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*ALL* Luongo Talk (News/Speculation/Rumors/Proposals)

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01-15-2013, 12:03 PM
  #226
blankall
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Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
If the Leafs are hesitant to deal a 1st for Luongo then why the hell would they do it for a very unproven Bernier?

I pray to god that Nonis protects the hell out of it.
Bernier is not all that unproven. Bernier is also a future. Worst case scenario in the Bernier trade, the Leafs lose a 1st rounder. Worst case scenario in the Luongo trade, the Leafs lose a first rounder, then end up straddled with Luongo's contract.

In other words, a Bernier for a 1st deal, asks the Leafs to swap one future for another of equivalent value. Luongo for a 1st, asks the Leafs to give up a future for an aging player on a long term deal.

As the Leafs are not in win now mode, which is more appealing?

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01-15-2013, 12:04 PM
  #227
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Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
Lombadri's price for Beriner is supposedly higher than Lu's. If the Leafs want to take that gamble, by all means.
Is there a link to the supposed asking price for Bernier? (not being smartass, just actually curious?)

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01-15-2013, 12:06 PM
  #228
GordieHoweHatTrick
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Originally Posted by blankall View Post
Bernier is not all that unproven. Bernier is also a future. Worst case scenario in the Bernier trade, the Leafs lose a 1st rounder. Worst case scenario in the Luongo trade, the Leafs lose a first rounder, then end up straddled with Luongo's contract.

In other words, a Bernier for a 1st deal, asks the Leafs to swap one future for another of equivalent value. Luongo for a 1st, asks the Leafs to give up a future for an aging player on a long term deal.

As the Leafs are not in win now mode, which is more appealing?
Bernier is absolutely unproven. Look at James Reimer. He's put up better numbers than Bernier and still **** the bed in his 2nd season. They're both unproven and I'd be hesistant to give up anything of real value for Bernier for that reason alone. Rather stick with Reimer who put up 2.60GAA .920 save %

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01-15-2013, 12:07 PM
  #229
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The price for Bernier will be similar to what Varlamov got. The upside is that it does not come with Luongo's 10 year contract.
The downside is that he is less proven than Varlamov, Halak, Rask or Schneider. This could be a lateral move for the team. Is he substantially better than the 2 prospect goalies you have now. Toronto is a pretty unrelenting market for a developing goaltender. His numbers with the Kings aren't much better than either of Toronto's 2 goalies, and he was playing behind a better defensive team and getting back up opponents. .913 & .908 isn't that great. Bernier gets far too much hype on this board.

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01-15-2013, 12:08 PM
  #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall View Post
Bernier is not all that unproven. Bernier is also a future. Worst case scenario in the Bernier trade, the Leafs lose a 1st rounder. Worst case scenario in the Luongo trade, the Leafs lose a first rounder, then end up straddled with Luongo's contract.

In other words, a Bernier for a 1st deal, asks the Leafs to swap one future for another of equivalent value. Luongo for a 1st, asks the Leafs to give up a future for an aging player on a long term deal.

As the Leafs are not in win now mode, which is more appealing?
If I were the Leafs I'd just stick with Reimer. Bernier is a lateral move at best.

Luongo is much better than either and if Nonis does acquire Luongo (and deals his first) I would expect Nonis to adjust his roster accordingly to make a run to the playoffs.

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01-15-2013, 12:08 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by Nash View Post
The downside is that he is less proven than Varlamov, Halak, Rask or Schneider. This could be a lateral move for the team. Is he substantially better than the 2 prospect goalies you have now. Toronto is a pretty unrelenting market for a developing goaltender. His numbers with the Kings aren't much better than either of Toronto's 2 goalies, and he was playing behind a better defensive team and getting back up opponents. .913 & .908 isn't that great. Bernier gets far too much hype on this board.
They're not even better. Reimer has better numbers. Scrivens also has comparable numbers at the AHL level

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01-15-2013, 12:09 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by Nash View Post
The downside is that he is less proven than Varlamov, Halak, Rask or Schneider. This could be a lateral move for the team. Is he substantially better than the 2 prospect goalies you have now. Toronto is a pretty unrelenting market for a developing goaltender. His numbers with the Kings aren't much better than either of Toronto's 2 goalies, and he was playing behind a better defensive team and getting back up opponents. .913 & .908 isn't that great. Bernier gets far too much hype on this board.
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
Bernier is absolutely unproven. Look at James Reimer. He's put up better numbers than Bernier and still **** the bed in his 2nd season. They're both unproven and I'd be hesistant to give up anything of real value for Bernier for that reason alone. Rather stick with Reimer who put up 2.60GAA .920 save %
I can appreciate at least there is knowledge that flows through the Toronto fans.
Bernier could be a great option, but as you said doesn't have the games under his belt yet and could end up being a potential vs a realistic.

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01-15-2013, 12:10 PM
  #233
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Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
If I were the Leafs I'd just stick with Reimer. Bernier is a lateral move at best.

Luongo is much better than either and if Nonis does acquire Luongo (and deals his first) I would expect Nonis to adjust his roster accordingly to make a run to the playoffs.
I think this is were we are.

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01-15-2013, 12:12 PM
  #234
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Luongo+his contract is a Gomez about to happen. if you want usefull assets you want to get back in a potential deal, stop making proposals about leafs' players. Nothing of value (by your standards) would come back. bozak+gunnarson+blacker+3rd is a logic offer for both teams.
It will only become a Gomez situation if no one is interested in dealing for him, which at this point is a stretch. I also don't think you have any insight into what my standards are, since I very rarely make proposals. You've made more proposals in this one post than I have in the last three Lu threads.

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01-15-2013, 12:12 PM
  #235
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Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
If I were the Leafs I'd just stick with Reimer. Bernier is a lateral move at best.

Luongo is much better than either and if Nonis does acquire Luongo (and deals his first) I would expect Nonis to adjust his roster accordingly to make a run to the playoffs.
Agreed but I would make a veteran backup type a top priority to acquire if Luongo's price is too high. Bernier, while a good goalie in the making, isn't the right fit.

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01-15-2013, 12:13 PM
  #236
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Call me out of touch, but can anyone explain this?

David Alter ‏@DavidAlter590
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Carlyle pretty much confirms that Gardiner will not play Saturday
David Alter ‏@DavidAlter590
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Carlyle implied that if Gardiner skated, he could play, but I'm pretty sure he meant with the team, which he didn't do.
Gardiner is injured? And they will start him in the minors even if he wasn't? Maybe it's the morning, but I don't understand.

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01-15-2013, 12:14 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
They're not even better. Reimer has better numbers. Scrivens also has comparable numbers at the AHL level
Exactly why Bernier makes zero sense to me. At 5'11", he is also close to being considered an undersized goalie as well. If you trade for Bernier, you are just getting a shiny new toy with a higher draft position.

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01-15-2013, 12:14 PM
  #238
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Call me out of touch, but can anyone explain this?

David Alter ‏@DavidAlter590


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Gardiner is injured?
He's out with a concussion.

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01-15-2013, 12:14 PM
  #239
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Call me out of touch, but can anyone explain this?

David Alter ‏@DavidAlter590


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Gardiner is injured? And they will start him in the minors even if he wasn't? Maybe it's the morning, but I don't understand.
Concussion suffered while playing with the Marlies.

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01-15-2013, 12:14 PM
  #240
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Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
If I were the Leafs I'd just stick with Reimer. Bernier is a lateral move at best.

Luongo is much better than either and if Nonis does acquire Luongo (and deals his first) I would expect Nonis to adjust his roster accordingly to make a run to the playoffs.
No team will give you a 1st for luongo, why can't you understand this ? look at the supposedly interested teams, there is 0 contendres among them. No sane GM would deal a 1st for a 34 years old goalie, with happens to posses one of the worst contracts in the league ( to me he is a gomez about to happen)

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01-15-2013, 12:15 PM
  #241
GordieHoweHatTrick
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Originally Posted by Skead View Post
Call me out of touch, but can anyone explain this?

David Alter ‏@DavidAlter590


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Gardiner is injured? And they will start him in the minors even if he wasn't? Maybe it's the morning, but I don't understand.
Recovering from concussion or whiplash. I haven't been following it that long. He's almost ready but he's been almost ready for some time now. Doesn't sound like he's experiencing any major pains but they want to be sure he's 100%

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01-15-2013, 12:18 PM
  #242
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It will only become a Gomez situation if no one is interested in dealing for him, which at this point is a stretch. I also don't think you have any insight into what my standards are, since I very rarely make proposals. You've made more proposals in this one post than I have in the last three Lu threads.
Even with the new cap recapture rule in place? I could see many people being detracted from trading for Luongo.

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01-15-2013, 12:19 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
I think this is were we are.
Agreed, and to be honest I think Scrivens gets at least the first start or two. For no other reason then he has actually been playing games. I think Gillis is in no real hurry to trade lou, unless it becomes a distraction, however I do expect him to be moved at the draft.

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01-15-2013, 12:21 PM
  #244
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It will only become a Gomez situation if no one is interested in dealing for him, which at this point is a stretch. I also don't think you have any insight into what my standards are, since I very rarely make proposals. You've made more proposals in this one post than I have in the last three Lu threads.
Luongo only becomes a Gomez situation if his play falls off the map. If Gomez put up the same 59 points he did his first year in Montreal, he would simply be overpaid, but he would still be one of Montreal's top scorers. His decline in play the past three years is amazingly bad.

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01-15-2013, 12:21 PM
  #245
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Agreed, and to be honest I think Scrivens gets at least the first start or two. For no other reason then he has actually been playing games. I think Gillis is in no real hurry to trade lou, unless it becomes a distraction, however I do expect him to be moved at the draft.
Draft or trade deadline; it's a condensed season but less games is less games. Some teams that start strong typically (Toronto, Edmonton, etc) may see this as an opportunity to make a run in the playoffs.

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01-15-2013, 12:22 PM
  #246
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Originally Posted by Highlander23 View Post
No team will give you a 1st for luongo, why can't you understand this ? look at the supposedly interested teams, there is 0 contendres among them. No sane GM would deal a 1st for a 34 years old goalie, with happens to posses one of the worst contracts in the league ( to me he is a gomez about to happen)
We'll see. It's the easiest way to resolve the problem of no trade fit between teams.

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01-15-2013, 12:26 PM
  #247
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Originally Posted by Highlander23 View Post
No team will give you a 1st for luongo, why can't you understand this ? look at the supposedly interested teams, there is 0 contendres among them. No sane GM would deal a 1st for a 34 years old goalie, with happens to posses one of the worst contracts in the league ( to me he is a gomez about to happen)
Ok bud, no need to get worked up. You can't say no GM will give a 1st for him, just as we can't say every GM will have to give up a first for him.

Each situation is different; if they're about to make a major playoff push, a first could be worthless to a team that expects to go deep in the playoffs.

As another poster said; Gomez is overpaid by a large amount and under performs. Totally different situation, people agree that Luongo has great skill and a very friendly cap hit, just that his contract is long and risky.

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01-15-2013, 12:27 PM
  #248
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Agreed but I would make a veteran backup type a top priority to acquire.
I agree... Luongo isn't the right fit in Toronto... Toronto simply needs the best veteran goalie they can get, at a cheap price... Luongo is simply too good, and too expensive (in both salary and return price), for what Toronto needs... Toronto simply isn't in the market to compete on any big stage, and doing what is necessary to get top 5 talent like Luongo is overkill...

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01-15-2013, 12:28 PM
  #249
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I agree... Luongo isn't the right fit in Toronto... Toronto simply needs the best veteran goalie they can get, at a cheap price... Luongo is simply too good, and too expensive (in both salary and return price), for what Toronto needs... Toronto simply isn't in the market to compete on any big stage, and doing what is necessary to get top 5 talent like Luongo is overkill...
Welcome to the club consisting of 29 other teams that would like to find that...
And his salary is 6~ but his cap is 5.3, which is very resonable.

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01-15-2013, 12:29 PM
  #250
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Originally Posted by Highlander23 View Post
No team will give you a 1st for luongo, why can't you understand this ? look at the supposedly interested teams, there is 0 contendres among them. No sane GM would deal a 1st for a 34 years old goalie, with happens to posses one of the worst contracts in the league ( to me he is a gomez about to happen)
Sure, I'm not pressing for a Leafs 1st anyways.

I mean seriously a Luongo led Leafs at worst finish 20th. A player drafted 10th won't make an impact 3-4 seasons down the line for the Canucks.

Big deal. Much rather have NHL talent, preferably young.

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