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Hickey (NYI) & Clune (NSH) Claimed from Waivers

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01-16-2013, 02:24 PM
  #276
Ollie Weeks
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Wherever Alzner plays, the fact remains, the Kings needed to swing for the fences with that pick, not go for a ground rule double. It didn't work out, but the thinking behind the pick wasn't that bad. Perhaps the only thing to fault is going defenseman over some of the forwards available.

Still to this day have no idea what the Kings were thinking the next year, that pick was by far Dean's worst as Kings GM, and it's not even close. Kings missed out on a ton more quality players in 2008 than they did in 2007. People just see the #4 pick and don't realize 2007 wasn't that great, where as 2008 was a loaded draft.
Teubert, right?

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01-16-2013, 02:29 PM
  #277
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Originally Posted by Ollie Weeks View Post
Teubert, right?
Nope, Doughty

In 2007 the Kings missed out on Alzner, Voracek, Couture, Gagner to name a few to draft a high risk, high reward player. Not the end of the world with any of those names except maybe Couture.

In 2008 the Kings missed out on Karlsson, Meyers, Eberle, Del Zotto, Gardiner, Carlson, Sbisa to take a player with almost zero upside who projected as a 3rd pair d-man. Those are some damn good players there.

Again, all the criticism is because of the #4 spot in the draft. It's only a number, and it was a weak draft.

Hickey just peaked at 19 and was passed by players taken after him by the Kings. It happens sometimes.

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01-16-2013, 03:09 PM
  #278
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Nope, Doughty

In 2007 the Kings missed out on Alzner, Voracek, Couture, Gagner to name a few to draft a high risk, high reward player. Not the end of the world with any of those names except maybe Couture.

In 2008 the Kings missed out on Karlsson, Meyers, Eberle, Del Zotto, Gardiner, Carlson, Sbisa to take a player with almost zero upside who projected as a 3rd pair d-man. Those are some damn good players there.

Again, all the criticism is because of the #4 spot in the draft. It's only a number, and it was a weak draft.

Hickey just peaked at 19 and was passed by players taken after him by the Kings. It happens sometimes.
What made it even worse was that they traded 2 1sts to take Teubert. So conceivably they could've had two of those players.

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01-16-2013, 03:17 PM
  #279
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What made it even worse was that they traded 2 1sts to take Teubert. So conceivably they could've had two of those players.
They had the picks which became Myers and Gardiner at one point. They actually traded down one spot with Buffalo, and Buffalo took Myers.

My only thought was that they thought Buffalo wouldn't take Myers. You'd think you'd ask them flat out to not take the player you want as a condition of the trade.

I'd hate to think how sick our D would look with Myers and Gardiner. Granted, we may not have won the cup considering the cap space needed to keep Myers long-term. Assuming we did the same contract extension Buffalo did for him, there's no way we'd have all three of Richards, Carter and Penner and it was that forward depth that really gave us that extra push into the playoffs and to the cup.

Hopefully that is a silver lining to a messed up selection process in the first round. I love our scouting staff... outside of the first round. Aside from Doughty we've been pretty much brutal in the first round.

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01-16-2013, 08:34 PM
  #280
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apparently lubo said today that he was planning on coming back. if this happens and the NYI waive hickey, does he become our property again?

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01-16-2013, 08:37 PM
  #281
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Originally Posted by cubsfan999 View Post
apparently lubo said today that he was planning on coming back. if this happens and the NYI waive hickey, does he become our property again?
No. But I read in a Manchester newspaper article that we get first crack at him

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01-16-2013, 08:39 PM
  #282
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Originally Posted by cubsfan999 View Post
apparently lubo said today that he was planning on coming back. if this happens and the NYI waive hickey, does he become our property again?
I believe the process is that he goes to the next highest team to have put in a claim. If they pass on taking him, it goes to the next highest after that and so forth until there are no other teams who put in a claim.

At that point, he's offered back to us and we can put him on the farm, if we choose to take him back. That is unless things have changed under the new CBA.

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01-16-2013, 10:25 PM
  #283
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I believe the process is that he goes to the next highest team to have put in a claim. If they pass on taking him, it goes to the next highest after that and so forth until there are no other teams who put in a claim.

At that point, he's offered back to us and we can put him on the farm, if we choose to take him back. That is unless things have changed under the new CBA.
I am pure garbage at knowing these sort of things but I am almost certain you are right. We don't get first crack at Hickey if he gets waived again. He has to go through the process and if he ends up with us then we can claim him.

At least that is what I remember.

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01-16-2013, 11:41 PM
  #284
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I thought if they waive him we get first crack at him. That's what happened with LeHoux back when Phoenix nabbed him. We took him back and then eventually traded him back to Phoenix for Jackman.

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01-16-2013, 11:43 PM
  #285
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As far the Teubert pick goes, his upside was projected as Bryan Marchment. At 12 or 13 that's not a big stretch if he pans out like that. I understand the thought process behind it.

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01-16-2013, 11:50 PM
  #286
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Nope, Doughty

In 2007 the Kings missed out on Alzner, Voracek, Couture, Gagner to name a few to draft a high risk, high reward player. Not the end of the world with any of those names except maybe Couture.

In 2008 the Kings missed out on Karlsson, Meyers, Eberle, Del Zotto, Gardiner, Carlson, Sbisa to take a player with almost zero upside who projected as a 3rd pair d-man. Those are some damn good players there.

Again, all the criticism is because of the #4 spot in the draft. It's only a number, and it was a weak draft.

Hickey just peaked at 19 and was passed by players taken after him by the Kings. It happens sometimes.
Teubert is terrible but he was ranked ahead of everyone on your list except Myers and had top 4 potential according to many.

http://www.tsn.ca/draftcentre/feature/?id=7125

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01-17-2013, 12:18 AM
  #287
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Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
As far the Teubert pick goes, his upside was projected as Bryan Marchment. At 12 or 13 that's not a big stretch if he pans out like that. I understand the thought process behind it.
Bleh, I felt the same way about Macilarth (sp?) and Gudbranson and Schenn and even to some degree Murray. If you are a "safe" pick in the top 5-10 (even the top of the first round) its not enough for me. I want the homerun guy. It so rare you get to pick a player that changes a game, a player that simply should be a nice player just isn't enough for me.

I mean Alzner is a top pairing defensemen now...but straight up for a #5 pick imo is a 50/50 proposition. I'd rather have Carlson.

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01-17-2013, 12:46 AM
  #288
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The problem with the Teubert (and Hickey) picks was that they swayed from drafting the best player available to going for an organizational need.

When they drafted Hickey, they didn't have any defensemen (aside from Johnson) with high end potential, which is what they saw in Hickey. They viewed Alzner as a finished product who had already reached his potential, whereas they were looking to hit a homerun with Hickey (and hit a ground ball).

They whiffed big time with Hickey, but part of the problem was Hickey's propensity of getting hurt because his body just took too much abuse from his style of play. Hickey was surprisingly physical for a player of his size, and that took a toll on him, hence the number of injuries he suffered from at critical points in his development. It didn't help Hickey that other defensemen in the pipeline surpassed him on the depth charts.

With Teubert, the Kings were going for a need once again. They felt that they had their puck moving defensemen already with Doughty, Johnson, Martinez, Hickey (and Voynov in round 2 of that same draft). They wanted a rugged defenseman and Teubert was advertised as such, he was supposed to be a man among boys and physically imposing.

I think the Kings would have preferred Luke Schenn as that player, but they couldn't move up high enough and went with the second best option as that physical stay-at-home defenseman that they wanted to eventually play on the right side with Hickey. Teubert and Hickey were also teammates on the WJC team.

Thankfully, the scouting staff was able to find talent that surpassed these prospects who failed and the Kings at the very least turned Teubert into a player who contributed to their Stanley Cup run.

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01-17-2013, 12:53 AM
  #289
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Originally Posted by cubsfan999 View Post
apparently lubo said today that he was planning on coming back. if this happens and the NYI waive hickey, does he become our property again?
I am guessing Hickey will stay on the Islanders roster even when/if Vish comes to play

As it stands

Streit-Hamonic-MacDonald-Martinek-Carkner are for sure

Add Vish that makes 6

which means there is still is room for a #7 guy and I am guessing Finley gets sent down before Hickey, unless Hickey really stinks up the joint

Add to that Martinek and MacDonald both have glass ankles chances are the Islanders will need able bodies on the roster. Also I was guessing De Haan was going to get that 6th spot before he got injured for the season. Only way I see Hickey at this point get sent down would be if Reinhart makes them team past a 5 game tryout


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01-17-2013, 01:21 AM
  #290
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My only thought was that they thought Buffalo wouldn't take Myers. You'd think you'd ask them flat out to not take the player you want as a condition of the trade.
Lombardi wanted Teubert. Carolina (or maybe Ottawa, don't remember) had wanted to move up so they could draft a player still on the board, which Lombardi was fine with as it wasn't Teubert. However, he knew Buffalo wanted a defensemen, and if Carolina drafted Myers than Buf might take Teubert.

So he worked out a deal with Buf, they both write the player they wanted down on a peice of paper. If both gms wrote Teubert, Lombari would have kept the pick and taken him at 12. If they were different players, they'd swap picks and Buf would give us a 3rd (to compensate for the pick that Carolina had offered to move up). Cool story, bad scouting.

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01-17-2013, 07:59 AM
  #291
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I thought if they waive him we get first crack at him. That's what happened with LeHoux back when Phoenix nabbed him. We took him back and then eventually traded him back to Phoenix for Jackman.
Kings didn't get first crack at him. It works like Kingsfan said above. Every other team had to pass on him before the Kings got the option to take him back and assign him to Manchester which is what happened. Later that year he was traded for Jackman and since both were in the AHL at that point they didn't need to pass through waivers and could simply switch AHl teams.

If Clune or Hickey end up back on waivers this year the Kings are last on the priority list for claiming them since they already lost those players. But if every team passes on taking them then the Kings can put in a claim and assign that player directly to the AHL since the 29 other teams passed on them and they will have already "cleared" through the waiver wire at that point. It's tough to explain as it's a complicated process... Not nearly as bad as baseball but still strange how it works.

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01-17-2013, 09:55 AM
  #292
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Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
I thought if they waive him we get first crack at him. That's what happened with LeHoux back when Phoenix nabbed him. We took him back and then eventually traded him back to Phoenix for Jackman.
Actually, if I recall correctly, no one else had put in a claim besides Phoenix, so when they tried to send him back down he reverted straight to us and we elected to keep him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
As far the Teubert pick goes, his upside was projected as Bryan Marchment. At 12 or 13 that's not a big stretch if he pans out like that. I understand the thought process behind it.
I liken him to a Steve Staois type, maybe a Matt Greene. I don't think Teubert is dirty like a Marchment, at least I haven't heard of him trying to wreck any careers yet.

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Originally Posted by tigermask48 View Post
Kings didn't get first crack at him. It works like Kingsfan said above. Every other team had to pass on him before the Kings got the option to take him back and assign him to Manchester which is what happened. Later that year he was traded for Jackman and since both were in the AHL at that point they didn't need to pass through waivers and could simply switch AHl teams.

If Clune or Hickey end up back on waivers this year the Kings are last on the priority list for claiming them since they already lost those players. But if every team passes on taking them then the Kings can put in a claim and assign that player directly to the AHL since the 29 other teams passed on them and they will have already "cleared" through the waiver wire at that point. It's tough to explain as it's a complicated process... Not nearly as bad as baseball but still strange how it works.
For the second paragraph, I think it's a bit off. If Hickey, for example, was to be waived within the first month of having been claimed by NYI, then he only needs to be offered to the team(s) who had put in a claim for him the first time (January 14 I beleive?) plus the Kings, with the Kings being last on that list.

After a month, then everyone can put in a claim again. I think it's just generally assumed nothing would have changed in one months time to sway a team that passed to suddenly wanting him. Once again, that may have changed in the new CBA.

As well, after the season has been rolling for one full month, the regular season standings are used for determining selection order. For the first month, it is based off last years final standings. It's why we got Quincey despite being one of the best teams in the league at the start of the season that year (Quincey wasn't claimed until about 3 weeks into the season I believe).

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01-17-2013, 11:15 AM
  #293
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Bodnarchuk has been placed on waivers. Looks like he's being returned to Manchester with Muzzin keeping a spot on the roster to start the season.

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01-17-2013, 08:03 PM
  #294
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Fill me on Peluso TG. What's the big hype? I haven't seen him play, only know his stats, which aren't all that impressive, but I also know stats don't tell the full story. I trust your judgement, so fill me in please.



Why does everyone think they can't send him down? They can so send him down, just he has to be cleared through waivers again, including the team that lost him. Not likely it would happen, I agree, but we can send him down.



I agree on Hickey and Glennie, but not Wheeler. He was the wildcard of the draft and while some said he was a 2nd round talent, others figured he'd go as high as top 10. At this point, he's scored the 17th most points of anyone from his draft year and he's likely to improve upon that considering some of the guy ahead of him have played as much as 229 more NHL games than he has thus far. If you go by points per game, he ranks approximately 12th and has nearly an identical points per game as Travis Zajac.

Looking just at those drafted around where he was expected to go (1st round through to pick 40) he ranks 9th in points and 7th in points per game. He's actually scored at a better pace than Andrew Ladd (4th overall pick) and is coming off his best NHL season yet by far with 64 points, making him the Jets top scorer last year.

Considering the draft class he was in, yeah maybe #5 was to high but he was definately worth a top 10 pick.
It was risk/reward for Wheeler because of his situation. He was such a project in the draft, and jumped ship on the Coyotes. And he's never been in a real featured role for a good team either.

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01-17-2013, 11:15 PM
  #295
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The Islanders grabbed Hickey the day after they got Joe Finley off waivers. Hickey will most likely get the opening night nod with Matt Carkner. God forbid you play Finley and Carkner as your third pair, that would be ugly. After Vis comes back to the States, who knows -- I'm sure there will be a groin strain or two, so it all works out (on a 25th in goals allowed team).

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01-18-2013, 10:38 AM
  #296
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It was risk/reward for Wheeler because of his situation. He was such a project in the draft, and jumped ship on the Coyotes. And he's never been in a real featured role for a good team either.
All opf which doesn't change the fact he was worthy of at least a top 10 pick, meaning the reach for him wasn't out of line.

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01-18-2013, 11:03 PM
  #297
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In any case, good luck to Hickey. He was one of the few Kings prospects that I had a chance to watch live shortly after they were drafted (was in Seattle on business and caught a T-Birds game) and he actually reminded me a lot of Mark Streit. So maybe there is a possible mentoring opportunity there that could bring out what the Kings couldn't get out of Hickey.

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01-19-2013, 11:29 AM
  #298
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I am thrilled the Isles got Hickey. I think he will slide right into the #5 slot partnered with either Carkner or Strait (not Streit). He has the ability to move the puck up the ice and is positionally sound in his own end. If he stays healthy he might even push into the #3 spot by the end of the year. I was shocked that neither Columbus or Edmonton did not claim him, but he might wind up being the best waiver wire pick up of the year.

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01-28-2013, 11:01 AM
  #299
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Saw that he played in his first game Sunday
12 minutes and 3 sog.

Congrats on the first game, hope he earns some more.

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01-28-2013, 11:31 AM
  #300
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Hickey cost the Islanders the game. Didn't backcheck hard enough on Kane who tapped in a rebound for the OT winner.

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