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01-14-2013, 03:41 PM
  #901
Kriss E
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I was gonna bring up the comparison with Armstrong because what I'm trying to say is that despite Armstrong being such a streaky player, and even a bit less productive than Kostitsyn on the scoring department, he's not a player who has question marks on his character and his effort level.

When healthy, Armstrong is your classic 3rd liner, plays a gritty game on a constant level, so when he doesn't score, he doesn't completely disappear. He still contributes with something.

Well, let's hope we do get a healthy Colby Armstrong.
And you'd be a fool to think Armstrong and AKost are on the same level.

Not signing a player means very little. Tanguay saw his salary drop by more than 50% after he played here. He signed a late deal with almost no teams showing interest. Why?? He still produced 41pts in 50Gp. He followed that with a terrible year in TB and had to settle for yet another 1year deal for again, less money.

You cannot be a consistent 20 goal scorer. You won't score 1 goal every 4 games.
It's just a different style of player. A.Ko is not the type of player to skate all over and hit a player, it's just not his style. He will lurk around, trying to find loose pucks and create a play. Don't ask Armstrong to create a play, it'll go nowhere 99% of the time. He's a grinder that will score garbage goals. AK is a finesse player.

However, I disagree about him being unidimensional. He formed a great two way trio with Eller and Moen. I find he was finally settling into a comfortable position where his defensive game improved tremendously. He had good two way players next to him that are more defensively responsible than him, but he brought them a very needed offensive touch that helped them dominate lower opposition, and especially helped Eller. Don't expect this to happen with Moen-Eller-Armstrong. They won't have the same offensive flare unless Eller improved a lot and is able to carry his line.
To me, this was the perfect role for him. Sadly, Cunneyworth opted to break up that working trio for some magical reason.
Also, we knew for a fact AK could step up a play on the top 2 lines in case of injury. I don't want to see Armstrong anywhere near our top 2 lines.

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01-14-2013, 03:52 PM
  #902
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Originally Posted by Myron Gaines View Post
I was gonna bring up the comparison with Armstrong because what I'm trying to say is that despite Armstrong being such a streaky player, and even a bit less productive than Kostitsyn on the scoring department, he's not a player who has question marks on his character and his effort level.

When healthy, Armstrong is your classic 3rd liner, plays a gritty game on a constant level, so when he doesn't score, he doesn't completely disappear. He still contributes with something.

Well, let's hope we do get a healthy Colby Armstrong.
They are streaky because of math of players of that caliber.

And Kostitsyn was hardly useless when he wasn't scoring a goal. He was a pretty reliable body for helping two-way lines push the play towards the other team's net. He could carry the puck and pass well and not be a liability in the defensive zone, even if he wasn't dominant there. Plus was an above average physical player as well. Over the years the results for the top two-way center in Plekanec were notably better with Kostitsyn rather than without him, just as Eller was far stronger with him on his wing rather than somebody else.

Kostitsyn was reliably a positive factor in team success even if he wasn't a guy that was close to being able to carry a line.

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01-14-2013, 04:07 PM
  #903
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Originally Posted by Myron Gaines View Post
I was gonna bring up the comparison with Armstrong because what I'm trying to say is that despite Armstrong being such a streaky player, and even a bit less productive than Kostitsyn on the scoring department, he's not a player who has question marks on his character and his effort level.

When healthy, Armstrong is your classic 3rd liner, plays a gritty game on a constant level, so when he doesn't score, he doesn't completely disappear. He still contributes with something.

Well, let's hope we do get a healthy Colby Armstrong.
Exactly why it's ridiculous to have Armstrong on the 4th line and Moen on the 3rd line. When healthy Armstrong is one of the most effective players in his role. He's way better than Moen offensively.

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01-14-2013, 04:55 PM
  #904
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They are streaky because of math of players of that caliber.

And Kostitsyn was hardly useless when he wasn't scoring a goal. He was a pretty reliable body for helping two-way lines push the play towards the other team's net. He could carry the puck and pass well and not be a liability in the defensive zone, even if he wasn't dominant there. Plus was an above average physical player as well. Over the years the results for the top two-way center in Plekanec were notably better with Kostitsyn rather than without him, just as Eller was far stronger with him on his wing rather than somebody else.

Kostitsyn was reliably a positive factor in team success even if he wasn't a guy that was close to being able to carry a line.
I could go on hours about Kostitsyn and the type of players he is. But the debate wont end. I simply don't see what kind of impact he had on our team besides when he got hot and scored in bunches. You say that he could carry the puck, but I say that he barely could carry the puck the past few years. You also said he could pass well, but for every nice pass there was about 10 erroneous passes.

That's what I remember from Kostitsyn the last few years. Flashes of brightness, missed pass receptions, missed shots, a few great goals, occasional nice hits and very streaky scoring and decent defensive play. He was avery clumsy player.

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01-14-2013, 05:05 PM
  #905
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And you'd be a fool to think Armstrong and AKost are on the same level.

Not signing a player means very little. Tanguay saw his salary drop by more than 50% after he played here. He signed a late deal with almost no teams showing interest. Why?? He still produced 41pts in 50Gp. He followed that with a terrible year in TB and had to settle for yet another 1year deal for again, less money.

You cannot be a consistent 20 goal scorer. You won't score 1 goal every 4 games.
It's just a different style of player. A.Ko is not the type of player to skate all over and hit a player, it's just not his style. He will lurk around, trying to find loose pucks and create a play. Don't ask Armstrong to create a play, it'll go nowhere 99% of the time. He's a grinder that will score garbage goals. AK is a finesse player.

However, I disagree about him being unidimensional. He formed a great two way trio with Eller and Moen. I find he was finally settling into a comfortable position where his defensive game improved tremendously. He had good two way players next to him that are more defensively responsible than him, but he brought them a very needed offensive touch that helped them dominate lower opposition, and especially helped Eller. Don't expect this to happen with Moen-Eller-Armstrong. They won't have the same offensive flare unless Eller improved a lot and is able to carry his line.
To me, this was the perfect role for him. Sadly, Cunneyworth opted to break up that working trio for some magical reason.
Also, we knew for a fact AK could step up a play on the top 2 lines in case of injury. I don't want to see Armstrong anywhere near our top 2 lines.
I know that, those are maths, I'm not talking about his consistency points wise. It's like you said, Kostitsyn is a finesse player, but when finesse players don't score, they don't do much. The 2-way in the Eller line was Eller and Moen, Kostitsyn brought in some offensive flair and could still hold his own defensively. That's why Eller and Moen we're on the PK, not Eller and Kostitsyn.

As far as PP goes, I do agree that Kostitsyn deserved more chances, even though he wasn't exactly playing his way into a PP unit.

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01-14-2013, 05:26 PM
  #906
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Originally Posted by Talks to Goalposts View Post
They are streaky because of math of players of that caliber.

And Kostitsyn was hardly useless when he wasn't scoring a goal. He was a pretty reliable body for helping two-way lines push the play towards the other team's net. He could carry the puck and pass well and not be a liability in the defensive zone, even if he wasn't dominant there. Plus was an above average physical player as well. Over the years the results for the top two-way center in Plekanec were notably better with Kostitsyn rather than without him, just as Eller was far stronger with him on his wing rather than somebody else.

Kostitsyn was reliably a positive factor in team success even if he wasn't a guy that was close to being able to carry a line.

Kostitsyn's defense notably improved in his last two years in my opinion, he gets a bad rap for a few high profile blunders and he was not the best decision maker, but the effort was always there and it's no coincidence every line he was put on except the 4th was typically better with him than without him.

It's not that Kostitsyn is anything special but he is better than both Bourque and Armstrong, or at least more complete.

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01-14-2013, 05:33 PM
  #907
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I know that, those are maths, I'm not talking about his consistency points wise. It's like you said, Kostitsyn is a finesse player, but when finesse players don't score, they don't do much. The 2-way in the Eller line was Eller and Moen, Kostitsyn brought in some offensive flair and could still hold his own defensively. That's why Eller and Moen we're on the PK, not Eller and Kostitsyn.

As far as PP goes, I do agree that Kostitsyn deserved more chances, even though he wasn't exactly playing his way into a PP unit.
He was a finesse player that could help drive puck possession. That has value even if it doesn't lead to a goal. It results in time spent in the offensive zone rather than spent playing defense. He's not so great if you think defense is just about chasing the puck but its also about having the puck and maintaining control of it. Then with the puck, counterattack. You need to be able to play offense to be a good two-way line, otherwise you're just losing slowly.

No point of having him on the kill, as he's mid level at best in the defensive zone. But he was a pretty good two-way ES player, one that fits 4th or 5th on pretty much any winger depth chart.

PP time wasn't that big a deal though. He was rarely better as a PP player than the guys playing 1st unit so he was getting about what he deserved. The point of Kostitsyn is that he was a decent ES player on a weak ES team and earned his roster spot there, being useful pretty much everywhere on the top nine. Except with Gomez, they were horrible together, subtract that disaster from those two's plus minus and they both come out looking pretty good.

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01-14-2013, 05:43 PM
  #908
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Idea
Most NHL teams are trying to figure out how to repay the fans back..how about on NHL.com they stream ALL games for FREE in this shortened season

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01-14-2013, 05:45 PM
  #909
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Omg people. I come on this thread to hopefully read about "training camp" and all I see is Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,

Enough already.

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01-14-2013, 05:46 PM
  #910
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Omg people. I come on this thread to hopefully read about "training camp" and all I see is Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn, Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,Kostitsyn,

Enough already.
I agree, I've been having the same debates over him these past few years and he's no longer a hab. Time to move on.

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01-14-2013, 05:48 PM
  #911
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did you guys saw this



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Old
01-14-2013, 05:53 PM
  #912
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did you guys saw this


How he got this job is beyond me. The guy a tool and he's even the president of the midget AAA ... Sigh

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01-14-2013, 05:54 PM
  #913
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I agree, I've been having the same debates over him these past few years and he's no longer a hab. Time to move on.
Some guys just can't get over this guy, like we lost a superstar or something...He's never been THAT good, ever, and he's had many chances under many coaches. He is what he is, nothing more nothing less.

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01-14-2013, 05:56 PM
  #914
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Some guys just can't get over this guy, like we lost a superstar or something...He's never been THAT good, ever, and he's had many chances under many coaches. He is what he is, nothing more nothing less.
That's a nice strawman.

The only people arguing in favor of kostitsyn have said no such thing. He'd make this team better, that's it.

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01-14-2013, 06:00 PM
  #915
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did you guys saw this


My French sucks, what's he say?

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01-14-2013, 06:01 PM
  #916
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I hate the mentality in Montreal that if you don't score every game, you suck and don't belong. It takes all types of players to build a good team. Even great teams have inconsistent guys.

Kostitsyn would be good for several reasons

1. He'd come cheap
2. He's already familiar with the city
3. He provides depth on wings, which the team doesn't have.
4. He provides skill, which the team also lacks.

He doesn't have to be relied upon to carry the team. He just needs to act as a complimentary winger. Provide some secondary or tertiary scoring. TBH, I'd take Andrei over Amstrong all day long.

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01-14-2013, 06:05 PM
  #917
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I hate the mentality in Montreal that if you don't score every game, you suck and don't belong. It takes all types of players to build a good team. Even great teams have inconsistent guys.

Kostitsyn would be good for several reasons

1. He'd come cheap
2. He's already familiar with the city
3. He provides depth on wings, which the team doesn't have.
4. He provides skill, which the team also lacks.

He doesn't have to be relied upon to carry the team. He just needs to act as a complimentary winger. Provide some secondary or tertiary scoring. TBH, I'd take Andrei over Amstrong all day long.
And bar owners in Montreal would be more than happy.

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01-14-2013, 06:07 PM
  #918
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My French sucks, what's he say?
Whats tells us that Galchenyuk wasn't dominant at the WJC is that it was Grigorenko who was on the 1st PP unit.

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01-14-2013, 06:08 PM
  #919
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Some guys just can't get over this guy, like we lost a superstar or something...He's never been THAT good, ever, and he's had many chances under many coaches. He is what he is, nothing more nothing less.
Actually, every post I see in this topic is saying we lost a depth scorer on the wing, a position we are weak at..not exactly the same thing as a superstar.

You can replace Kostitsyn with Jagr, Semin and Whitney, all who would have been nice on the contracts they got, but AK would have probably been the easiest to sign of them.

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01-14-2013, 06:38 PM
  #920
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Does anybody else find it weird that Eller looks 5 years older compared to last year? So much bigger and even his voice has changed.

Suspicious...

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01-14-2013, 06:39 PM
  #921
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Does anybody else find it weird that Eller looks 5 years older compared to last year? So much bigger and even his voice has changed.

Suspicious...
Don't go there, it's been done


Against HF rules etc, etc.

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01-14-2013, 06:44 PM
  #922
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Don't go there, it's been done


Against HF rules etc, etc.
Talking about a player hitting puberty is against HF rules?

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01-14-2013, 07:21 PM
  #923
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Some guys just can't get over this guy, like we lost a superstar or something...He's never been THAT good, ever, and he's had many chances under many coaches. He is what he is, nothing more nothing less.
So many tears shed for a inconsistent 3rd liner.

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01-14-2013, 07:24 PM
  #924
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Talking about a player hitting puberty is against HF rules?



In other news:

http://video.canadiens.nhl.com/video...ed-share-video


Lars is quoted as saying "I got a fresh body"


inb4 Myron Gaines

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Old
01-14-2013, 07:28 PM
  #925
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His body is ready.

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