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*ALL* Luongo Talk (News/Speculation/Rumors/Proposals)

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01-15-2013, 11:07 AM
  #176
blankall
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Originally Posted by Skead View Post
They haven't been asking questions the past 2 Years when Schneider and Luongo shared the crease. I honestly believe that Luongo and Schneider are both professionals that are able to prevent this from becoming a distraction. They'll even resort to "run of the mill" type of answers.

On that note; I believe the Canucks want to get a deal done because it could provide a good return to improve the team in other areas but I don't see them getting rid of him for the sake of getting rid of him or any "clock".
There were no questions asked, because it was clear that Luongo was the starter and Schneider was the backup. Schneider was being paid on an ELC. Schneider, after all, has only ever played 68 regular season games in the NHL.

Now we have a shortened season, where, in general, backups will be playing less games, and it is less of an advantage to have a goalie tandem.

Meanwhile, the Canucks injuries are pilling up. Hamhuis, Booth, Kassian, and Kesler are all injured. Yes, the Canucks can keep both goalies this season. However, it is poor asset management to have one of them on the bench. Having Luongo get only a dozen starts won't exactly help his trade value either. Especially if even a few of those games are bad starts.

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Old
01-15-2013, 11:10 AM
  #177
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Originally Posted by CellarDweller0 View Post
Do you honestly believe that the situation is the same as it was 2 years ago?

It's fine if you don't think it will be a distraction. You are entitled to that for sure. I just don't think it's realistic tbh and to be clear I am not saying this to drive Lu's value down in this thread because I don't really care where he goes if anywhere at all.
I don't believe they're the same, but I believe the way they handled it then can give good insight to how they will handle it in the future. Schneider essentially took Luongo's job in the Chicago series, Luongo owned up and stated the better goalie was playing.

Luongo came back in net and Schneider was graceful in his backup role interviews.
Schneider would have made a much bigger fuss come his contract signing, but he didn't.

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01-15-2013, 11:11 AM
  #178
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The clock that you are oblivious of. If Luongo is not traded, and I don't even care where to, this WILL be a distraction. The media will be relentless asking the questions every day until a deal is done. They will ask Gillis, they will as Bobby Lu and they will ask good ol'Cory. Every. Day.

If you do not think that is a distraction, then you live in a bubble.
You do realize that there has been a goaltending controversy in Vancouver for 2 years already. It's what happens when you have two capable net minders. The past two seasons have been full of questions about what to do with two potential number one goalies. Now we know. Luongo is going to be traded at some point in the near (preseason) or distant (trade deadline or offseason) future. The only question right now is timing and return. The situation is actually more black and white than it was for two years...and how was the Canucks goaltending during those two seasons?

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01-15-2013, 11:11 AM
  #179
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I say Leafs walk away from the discussion. Let them either keep him or trade him somewhere else. I find it hard to believe a franchise picking up that contract with what is being asked for compensation is crazy.

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01-15-2013, 11:12 AM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
*sighs*

He said he does not see himself in Vancouver for long. That is not him saying "trade me now!" We are not trading Luongo unless something of quality is coming back. Why is this concept so difficult for people to grasp?
Its not. I don't think the concept that trading this something of quality doesn't make sense from a Leafs perspective (at least according to what we've decided quality means in terms of Canuck needs) is difficult either.

The discussion seems to have become back and forth banter of Luongo's perceived value again, and not actually what Gillis will move him for.

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01-15-2013, 11:15 AM
  #181
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There were no questions asked, because it was clear that Luongo was the starter and Schneider was the backup. Schneider was being paid on an ELC. Schneider, after all, has only ever played 68 regular season games in the NHL.
Roberto has gone from 68 Games played, to 60, to 55 in the past 3 years. I haven't heard him complain about Schneider one bit even though his workload has been reduced drastically.

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Now we have a shortened season, where, in general, backups will be playing less games, and it is less of an advantage to have a goalie tandem.
Disagree, a shortened season means less room for errors. Schneider hits a cold streak? We have arguably the best backup goaltender to potentially bail us out.

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Originally Posted by blankall View Post
Meanwhile, the Canucks injuries are pilling up. Hamhuis, Booth, Kassian, and Kesler are all injured. Yes, the Canucks can keep both goalies this season. However, it is poor asset management to have one of them on the bench. Having Luongo get only a dozen starts won't exactly help his trade value either. Especially if even a few of those games are bad starts.
Hamhuis, Kassian are both cleared for play and practice.
Booth has a groin strain, had MRI yesterday do not timeline.
Kesler is a big mystery, his agent says "months" (mind you during the lockout)
but Gillis says that he isn't very far off and the 2nd line slot won't be open for long.

No idea what that means but our injury situation isn't as gloomy as you make it seem.

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01-15-2013, 11:15 AM
  #182
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Luongo needs to stop doing interviews. He's not making Gillis' life any easier with them.
Umm.... What has he said that has hindered Gillis' position?

If anything the way Luongo has handled this has helped as it shows how good of a team guy he is, and how calm he is at handling the media now.

I find it funny that people seem to take whatever the Leafs say (Burke/Nonis) as gospel but nitpick and look for hidden meanings in what Luongo and Gillis say. You can't have it both ways...

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01-15-2013, 11:17 AM
  #183
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It depends how many teams are interested. If only one team has any interest in the summer then his value likely plummets, but if there are multiple teams in the fold then the impact will be minimal.

If Gillis has an offer on the table from Florida, say Shore + 2014 1st for example, is Nonis going to stay out of the bidding if he can make a better deal that makes sense for the Leafs? If he chooses to do so he'll be passing up an opportunity to improve his team for no other reason than not wanting to bid against Florida. This is irresponsible in his duties as a GM.
I would think that bidding against Florida stops when Nonis reaches what he no longer considers a reasonable price.

Just like any GM would. Its all about need vs cost.

Unless Nonis has a fear of confrontations?

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01-15-2013, 11:17 AM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Spasmatic Dan View Post
Its not. I don't think the concept that trading this something of quality doesn't make sense from a Leafs perspective (at least according to what we've decided quality means in terms of Canuck needs) is difficult either.

The discussion seems to have become back and forth banter of Luongo's perceived value again, and not actually what Gillis will move him for.
But it really doesn't make sense. (of course, as you say, depends on what you mean by quality) Luongo makes the Leafs a fringe playoff team. That doesn't put forth a reason to move Gardiner/Reilly/1st.

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01-15-2013, 11:21 AM
  #185
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It depends how many teams are interested. If only one team has any interest in the summer then his value likely plummets, but if there are multiple teams in the fold then the impact will be minimal.

If Gillis has an offer on the table from Florida, say Shore + 2014 1st for example, is Nonis going to stay out of the bidding if he can make a better deal that makes sense for the Leafs? If he chooses to do so he'll be passing up an opportunity to improve his team for no other reason than not wanting to bid against Florida. This is irresponsible in his duties as a GM.
So by your logic, luongo could fetch this package ? i'm no panthers' fan but you are not getting either of them. And you still want Nonis to up that package ? Get real people

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01-15-2013, 11:22 AM
  #186
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
But it really doesn't make sense. (of course, as you say, depends on what you mean by quality) Luongo makes the Leafs a fringe playoff team. That doesn't put forth a reason to move Gardiner/Reilly/1st.
If I were a leafs fan, I'd be more than happy to offer up a first. I am 100% confident Luongo will get you guys to the playoffs. It's what beyond that is the problem. So we're looking at what? 15th +/- overall pick?

But would agree, Rielly would be too hard to cough up and Gardiner would likely stay off as well.

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01-15-2013, 11:25 AM
  #187
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If I were a leafs fan, I'd be more than happy to offer up a first. I am 100% confident Luongo will get you guys to the playoffs. It's what beyond that is the problem. So we're looking at what? 15th +/- overall pick?

But would agree, Rielly would be too hard to cough up and Gardiner would likely stay off as well.
I'd be ok if the Leafs sent a conditional 1st round pick Vancouver's way. If fans are so confident Luongo gets the job done in Toronto then they should be ok with such a scenario. 2013 1st contingent on the Leafs making the playoffs. If they don't it becomes a 2014 1st without a condition

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01-15-2013, 11:28 AM
  #188
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
But it really doesn't make sense. (of course, as you say, depends on what you mean by quality) Luongo makes the Leafs a fringe playoff team. That doesn't put forth a reason to move Gardiner/Reilly/1st.
Nothing about a Leafs/Canucks trade makes sense to me. The Canucks are a contender, so they want either something to put them over the top or prospects to increase their chances of staying at the top for a longer window. The Leafs are a rebuilding team. If they go for it with Luongo, it wouldn't make sense to subtract from the lineup, and the prospect cupboard is too barren to trade away.

These two teams are getting talked about so much because obviously the Leafs goaltending has been horrid, Burke/Nonis are ex Vancouver GMs, and any/all big name players are speculated as going to Toronto when available. The media feeds this.

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01-15-2013, 11:30 AM
  #189
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
I'd be ok if the Leafs sent a conditional 1st round pick Vancouver's way. If fans are so confident Luongo gets the job done in Toronto then they should be ok with such a scenario. 2013 1st contingent on the Leafs making the playoffs. If they don't it becomes a 2014 1st without a condition
For the love of god stop fooling ourselves here, we have a ****** roster. With luongo or not, we are not making the playoffs. By the way, what's the point of making the playoffs, if we have 0 odds we wiin anything. We are not a player away from anything of value. this franchise should implement an internal code, it should be forbidden to trade our 1st round pick

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01-15-2013, 11:31 AM
  #190
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
I'd be ok if the Leafs sent a conditional 1st round pick Vancouver's way. If fans are so confident Luongo gets the job done in Toronto then they should be ok with such a scenario. 2013 1st contingent on the Leafs making the playoffs. If they don't it becomes a 2014 1st without a condition
Make it 2014 period for all I care, if we're getting a good return. That last part has been the point of contention for both sides.

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01-15-2013, 11:32 AM
  #191
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
I'd be ok if the Leafs sent a conditional 1st round pick Vancouver's way. If fans are so confident Luongo gets the job done in Toronto then they should be ok with such a scenario. 2013 1st contingent on the Leafs making the playoffs. If they don't it becomes a 2014 1st without a condition
Here's why I don't like a conditional first. If luongo plays lights out, but your defensive core gets decimated by injuries, or your forward line can't score and you finish lower than what Luongo would typically would have gotten you, then that's not a lack of production from what the Canucks supplied.

I would say 1st (unconditional) + Bozak or Franson or whatever Roster player that is reasonable.

That really isn't shabby imo for a goalie of Luongos caliber.

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01-15-2013, 11:34 AM
  #192
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I would think that bidding against Florida stops when Nonis reaches what he no longer considers a reasonable price.

Just like any GM would. Its all about need vs cost.

Unless Nonis has a fear of confrontations?
Totally agree. What I'm trying to outline is that this was the case both before and after Luongo made his comments, and therefore the affect they have on his trade value is only significant if multiple teams aren't interested.

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01-15-2013, 11:36 AM
  #193
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For the love of god stop fooling ourselves here, we have a ****** roster. With luongo or not, we are not making the playoffs. By the way, what's the point of making the playoffs, if we have 0 odds we wiin anything. We are not a player away from anything of value. this franchise should implement an internal code, it should be forbidden to trade our 1st round pick
Meh. Teams should be built from the net out. If we can acquire Luongo for "fair value" we should do it. Holding on to Kadri doesn't make use better than acquiring Luongo would, for example, in the short AND long term. I don't think 33/34 is too old for a goalie of Luongo's caliber either. He should still have 3-4 GOOD years ahead of him. After that it's too difficult to tell. Contract, Schmontraft anyway. Leafs should be able to flex their financial muscle and bury that contract as soon as it becomes a hindrance but, for goodness sake, stop asking about Jake Gardiner or Morgan Rielly Nucks fans. Not in your wildest dreams

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01-15-2013, 11:37 AM
  #194
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Here's why I don't like a conditional first. If luongo plays lights out, but your defensive core gets decimated by injuries, or your forward line can't score and you finish lower than what Luongo would typically would have gotten you, then that's not a lack of production from what the Canucks supplied.

I would say 1st (unconditional) + Bozak or Franson or whatever Roster player that is reasonable.

That really isn't shabby imo for a goalie of Luongos caliber.
And for that reason I don't want my Maple Leafs to offer any 1st round pick without conditions. What if Luongo is the one who gets injured. In a 48 game season any game missed is amplified. If the boat sinks with Luongo we'll have ****ed ourselves out of another asset we'll desperately need. No thanks on trading any first without conditions.

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01-15-2013, 11:38 AM
  #195
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Here's why I don't like a conditional first. If luongo plays lights out, but your defensive core gets decimated by injuries, or your forward line can't score and you finish lower than what Luongo would typically would have gotten you, then that's not a lack of production from what the Canucks supplied.

I would say 1st (unconditional) + Bozak or Franson or whatever Roster player that is reasonable.

That really isn't shabby imo for a goalie of Luongos caliber.
A first and Bozak/Franson? Why would we do that? Neither of those roster players - if you can even call Franson that - have any value or interest to us, and a first alone does not warrant Luongo.

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01-15-2013, 11:39 AM
  #196
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Not sure how Luongo saying he doesn't see himself in Vancouver long term hurts his trade value? Is this some kind of new revelation? I thought it was already common knowledge that Schneider is taking the reigns. Luongo has made it clear that he would like the opportunity to be a number one again, so nothing has changed.

He is either going to Florida or a team not named the Maple Leafs prior to the season or he will likely play out the year in Vancouver, unless a team comes in with a significant trade deadline deal. Next summer the market for all free agents should be large. After teams use amnesty buyouts, there will be more teams viable as an option. This isn't going to increase Luongo's worth, as he will be a year older, but it will just mean more viable trading partners. A rebuilding bottom rung team with a mediocre prospect pool is not a good trading partner for the Canucks or a good destination for Luongo. And for those that keep saying the Canucks might have to buy him out, get a clue. In a worse case scenario, where teams only offer us negative value or Luongo blocked any trade, the Canucks could still put him on waivers. It won't ever come to that, but he would never clear waivers.
The difference is that he is being vocal about it by repeating it. Media jumps all over that. Expect things to ramp up.

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01-15-2013, 11:39 AM
  #197
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And for that reason I don't want my Maple Leafs to offer an 1st round pick without conditions. The boat sinks with Luongo and we just ****ed ourselves out of another asset we'll desperately need. No thanks on trading any first without conditions.
So basically you won't trade unless there is a safety net. I doubt you'll have many teams interested in that scenario.

If it is a conditional first that reduces the potential value by a substantial amount thus increasing what else TOR will have to pay. Cond. 1st + Kadri + Bozak/Franson, etc

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01-15-2013, 11:41 AM
  #198
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So by your logic, luongo could fetch this package ? i'm no panthers' fan but you are not getting either of them. And you still want Nonis to up that package ? Get real people
That was just an example, hence the use of the term "for example". Unlike many posters in these threads (yourself included) I don't pretend to know what Luongo is worth on the trade market. I prefer to discuss factors that affect his value, what pieces make sense for Vancouver to target, and toss in the occasional facetious comment.

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01-15-2013, 11:41 AM
  #199
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If I were a leafs fan, I'd be more than happy to offer up a first. I am 100% confident Luongo will get you guys to the playoffs. It's what beyond that is the problem. So we're looking at what? 15th +/- overall pick?

But would agree, Rielly would be too hard to cough up and Gardiner would likely stay off as well.
That is because you don't watch every Leafs game. Was goaltending a problem? Yup. Was it the only problem...nope.

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01-15-2013, 11:43 AM
  #200
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So basically you won't trade unless there is a safety net. I doubt you'll have many teams interested in that scenario.

If it is a conditional first that reduces the potential value by a substantial amount thus increasing what else TOR will have to pay. Cond. 1st + Kadri + Bozak/Franson, etc
So basically, you want Toronto to bid on Luongo as though he was a lock to bring the Leafs to the playoffs, but you aren't willing to take that bet yourself.

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