However, I think the organization could easily be comfortable with Benn and Rome competing for #6 minutes.
At the very least, Oleksiak is 8 so we'll see him this year at some point when injuries hit.
The front office is smoking crack if Benn is in over Oleksiak or Dillon.
I think you're doing your math wrong. There's room for two so there's no question Dillon is in, IMO.
NHL one-way D: Daley, Goligoski, Larsen, Robidas, Rome
I'd also argue allowing 20 year old Oleksiak to develop a bit more isn't smoking crack it's just being patient. All you need to do is look to Matt Niskanen to figure out why they'd be gun-shy to rush a D again.
If Benn is in the NHL right now and Oleksiak isn't, that's not a sign of either player's long term impact on the team.
“As you know, these are never easy decisions, but I feel comfortable where are kids are at and it’s not just the two (Jordie Benn and Brenden Dillon) we have here in camp. I think there’s (Jamie) Oleksiak and (Patrik) Nemeth, too. That factors into it. These two (Benn and Dillon) in particular have been playing 22-24 minutes a night, are in game shape and ready to go. You always try to analyze when the best time is to transition your kids in, and I think this is a real good time because the league has been shut down and these kids have been playing. That factored into it. And the fact that we have Aaron Rome now, who plays a similar brash style.”
I dont think this signals that at all. Its pretty clear that Goligoski, Larsen, Daley, Dillion, and Robidas are all locks. Rome and Benn will most likely compete for the last spot, and the other will be #7, for now. Oleksiak will probably be the first injury call up.
Hopefully they learned from Niskanen that they dont need to rush any d-men. Now, if Oleksiak is truly ready, then by all means play him. But Im not sure 40 games in the AHL is enough at this point. Much rather see him play big minutes in the AHL than be bottom pairing/rotating healthy scratch with the big club.
I thought fistric made big strides last year and was looking forward to seeing how he progressed this year... I'm not so much upset at the return as I am about the simple fact he was traded... D depth is never a bad thing to have and we were already pretty thin
No it shows that we can't assess talent on the backend at all.
Daley (Small not physical enough)
Robidas (Turnover machine)
Goose (not physical but has great offense)
Larsen (Well rounded now)
Rome (good for healthy scratch days)
That leaves two spots.
Jordie Benn can pass and he can block shots like a mother****er. But he CANNOT think the game as fast as you need to in the NHL, and it's just that easy. Not to mention he'll get absolutely manhandled by teams like SJ, ANA, and LA. He's proven it time and time again in the AHL, that he just isn't up to it.
Oleksiak can hang with anybody, he's ****ing huge, he's got a great shot, and if he's ready then why waste time and keep him in an inferior league?
Dillon is an NHLer and there's no if's, and's, or but's about it.
Now with that group at the top there is clearly one thing missing, and it's a huge, gaping hole. Shutdown physicality.
Oleksiak and Dillon can absolutely without a doubt bring that to the table. Benn cannot.
This concern over how Niskanen was handled is total bull.
He played next to Zubov and looked amazing, then when he left he played like ****. How's that surprising? He was weak, a turnover machine, and was intimidated very easily.
I don't know why the hell Joe is referring to Benn as a kid, but whatever.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozen Failure
It's not a bad trade. It's a completely logical trade to open a defensive roster spot and get a pick back for a guy that would likely never play because of his lack of actual systemic value.
I fail to see the logic behind trading a veteran D away when there's ALREADY an open roster spot for a rookie who may have earned the opportunity, but certainly hasn't proven that he's ready for sure. No additional spot needed to be opened. This is a big gamble. Things are going to get touch and go real fast if injuries start piling up in a compressed season. It also does absolutely nothing to help the team make the playoffs this year.
Oleksiak and Nemeth both need more time in the AHL. If you're using them as the stopgaps you're doing a disservice to their development.
