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Thoughts on our grit up front.

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Old
01-15-2013, 08:18 PM
  #26
ObsessedCreative
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Originally Posted by MichiganWolverines View Post
Pick up Brandon Mashinter off of waivers.
Would love having that element on the 4th line!

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01-15-2013, 08:20 PM
  #27
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Orpik obviously brings the grit to our top 4 D and Letang has a nasty part to his game as well as being a physical presence. Martin Lovejoy and Nisky all are soft but don't forget Engelland is back there. Despres has a big body too when he gets playing time. I feel our O is where we hurt in size and grit
Hopefully for our sake and the sake of the team, he doesn't see one shift this year and is traded or waived.

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01-15-2013, 08:33 PM
  #28
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How about Anthony Peluso?

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01-16-2013, 01:03 AM
  #29
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Not happy about the grit on this team at all.

I like that they are a group that will work hard to get pucks but I don't think they're overly mean or even puck heavy. I actually think they're a middle of the road team in a lot of ways and kind of stale but we'll see if they have that championship chip on their shoulder.

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01-16-2013, 02:19 AM
  #30
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It would be more of a luxury, but I'd love to see this team have a guy like Kevin Stevens (pre-Pilon hit) or Rick Tocchet skating with Crosby. Unfortunately there aren't too many guys in the league that can play with a star and knock someone out when they need to.

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01-16-2013, 02:46 AM
  #31
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It would be more of a luxury, but I'd love to see this team have a guy like Kevin Stevens (pre-Pilon hit) or Rick Tocchet skating with Crosby. Unfortunately there aren't too many guys in the league that can play with a star and knock someone out when they need to.
Ryane Clowe

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01-16-2013, 06:21 AM
  #32
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Ryane Clowe
He would fix so many things just by himself.

Another thing worth bringing up is.... Will the Pens let Matt Cooke be Matt Cooke again? During the last half of last season I thought he was playing well and walking the line better than he has in the past.

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01-16-2013, 10:20 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
I guess I'm in the minority but I think there's a good amount of grit in our forward group (and at least one guy on each line that can really bury people) but our defense is a little soft/small for my liking.
This.

I don't understand how people in one thread can constantly worry about the lack of skill on the wings, then turn around and say the wings aren't gritty enough. Even then, it's not like Neal and Kunitz are cupcakes... they have a good amount of strength / sandpaper to their game for guys who have some skill. Just because they're not Jarome Iginla out there, beating the crap out of someone in a fight, doesn't mean they lack grit overall. Dupuis is fine also in this capacity, so the only real question is Tangradi / whoever steps onto line 2.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. Short of guys like Iginla and Steve Ott (and Ott's a stretch), there aren't a whole lot of players out there who are "skilled enough" to not look stupid on a scoring line, and who are also "gritty enough" for the typical Pittsburgh mindset (i.e. someone who can literally bang bodies and throw punches with good effect). I think our group up front is pretty damn good. More worried about what's going to happen on D (and hoping Elmer is part of the answer as he can be a big, mean SOB when he wants to), and maybe Bortuzzo. Still, that's swapping one problem (soff) for another (inexperience).

That's hockey in teh Cap era. You're going to have weaknesses / question marks.

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01-16-2013, 10:35 AM
  #34
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Overall, I don't think grit is a huge problem (although I'd prefer more I wouldn't want it at the expense of skill). Our bottom 6 lacks size so I would prefer dumping Adams for a big bodied grinder, but we can't have it all as Chancellor said.

On D, we are currently lacking in size/grit but the potential is there if Despres and Bortuzzo make the team.

This is also one of the reasons why I want to see Tangradi make the team. To me, it's not really about having a bunch of tough guys, but having guys with size that can control the puck and wear down opponents. Tangradi can provide that. Having more players in the mold of King from LA or Lucic or Clowe would help this team immensely. That said, I think Tangradi and another deadline pickup can put this team over the top.

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01-16-2013, 10:58 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
This.

I don't understand how people in one thread can constantly worry about the lack of skill on the wings, then turn around and say the wings aren't gritty enough. Even then, it's not like Neal and Kunitz are cupcakes... they have a good amount of strength / sandpaper to their game for guys who have some skill. Just because they're not Jarome Iginla out there, beating the crap out of someone in a fight, doesn't mean they lack grit overall. Dupuis is fine also in this capacity, so the only real question is Tangradi / whoever steps onto line 2.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. Short of guys like Iginla and Steve Ott (and Ott's a stretch), there aren't a whole lot of players out there who are "skilled enough" to not look stupid on a scoring line, and who are also "gritty enough" for the typical Pittsburgh mindset (i.e. someone who can literally bang bodies and throw punches with good effect). I think our group up front is pretty damn good. More worried about what's going to happen on D (and hoping Elmer is part of the answer as he can be a big, mean SOB when he wants to), and maybe Bortuzzo. Still, that's swapping one problem (soff) for another (inexperience).

That's hockey in teh Cap era. You're going to have weaknesses / question marks.
I don't think most of us are worried about our top 6 size/toughness. It's the bottom 6 that is questionable at best.

Suter: Not physical
Cooke: Neutered
Kennedy: Too small to make an impact
Vitale: Decent, but on the small side
Adams: Aside from the PK is absolutely worthless
Glass: The only one that fits the bottom 6 mold, but certainly not a feared hitter or fighter.
Jeffrey: Not physical at all.

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01-16-2013, 11:26 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
I don't think most of us are worried about our top 6 size/toughness. It's the bottom 6 that is questionable at best.

Suter: Not physical
Cooke: Neutered
Kennedy: Too small to make an impact
Vitale: Decent, but on the small side
Adams: Aside from the PK is absolutely worthless
Glass: The only one that fits the bottom 6 mold, but certainly not a feared hitter or fighter.
Jeffrey: Not physical at all.
Our fourth line:

6'1" Glass/ 6" Vitale / 6'4" Mashinter?

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01-16-2013, 12:33 PM
  #37
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Cooke will be back to his gritty self without the illegal hits / stupid elbows. He seemed to find that balance near the end of last season. I have no worries there. Also, what is up with the notion that you have to be huge/gritty to "fit the bottom 6 mold"? There are many ways to be effective in a bottom 6 role. I do think we could use more size and grit in the forward corps, but let's not go overboard here.

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01-16-2013, 12:51 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
I don't think most of us are worried about our top 6 size/toughness. It's the bottom 6 that is questionable at best.

Suter: Not physical
Cooke: Neutered
Kennedy: Too small to make an impact
Vitale: Decent, but on the small side
Adams: Aside from the PK is absolutely worthless
Glass: The only one that fits the bottom 6 mold, but certainly not a feared hitter or fighter.
Jeffrey: Not physical at all.
I actually think Suter has some grits to his gravy. He gets on loose pucks, will take the body and plays up tempo all the time. Kind of like Armstrong.

This is where Tangradi can get his spot on the team. The Pens need size and someone willing to use it. I'm hoping he can be a richard and make a statement this year. I often wonder what direction the Pens give a player like Tangradi??? I remember a few years ago he got in a fight in camp and someone on the Pens said that they don't want him fighting in camp because he might hurt his hand. As a Pens fan thats the last thing I want to hear. We're talking about Eric Tangradi here not Hakan Loob. Go burn your bra on the tennis courts with that garbage.

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01-16-2013, 01:08 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
I guess I'm in the minority but I think there's a good amount of grit in our forward group (and at least one guy on each line that can really bury people) but our defense is a little soft/small for my liking.
This is where I am.

The grit is built within the entire team and not one single player has to be the guy on grit.

"Dis team Grinds Grit, I very impress."


Sid, Geno, Kunitz, Neal, Dupuis, Kennedy, Cooke, Sutter, Glass, Adams, Vitale, Tangradi, every single name listed (no particular order)here has some sandpaper built within them. Grit is probable the last thing I'd be worried about. When their going on all twelve cylinders it's like a mini tornado.

Yes, we could always use more. Just like, we could always use more scoring wingers and more top defensive defenseman. We need everyone to play within the system and cover everyone when times are called for it, forwards and D-man alike.

I'd rather get that nasty D-man personally.

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Old
01-16-2013, 01:18 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
This.

I don't understand how people in one thread can constantly worry about the lack of skill on the wings, then turn around and say the wings aren't gritty enough. Even then, it's not like Neal and Kunitz are cupcakes... they have a good amount of strength / sandpaper to their game for guys who have some skill. Just because they're not Jarome Iginla out there, beating the crap out of someone in a fight, doesn't mean they lack grit overall. Dupuis is fine also in this capacity, so the only real question is Tangradi / whoever steps onto line 2.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. Short of guys like Iginla and Steve Ott (and Ott's a stretch), there aren't a whole lot of players out there who are "skilled enough" to not look stupid on a scoring line, and who are also "gritty enough" for the typical Pittsburgh mindset (i.e. someone who can literally bang bodies and throw punches with good effect). I think our group up front is pretty damn good. More worried about what's going to happen on D (and hoping Elmer is part of the answer as he can be a big, mean SOB when he wants to), and maybe Bortuzzo. Still, that's swapping one problem (soff) for another (inexperience).

That's hockey in teh Cap era. You're going to have weaknesses / question marks.
I think you're arguing against two different things though. For the most part, I think folks want to see more size/grit/toughness in the bottom six. So that really has no bearing on people also wanting to see more talent/skill in the top six.

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01-16-2013, 01:19 PM
  #41
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I actually think Suter has some grits to his gravy. He gets on loose pucks, will take the body and plays up tempo all the time. Kind of like Armstrong.

This is where Tangradi can get his spot on the team. The Pens need size and someone willing to use it. I'm hoping he can be a richard and make a statement this year. I often wonder what direction the Pens give a player like Tangradi??? I remember a few years ago he got in a fight in camp and someone on the Pens said that they don't want him fighting in camp because he might hurt his hand. As a Pens fan thats the last thing I want to hear. We're talking about Eric Tangradi here not Hakan Loob. Go burn your bra on the tennis courts with that garbage.
Yes because breaking your hand in a fight in training camp makes so much sense.

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01-16-2013, 09:47 PM
  #42
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Yes because breaking your hand in a fight in training camp makes so much sense.
As opposed to what? His blah play every year when called up. Make them notice you, stand out, ask Disco to get in against the Isles then butt end Nino in the temple, make a youtube vid of yourself pissing fire... do something but be a net front statue.

I like what Tangradi brings to the table but jeez at least show up hungry.

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01-16-2013, 10:07 PM
  #43
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Just talk to a Flyers fan if you feel bad - they think we are the dirtiest team with the most cheap shots and attempts to injury other players. I think we'll be fine

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01-16-2013, 11:10 PM
  #44
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As opposed to what? His blah play every year when called up. Make them notice you, stand out, ask Disco to get in against the Isles then butt end Nino in the temple, make a youtube vid of yourself pissing fire... do something but be a net front statue.

I like what Tangradi brings to the table but jeez at least show up hungry.
I'm not a Tangradi fan really. I think he could turn into a top 6 warm body, but that's about it. Not a bad player but nothing that couldn't be traded at a moment's notice. That being said fighting to get noticed is beneath him. That's for guys that play a checking role and guys that were drafted low/not at all. He's on the team's radar, there's no need for that.

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01-16-2013, 11:26 PM
  #45
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I'm not a Tangradi fan really. I think he could turn into a top 6 warm body, but that's about it. Not a bad player but nothing that couldn't be traded at a moment's notice. That being said fighting to get noticed is beneath him. That's for guys that play a checking role and guys that were drafted low/not at all. He's on the team's radar, there's no need for that.
As I type this, someone just selected Tangradi in my fantasy draft.


He fought last year to try to stick. There's no other reason he'd fight Gudbranson and Bickel.

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01-16-2013, 11:44 PM
  #46
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As I type this, someone just selected Tangradi in my fantasy draft.


He fought last year to try to stick. There's no other reason he'd fight Gudbranson and Bickel.
To be honest those are those only times I've really noticed him.

I'm not overly a Tangradi fan either but I think some people, maybe even the Pens, miscast him as a Malone or Ladd type. IMO he's more along the lines of Avery or Cooke, he needs to hit, fight, chirp and be hard to play against. I want to see him play with a huge chip on his shoulder and dare people to knock it off.

It goes beyond Tangradi and right to the team. The 08 and 09 finals teams were full of pee and vinegar. The Pens need that back. There's just something so stale about them now.

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01-16-2013, 11:52 PM
  #47
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Imagine a MEAN Tangradi...He'd be like Joe Vitale on steroids.

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01-16-2013, 11:57 PM
  #48
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Imagine a MEAN Tangradi...He'd be like Joe Vitale on steroids.
Yeah... if he could get 15G 15A and play cobra mean like David Backes I would be one happy camper.

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01-16-2013, 11:59 PM
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Yeah... if he could get 15G 15A and play cobra mean like David Backes I would be one happy camper.
Better comparison there. If he played like Backes/Iginla/Benn...he'd be amazing. Hit, have an edge, score some, and have a few fights.

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01-17-2013, 12:15 AM
  #50
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Better comparison there. If he played like Backes/Iginla/Benn...he'd be amazing. Hit, have an edge, score some, and have a few fights.
I'm a huge Backes fan. IMO he's right up there with Sid, Malkin, Dats and Quick as the hardest players to play against. Those other guys are really skilled but Backes is big, viper mean and 2 way smart. Players can learn something by watching him.

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