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01-16-2013, 08:32 PM
  #26
adam graves
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
He's not that replaceable. Who do you think will replace him exactly? He's playing as our #1 center. Bjugstad? Shore? They're a couple years away at a minimum.
No.

IF he chooses to leave, or demands astronomical money, he would be replaced by a free agent.

Again, this thread is about at what price.

Do you think RR he is worth 8yr 46 mil?

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01-16-2013, 08:37 PM
  #27
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How about trading him to Van. for Luongo??

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01-16-2013, 08:38 PM
  #28
Dr Beinfest
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adam graves View Post
No.

IF he chooses to leave, or demands astronomical money, he would be replaced by a free agent.

Again, this thread is about at what price.

Do you think RR he is worth 8yr 46 mil?
If he demands astronomical money and you want someone of equivalent to Stephen Weiss out of the FA market, that player is also going to demand astronomical money. That's the point of Free Agency. The only way you can replace a pending UFA for cheaper with talent equivalent is internally through prospects or via trade.

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01-16-2013, 08:54 PM
  #29
adam graves
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Originally Posted by Dr Beinfest View Post
If he demands astronomical money and you want someone of equivalent to Stephen Weiss out of the FA market, that player is also going to demand astronomical money. That's the point of Free Agency. The only way you can replace a pending UFA for cheaper with talent equivalent is internally through prospects or via trade.
The free market seeks its own level. If Weiss demands more than his value, then someone is out there of better value. If all demand astronomical money, than its no longer astronomical..its now fair market.

Itll be up to Weiss. That's the point some are missing. And after the way Ive seen him hit a 9 iron, my money is on him staying.

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01-16-2013, 09:28 PM
  #30
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I'm hoping we can keep Weiss. True, we have some pretty good center prospects but don't expect them to automatically adjust to NHL caliber of play. Having a guy like Weiss to help ease them in and take some of the pressure off is huge.

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01-16-2013, 09:44 PM
  #31
RainingRats
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Originally Posted by adam graves View Post
No.

IF he chooses to leave, or demands astronomical money, he would be replaced by a free agent.

Again, this thread is about at what price.

Do you think RR he is worth 8yr 46 mil?
No, that's too long. Zajac is little younger and a little better offensively.

5.75 a year for a few years, he will get as a free agent, imo. That's a little more than I'd like to pay but he's been a very cheap player all these years. We'd be silly to not re-sign him if we can. The length will be an issue. this is probably his last chance at a big contract.

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01-16-2013, 10:26 PM
  #32
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I'd really hate to see Weiss go. I've never seen a player who wanted to play here so badly, but I don't think I'd dislike him one bit if he went elsewhere. Even though he won't be as useful as time goes on and our young prospects develop, I don't think he's that replaceable with the free agent market right now. I could see him signing for less than he should earn to stay a Panther. This Zajac signing probably didn't help him want to stay here though.

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01-16-2013, 10:38 PM
  #33
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I think that's the same feeling with Garrison. I don't have any hard feelings towards him even if he left for money.

It's guys like Bouwmeester and Horton that I hate.

Well... I hated Horton while he was here, too.

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01-16-2013, 11:28 PM
  #34
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I think some of you are forgetting that Weiss wants to be here. He has stated repeatedly that he wants to end his career a Panther and be part of the rebuild. He's a completely selfless guy, and I can easily see him taking less money to stay.

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01-16-2013, 11:32 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoupyFIN View Post
If the Devils GM is that stupid, doesn't mean DT and Weiss have to be the same. Devils just probably tried to avoid a Parise v.2.0 with that signing.

Playing 1st line minutes on a team doesn't mean you're a 1st line center. Same can be said for Weiss. Under 4.5 million and he stays, great. Anything over that and I'll be hugely disappointed in DT.
All of this is true, but it doesnt matter if weiss is a 1st liner, 2nd liner, 3rd liner or whatever, if he reaches the open market, he is worth whatever someone will pay him. It doesnt mean Tallon screwed up, Weiss is greedy, or anything. But when someone reaches UFA, all bets are off, players are overpriced and hearts are broken.

We can rationalise it however we want, but if weiss can get more money at another club at the end of the year, he is probably going to go there.

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01-17-2013, 12:13 AM
  #36
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Not a big loss? Replaceable? Losing Weiss is a big loss, and is not easily replaceable. Oooh, we have Shore and Bjugstad as prospects...so what, they are prospects. One or both can come up and stink up the joint. Weiss has been a lifer here, through the bad times and one good time. He could have bolted just as easily as others, but decided to stay here and see this through. Is he an ideal first line C, no hes not, but to say its no big deal is a bit idiotic if you ask me. He doesnt fill up the score sheet as other top centers do, which Im sure some strictly look at, but what he does for this team on and off the ice makes him somewhat irreplaceable. That was CLEAR every time Weiss was on the ice, versus when he was off. Weiss doesnt deserve Zajac money, but anything around $5 million per shouldnt even be questioned.

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01-17-2013, 03:46 AM
  #37
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saying weiss isn't a big loss is laughable. he's our best forward...anytime you (potentially) lose your best forward, it's a big loss.

he's not a true #1 center, but hes OUR #1 center until proven otherwise. and if he leaves...MARCEL FRIGGEN GOC becomes our #1 center.

if you don't think Weiss is a true #1 center, well, i don't even know what to tell you about Goc playing that role

Bjugstad and Shore are good prospects, but they're prospects. If you're counting on them to be a #1 C right off the bad you're setting them up to fail, which is something Tallon/Santos stressed over and over that they WILL NOT DO

so if weiss for whatever reason leaves, he BETTER be replaced or i'll be absolutely furious. this is no where near the same situation as Garrison. Weiss is a far more valuable player than Garrison is, and we were far more equipped to replace him than we are Weiss, both now and in the future.

that being said, i think weiss will stay. not for that much, but if he gets $5m x 5 yrs, i think he'll stay.

what a terrible contract by jersey though, jesus...and it's even worse when you consider the salary cap is actually going to be lower next year and beyond (teams are allowed to spend to $70m right now)

Lou

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01-17-2013, 04:14 AM
  #38
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Agreed.

It's amazing how quickly money will make people change their tune. The Leafs signed Mikael *** Grabovski for over $5 Million a year. You're not going to give Weiss that kind of money after he's shown so much loyalty and has actually been serviceable his ENTIRE CAREER. How many Panthers can actually say that?

Weiss is the kind of guy that, because he plays in Florida, no one cares. But as soon as he signs with Toronto/Montreal/Detroit/Pittsburgh he automatically becomes one of the best 2nd line centers in the league. I understand he is just a second line center, but keeping Weiss means keeping stability. All the successful franchises in sports PREACH stability. Weiss has been loyal to us, and there is no reason to NOT repay him with a big fat contract.

Eventually Weiss will drop back to the 2nd line center role when Bjugstad develops. But until then we have no clear player to fill that role. The difference in our team with Weiss in the lineup and out of the lineup is huge. We play better has a unit with him on the ice.

I think Weiss is irreplaceable. He scores, plays great defense, has a good shot, passes well, can beat defenders, throws the occasional hit, plays PP and PK.

I really can't believe some of you. If we trade or let Stephen go to free agency, it will be a sad, sad day in Pantherland for many. I hope one day to see that #9 raised to the rafters. He truly is a Panther.

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01-17-2013, 04:46 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by JonathanHuberdoh View Post
Agreed.

It's amazing how quickly money will make people change their tune. The Leafs signed Mikael *** Grabovski for over $5 Million a year. You're not going to give Weiss that kind of money after he's shown so much loyalty and has actually been serviceable his ENTIRE CAREER. How many Panthers can actually say that?

Weiss is the kind of guy that, because he plays in Florida, no one cares. But as soon as he signs with Toronto/Montreal/Detroit/Pittsburgh he automatically becomes one of the best 2nd line centers in the league. I understand he is just a second line center, but keeping Weiss means keeping stability. All the successful franchises in sports PREACH stability. Weiss has been loyal to us, and there is no reason to NOT repay him with a big fat contract.

Eventually Weiss will drop back to the 2nd line center role when Bjugstad develops. But until then we have no clear player to fill that role. The difference in our team with Weiss in the lineup and out of the lineup is huge. We play better has a unit with him on the ice.

I think Weiss is irreplaceable. He scores, plays great defense, has a good shot, passes well, can beat defenders, throws the occasional hit, plays PP and PK.

I really can't believe some of you. If we trade or let Stephen go to free agency, it will be a sad, sad day in Pantherland for many. I hope one day to see that #9 raised to the rafters. He truly is a Panther.
Well said.

We absolutely need to keep him, but my point is that if he actually gets to FA i just dont like our chances of retaining him.

Tallon has got to try and lock him up before FA if possible

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01-17-2013, 09:07 AM
  #40
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Now will everyone realize that Weiss will easily get 5+ M? And Tallon will pay it, because Weiss is worth it. I can't see Weiss leaving unless he really wants to part with the team. It won't be about the money.

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01-17-2013, 09:09 AM
  #41
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Question becomes whether or not he dips his toes into free agency. If he does, is it out of the question that somoene offers him 6+?

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01-17-2013, 09:09 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PanthersHockey1 View Post
When it comes to Stephen Weiss and this summer 2 names come to mind...Drew Shore and Nick Bjugstad.

Nonetheless, what concerns me about the prospects for long term success and bringing a stanley cup to our organization in the near future is a commitment from players to stay and our ability to resign them. I don't want Bouwmeester, weiss, or kulikov to set a bad precedent when it comes time to resign huberdeau, gudbranson, or bjugstad lets say.

This has always been a concern of mine as a fan of a non-traditional market team.
Neither of them are going to be as good as Weiss in 2013-14.

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01-17-2013, 09:10 AM
  #43
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Question becomes whether or not he dips his toes into free agency. If he does, is it out of the question that somoene offers him 6+?
Who's going to offer him that with a 64.3M cap?

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01-17-2013, 09:13 AM
  #44
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Who's going to offer him that with a 64.3M cap?
No one. So why the heck is everyone so sure he's leaving?

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01-17-2013, 09:17 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
He's not that replaceable. Who do you think will replace him exactly? He's playing as our #1 center. Bjugstad? Shore? They're a couple years away at a minimum.
Exactly. And if we wouldn't pay the money for Weiss, why would we pay even more for Ribeiro or Roy? Weiss is the best we're going to get until Bjugstad, Shore or someone else grows into the role. Unless we trade for a #1 center, and trading for a #1 center pretty much never happens in the NHL anymore. We're not going to replace Weiss is free agency.

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01-17-2013, 09:17 AM
  #46
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No one. So why the heck is everyone so sure he's leaving?
Heh, I really don't know.

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01-17-2013, 10:02 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Montsy14 View Post
No one. So why the heck is everyone so sure he's leaving?
It could be the length then. You make a good point about it relating to cap hit. However, this is the last chance for Weiss to cash in big. An extra couple of yeas could make a huge difference. 5mill @ 5 years versus 5mill @ 7 years is a huge difference.

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01-17-2013, 10:45 AM
  #48
adam graves
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
It could be the length then. You make a good point about it relating to cap hit. However, this is the last chance for Weiss to cash in big. An extra couple of yeas could make a huge difference. 5mill @ 5 years versus 5mill @ 7 years is a huge difference.
I do continue to think he will take a hometown discount. He likes it here (not just the jersey, the region). How much is anyones guess.

5/25 would be a win win for both sides IMHO.

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01-17-2013, 10:52 AM
  #49
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I do continue to think he will take a hometown discount. He likes it here (not just the jersey, the region). How much is anyones guess.

5/25 would be a win win for both sides IMHO.
I don't doubt it he likes it here but I don't think he'll be giving us a hometown discount. His last contract was one of the best deals we've signed. He's going to cash in. There's no reason for him to wait and risk injury if he didn't want to at the very least see what other teams would offer. When players wait for free agency it is never a good sign.

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01-17-2013, 01:06 PM
  #50
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5 year 27 million sounds like a good deal.

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