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Old
01-15-2013, 03:25 AM
  #26
Halpysback
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Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer View Post
Are you ******** me?

Let's all have a reminder of the fact that JVR was traded for Luke Schenn. Justin Braun > Luke Schenn.
Not to Flyers.

Ilya Kovalchuk > Jordan Staal, yet Staal got a far better return.

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Old
01-15-2013, 03:26 AM
  #27
Exit Dose
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Originally Posted by BigBenSF View Post
You are overvaluing JVR way way way too much.
And severely undervaluing Hertl and Braun.

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Old
01-15-2013, 03:32 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Halpysback View Post
Not to Flyers.

Ilya Kovalchuk > Jordan Staal, yet Staal got a far better return.
Very different circumstances, but I'm not even sure of what you're trying to prove here. If anything that would make Braun worth more, as he's on a great contract and Schenn's on a horrid one.

I know, one's an overage 7th round draft pick and one was picked 5th overall, but that has quite little to do with their current respective values.

Braun is the better player by every measure minus physicality. He's a great skater, he's got strong offensive instincts, and he did rather well playing quite a bit in the defensive zone. He forced his way up the Sharks' depth chart and earned the #4 spot on one of the best bluelines in the league. Whereas Luke Schenn struggled to crack one of the worst bluelines in the league.

But yeah, draft pedigree, woo.

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Old
01-15-2013, 03:39 AM
  #29
Halpysback
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Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer View Post
Very different circumstances, but I'm not even sure of what you're trying to prove here. If anything that would make Braun worth more, as he's on a great contract and Schenn's on a horrid one.

I know, one's an overage 7th round draft pick and one was picked 5th overall, but that has quite little to do with their current respective values.

Braun is the better player by every measure minus physicality. He's a great skater, he's got strong offensive instincts, and he did rather well playing quite a bit in the defensive zone. He forced his way up the Sharks' depth chart and earned the #4 spot on one of the best bluelines in the league. Whereas Luke Schenn struggled to crack one of the worst bluelines in the league.

But yeah, draft pedigree, woo.
The idea is that Schenn got his development messed up by Wilson and can be straightened out to become a dominant defensive defenseman he showed flashes of after his rookie season.

Likewise, the idea is that JVR can overcome his injury issues and become a dominant forward he showed flashes of in the 2011 playoffs.

But yeah, what have you done for me lately, woohoo. I guess Lupul for Pavelski would be a ripoff for the Sharks too.

Braun is a dime a dozen player in the vein of Fayne, Sauer, Martinez, etc. Good, but still very common quantity. Schenn is dime a dozen at the moment as well, but his entire worth is based on him living up to his potential and somehow being super awesome with his brother. His current play had nothing to do with the trade other than pegging his value near a similarly underachieving JVR's ballpark.

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Old
01-15-2013, 07:15 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Halpysback View Post
I guess Lupul for Pavelski would be a ripoff for the Sharks too.
Yes. Until Lupul proves he's not Marek Svatos or one of many other one hit wonders Pavelski's consistent all-around game wins out.

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Old
01-15-2013, 07:35 AM
  #31
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We're still butt hurt from Toskala. Leafs say no.

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Old
01-15-2013, 08:02 AM
  #32
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Toronto should be highly interested in Niemi, but not if the cost is JvR. The fact that SJ doesn't have another goalie should tell you that a deal involving Niemi isn't going to happen.

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Old
01-15-2013, 09:06 AM
  #33
Lebda Snipes
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Originally Posted by BigBenSF View Post
You are overvaluing JVR way way way too much.

Agreed. But i wouldnt go JVR for him straight up. I would think along the lines of Kulemin+ for Niemi. Depending on what SJ's needs are, which i dont really know.

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Old
01-15-2013, 09:15 AM
  #34
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There's no need to trade Niemi this year. If the Sharks get good value for him in a deal, I'd part with him. Greiss and Stalock are good to go. They just need a real opportunity and not a start once or twice a month to show their worth.

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Old
01-15-2013, 09:35 AM
  #35
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No thanks.

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Old
01-15-2013, 09:39 AM
  #36
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No interest in Niemi. Especially at the cost of JVR.

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Old
01-15-2013, 10:08 AM
  #37
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Yeah, because the last goalie we got from the Sharks worked out really well...

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Old
01-15-2013, 10:14 AM
  #38
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Maybe for Mac and a goalie prospect. Owuya?

Mac + Owuya + 3rd 2013

for Niemi

Flame on

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Old
01-15-2013, 10:20 AM
  #39
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Its not a horrible idea. I just dont see Niemi (in the long run) being much of an upgrade over Reimer. I think people have written this guy off way to soon.

Secondly does it really make sense for San Jose? WHat do they do in goal?

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Old
01-15-2013, 10:57 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halpysback View Post
But yeah, what have you done for me lately, woohoo. I guess Lupul for Pavelski would be a ripoff for the Sharks too.
Um. Yes. Yes it would.

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Old
01-15-2013, 11:00 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniversalRemonster View Post
I'm not really into trading Niemi, but Doug Wilson supposedly offered Niemi for JVR straight up

To San Jose: JVR

To Toronto: Niemi

Before the idiots come in and say Niemi sucks...

I hate to be "that" guy, but three videos doesn't prove he's a good goalie. You could certainly do worse, but I wouldn't rank him even close to the top goalies.

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Old
01-15-2013, 11:04 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Benny FTW View Post
Pretty bad for the leafs.
Yup! And they are in need of top 6 forwards..Nonis won't be on the hot seat this year at all and will wait for what he wants or free agency

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Old
01-15-2013, 11:23 AM
  #43
Pheasant the peasant
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The Leafs need JVR more than they need Niemi. And San Jose needs Niemi more than they need Van Riemsdyk.

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Old
01-15-2013, 12:48 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Halpysback View Post
But yeah, what have you done for me lately, woohoo. I guess Lupul for Pavelski would be a ripoff for the Sharks too.
Ignoring contract status if I was the Sharks I would not make this trade. Pavelski is a great two way forward with multiple good playoff years. Lupul needs to show some consistency first in both statistics and health.

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Old
01-15-2013, 12:52 PM
  #45
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Love how all fans say Schenn isn't worth JVR and Toronto needs to add and now we get him and he's usless.. Jvr won't be moved for a stop gap goalie.

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Old
01-15-2013, 12:54 PM
  #46
Halpysback
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Originally Posted by SnarkAttack View Post
Yes. Until Lupul proves he's not Marek Svatos or one of many other one hit wonders Pavelski's consistent all-around game wins out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Um. Yes. Yes it would.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brokencow View Post
Ignoring contract status if I was the Sharks I would not make this trade. Pavelski is a great two way forward with multiple good playoff years. Lupul needs to show some consistency first in both statistics and health.
I was obviously being facetious. Lupul for Pavelski is a horrible trade for the Sharks. Lupul is a far inferior player. Yet because he had a good season better than his average and Pavelski had an underwhelming season worse than his average people you could have them in the same conversation and people wouldn't automatically be taken aback. It's the same mentality that leads to people to dump falling Apple stock to buy rising Nokia stock. Very persistent in our species.

The point was that looking at Braun and Schenn through the prism of last season and determining their respective value is about as accurate as doing the same to Pavelski and Lupul and gauging Lupul as comparable.

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Old
01-15-2013, 12:57 PM
  #47
DuckEatinShark
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Originally Posted by Pheasant the peasant View Post
The Leafs need JVR more than they need Niemi. And San Jose needs Niemi more than they need Van Riemsdyk.
Yup. Everyone reading this thread please read this before posting anything else.

IF we trade Nemo he would be packaged for a better goalie. We have a very, very deep goalie prospect pool and some of them just need a year or two to make the jump.

We don't want goalie prospects or even lesser starting goalies in return.

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Old
01-15-2013, 01:01 PM
  #48
IBLEAF
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniversalRemonster View Post
I'm not really into trading Niemi, but Doug Wilson supposedly offered Niemi for JVR straight up

To San Jose: JVR

To Toronto: Niemi

Before the idiots come in and say Niemi sucks...

**** no!!!!

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Old
01-15-2013, 01:03 PM
  #49
DougGilmour93
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If you want JVR...


JVR + B level prospect

for

Pavelski

We could always throw in Mac for Niemi, but I doubt Nonis goes after such a mediocre goalie.

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Old
01-15-2013, 01:05 PM
  #50
Sterling31
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Don't care if Niemi is a decent goalie. This is a terribad trade for the leafs.

I'd rather see Reimer and Scrivens struggle; then a chance that Niemi pulls a Vesa , while giving a competent top 6er.

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